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Old January 5th, 2013, 09:45 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default is Android hardwares turning into Apple?

Instead of Android phones influencing Iphones and WP, more and more Android phones now have irremovable battery and no expendable memory. Just take a look at the evolution of the nexus phones.

What if Samsung decide to follow this trend as well? In a few years time, all smartphones will have irremovable battery and no expendable memory, this is not something I look forward to.
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Old January 5th, 2013, 09:47 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I smell lawyers...
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Old January 5th, 2013, 10:00 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I don't know why the idea of removable battery and expendable memory is not in favor with phone manufacturers. Is it becuz of cost? It is cheaper to build phone with irremovable battery and non-expendable memory?
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Old January 5th, 2013, 10:05 PM   #4 (permalink)
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maybe samsung might go with non removable battery, but i cant see them ever not supplying an sd card slot. imo it's one of the reasons many people buy their phones.
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Old January 5th, 2013, 10:22 PM   #5 (permalink)
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There are many possible reasons for why it may be undesirable to have an SD card:

Why Google wants to kill SD cards, and what's holding them back
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Old January 5th, 2013, 10:39 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Apple will probably sue the manufacturer of a next phone with irremovable battery.
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Old January 5th, 2013, 10:41 PM   #7 (permalink)
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excellent article, if Google really want to rid of SD card, why do they only offer 8GB and 16GB nexus 4 when Iphone 5 goes up to 64GB??
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Old January 6th, 2013, 04:36 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jefboyardee View Post
I smell lawyers...
Yeh I was thinking that...I mean hasn't Apple got a patent for non-removable batteries?
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Old January 6th, 2013, 04:40 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by FinancialWar View Post
excellent article, if Google really want to rid of SD card, why do they only offer 8GB and 16GB nexus 4 when Iphone 5 goes up to 64GB??
I think it's because Google is trying to push people towards their cloud services.

Can't see Android phones in China losing their expandable SD-card storage any time soon though.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 08:10 AM   #10 (permalink)
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check out this article i just posted in the lounge:
Why Nexus devices (and newer devices) have no SD card
it seems like the mtp protocal is less error prone then a removable sd card
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Old January 6th, 2013, 11:36 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by h4x0rj3ff View Post
check out this article i just posted in the lounge:

it seems like the mtp protocal is less error prone then a removable sd card
I've personally used a total of two android phones. My first one was on Gingerbread and had an SD card. I CONSTANTLY forgot to dismount the card when I unplugged it from my computer. And that caused many issues.

I am on JB now, but not having an SD card and having to unmount it is - to me personally - a god send. That, plus I have only used half of my 16GB so far makes it seem like no SD card is a good move for my personal usage.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 12:34 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I have an OG EVO with limited storage, so I do have a lot of app moved to my SD Card.

However, if I had larger internal storage, all of my apps would be on the internal storage. Even then, I would want a SD card to keep my picture, video, music on. If all of it was on the internal storage, and I had to do a Factory Reset, it all would get wipped out.

And, no, I do not sync my phone with my computer. The last time I tried that with a Blackberry several years ago, it completely screwed up my Blackberry. It took me weeks to recover the correct setting.

Honestly, I do not want to go through that again.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 08:02 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I CONSTANTLY forgot to dismount the card when I unplugged it from my computer.
Iíve had an 8GB SD in mine for over a year, havenít had to unmount it even once. But if I did have to, Iíd probably muff it like you did. Anyway, I have lot on it and sure glad itís there.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 08:21 PM   #14 (permalink)
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lets take Droid DNA for example

This phone has a 1080p screen, torrenting a 1080p full Hd movie will take at least 4GB with some blueray rip around 7GB. In Droid DNA, you have 16GB with usable storage of around 11GB, minus all the other stuff on the phone such as photo, books etc you can only fit one full HD movie to take advantage of the 1080p screen.

Are you serious?

If Google feel that apps installed on SD card will affect the performance, that make sure all apps are installed on internal memory, since they are all quite large in size now days, but expandable memory for movies and videos, which are non operation vital but takes up large storage.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 01:27 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FinancialWar View Post
excellent article, if Google really want to rid of SD card, why do they only offer 8GB and 16GB nexus 4 when Iphone 5 goes up to 64GB??
16GB is a deal breaker for me. I need 32GB.

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Originally Posted by mikedt View Post
I think it's because Google is trying to push people towards their cloud services.

Can't see Android phones in China losing their expandable SD-card storage any time soon though.
There are enough instances where I do not have network access that would make relying on cloud services not feasible for me.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 07:15 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by kct1975 View Post
I have an OG EVO with limited storage, so I do have a lot of app moved to my SD Card.

However, if I had larger internal storage, all of my apps would be on the internal storage. Even then, I would want a SD card to keep my picture, video, music on. If all of it was on the internal storage, and I had to do a Factory Reset, it all would get wipped out.

And, no, I do not sync my phone with my computer. The last time I tried that with a Blackberry several years ago, it completely screwed up my Blackberry. It took me weeks to recover the correct setting.

Honestly, I do not want to go through that again.
Question, I had a mac and a blackberry, so I understand the sync issue. However, now that google drive is an option for storing information, why not store items there that aren't needed everyday?
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Old January 8th, 2013, 08:47 AM   #17 (permalink)
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And, no, I do not sync my phone with my computer. The last time I tried that with a Blackberry several years ago, it completely screwed up my Blackberry. It took me weeks to recover the correct setting.
So because of one bad sync, years ago on a completely different platform you won't sync your device? Even though the vast majority of millions of people (most of which have no idea what they are really doing) do so every day without a problem?

Eh I suppose it is no big deal since Android is designed to be independent of a host PC. I do hope you have figured out ways of getting your data on and off of the phone and backup regularly though. At least that is the lesson I would of taken away from the experience.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 08:50 AM   #18 (permalink)
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And don't forget Google Play Music/Amazon MP3 for your music (Where most of mine is).
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Old January 8th, 2013, 08:57 AM   #19 (permalink)
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This phone has a 1080p screen, torrenting a 1080p full Hd movie will take at least 4GB with some blueray rip around 7GB. In Droid DNA, you have 16GB with usable storage of around 11GB, minus all the other stuff on the phone such as photo, books etc you can only fit one full HD movie to take advantage of the 1080p screen.
When you put it in that context, the conspiracy theorist begins to wonder if there is a MPAA influence being felt here?

The truth of the matter though is that Google and more specifically manufactuers are not really concerned about the very small (the word infintisimal comes to mind) percentage of people who want to carry 64+ GB of 1080p movies on their device. They are concerned about the experience of the average user though who doesn't even use the 16GB built into the device. If their research shows SD cards are harmful to that experience and it saves money not to include it - out it goes.

Fortunately, Android still supports it so there will probably always be some manufacturer making a device for the people who want an SD card.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 09:10 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I can't speak for nexus phones, but carriers are also playing a role. Reports are saying that Verizon specifically requested that HTC remove the SD card on the DNA from the Butterfly J(International Version of the DNA). No doubt this is because of data no longer being unlimited for a majority of users, they want people streaming from the cloud and racking up huge data amounts in order to make more money. So you get the double whammy of google wanting you to use their cloud services, and carriers wanting you to use lots of data.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 11:34 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I think its stupid. SD cards you can take wherever a cloud you can't unless you have network access. Major flaw in my eyes on top of that what If some hacker or hackers decide to hack the cloud then what. All your info is in other ppls hands now? Come on lol
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Old January 8th, 2013, 01:57 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Think of it this way...It's far more likely your phone will be lost or stolen than your cloud storage will be hacked. If the phone is lost or stolen but locked cloud storage is still safe. But the info on a card is available even if the phone is locked.

I have no problem with cloud security. I stash copies of everything in the cloud. But Iím not stupid - nothing is stored there with social security or bank account numbers.

And these days, unless I'm waaaay out in the boonies I always have internet access. It's 2013.

A year or two ago I wouldn't buy a phone with no SD slot. But I now have a Nexus 4 and don't miss it a bit.

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Old January 8th, 2013, 02:10 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Quote:
Iím not stupid - nothing is stored there with social security or bank account numbers.
So I am stupid and feel safe with Pocket encryption...
When you use Pocket, your data is encrypted using the industry standard AES-256. Only you will be able to access your data via a master password.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 02:13 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I don't trust encryption. There's always a key.

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Old January 8th, 2013, 03:25 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Google does not allow SD slots in their devices because they make money from selling higher storage versions. i.e. Nexus 7 or 10.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 06:41 PM   #26 (permalink)
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So I am stupid and feel safe with Pocket encryption...
When you use Pocket, your data is encrypted using the industry standard AES-256. Only you will be able to access your data via a master password.
Well it would be good if you could get some independent verification that they do what they say they do. On the surface though it looks it looks good and takes a few extra steps other systems might not thought (or maybe they have). I would think you data is safe.

Personally though I prefer LastPass.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 07:59 PM   #27 (permalink)
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I think its stupid. SD cards you can take wherever a cloud you can't unless you have network access. Major flaw in my eyes on top of that what If some hacker or hackers decide to hack the cloud then what. All your info is in other ppls hands now? Come on lol
So you feel this way about your email? It's in the cloud.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 08:00 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
it would be good if you could get some independent verification that they do what they say they do.
Their site, Pocket for Android:
Pocket is all about security. Many people still store their sensitive information under contacts, which can easily be seen if your phone falls into the wrong hands...ouch! When you use Pocket, your data is encrypted using the industry standard AES-256. Only you will be able to access your data via a master password. Even if you lose your phone your data will still be safe. For extra security, Pocket doesn't store your master password locally on the device, but rather as a SHA-512 hash. In addition, Pocket self-locks after a timeout period and clears the clipboard to ensure your data is protected.
And AES-256 is recognized...
The design and strength of all key lengths of the AES algorithm (i.e., 128, 192 and 256) are sufficient to protect classified information up to the SECRET level. TOP SECRET information will require use of either the 192 or 256 key lengths. The implementation of AES in products intended to protect national security systems and/or information must be reviewed and certified by NSA prior to their acquisition and use.
So personally, I have no idea how true encryption works, but like what I’m hearing. They also have a Windows companion which makes it a must-have, to me at least.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 08:34 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by gneugneu84 View Post
Google does not allow SD slots in their devices because they make money from selling higher storage versions. i.e. Nexus 7 or 10.
Interestingly enough, I bet most of their Dev boards have sd card slots for the sake of development just like the BeagleBoard and stuff. Which means for the final product, they must have designed it out lol.
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Old January 8th, 2013, 09:13 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by casophylip View Post
It is cheaper to build phone with irremovable battery and non-expendable memory?
lol that depends. Pretty sure their test devices start off with removable batteries and expandable memory

edit: by that I mean they have pay to redesign and redo their testing on more hardware versions
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Old January 8th, 2013, 10:00 PM   #31 (permalink)
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When you put it in that context, the conspiracy theorist begins to wonder if there is a MPAA influence being felt here?
You do realize that Google also rent and sell movies on Google Play right? Wouldn't a smaller storage harm their movie business?
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Old January 8th, 2013, 10:08 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by FinancialWar View Post
You do realize that Google also rent and sell movies on Google Play right? Wouldn't a smaller storage harm their movie business?
I don't believe by default that they are stored on the device, though you might have the option to download them for offline use. Normally they just record on your account that you purchased it, and let you stream it via the cloud.
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Old January 9th, 2013, 01:58 AM   #33 (permalink)
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If they're going to take ideas from Apple, can they at least take the good ones? It seems they are emulating the worst of what Apple has to offer, including a phone with a glass back. They have ruined the Nexus line of phones in my eyes.
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Old January 9th, 2013, 12:32 PM   #34 (permalink)
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You do realize that Google also rent and sell movies on Google Play right? Wouldn't a smaller storage harm their movie business?
Selling content is more about locking you into their ecosystem than it is about making money directly from the actual selling of the content. It is also about changing the thinking from storing your entire library on the device to storing it in the cloud. You don't need large on device storage mediums if you can simply stream or download whatever it is you are currently watching.

To expand upon my conspiracy theory though it is probably in the interest of the MPAA encourage limiting storage options. It basically has the effect of encouraging people to legitimate sources for content rather than trying to store it on the device.
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Old January 9th, 2013, 01:08 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Selling content is more about locking you into their ecosystem than it is about making money directly from the actual selling of the content. It is also about changing the thinking from storing your entire library on the device to storing it in the cloud. You don't need large on device storage mediums if you can simply stream or download whatever it is you are currently watching.

To expand upon my conspiracy theory though it is probably in the interest of the MPAA encourage limiting storage options. It basically has the effect of encouraging people to legitimate sources for content rather than trying to store it on the device.
if Google is trying to lock you into their ecosystem why are they selling movies and books at a price higher than actually physical media? $5.99 to rent a digital movie for 48 hours, come on that's a rip off.

I wonder how much Google is getting for every movie they sell. May that is the reason why they are so against SD cards.

If the next Samsung galaxy S have 1080P screen, support exFAT sd card and removable battery like it is now, haha Google will not get a cent from me for movies.
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Old January 9th, 2013, 03:36 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Their site, Pocket for Android:
Pocket is all about security. Many people still store their sensitive information under contacts, which can easily be seen if your phone falls into the wrong hands...ouch! When you use Pocket, your data is encrypted using the industry standard AES-256. Only you will be able to access your data via a master password. Even if you lose your phone your data will still be safe. For extra security, Pocket doesn't store your master password locally on the device, but rather as a SHA-512 hash. In addition, Pocket self-locks after a timeout period and clears the clipboard to ensure your data is protected.
And AES-256 is recognized...
The design and strength of all key lengths of the AES algorithm (i.e., 128, 192 and 256) are sufficient to protect classified information up to the SECRET level. TOP SECRET information will require use of either the 192 or 256 key lengths. The implementation of AES in products intended to protect national security systems and/or information must be reviewed and certified by NSA prior to their acquisition and use.
So personally, I have no idea how true encryption works, but like what I’m hearing. They also have a Windows companion which makes it a must-have, to me at least.
I wouldn't worry about someone cracking AES256. If they are smart enough to crack it, I guarantee they won't be going after your files in the cloud.
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Old January 9th, 2013, 07:26 PM   #37 (permalink)
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I guarantee they won't be going after your files in the cloud.
Thatís pretty bold... weíre talking about twenty-five hundred dollars here.
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Old January 10th, 2013, 07:11 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Thatís pretty bold... weíre talking about twenty-five hundred dollars here.
Why settle for 25 hundred when they could have....millions?

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Old January 12th, 2013, 06:38 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Instead of Android phones influencing Iphones and WP, more and more Android phones now have irremovable battery and no expendable memory. Just take a look at the evolution of the nexus phones.

What if Samsung decide to follow this trend as well? In a few years time, all smartphones will have irremovable battery and no expendable memory, this is not something I look forward to.
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Apple will probably sue the manufacturer of a next phone with irremovable battery.
I don't like the notion that because someone was first to do something (were they?) then they invented it. Anyone could have done it if they wanted to or could be bothered .

If all phones had non removable sim cards then this might be ideal, especially since returns (contract) would be dealt with swaps. But they're not. Not all phones are free on contract. I just bought a spare battery too.

I get their thinking. In-built memory & battery are generously specced. But they still have us down for replacing them after one or two years & buying another. They are still on Planet Mobile Phone when we have migrated to Planet Pocket Computing.

The sealed battery / memory thing is easy to deal with, just vote with your feat. Getting them to make hardware that lasts more than three or four years is another issue!
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Old January 12th, 2013, 10:36 AM   #40 (permalink)
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I have a Galaxy Nexus, and it has a removable battery. Which Nexus phone doesn't have a removable battery?
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Old January 12th, 2013, 10:48 AM   #41 (permalink)
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