With Android on the rise, do you think that Apple's iOS is dying?
My personal opinion is a big YES. And rightfully so.
Apple says that their customers are putting the 'deathgrip' on the new iPhone4 (You know, the whole antennagate thing...), but really Apple seems to have a deathgrip on their own products. The iPod Touches, iPhones and iPads, namely. They have a ridiculous app approval process for programmers, and they are quite hostile toward third party software. They brick (on occasion) jailbroken devices, and they do not offer a way for their users to download and use third party software without jailbreaking. Android does. (Haha, get it? DROID DOES. Haha.) Also, the iOS is only supported on devices MADE by Apple. Like I said, Apple has a deathgrip on their product. And I don't think it will be too long before it backfires.
Also, The Android Market and Android Customers are growing exponentially. Do you think the fall of iOS is near?
Aaaand... With your response please don't say something like "Yeah android pwns apple suxx", be a little more detailed than that
EDIT:
Let me rephrase my actual question. I don't think there is any way that Android will completely remove Apple from the market, but do you think that Android will eventually take the throne from iOS as top smartphone?
Last edited by Storm613; August 1st, 2010 at 02:36 PM.
While it may or may not decline in terms of numbers, it wont be going anywhere for quite some time. The market for smartphones is increasing by the day; and as a result, just because Android's numbers are on the rise doesn't mean we are going to see a decline in iOS users.
And quite frankly, we had better hope it doesn't. Competition breeds innovation. If the river that feeds a lake dries up, it becomes stagnant.
And what Android needs to shoot for is the true big fish: RIM.
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I doubt iOS will fall any time soon. They only have a tiny share of the computer market, so no matter how big of a smartphone percentage they have they'll be viewed as the anti-corporate hero, and that's a huge draw for trendy hipsters. In a sick and twisted way, it won't matter how much Android might eventually dominate the market. Think of it like Ford vs Ferrari. No matter how many more cars Ford sells, it won't make the slightest bit of difference to Ferrari or their customers. As superior as Android might be to iOS, there are legions of paying customers that will always view Apple as the best despite all logic. It's very much like a religion. The more heretics (Android users) there are in the world, the more fiercely the faithful (Apple users) will defend and support their beliefs.
I doubt iOS will fall any time soon. They only have a tiny share of the computer market, so no matter how big of a smartphone percentage they have they'll be viewed as the anti-corporate hero, and that's a huge draw for trendy hipsters. In a sick and twisted way, it won't matter how much Android might eventually dominate the market. Think of it like Ford vs Ferrari. No matter how many more cars Ford sells, it won't make the slightest bit of difference to Ferrari or their customers. As superior as Android might be to iOS, there are legions of paying customers that will always view Apple as the best despite all logic. It's very much like a religion. The more heretics (Android users) there are in the world, the more fiercely the faithful (Apple users) will defend and support their beliefs.
I doubt iOS will fall any time soon. They only have a tiny share of the computer market, so no matter how big of a smartphone percentage they have they'll be viewed as the anti-corporate hero, and that's a huge draw for trendy hipsters. In a sick and twisted way, it won't matter how much Android might eventually dominate the market. Think of it like Ford vs Ferrari. No matter how many more cars Ford sells, it won't make the slightest bit of difference to Ferrari or their customers. As superior as Android might be to iOS, there are legions of paying customers that will always view Apple as the best despite all logic. It's very much like a religion. The more heretics (Android users) there are in the world, the more fiercely the faithful (Apple users) will defend and support their beliefs.
That is because the people that go "ohh its shiny" have the money to waste on that crap.
I wouldn't compare it to ferrari though.. Ferrari can outperform a ford. While Apple does not outperform Android (or pc if we are talking about that battle)
Actually as an owner of both an Android and an iPhone 4, I can say that Android STILL has a long way to go to become as polished, user friendly, intuitive and smooth as iOS.
Argue all you want, Android is very good for a lot of the tech types, but for people who just want something that does what it's supposed to the first time without much thought -- well, Android isn't that OS.
It's asinine to say one is superior over the other though. They both serve different needs and cater 'usually' to different types of customers. I love my Android phone, but until it performs as well as my iPhone and until the same apps are on par with their iPhone counterparts, I can't say that Android has dethroned iOS. Another way to look at it is this: As long as people are looking for an iPhone killer, that must mean it's still on top.
Actually as an owner of both an Android and an iPhone 4, I can say that Android STILL has a long way to go to become as polished, user friendly, intuitive and smooth as iOS.
Argue all you want, Android is very good for a lot of the tech types, but for people who just want something that does what it's supposed to the first time without much thought -- well, Android isn't that OS.
It's asinine to say one is superior over the other though. They both serve different needs and cater 'usually' to different types of customers. I love my Android phone, but until it performs as well as my iPhone and until the same apps are on par with their iPhone counterparts, I can't say that Android has dethroned iOS. Another way to look at it is this: As long as people are looking for an iPhone killer, that must mean it's still on top.
2 smartphones? what are you a drug dealer
anyways. Apple has always been known for looks and user friendly, even in the Macs. But what makes PC better is the ability to have control over more things. The same thing the android brings to the table.
While it may or may not decline in terms of numbers, it wont be going anywhere for quite some time. The market for smartphones is increasing by the day; and as a result, just because Android's numbers are on the rise doesn't mean we are going to see a decline in iOS users.
And quite frankly, we had better hope it doesn't. Competition breeds innovation. If the river that feeds a lake dries up, it becomes stagnant.
And what Android needs to shoot for is the true big fish: RIM.
Apple's iOS could be classified as soaring (like like the way their smartphone sales are soaring) but to suggest it's dying? Not a chance.
As it stands now, Apple is ~steamrolling~ the smartphone market in terms of sheer number of units being sold and the current 3+ week long waitlist for those who pre-order the Iphone 4. Their incredible numbers are a testament to the Iphone and iOS's excellent quality and overall consumer satisfaction. Most people would not buy an Iphone if it was garbage, buggy, or faulty, because they want to get their money's worth. I am one of these people, I am not an Apple fanboy or anything of the sort, as the only two Apple product's I've ever owned are the Iphone 3G and Iphone 4. But I chose the Iphone because they are of excellent quality and good phones all around.
It's disingenuous however to chide the Iphone 4 in its entirety due to some complaints about "antennagate", because if that's the route that some people want to go, then it's likewise also possible to browse these very forums and find countless upon countless of user complaints (hardware and software related) with all the different kinds of droid phones. I personally don't have any problems with my Iphone 4, and neither do any of my friends / co workers who I have asked. Regardless, all phones have problems, none are perfect. But the enormous hype surrounding the Iphone 4 has deluded some people into thinking that it SHOULD be perfect, which of course is unrealistic and silly.
But perhaps the most pathetic aspects pertaining to this whole "iphone vs android" make-believe-war are the petty generalizations and mischaracterizations of their users. For the record: Iphone users are not moronic computer-illiterate dolts that simply want a "Shiny" phone to "waste their money on".
A phone is a phone is a phone. It comes down to personal preference, that's it.
That is because the people that go "ohh its shiny" have the money to waste on that crap.
I wouldn't compare it to ferrari though.. Ferrari can outperform a ford. While Apple does not outperform Android (or pc if we are talking about that battle)
The Ferrari comparison is a crappy one if you're talking about performance, just focus on the sales numbers bit of it.
A large percentage iPhone users don’t buy it for it's Smartphone functionality, they get it for it's cool factor. Doesn't matter how feature rich, or powerful android becomes, Apple will still have enough people to buy their products.
When iPhone first came out, Nokia (on Symbian platform) already had a huge application base (several times more than the current android app base) with far better handsets, but still Apple managed to thrive. As Tangent said, apple fans are like a religious cult, I don’t think Android can pose a significant threat to Apple's popularity, not anytime soon at least.
P.S: iPhone is very popular indeed, but they are not the largest smartphone manufacturer (Nokia has more than twice Apples's market share, even RIM is larger than Apple).
OMG did you here apple is coming out with a new rock.. I am totally gonna buy it. its so cool and it has the apple logo on it. It even has this cool feature if you throw it then it will hit the ground eventually. It comes with an app to see how far you can throw!
OMG did you here apple is coming out with a new rock.. I am totally gonna buy it. its so cool and it has the apple logo on it. It even has this cool feature if you throw it then it will hit the ground eventually. It comes with an app to see how far you can throw!
Well, at least they will be able to throw it more smoothly and using less steps than if they were trying to throw a Google rock.
The iphone reminds me of Air jordan back in the days, every year a new design came out and all this commercials and news buzz just pouring out and how is the best selling shoe etc.etc.but eventually all that buzz and hype will come to pass.I keep hearing how easy the iphone is to use but what's so hard about Android?
I definitely would not say it's dying at the moment. They sold 3 million in 3 weeks. It's the best iPhone launch they've had yet. I said it in an old thread, and it's a Steve Jobs quote. When he came back to a dying Apple in '97 he said during a Macworld, "We need to let go of the notion that for Apple to succeed Microsoft has to lose." The same is true of Android. For Android to succeed (and it is succeeding), Apple does not have to lose.
i have both a i-phone and a android in the form of a HTC desire. and while i am loathe to say it ios is not going any where any time soon as already stated in this thread it just works and thats what a lot of people want, some thing that just works with no fuss and no hassle. personally though i prefer the android os as it allows me to get me geek while giving me full customisation of my phone.
@ Weazol i have 2 smart phones and no i'm no drug dealer either, just a hard working bloke who likes to spend his hard earned money on things i like.
I definitely would not say it's dying at the moment. They sold 3 million in 3 weeks. It's the best iPhone launch they've had yet.
All other points aside, this needs to be addressed: 3 million in 3 weeks were mostly 3G/3GS users upgrading--especially since AT&T offered everyone an early upgrade that'd let them keep their unlimited data plan, which led to everyone scrambling to grab that before AT&T moves to tiered pricing.
3 million in 3 weeks doesn't mean a direct increase in market share. Just thought you should know. On which note, a lot of 3G/3GS users were so pissed off at iOS4 crippling their devices many of them ran for Android. Going by Engadget/BGR commentators, they never looked back.
My personal opinion is a big YES. And rightfully so.
Apple says that their customers are putting the 'deathgrip' on the new iPhone4 (You know, the whole antennagate thing...), but really Apple seems to have a deathgrip on their own products. The iPod Touches, iPhones and iPads, namely. They have a ridiculous app approval process for programmers, and they are quite hostile toward third party software. They brick (on occasion) jailbroken devices, and they do not offer a way for their users to download and use third party software without jailbreaking. Android does. (Haha, get it? DROID DOES. Haha.) Also, the iOS is only supported on devices MADE by Apple. Like I said, Apple has a deathgrip on their product. And I don't think it will be too long before it backfires.
Also, The Android Market and Android Customers are growing exponentially. Do you think the fall of iOS is near?
Aaaand... With your response please don't say something like "Yeah android pwns apple suxx", be a little more detailed than that
Not even close. They just sold 3 million plus iPhone 4s in just a month of release. Add in the number of older iPhones, iPod touches, and iPads and you get a massive number of devices. Not dying anytime soon. Apple is at a point where it's stuff is selling like hotcakes. In fact, anything that sells even close would be described as selling like an iPhone 4.
Yes, Apple has a stranglehold on it's users, but most people forget that most Android phones have not one, but TWO, outside entities have a stranglehold on their devices, that being the cellular provider and the hardware manufacturer. Also, a lot of Android devices don't allow 3rd party software unless they're rooted, which is the same thing as jailbreaking on the iOS. It's also beneficial that Apple makes all they're own hardware, because you're secure for updates, and you know that all applications in the app store will work. That's some comforting security.
Android market also may be expanding, but there is no denying that most apps don't have that same amount of polish that iOS apps have.
I believe that Android is the superior OS, but there is no denying that iOS has it's own strengths that can't be denied. I like tinkering with my phone, so I'm an Android fan. My mother likes things that work out of the box and continue to work and remain relevant for more than 3-4 months. Different strokes for different folks.
I have 2 coworkers who dropped their iphone 3gs from 3 feet and the screen cracked. They both said they would buy on iphone 4 if they could....People are just less informed about android and its cool features.
I have 2 coworkers who dropped their iphone 3gs from 3 feet and the screen cracked. They both said they would buy on iphone 4 if they could....People are just less informed about android and its cool features.
Any phone with a large screen can crack from a fall of ANY height. That has nothing to do with one phone being better than another - that's just physics.
People would be crazy to write off iOS at this point. It's still got a slick user interface and very well polished apps. Even without the huge hype machine it has behind it, it's a very nice platform.
Apple lost the desktop war more than a decade ago. I think they learned lessons there that they're going to take over to the mobile world. I would be shocked if you saw one platform with a 95% share in the mobile world.
A lot of people in my line of work do buy the iPhone for the cool factor.
I like the iPhone. I think it is overhyped, and I detest iTunes, but all in all, I think it is a smokin' device. And I like the competition it engenders.
The longer iPhone is around, and doing well,the better for us consumers. As I have said before, I am a self-centered consumer. When Ilook for a new device, I look for the best fit for my needs. If Apple puts out that product, than so be it. I don't have a logo branded on my chest. When they make changes, it forces competitors to raise their game. That's why I adore Android, and feel it is a better fit for me than iOS.
a friend of mine upgraded to the ip4 and had literally no idea why it was better. THATS why apple sell products because their bullshit sales blurb is still believed by alot of people.
Its not dying but its loosing momentum compared to other brands. Its not changed a whole lot from its first iteration (appart from adding all the stuff other phones have had for ages) when apple finally have to innovate something they will struggle or rebrand video calling and call it magic....and the sad thing is people will believe them.
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I don't think it will die off, it will be another repeat of what happened to the mac. It will occupy a niche in the smartphone market. In a fast-paced, constantly evolving market, it will be difficult for one phone from one company on one carrier with one update a year to stay as the leader. Even with Apple's brand image.
Also, a lot of Android devices don't allow 3rd party software unless they're rooted, which is the same thing as jailbreaking on the iOS.
This is just wrong. Third party software is never blocked, there are a few devices that block non-market programs. Those aren't even close to being the same thing. You constantly post pro-Apple rants, can you at least do it with correct information?
Also, a lot of Android devices don't allow 3rd party software unless they're rooted, which is the same thing as jailbreaking on the iOS.
You're badly informed. Even devices where side-loading apps is blocked by the carrier can. Still. Do. So. Without. Rooting. Herp derp derp.
Quote:
My mother likes things that work out of the box and continue to work and remain relevant for more than 3-4 months. Different strokes for different folks.
How does Android not work out of the box? And here you are again with the "relevant for 3-4 months" crock. Oh hi, the original Droid is getting Froyo.
Last edited by grainysand; July 31st, 2010 at 02:28 PM.
the iphone only stays ''relevevant'' because apple artificailly slows its release rate. In the wider tech scene the iphone is outdated in 4-6 months just like every other bit of tech.
While it may or may not decline in terms of numbers, it wont be going anywhere for quite some time. The market for smartphones is increasing by the day; and as a result, just because Android's numbers are on the rise doesn't mean we are going to see a decline in iOS users.
And quite frankly, we had better hope it doesn't. Competition breeds innovation. If the river that feeds a lake dries up, it becomes stagnant.
And what Android needs to shoot for is the true big fish: RIM.
That's said perfectly. We need both. I have an HTC incredible and an iPad and love both very much. Certainly no Apple fan boy ad the iPad is the only Apple product I've owned. Competition is good.
I agree, healthy competition is good. I have ummed and ahhed about getting an iPhone for ages, but now that Android phones have become so amazing I have decided to buy an HTC Desire instead and am so happy. I don't like Apple's dominance and not allowing freedom with their products. More competition with a wide range of eqully good products will hopefully also force prices down.
well for us technologically aware a highly competative market is the best thing as we will be on top of the cutting edge in top end smart phones which will keep getting better and better!
and tbh its looking to be a big fight with Apple, Android and Winmo 7 looking v strong with the possibility of bb6 being ok(ish...dont rele care tho lol)
This is just wrong. Third party software is never blocked, there are a few devices that block non-market programs. Those aren't even close to being the same thing. You constantly post pro-Apple rants, can you at least do it with correct information?
Non-market programs then. Doesn't matter what you call it, it's true that some applications on certain networks are blocked. I've never been "pro-Apple", I explore both sides of the "smartphone wars" and try to be as objective as possible. Perhaps if you had used your reading abilities (something I've noticed the more sensitive members here don't use) you'd see I prefer Android by a longshot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grainysand
You're badly informed. Even devices where side-loading apps is blocked by the carrier can. Still. Do. So. Without. Rooting. Herp derp derp.
How does saying Herp derp derp better your argument? Yes you can do it without rooting, but rooting is the go to solution for most of us. People who want to sideload apps are people who are already interesting in working with custom ROMs and the like, so will already have it rooted.
Quote:
How does Android not work out of the box? And here you are again with the "relevant for 3-4 months" crock. Oh hi, the original Droid is getting Froyo.
Android works out of the box fine, but we all know that what we get stock is only 1/4 of what we can get when we tinker with the firmware and run custom ROMs. And when I say relevant for 3-4 months, I mean in the eye of the consumer. Too many Android powered smart phones are coming out way to fast.
Last edited by Intervenient; July 31st, 2010 at 03:02 PM.
How does saying Herp derp derp better your argument? Yes you can do it without rooting, but rooting is the go to solution for most of us. People who want to sideload apps are people who are already interesting in working with custom ROMs and the like, so will already have it rooted.
To emphasize how wrong you are and how very obviously wrong your comment is? My argument doesn't need to be "better." I was objectively, factually right. You were objectively, factually wrong. Let me jolt your memory:
Quote:
Also, a lot of Android devices don't allow 3rd party software unless they're rooted, which is the same thing as jailbreaking on the iOS.
Do you suffer from short-term memory loss? You said there are Android devices that don't let you sideload apps unless rooted. I pointed out that you can sideload apps just fine without rooting. You furiously backpedal and waffle around with "well I'm saying something completely different to what I originally said and you might as well root anyway." This is what happens when you state nonsense as fact.
Quote:
Android works out of the box fine, but we all know that what we get stock is only 1/4 of what we can get when we tinker with the firmware and run custom ROMs. And when I say relevant for 3-4 months, I mean in the eye of the consumer. Too many Android powered smart phones are coming out way to fast.
And... the iPhone... does everything... out of the box... without jailbreaking? Could it multi-task out of the box pre-iOS4 or even change wallpapers? Let's try this again:
Quote:
My mother likes things that work out of the box and continue to work
You were talking about your mother and what "works out of the box" for her. Now you're talking about flashing custom ROMs and kernels, as evidently you consider stock Android to "not work out of the box." Does your mother flash custom ROMs then? Does she even jailbreak her iFail? You can't seem to stay consistent for more than one paragraph, which as far as an attempt at discourse goes is pretty pathetic.
To emphasize how wrong you are and how very obviously wrong your comment is? My argument doesn't need to be "better." I was objectively, factually right. You were objectively, factually wrong. Let me jolt your memory:
Do you suffer from short-term memory loss? You said there are Android devices that don't let you sideload apps unless rooted. I pointed out that you can sideload apps just fine without rooting. You furiously backpedal and waffle around with "well I'm saying something completely different to what I originally said and you might as well root anyway." This is what happens when you state nonsense as fact.
And... the iPhone... does everything... out of the box... without jailbreaking? Could it multi-task out of the box pre-iOS4 or even change wallpapers? Let's try this again:
You were talking about your mother and what "works out of the box" for her. Now you're talking about flashing custom ROMs and kernels, as evidently you consider stock Android to "not work out of the box." Does your mother flash custom ROMs then? Does she even jailbreak her iFail? You can't seem to stay consistent for more than one paragraph, which as far as an attempt at discourse goes is pretty pathetic.
Not even going to bother. It's pretty pathetic to argue more than one or two posts about a cell phone. I apologize for having an opinion that differs from you, and I can't wait to be just like you when I grow up.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swizz
No.
While it may or may not decline in terms of numbers, it wont be going anywhere for quite some time. The market for smartphones is increasing by the day; and as a result, just because Android's numbers are on the rise doesn't mean we are going to see a decline in iOS users.
And quite frankly, we had better hope it doesn't. Competition breeds innovation. If the river that feeds a lake dries up, it becomes stagnant.
And what Android needs to shoot for is the true big fish: RIM.
This exactly, just take a look at the original android and you can see the vast GUI improvements that were brought about by competition with ios. I'm certainly very anti-apple almost as much as I am anti-religion but I wouldn't like them to disappear just yet (and they're not going to either). Your also right that android should aim compete with RIM. There is always somebody around here looking for better outlook integration, remote wipe and storage encryption.
ios is at a cusp. I am counting the days...minutes until froyo is released OTA for droid because then people will actually see Flash being on android but not on iPhone. Until that point they will get iphone because they don't see what they are missing, don't see a difference right now.
It is unfortunate that many people can't handle abstract thought and only think in terms of the concretely known present and not the exciting possibilities of an unknown future driven by open competition.
I could care less if flash is on a phone or not. LOL. I am sure if you polled the public you would get most people saying, "What is flash??" or they would think it has something to do with the camera.
Using both an Android and iOS, the iOS web experience just blows Android away and probably will for a while.
I could care less if flash is on a phone or not. LOL. I am sure if you polled the public you would get most people saying, "What is flash??" or they would think it has something to do with the camera.
Using both an Android and iOS, the iOS web experience just blows Android away and probably will for a while.
If you polled the public what a 1GHZ processor was they'd probably be clueless too...but most of them would use one on their phone. People know the difference when they go on websites when they see the little boxes and some of their favorite website works. Just because they don't know it's called "flash" doesn't mean they don't use it.
I could care less if flash is on a phone or not. LOL. I am sure if you polled the public you would get most people saying, "What is flash??" or they would think it has something to do with the camera.
Using both an Android and iOS, the iOS web experience just blows Android away and probably will for a while.
LOL my mom got an ipod touch and after the first 10 minutes of using it she asked why Flash wasn't working on the internet.
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I could care less if flash is on a phone or not. LOL. I am sure if you polled the public you would get most people saying, "What is flash??" or they would think it has something to do with the camera.
Using both an Android and iOS, the iOS web experience just blows Android away and probably will for a while.
Sure?
Until this morning, I playfully conceded that to an iPhone-owning friend. He ruefully sent me this link:
I'll let you draw your own conclusions. To be fair, the tests used FroYo, so go figure.
Me? If I were ever to go to another device, right now, it wouldn't be because of a web browser. Safari is no longer the lion of the mobile browsing jungle, but kudos to Apple for blazing the trail. FTR, I think they did max out the Acid3 test, IIRC.
Me? If I were ever to go to another device, right now, it wouldn't be because of a web browser. Safari is no longer the lion of the mobile browsing jungle, but kudos to Apple for blazing the trail. FTR, I think they did max out the Acid3 test, IIRC.
Before there was the iPhone, there was Palm and the name of its browser was Blazer. But what made iPhone unique was that it had a mobile browser with a core that was the same as the one that was tested and proven on the desktop (IE on winmo was clearly not the same as the x86 Windows version). Remember the commercial? "Not the mobile internet but the internet internet"
Before there was the iPhone, there was Palm and the name of its browser was Blazer. But what made iPhone unique was that it had a mobile browser with a core that was the same as the one that was tested and proven on the desktop (IE on winmo was clearly not the same as the x86 Windows version). Remember the commercial? "Not the mobile internet but the internet internet"
I was one person who loved Blazer. I know it was rudimentary, but still...
The thing about the iOS that makes it so good for what it does, is that it's relatively simple. I can tell you that it's taken me quite a bit of effort to teach people how to use their droids... and I've been a droid owner for less than a month.
It's user friendly, it's easy, it's recognizable and many people have it as the operating system in which they compare other operating systems to. It's a clean setup, despite how much we might dislike it. It's hard to kill.
What Android needs is more attention for all these tiny little details that make an OS just 'click.' Steve Jobs is a master at getting the aesthetics. Fortunately Android getting Duarte from Palm.
"When recording the audio's base notes, the company opted for actual musicians playing simple instruments like Tibetan bells over synthetic gizmos that generate "electronic blips and bloops," says Matias Duarte, Palm's vice president of human interface and user experience.
"We wanted to have tones that would be part of the Pre's aesthetic whole," Duarte says. "The phone's hardware, software and audio experience needed to be coherent." Five Things You Didn't Know About The Palm Pre - Forbes.com
Combine that kind of attention to detail with google tech (widgets, voice recognition, bumptop, etc) and Android will have it all.
I honestly, truly do not get that Android is hard. Seriously.I thought it was fairly easy to figure out. Never opened the manual once. I found it intuitive.
Not being argumentative; I really, really don't get that iOS is any easier to use than Android, especially with basic operations.
With Android on the rise, do you think that Apple's iOS is dying?
