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Old January 15th, 2013, 07:07 AM   #101 (permalink)
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Had it not been for Xenix, I wouldn't be the anti-micro$oft, *nix-centric snob I am today. I never thought of Xenix as having anything to do with m$, because what I used was Tandy Xenix [very briefly] and then SCO Xenix. Regardless, I have such fond memories of my Xenix days.
What I find interesting is the timing. By 1980 Microsoft had become a major software OEM, selling MS-BASIC to many of the early microcomputer (that's what they were called before "PC" became popular) manufacturers. They could have told IBM that "UNIX was the future" and pushed their Xenix product on IBM instead of purchasing a CP/M clone and "making it work". Who knows how different things would be if Microsoft had stuck with UNIX and used their bargaining power to get AT&T to lower the license fees.

It was no mean feat to adapt UNIX to run on hardware that lacked key functionality that made SYSV UNIX so successful. The 8086 and 68k CPUs that were a big step forward from their 8-bit predecessors were still pretty crude. Although I never used Xenix, my experience with Minix for pre-286 computers was really interesting and educational.

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It's not sckmd, it's sckmud. As I posted earlier
No matter how it's spelled, the only accounts that I've ever seen of the message are apocryphal. Since a "Starship" isn't likely to suffer from a problem that's more common with jet-skis, I think it's safe to say that the "sucking mud" reference was to the phonetics of what you wrote as "Sckmud" and nickdalzell wrote as "Sckmd". In the UNIX world there's a long tradition of novel pronunciations for things that aren't words. AIX is pronounced "aches", HP-UX is "H-pucks", DEC is "deck", fsck is "F-suck", so on and so forth.

Along the same lines I was just recalling my experiences with OS/2 Warp in another thread, and how I saw the Win-OS/2 directory (WINOS2) and heard it in my mind as "winos two".

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Old January 15th, 2013, 07:34 AM   #102 (permalink)
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the only memory i have of Xenix was the childhood bits and pieces glimpse of the mainframe upstairs...

that loud old hard drive though--that is one sound i will never forget....thing was huge--stored in a key-locked drawer on the bottom of the mainframe. the upper part had tape drives, i suppose for backup purposes, and another part had a few buttons and lights. the buttons had things such as 'power' 'restart' 'diag' and various lights for disk access, on-line, error, working, and others.
I think what you're calling a "mainframe" was actually a DEC PDP-11 minicomputer. That's the only machine larger than a desktop microcomputer that Xenix was compiled for. And while a hard disk drive that fills up a 19" relay rack is gigantic by today's standards, the "big iron" mainframe DASD boxes were as big as a clothes washer, and sometimes even larger:



I've heard stories about mainframe programmers writing assembler programs that made these large spinning disk or drum drives do things beside storage. One program moved the read/write heads in a way that played a little tune. Another one that was clearly written for revenge cycled the reciprocating assembly back and forth repeatedly, causing the whole assembly to move across the floor!

Back then tape drives were still used to store data. Tapes were more cost-effective than spinning media drives, and more efficient for reading sequential access data. Tape drives were also the way that old mainframes and minis were booted.
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Old January 15th, 2013, 11:05 AM   #103 (permalink)
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it was considerably smaller than that--it was along the same footprint of an AST Mentor--if you remember those, it was basically the same size as a small entertainment cabinet, produced so much heat it had a R-12 Freon based cooling unit inside. it was kept upstairs, and the terminals were all connected to it by wire. downstairs, where you actually interacted with it, were dumb terminals with keyboards made by WYSE. the mainframe was a proprietary make and had some medical branding on it. I do not remember the name--the company is now defunct.

I have always generically referred to any server that sends data to dozens or more dumb terminals or teletypes as 'mainframes' whether or not that is the correct term. to me a 'server' is simply a network file server that connects to newer boxes via token ring or Ethernet interfaces. servers have connections to independent computers, while mainframes as I call them are the only CPU there--with the dumb terminals being nothing but telnet-type methods of communicating with it. Xenix/UNIX being multiuser it made it come off as if the terminals you interacted with had processing capabilities of their own-the illusion. they called it Xenix but it could have been a port of UNIX used for that computer's intended purpose. they may have just called it by the wrong name. I was a child then, using DOS on an IBM 5150, so what would I know? I just remember the text on the screen and that error

I would say whatever it was it was as large as the double-decker washer/dryer used in a small apartment. but not an entire room was taken up. it shared the same air-conditioned closet as the medicine storage. I think the office still exists but remains closed--the unit was still up there being used as a table. the picture you posted if that is the hard drive on top of the machine that is what the Hard drive did look like.
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Old January 15th, 2013, 01:04 PM   #104 (permalink)
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I have always generically referred to any server that sends data to dozens or more dumb terminals or teletypes as 'mainframes' whether or not that is the correct term.
No, it's not correct. At least not to me. When I think of mainframes, I think of huge, noisy, hot, room-filling monsters.

The furniture store chain I worked for had several IBM System/3 computers, with no access via terminals. Everything had to be printed out, so sales reports, inventory reports, etc., were cranked out daily. I replaced the System/3s with an SCO Xenix system; it ran on an ALR 386/25, to which I attached terminals, printers, and modems, using a variety of RS-232, serial, and short-haul modem cabling. The server, in my office, was what I used to do my normal work programming and administering the system. It most definitely was NOT a mainframe! But it had Wyse terminals connected to it at multiple locations, including in my office at home.
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Old January 15th, 2013, 04:48 PM   #105 (permalink)
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your definition of Mainframe sounds more like ENIACs from the late 1940s
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Old January 15th, 2013, 10:12 PM   #106 (permalink)
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I finally am on linux mint , but really dont know a whole lot. Am doing alit of research in how to use linux
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:26 AM   #107 (permalink)
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I finally am on linux mint , but really dont know a whole lot. Am doing alit of research in how to use linux
In my experience there's little to no learning curve. (I'm talking about typical end users, not geeks who want to learn the real guts of the OS, its kernel, etc.) When I convert someone, I do it with Kubuntu Linux, so keep in mind that's what I'm referring to. When I switched my [elderly] mother to Kubuntu from windows, I installed it, added a ton of games and other stuff, then said "here you go!" My mom can do things with computers--as in SCREW THEM UP ROYALLY--that I've never even seen in 30 years of computing. "Computer literate" and "my mother" do NOT belong in the same sentence. Yet she managed with virtually no instruction. That's how intuitive KDE is. YMMV depending on distro and desktop environment.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:34 AM   #108 (permalink)
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Ubuntu finally grew on me after Pear Linux. i am now running the official 12.10 on my Toshiba (Windows 8 and its many partitions and EFI crap are GONE!) and at least one of my games runs fine in it. now all i have to do is rid the ugly out of it (who designs the default interface anyway?) and relocate the launcher to the bottom where i like it and i'm on my way
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:45 AM   #109 (permalink)
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Ubuntu finally grew on me after Pear Linux. i am now running the official 12.10 on my Toshiba
Nick, you won't mind if I have a HUGE GRIN on my face right now, will you?

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(Windows 8 and its many partitions and EFI crap are GONE!)
Bye-bye!

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now all i have to do is rid the ugly out of it (who designs the default interface anyway?) and relocate the launcher to the bottom where i like it and i'm on my way
KDE, Nick, KDE. Just try it. Install the Kubuntu components (via Synaptic is easiest, but apt-get will work, too) and give it a try.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:54 AM   #110 (permalink)
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i am not a big fan of KDE either. right now my biggest issue is finding additional themes and relocating the bar to the bottom but neither option seems to exist. haven't used KDE since Red Hat 7.

i'm really addicted to sudo apt-get. if there is one thing about Ubuntu that is literally irresistable that is it. found out how the 'add apt' command works too so future lifecycle woes are gone later on in life. i find myself in terminal more than Software Center (for some reason Wine fails to install in Software Center but does just fine in terminal...)
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Old January 16th, 2013, 01:02 AM   #111 (permalink)
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i am not a big fan of KDE either. right now my biggest issue is finding additional themes and relocating the bar to the bottom but neither option seems to exist. haven't used KDE since Red Hat 7
EVERYTHING is customizable in KDE. And it's changed A LOT since you last used it. You have nothing to lose installing the Kubuntu components and firing up under KDE.

It's astonishingly beautiful and endlessly--truly infinitely--customizable with themes, colors, widgets, placement of objects...it just goes on and on.

If you give it a fair try and still don't like it, remove it. Frankly, though, I'd be surprised that anyone who's actually played with its myriad of options and understands how much they can do with them WOULDN'T like it.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:14 PM   #112 (permalink)
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installing KDE and its specific apps won't break my STO on Wine would it? i'm afraid to do anything that would mess that up. never installed a window manager before, so i am unsure if, like Android, i would simply get a prompt to select a new launcher or if it would be far more complicated than i'd like?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:26 PM   #113 (permalink)
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installing KDE and its specific apps won't break my STO on Wine would it? i'm afraid to do anything that would mess that up. never installed a window manager before, so i am unsure if, like Android, i would simply get a prompt to select a new launcher or if it would be far more complicated than i'd like?
No, no, no. Not complicated at all.

First, KDE is not a window manager, it's a desktop environment. It's not something you run from within GNOME/Unity/whatever, it *REPLACES* those. You can install it while you're running Ubuntu, either by installing KDE, per se, or--and I think this would be a better choice for you right now--by installing the Kubuntu and KDE components via Synaptic.

Once installed, you'll be able to choose which DE you want to use when you're logging in. You can also set which DE to use as your default so you only need to pick one when you feel like using a different one. I, obviously, use KDE as my default, but when I feel like using one of the other DEs I've installed, I pick one and log in with it.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:35 PM   #114 (permalink)
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i do not login? it is automatic does that change how it will auto-select? pardon my n00b here, also what is the diff between a WM and DE?

another problem:

>sudo apt-get install kde

Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Package kde is not available, but is referred to by another package.
This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
is only available from another source

E: Package 'kde' has no installation candidate
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Old January 16th, 2013, 12:49 PM   #115 (permalink)
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i do not login? it is automatic does that change how it will auto-select?
At some point you chose to automatically log in. You'll need to undo that. Some Unity person will need to help if you can't figure it out. It should be somewhere in your system settings. On Kubuntu it's under System Settings | Login Screen | Convenience.

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pardon my n00b here, also what is the diff between a WM and DE?
This can be kind of fuzzy. But in our discussion, KDE is the total environment you see and use. A window manager can be run on top of a desktop environment.

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another problem:

>sudo apt-get install kde

Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Package kde is not available, but is referred to by another package.
This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
is only available from another source

E: Package 'kde' has no installation candidate
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One word--which I THINK I've already said : Synaptic. Use Synaptic to first search for and then install the essential components for Kubuntu and KDE; it'll do much of the work for you [if you've set your preferences appropriately], automatically selecting packages that need to be installed, too.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 01:14 PM   #116 (permalink)
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your definition of Mainframe sounds more like ENIACs from the late 1940s
Actually, the old vacuum tube and relay computers relied heavily on telco-style relay racks for holding the various components.

The word "mainframe" comes from the construction methods used to build large, mass-produced computers of the day. For those who have seen one with the decorative panels off, the structural framework is visible. Seeing it that way makes it obvious why they're named that way!

Over the years, packaging has changed, so there are no hard and fast distinctions between what's a mainframe and what's not. In the '80s and 90s a mainframe class machine used more robust (and more costly) TTL chips for the CPU and other key components, while cheaper computers used CMOS VLSI circuits that offer more "bang for the buck". These days what we usually call a mainframe is any machine that's built to run a mainframe operating system.

When minicomputers came out around 1970, the main distinction between a mainframe and a mini was cost. Mainframes typically exceeded $1,000,000US to buy, and were often leased to the customer. Minicomputers cost less than that, and were unable to run mainframe software. The classic minicomputer consists of several modules mounted on rack rails in one or more cabinets. I had a friend who worked for AT&T and had a 6-cabinet VAX computer in his living room.

It's not proper to call any computer that uses serial cables and terminals a server. The word server comes from client/server technology that came out of local area networking and the Internet. Client/server operates on a network, and requires a computer with the client software running on it in order to work.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 01:18 PM   #117 (permalink)
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Moody, most packages i try to install that way (Synaptic is Software Center right?) fail. Wine was one of them. it downloaded, hung on 'waiting for install' and then said 'failed'. in terminal it worked fine though. i did seem to successfully install kubuntu-desktop but i am still doing things on this one that i don't want to lose yet (browser tabs of ubuntu pages i am still learning from) but will see if that worked

Speed, this is why i do not refer to older 1970s UNIX/Xenix CPUs (and their serially connected dumb terminals) as 'servers'. i've always called them mainframes. not sure what else to call them--this isn't the 1940s anymore so the term is likely to have changed to apply to more than one singular machine type.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 01:31 PM   #118 (permalink)
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It's not proper to call any computer that uses serial cables and terminals a server. The word server comes from client/server technology that came out of local area networking and the Internet. Client/server operates on a network, and requires a computer with the client software running on it in order to work.
Then I must have possessed prescience! Otherwise, how did I come up with the term server? We're talking about the mid-'80s, when the Internet wasn't a factor at all in 99.99% of people's lives. As for LANs, that's not at all what I created at the furniture store, i.e., we did NOT have a server with PCs connected to it. We had [what I've always called] a server, with dumb terminals connected to it. I also remember calling it "the console," but typically referred to it as "the server." So where did I get that?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 03:24 PM   #119 (permalink)
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BTW finally got KDE going, love the widgets (those are new) but is there a similar thing to the Unity Launcher that can replace the Windows 95 Start Menu layout (one of the things that keeps making KDE look dated to me)? i kinda liked Unity's launcher just not how it was always on the left side?

Disregard that, got a widget solution that looks nicer than a panel
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Old January 16th, 2013, 03:42 PM   #120 (permalink)
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BTW finally got KDE going
Great!

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love the widgets (those are new)
To YOU. They've been around for a long time now.

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but is there a similar thing to the Unity Launcher that can replace the Windows 95 Start Menu layout (one of the things that keeps making KDE look dated to me)? i kinda liked Unity's launcher just not how it was always on the left side?
Like I've said, you have to explore all the options--the ZILLIONS of them--to really understand how versatile KDE is. OF COURSE you can get rid of the KDE application launcher menu. You can make your desktop(s) look however you WANT them to look. Play around a bit, okay?

Also, every desktop can have its own wallpaper, widgets, etc. I don't know and, frankly don't care, if Unity does this too.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 03:46 PM   #121 (permalink)
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i just found out late you can remove the panel. now having fun with the widget toys
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Old January 16th, 2013, 08:53 PM   #122 (permalink)
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KDE is a very nice interface but it is too bloated for my taste. I'm currently running Mageia 3 beta with Gnome 3, giving G3 a chance since I was a big G2 fan. I wanted to install Digikam to use with my camera and it was going to install 173 or so files. Why on earth does it need to install that many files just for one app???

I do know you can install both DE or all environments, but if I'm using one I really don't like installing much of the other one. It's just a personal thing with me.

Now that Fedora 18 is out, I'm thinking about giving it a shot, the G3 version of course.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:08 PM   #123 (permalink)
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KDE3 is great. KDE4 is like being forced to use Windows Vista with every useless (and buggy) gadget enabled. It's like a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:25 PM   #124 (permalink)
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KDE is a very nice interface but it is too bloated for my taste. I'm currently running Mageia 3 beta with Gnome 3, giving G3 a chance since I was a big G2 fan.
I never thought of it as bloated until I tried running 11.10 on an old laptop. At any rate, I love KDE and don't care if it is bloated, because it runs great on all my computers and is, in my opinion, the prettiest DE.

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I wanted to install Digikam to use with my camera and it was going to install 173 or so files. Why on earth does it need to install that many files just for one app???
digiKam has many, many abilities and features, so the files are needed for its various functions. Have a quick look at my installed files for digikam and digikam-data, respectively; they'll give you an idea of what they're needed for:

Code:
/.
/etc
/etc/apparmor.d
/etc/apparmor.d/usr.sbin.mysqld-digikam
/usr
/usr/bin
/usr/bin/cleanup_digikamdb
/usr/bin/digikam
/usr/bin/digitaglinktree
/usr/include
/usr/include/digikam
/usr/include/digikam/albumdb.h
/usr/include/digikam/bcgfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/bcgsettings.h
/usr/include/digikam/blurfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/cbfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/cbsettings.h
/usr/include/digikam/cietonguewidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/colorgradientwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/dcolor.h
/usr/include/digikam/dcolorblend.h
/usr/include/digikam/dcolorcomposer.h
/usr/include/digikam/dcolorpixelaccess.h
/usr/include/digikam/dcursortracker.h
/usr/include/digikam/dgradientslider.h
/usr/include/digikam/dimg.h
/usr/include/digikam/dimgthreadedfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/dlogoaction.h
/usr/include/digikam/dmetadata.h
/usr/include/digikam/dpopupmenu.h
/usr/include/digikam/dprogressdlg.h
/usr/include/digikam/dzoombar.h
/usr/include/digikam/exifwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/hslfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/iccpreviewwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/iccprofileinfodlg.h
/usr/include/digikam/iccprofilewidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/icctransform.h
/usr/include/digikam/imagecurves.h
/usr/include/digikam/imagedialog.h
/usr/include/digikam/imageiface.h
/usr/include/digikam/imagelevels.h
/usr/include/digikam/imageplugin.h
/usr/include/digikam/iptcwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/knotificationwrapper.h
/usr/include/digikam/libsinfodlg.h
/usr/include/digikam/makernotewidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/mdkeylistviewitem.h
/usr/include/digikam/metadatalistview.h
/usr/include/digikam/metadatalistviewitem.h
/usr/include/digikam/metadatawidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/nrfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/nrsettings.h
/usr/include/digikam/paniconwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/photoinfocontainer.h
/usr/include/digikam/previewwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam/rawcameradlg.h
/usr/include/digikam/refocusfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/rexpanderboxexclusive.h
/usr/include/digikam/searchtextbar.h
/usr/include/digikam/sharpenfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/sidebar.h
/usr/include/digikam/statusled.h
/usr/include/digikam/statusnavigatebar.h
/usr/include/digikam/statusprogressbar.h
/usr/include/digikam/template.h
/usr/include/digikam/unsharpmaskfilter.h
/usr/include/digikam/xmpwidget.h
/usr/include/digikam_export.h
/usr/lib
/usr/lib/kde4
/usr/lib/kde4/digikamimageplugin_color.so
/usr/lib/kde4/digikamimageplugin_decorate.so
/usr/lib/kde4/digikamimageplugin_enhance.so
/usr/lib/kde4/digikamimageplugin_fxfilters.so
/usr/lib/kde4/digikamimageplugin_transform.so
/usr/lib/kde4/digikamnepomukservice.so
/usr/lib/kde4/kio_digikamalbums.so
/usr/lib/kde4/kio_digikamdates.so
/usr/lib/kde4/kio_digikamsearch.so
/usr/lib/kde4/kio_digikamtags.so
/usr/lib/kde4/libexec
/usr/lib/kde4/libexec/digikamdatabaseserver
/usr/lib/kde4/plugins
/usr/lib/kde4/plugins/marble
/usr/lib/kde4/plugins/marble/ExternalDraw.so
/usr/lib/libdigikamcore.so
/usr/lib/libdigikamcore.so.1
/usr/lib/libdigikamcore.so.1.0.0
/usr/lib/libdigikamdatabase.so
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/usr/lib/libdigikamdatabase.so.1.0.0
/usr/sbin
/usr/sbin/mysqld-digikam
/usr/share
/usr/share/applications
/usr/share/applications/kde4
/usr/share/applications/kde4/digikam.desktop
/usr/share/doc
/usr/share/doc/digikam
/usr/share/doc/digikam/changelog.Debian.gz
/usr/share/doc/digikam/copyright
/usr/share/lintian
/usr/share/lintian/overrides
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/usr/share/man/man1/digikam.1.gz
/usr/share/man/man1/digikamthemedesigner.1.gz
/usr/share/man/man1/digitaglinktree.1.gz
/usr/share/menu
/usr/share/menu/digikam
/usr/share/pixmaps
/usr/share/pixmaps/digikam-16.xpm
/usr/share/pixmaps/digikam.xpm

Code:
/.
/usr
/usr/share
/usr/share/doc
/usr/share/doc/digikam-data
/usr/share/doc/digikam-data/changelog.Debian.gz
/usr/share/doc/digikam-data/copyright
/usr/share/kde4
/usr/share/kde4/apps
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/about
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/about/digikam.css
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/about/main.html
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/about/top-left-digikam.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/cameraui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-collection.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-metadata.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-openfile.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-preview.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-rawimport.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-scancollection.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/assistant-tooltips.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/banner-digikam.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/bluejean-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/bothhorz.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/bothvert.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/bricks-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/bricks2-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/burlap-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/canvas-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/cellwood-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/centerheight.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/centerwidth.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/chalk-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/colors-chromablue.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/colors-chromared.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/colors-luma.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/craters-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/curvefree.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/curvemooth.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/dried-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/duplicatebothhorz.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/duplicatebothvert.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/fabric-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/granit-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/histogram-lin.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/histogram-log.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/ice-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/image-full.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/image-selection.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/indicator-gray.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/indicator-green.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/indicator-red.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/leaf-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/logo-cimg.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/logo-digikam.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/logo-exiv2.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/logo-gphoto.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/logo-lcms.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/marble-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/marble-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/marble2-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/metalwire-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/modern-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/moss-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/original.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/paper-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/paper-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/paper2-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/parque-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/pine-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/pink-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/rain-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/rock-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/sample-aix.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/splash-digikam.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/stone-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/stone-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/target.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/togglemouseover.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/wall-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/wall-texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/data/wood-pattern.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/database
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/database/dbconfig.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/database/mysql-global.conf
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikam.notifyrc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamimageplugin_color_ui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamimageplugin_decorate_ui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamimageplugin_enhance_ui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamimageplugin_fxfilters_ui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamimageplugin_transform_ui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamimagewindowui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/digikamui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/adjusthsl.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/adjustlevels.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/adjustrgb.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/albumfolder-importdir.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/albumfolder-importdir2.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/albumfolder-importimages.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/albumfolder-new.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/albumfolder-properties.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/albumfolder-user-trash.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/antivignetting.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/autocorrection.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/blurfx.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/blurimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/bordertool.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/bwtonal.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/channelmixer.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/charcoaltool.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/colorfx.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/colormanagement.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/contrast.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/depth16to8.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/depth8to16.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/distortionfx.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/editimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/embosstool.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/exifinfo.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/filmgrain.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/freerotation.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/hotpixels.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/imagecomment.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/inpainting.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/invertimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/lensautofix.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/noisereduction.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/oilpaint.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/perspective.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/raindrop.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/ratiocrop.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/redeyes.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/restoration.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/sharpenimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/shear.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/superimpose.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/texture.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/tonemap.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/128x128/actions/whitebalance.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/adjustcurves.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/adjusthsl.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/adjustlevels.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/adjustrgb.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/albumfolder-importdir.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/albumfolder-importdir2.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/albumfolder-importimages.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/albumfolder-new.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/albumfolder-properties.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/albumfolder-user-trash.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/antivignetting.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/autocorrection.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/blurfx.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/blurimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/bordertool.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/bqm-add.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/bqm-addqueue.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/bqm-commit.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/bqm-remove.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/bwtonal.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/channelmixer.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/charcoaltool.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/colormanagement.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/contrast.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/imagecomment.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/inpainting.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/invertimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/lensautofix.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/lensdistortion.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/noisereduction.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/oilpaint.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/perspective.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/16x16/actions/ratiocrop.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/22x22
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/22x22/actions/adjustrgb.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/22x22/actions/albumfolder-importdir2.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/22x22/actions/blurimage.png
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/22x22/actions/bordertool.png
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/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/albumfolder-importimages.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/albumfolder-new.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/albumfolder-properties.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/albumfolder-user-trash.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/antivignetting.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/autocorrection.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/blurfx.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/blurimage.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bordertool.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-add.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-addqueue.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-commit.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-diff.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-remove.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-rmqueue.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bqm-update.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/bwtonal.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/channelmixer.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/colormanagement.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/contrast.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/depth16to8.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/depth8to16.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/distortionfx.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/editimage.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/exifinfo.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/filmgrain.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/freerotation.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/hotpixels.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/imagecomment.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/inpainting.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/invertimage.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/lensautofix.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/noisereduction.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/perspective.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/ratiocrop.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/restoration.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/sharpenimage.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/shear.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/superimpose.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/texture.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/tonemap.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/icons/hicolor/scalable/actions/whitebalance.svgz
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/6x6.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-canon.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-casio.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-fujifilm.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-kodak.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-konica-minolta.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-leica.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-nikon.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-olympus.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-panasonic.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-pentax.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-ricoh.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-sigma.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/compact-sony.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/generic.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/rf-leica.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-canon.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-contax.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-hasselblad.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-konica-minolta.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-nikon.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-olympus.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-panasonic.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-pentax.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-samsung.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-schneider.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-sigma.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-sony.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-tamron.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-tokina.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lensfun/slr-ussr.xml
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/lighttablewindowui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/queuemgrwindowui.rc
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Blue
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Clean
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/DLR
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Dark
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/DarkRoom
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Dessert
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Digikasa
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Dreary
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Gray
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Marine
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/OrangeCrush
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Rose
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/themes/Sandy
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/tips
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/utils
/usr/share/kde4/apps/digikam/utils/digikam-camera
/usr/share/kde4/apps/solid
/usr/share/kde4/apps/solid/actions
/usr/share/kde4/apps/solid/actions/digikam-opencamera.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamalbums.protocol
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamdates.protocol
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamimageplugin_color.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamimageplugin_decorate.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamimageplugin_enhance.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamimageplugin_fxfilters.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamimageplugin_transform.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamnepomukservice.desktop
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamsearch.protocol
/usr/share/kde4/services/digikamtags.protocol
/usr/share/kde4/servicetypes
/usr/share/kde4/servicetypes/digikamimageplugin.desktop
I should point out that without digiKam I'd be lost! I use it for managing photos from my DSLR cameras, and I love the way its options allow for doing things, such as automatically creating date-named directories and dumping the appropriate photos into the correct directories. (I use the GIMP for all my image *EDITING* needs.)

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I do know you can install both DE or all environments, but if I'm using one I really don't like installing much of the other one. It's just a personal thing with me.
But that's the great thing about Linux! It's *ALL* about personal taste.

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Now that Fedora 18 is out, I'm thinking about giving it a shot, the G3 version of course.
When you do, how about posting some screenshots in the 'show us your desktop' thread?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:37 PM   #125 (permalink)
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I've always wanted to give KDE a serious go, but sadly linux is limited to my 10in netbook. And last time I tried KDE on that, the whole thing felt too condensed. I'd really like to get a KDE desktop going with a 'real' monitor

I'm thinking of giving ubuntu another go (12.04 is the last one I have) because it's the most updated distro I have saved for day to day use.

But, because I don't like unity too well, I'm thinking I'll be giving some of the more light weight WMs a try (openbox again probably)...

<3 Linux
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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:59 PM   #126 (permalink)
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i like widgets/gadgets--Android got me into them first, and KDE (whatever comes form the 12.10 repos) does not feel bloated! this isn't a very powerful laptop and it can do things as smoothly as in Unity but with levels of customization that makes Android feel primitive in comparison (trust me, a lot has changed since the KDE shipped with my ancient Red Hat 7 complete system discs)

besides, you can turn the bloat off, uninstall what you hate. the widgets are not permenant and not turned on by default. i do like how that annoying top bar is not covering up important parts of Star Trek Online now, i was unable to see how much XP i gained or how much i needed to level up again with that annoying Unity status bar up there being permenant even in fullscreen mode

what i found interesting is that after i installed and shut the system down when i turned it back on i was greeted by the Kubuntu logo and name, instead of the distro i actually installed. first time it did a disk scan (said unmounted unclean, even though i did a proper shutdown first?) the second time it locked up tighter than a drum, some weird kernel panic, third time it was fine. perhaps part of the install but it's fine now

i was able to disable the error (strange, kept getting this random 'Ubuntu 12.10 has encountered an internal error' even though not one program or widget had crashed which was weird) by editing some file to remove the 'apport' feature. i guess it is a lot like the annoying Bug Buddy in Mandriva since it, too, seemed to pop up when nothing was actually wrong, just like Windows 'This program stopped working'. some weird type of crash detection which is a lot of times a false positive. the stupid send crash report was a reminder of MS i hated so bye bye it went.

Unity was not THAT bad, had a nice selection of wallpaper and you can auto-hide the launcher, but the themes were not very flexible, lacked provisions to install new ones, no widget support, and you cannot relocate the launcher when it is visible. gestures seemed no-go, and it was hard to find apps of specific category in the launcher main menu, which resembled Pear Linux's launchpad (but without the organized category list up top) and i ended up using keyboard shortcuts to work around certain programs i couldn't find easily in it, such as the console. in a way it lacked most of the customization and felt very dumbed down, as if for newbies. Reading posts online this whole move to Mint has a lot to do with the change to Unity
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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:21 PM   #127 (permalink)
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I normally use gtkphoto but some reason Mageia doesn't have it in repositories. Mga is only 2 yrs. old or so

I have nothing against KDE, it is one of the best around and have some great apps but I get lost using it. I'm a minimalist and mostly use Openbox/Fluxbox. I have Gnome for the family members to use.

After I started using linux more, then I started using Debian and net install and only added what I needed/wanted. Another reason for this I always had low spec hardware.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:25 PM   #128 (permalink)
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i do adore simplicity but i do not like not having the option to do more. because there will be a time when i want to change stuff besides the wallpaper and two themes. limiting that ability just makes me upset. this is one reason i dumped Windows 8 after finding out Star Trek Online worked fine in Ubuntu. After all, what is Linux without customization? it should not be Unity out of the box. somehow the 'if you don't like it change it' attitude makes me irked. the way Desktop and mobile OS is beginning to resemble a kid's plaything from Fisher Price is really beginning to bug me. at least we are still given the option to install other DEs otherwise i'd truly be miffed. when i tried Ubuntu more recently before committing to it, it was an older version known as Maverick Meerkat. it had Gnome but it still had the dumbed down feel and poo colors that made me feel like i was inside of another's digestive tract. i am not sure who designs the default interface but it looks meant for color blind kids.

not to nitpick but what is it with the animal names for each distro? are they being co-opted by the DeHavilland aircraft company? (they used to name their aircraft after animals as well)

I may have blown away Win8 but in actuality it was a mistake. i resized the partition and then the installer crashed (error number 5, input output error) and when i restarted the installer from scratch it had erased all my partitions and had only a ext4 and a swap. not sure what happened but oh well
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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:32 PM   #129 (permalink)
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I just found this in the show us your desktop thread. Mageia 1 with Openbox, Audacious, Tint2 panel, and conky...wow


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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:45 PM   #130 (permalink)
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not to nitpick but what is it with the animal names for each distro? are they being co-opted by the DeHavilland aircraft company? (they used to name their aircraft after animals as well)
Why not? I mean, what's with all the dessert names for each version of Android? They're in alphabetical order, and IMO are more memorable and distinctive than just numbers...ahem Microsoft..."Windows 8" i'ts not even the 8th version of Windows.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:49 PM   #131 (permalink)
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dunno, it just reminds me of DeHavilland...been done before

now, if they included animal-themes with each version to match its name, that would be interesting
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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:58 PM   #132 (permalink)
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Debian uses the character names from the movie Toy Story for its releases except for Unstable, which is always called Sid.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 11:06 PM   #133 (permalink)
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The reason they call it 'Windows 8' is because it is the eighth NT-Based Windows. they did not count Win 1.x and up as part of the version numbering scheme. it really is confusing though.

1. Windows NT 3.x
2. Windows NT 4.x
3. Windows 2000
4. Windows XP
5. Windows Server
6. Windows Vista
7. Windows 7
8. Windows 8

there is even debate whether Windows versions 1.x to 3.x were actually Operating Systems or apps which simply run on top of MS-DOS (even MS themselves called it the 'Microsoft Windows 3.1 Operating System')
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:06 AM   #134 (permalink)
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It is confusing, because Windows 7 is actually 6.1, and Windows 8 is actually 6.2. Vista was 6.0.

BTW does anyone know what happened to K-Office, the KDE office suite. That seems to have died all of a sudden.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:13 AM   #135 (permalink)
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not to nitpick but what is it with the animal names for each distro? are they being co-opted by the DeHavilland aircraft company? (they used to name their aircraft after animals as well)
Why not? I mean, what's with all the dessert names for each version of Android? They're in alphabetical order
Not exactly. It wasn't until version 5.10, AKA Breezy Badger, that the alphabetical thing started. The first two releases, versions 4.10 and 5.04, were named Warty Warthog and Hoary Hedgehog, respectively.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:21 AM   #136 (permalink)
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BTW does anyone know what happened to K-Office, the KDE office suite. That seems to have died all of a sudden.
This taken from Wikipedia.

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After the Calligra Suite was forked from it in 2010, the KOffice project was seemingly shut down permanently without any official announcement in September 2012.
It never really got the support it should have anyway. I think Openoffice/Libreoffice was getting the users.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:26 AM   #137 (permalink)
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The reason they call it 'Windows 8' is because it is the eighth NT-Based Windows. they did not count Win 1.x and up as part of the version numbering scheme. it really is confusing though.

1. Windows NT 3.1
1.5. Windows NT 3.5x
2. Windows NT 4.x
3. Windows 2000
4. Windows XP / Server 2003
X. Windows Server <<-- NO
5. Windows Vista / Server 2008
6. Windows 7 / Server 2008 R2
?. Windows 8
It's especially confusing when you count a product version as a release.

Every major release is available in a workstation and a server version. Although later schemes are ridiculously confusing in their naming, there's a one-to-one match at each level. Windows 7 / Server 2008R2 is version 6.1.

For those who don't know, there was no Windows NT prior to 3.1. Before that, OS/2 was the chosen successor to MS-DOS. Why Microsoft broke with IBM and made its own product can fill a book, but that's the gist of it.

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there is even debate whether Windows versions 1.x to 3.x were actually Operating Systems or apps which simply run on top of MS-DOS (even MS themselves called it the 'Microsoft Windows 3.1 Operating System')
Versions 1 & 2 were little more than ANSI art shells (like DOSHELL). They added no OS functionality. Windows 3.1 is a different story.

Although Windows 3.0 was the first to look like more than a glorified DOS program, and had some '286 Protected Mode support, it was 3.1 that started piling in the stuff that a modern OS is made of: virtual memory, multitasking, abstraction layers etc. The 32-bit disk drivers and Win32s that came with Windows for Workgroups 3.11 were a dress rehearsal for Windows 95. Windows 3.1/3.11 weren't complete operating systems, but they were getting close.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:31 AM   #138 (permalink)
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(KOffice) never really got the support it should have anyway. I think Openoffice/Libreoffice was getting the users.
Yup. KOffice was so well hidden that most users never knew it was there.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:58 AM   #139 (permalink)
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I normally use gtkphoto but some reason Mageia doesn't have it in repositories. Mga is only 2 yrs. old or so
digiKam is so perfect for me, I rarely even try anything else.

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I have nothing against KDE, it is one of the best around and have some great apps but I get lost using it.
Can you expand on that a bit? How/when/where do you get lost? I'm actually having a hard time picturing this, because everything about KDE seems so intuitive and straightforward--to me.

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I'm a minimalist
SO AM I! Have you seen my most recent desktop shots? They're in the desktop thread, but here:





Look at them full size so you can see that there's NOTHING on any of my nine desktops--no widgets, no icons, nothing; everything's confined to one panel at the bottom of each desktop.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 02:50 AM   #140 (permalink)
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It's a personal thing with me, if I'm using Gnome I don't like to install KDE or Xfce stuff and vice versa. I have at times for certain programs. By getting lost, KDE installs too much software by default. 3-4 music players, video players, etc.

By minimalistic I mean the whole exprience, installing Openbox/Fluxbox or similar window manager. Install programs that doesn't have lots of dependencies, such as Firefox, Audacious, VLC etc. Programs not tied to KDE, Gnome or XFCE. It have been times I will install one of those programs, but not many.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 03:04 AM   #141 (permalink)
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It's a personal thing with me, if I'm using Gnome I don't like to install KDE or Xfce stuff and vice versa. I have at times for certain programs. By getting lost, KDE installs too much software by default. 3-4 music players, video players, etc.

By minimalistic I mean the whole exprience, installing Openbox/Fluxbox or similar window manager. Install programs that doesn't have lots of dependencies, such as Firefox, Audacious, VLC etc. Programs not tied to KDE, Gnome or XFCE. It have been times I will install one of those programs, but not many.
I installed KDE 4.8.5 onto my Linux Mint system, which uses Mate by default, to see what it's like. I found it didn't actually install much bloat at all, just the base system. Didn't even get KDE file manager(Dolphin) by default. That's why I enquired earlier, what happened to KOffice? It wasn't in the Mint/Ubuntu repos. And it's a couple years since I last looked at KDE.

If you install a KDE based distro like Kubuntu, then it will probably full of KDE specific software and widgets, rather than GTK/Mate/Gnome based stuff.

One thing I've certainly noticed with KDE, is that it takes significantly longer to get going than Mate. It's 40-45 seconds from when X starts, to when KDE is fully ready. First the hard drive icon appears, then the screwdriver and spanner icon, etc.. and eventually the desktop gradually appears. 70 Mongolian students were staring at it this morning on the classroom projector and screen, probably wondering what was going on with teacher's laptop. Mate is fully loaded in about 10-15 seconds, and LXDE in about 5 seconds after X starts. To me it seemed rather like going from Windows XP to Windows Vista.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 07:52 AM   #142 (permalink)
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forget KOffice, what happened to OpenOffice? it seems to have been replaced by LibreOffice?

As for those complaining about KDE bloat, let's not forget how long it takes to load up a Windows 7 desktop after login, at least in KDE i can start browsing the web and opening some MP3s long before all the widgets have fully loaded up

there are also means to speed things up just like there are in Android. minimizing what starts when X starts, uninstalling, hell turning widget support off entirely. it all depends on your hardware, much like PC Gaming. either you can have the graphics all the way up or you turn it all the way down depending on the hardware--either the game looks nice or plays well in many cases. some have to accept certain tradeoffs depending on what they got--if you got a cheap budget laptop you can't have it all. or vice versa, just like budget-vs-expensive Android devices

Moody, how the hell do you get that cool Compiz pentagon effect going? i installed it a lot of times but it NEVER loads up that way! it always seems limited to window minimize/maximize and open/close transitions....i must be missing something
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Old January 17th, 2013, 09:11 AM   #143 (permalink)
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forget KOffice, what happened to OpenOffice? it seems to have been replaced by LibreOffice?
OpenOffice is still around, still developed and supported. It's in the Ubuntu repos or can be downloaded from OOs website. LibreOffice was forked from OpenOffice, which was owned by Oracle at the time. It's now Apache. Not like KOffice, that's dead. I use LibreOffice, because it seems to be better for MS Office compatibility and PPTs downloaded from Baidu Wenku.

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As for those complaining about KDE bloat, let's not forget how long it takes to load up a Windows 7 desktop after login, at least in KDE i can start browsing the web and opening some MP3s long before all the widgets have fully loaded up

there are also means to speed things up just like there are in Android. minimizing what starts when X starts, uninstalling, hell turning widget support off entirely. it all depends on your hardware, much like PC Gaming. either you can have the graphics all the way up or you turn it all the way down depending on the hardware--either the game looks nice or plays well in many cases. some have to accept certain tradeoffs depending on what they got--if you got a cheap budget laptop you can't have it all. or vice versa, just like budget-vs-expensive Android devicest
Most of the time I'm using applications, so don't care so much about desktop eyecandy and widgets. Chrome looks exactly the same whether it's running on OpenBox, LXDE or KDE4. Similarly for LibreOffice or MS Office running on Wine.

Waiting 40-50 seconds for KDE4 to complete it's startup sequence and animations can be a long time when I'm wanting to get started with the lessons, as I found out this morning. Even Windows 7 and 8 fully booted quicker on the same PC. That's why I've taken to using LXDE for this. The laptop I'm using is indeed a budget PC, a Lenovo S110, but on the other hand it's very lightweight, small and easily carried around, barely larger than an Apple iPad.

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Moody, how the hell do you get that cool Compiz pentagon effect going? i installed it a lot of times but it NEVER loads up that way! it always seems limited to window minimize/maximize and open/close transitions....i must be missing something
Personal preference, but I like my applications to minimise/maximise/open/close instantly. Don't care so much for fancy animations and transitions here.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:33 PM   #144 (permalink)
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Moody, how the hell do you get that cool Compiz pentagon effect going? i installed it a lot of times but it NEVER loads up that way! it always seems limited to window minimize/maximize and open/close transitions....i must be missing something
Follow this path: System Settings | Desktop Effects. Then plunge in and start trying its ZILLIONS of options/combinations.

Go to its "All Effects" tab and explore the "Desktop Cube" option. Look at, and experiment with, its options.

Note that you have to, obviously, have more than one desktop or there won't be anything to display on the cube. How many sides the cube has depends on how many desktops you have. I always set my desktops at 9, so my cubes have 9 sides.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:37 PM   #145 (permalink)
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Personal preference, but I like my applications to minimise/maximise/open/close instantly. Don't care so much for fancy animations and transitions here.
Me either. The only effect I use is the cube; I don't do any of the fancy animations, like fire or whatever, when minimizing/maximizing a window. I like everything to JUST HAPPEN when I want it to. I don't care about special effects.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 12:40 PM   #146 (permalink)
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Hey everybody, I started a new thread dedicated to Linux questions/topics/answers/etc. How about moving over there to talk about all these random Linux things?
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Old January 17th, 2013, 08:02 PM   #147 (permalink)
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now, if they included animal-themes with each version to match its name, that would be interesting
They actually used to do this. There were a few wallpapers included that would have a very stylistic rendering of said animal. It was something that I originally found very 'warm' about Ubuntu.

I know it's in 8.04 (last cd I have to include it [[I think]] )
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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:21 AM   #148 (permalink)
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It's a personal thing with me, if I'm using Gnome I don't like to install KDE or Xfce stuff and vice versa. I have at times for certain programs. By getting lost, KDE installs too much software by default. 3-4 music players, video players, etc.

By minimalistic I mean the whole exprience, installing Openbox/Fluxbox or similar window manager. Install programs that doesn't have lots of dependencies, such as Firefox, Audacious, VLC etc. Programs not tied to KDE, Gnome or XFCE. It have been times I will install one of those programs, but not many.
AFAIK KDE doesn't use a separate installer; it's installed by the distro. Don't blame KDE for the distro maintainer's decisions.

To be fair, Xfce has nothing to do with KDE, and uses the GTK+2 libraries that would come with the GNOME install. Audacious uses the GTK+2 or GTK+3 (depending on version) libraries that GNOME uses, but which are just excess bagage to KDE installs. (Equally unacceptable from a KDE user's POV.) The last time I checked, Mozilla has mandatory GTK dependencies in Linux, and VLC uses the Qt libraries.

By the same token, applications like AmaroK and DigiKam don't require the entire KDE environment to be installed, just the Qt libraries.

If you look at the dependencies list for lots of popular X programs, you'll find that most of them use one or more popular visual libraries (like WxWidgets) and/or media players like XMMS (using GTK+1). The average Linux/X install is going to have lots of support libraries, even the "minimal" ones.

It's really not fair to say that programs that use one set of libraries are automatically better than those that use a different set of libraries just because you prefer the desktop environment that also uses the same libraries. Qt got a bad rap due to the less than 100% FOSS Qt library, but that was resolved ages ago! KDE4 may suck, but that's not reason enough to boycott all Qt-based programs.
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Old January 29th, 2013, 12:45 AM   #149 (permalink)
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I could have sworn in Ubuntu I was able to access the windows file system on my dual boot laptop. Is there a reason I can't on Xubutu running xfce?
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Old January 29th, 2013, 11:09 AM   #150 (permalink)
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I could have sworn in Ubuntu I was able to access the windows file system on my dual boot laptop. Is there a reason I can't on Xubutu running xfce?
Do you have the correct drivers installed? Is the partition mounted?
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