I know this forum censors IMEI change discussion but hope that this one will stick around because it exposes a serious liability for anyone considering selling their phone.
People are always asking why one would want to change their IMEI other than for illegal reasons. I've got a perfectly legal reason that I share with a rapidly increasing number of others. I changed carriers and want to sell my old phone. I have no idea who will buy it or for what purpose they will use it. Doesn't it seem obvious that I would be utterly foolish to leave anything on that phone that could be traced back to me?
If I can't remove its past link to me I simply will not be able sell that phone without the potential of unthinkable liability (indefinite imprisonment without any due process in the U.S. were it used by the buyer for the purpose of terror.) That currently indelible link to me is its IMEI and to risk passing the phone into unknown hands I simply must change it.
If you are considering selling your phone you may want to reconsider.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Btfsplk
I know this forum censors IMEI change discussion but hope that this one will stick around because it exposes a serious liability for anyone considering selling their phone.
People are always asking why one would want to change their IMEI other than for illegal reasons. I've got a perfectly legal reason that I share with a rapidly increasing number of others. I changed carriers and want to sell my old phone. I have no idea who will buy it or for what purpose they will use it. Doesn't it seem obvious that I would be utterly foolish to leave anything on that phone that could be traced back to me?
If I can't remove its past link to me I simply will not be able sell that phone without the potential of unthinkable liability (indefinite imprisonment without any due process in the U.S. were it used by the buyer for the purpose of terror.) That currently indelible link to me is its IMEI and to risk passing the phone into unknown hands I simply must change it.
If you are considering selling your phone you may want to reconsider.
Hmm.. that's a good point. Perhaps another reason for CDMA carriers to embrace the SIM/R-UIM method of doing things.
I'm thinking, if one is that paranoid about your old phone falling into terrorist or criminal hands, then don't sell it, put it in a draw, destroy it or something. Attempting to change a phone's IMEI is a criminal offence in many countries and jurisdictions and can land one in jail. Most phone manufacturers make it almost impossible to change the IMEI, as it's permanently burned into the phone's electronics.
Also discussion of illegal activities like changing a phone's IMEI are against forum rules.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IOWA
Hmm.. that's a good point. Perhaps another reason for CDMA carriers to embrace the SIM/R-UIM method of doing things.
Won't make any difference, the IMEI is in the phone not the SIM.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedt
I'm thinking, if one is that paranoid about your old phone falling into terrorist or criminal hands, then don't sell it, put it in a draw, destroy it or something. Attempting to change a phone's IMEI is a criminal offence in many countries and jurisdictions and can land one in jail. Most phone manufacturers make it almost impossible to change the IMEI, as it's permanently burned into the phone's electronics.
Also discussion of illegal activities like changing a phone's IMEI are against forum rules.
Won't make any difference, the IMEI is in the phone not the SIM.
I know what the IMEI does, but switching authentication to a SIM method would avoid those issues completely
I'm thinking, if one is that paranoid about your old phone falling into terrorist or criminal hands, then don't sell it, put it in a draw, destroy it or something. Attempting to change a phone's IMEI is a criminal offence in many countries and jurisdictions and can land one in jail. Most phone manufacturers make it almost impossible to change the IMEI, as it's permanently burned into the phone's electronics.
Also discussion of illegal activities like changing a phone's IMEI are against forum rules.
This is understood and I hope the thread does not evolve into any discussion of how to do it but rather remain on the topic of the implications of the restriction. A similar problem exists with respect to guns and automobiles and there are recognized official procedures for one to disclaim and transfer liability. I would argue that the same is needed for phones for all the same reasons. This is not paranoia but simple practicality.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Btfsplk
This is understood and I hope the thread does not evolve into any discussion of how to do it but rather remain on the topic of the implications of the restriction. A similar problem exists with respect to guns and automobiles and there are recognized official procedures for one to disclaim and transfer liability. I would argue that the same is needed for phones for all the same reasons. This is not paranoia but simple practicality.
The last thing we need is any kind of more regulation.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IOWA
I know what the IMEI does, but switching authentication to a SIM method would avoid those issues completely
Except this method would prevent carriers from blocking/blacklisting lost or stolen phones, unless there were a two stage authentication process which would authenticate using sim but block is done by IMEI or ESN. This could still tie the sim user to the IMEI and not eliminate the original premise/problem.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lunatic59
Except this method would prevent carriers from blocking/blacklisting lost or stolen phones, unless there were a two stage authentication process which would authenticate using sim but block is done by IMEI or ESN. This could still tie the sim user to the IMEI and not eliminate the original premise/problem.
No, it wouldn't stop the blacklist. IMEI's can be blacklisted just fine with/without a SIM. AT&T or T-Mobile could blacklist if they felt like it, they just don't. Blacklisting also has it's drawbacks as well, quite a few actually.
what about the data on the phone you "thought" you deleted. Anything you delete from the phone can be recovered, unless you take the appropriate measures to ensure a very very very good data cleansing.
as far as the IMEI being linked to you, only the carrier knows it was linked to you. It would be next to impossible for anyone like my self to trace the phone back to you with the IMEI only as they would need to get that data from past archives of your accounts records.
The last thing we need is any kind of more regulation.
Ha ha can you imagine waiting in line at a DMV-like establishment to transfer the "title" to your phone? I'm not against all regulation, but this sounds like a nightmare lol. Let's not give anybody any ideas. After all, this could be spun as a revenue generator and job creator. Also, people seem willing to accept just about anything in the name of "security".
IMEI indelibility and liability!
