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Old November 21st, 2012, 03:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
Rolo42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
I've read this argument many times. I have yet to see a single bit of empirical evidence that supports that sales point.
Yes you have: Windows dominates in the corporate desktop arena, even after 21 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
IME as an IT professional I've seen upper management make the mistake of replacing Netware and UNIX in the data center,
To clarify: I was talking overall corporate networks (which are largely client-networks), not data-centres. *nix destroys Windows back-end for reliability and competes cost-wise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
under the false assumption that if a low-paid clerk or secretary can operate their Windows desktop, then the company can save lots of HR money by replacing skilled administrators with entry-level workers.
That's going from one extreme to the other (and, I agree, that happens), which doesn't negate the fact that an average Windows jockey doesn't require as much skill (pay) as a *nix one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
As it turns out, it takes a lot more than the ability to operate a desktop PC when it comes to managing a corporate IT infrastructure.
It depends on the network; if your back end is relatively small (or run by someone else, as a lot of networks have gone) and 90% of it is comprised of clients, then client TCO is pretty much all that matters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
I've been in situations where I'm the only MCSE in the whole organization, and my work is constantly being interrupted because I'm the only one who knows how to administer the Windows Server machines. I know from copious experience that it's a lot cheaper and easier to do things correctly from the start than it is to fix a large broken system.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by that; if you mean Windows Server is completely broken, I can't agree. I've administered a few Win-based enterprise networks and build small ones (even in combat environments) without anything being completely broken. In fact, Win NT and Proxy Server 2.0 on saved the day once when--literally--the black box proxy got blown up and disconnected 1200 users from the Internet.

If you're talking about a poor/flawed design/implementation, then yes, those are [nifty] major projects and is more likely to happen with lesser-skilled MCSE types [who don't have to take a practical exam].

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
Every time Microsoft releases a new version of Windows, with lots of changed, new and often unnecessary new things, Windows administrators have to go back to school to master the new version and its peculiarities.
I don't agree; having administered since WFW 3.11, the only significant change was WinNT; otherwise, it's pretty much the same. The changes are more like patch notes than learning something new.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
BTW, it's ROI not TCO that matters in this case.
Having worked directly for CIOs almost 20 years, I agree but that's not how it works in the "real" world: you can't always get the money when you need it, no matter how much better, long term, it is--and that's another issue: long term isn't a priority now. Additionally, "more reliable" at $x more cost (and learning curve/productivity loss while converting to a new way of doing things) doesn't matter when you can get "does the job" more cheaply.

Having retired from US Air Force, we pretty much use Windows for corporate/admin networks and *nix (generally Solaris--freeware of any kind is not authorised.) for weapon systems--and that's a nice balance between usability/cost (Microsoft) vs. mission-critical (Sun).
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