If they figure out root, doesn't Motorola/Google just need to release and update to the phone that has a different password, or can they still use the exploit?
If they figure out root, doesn't Motorola/Google just need to release and update to the phone that has a different password, or can they still use the exploit?
well, if the phone is simply rooted you should receive all OTAs just fine. the potential for a problem would come when you flashed a custom ROM... but any good cook will disable OTAs.
c) I find it implausible that someone would be able to point at a droid and say "oooo! lookz! A DROID! I'm going to steal it and sell it on the BLACK MARKET" when you can go get one at frickin' verizon.
There is still a large amount of confusion in regards to the rooting devices. Hopefully this post will clear up most of it.
Why "root" anything?
If you're wondering why someone would need root access, then you probably do not need root access yourself and could skip this long post.
If you're still curious as to why then look at it this way, do you allow your ISP to tell you what you can do with your computer? Do they get to dictate what operating system you run on the hardware you payed for? Hells no!
That's like purchasing a cup of coffee, then discovering that it is locked inside a metal container and the only way to drink it is through a provided straw. WTH? I don't want to drink my coffee through a damn straw, I payed for it why can't I just drink it the normal way?
What's the password?
There is no password involved. It's not like if we had some magical password would be able to go to Settings > Login as Root. Don't think of root access as an administrative user. Think of it as a level of security clearance. And that security clearance is simply not granted to anyone using, or any application running on top of, the stock Motorola Android OS.
How would I "root" the phone?
The only way to gain root access is for someone to find an attack vector, a hole in Motorola's "firewall", that will allow one to execute commands as the root user. Once a vector is found people will be able to grant root access to themselves and programs they select, giving them full control over the device just as Motorola intended for us not to do.
Finding the attack vector is insanely hard. But once it's found there will be many websites posting easy-to-follow instructions on how to "root your Droid".
Does rooting a device have it's risks?
Yes. If Motorola or Verizon finds out they will probably void your warranty. Luckily you generally COULD flash a default ROM back on the phone before sending/taking it in and they will be none the wiser. Additionally most people root their devices so that they can install custom ROM's. Unfortunately, anytime you flash something to ROM you run a small risk of completely bricking said device. Luckily, that risk has been mitigated with backups and other handy tools.
Does it decrease the security of the phone?
No, unless you are not very street smart about computer security, in which case yes it could. However, for those of us that are knowledgeable this can actually increase the security of our phone. For example, we can plug security holes as soon as they are found because we do not have to wait on official OS updates.
@eraser Thank you for posting that. I was going to say something, but figured I might be feeding the troll.
Last edited by Jedakiah; November 18th, 2009 at 04:42 PM.
What's the password?
There is no password involved. It's not like if we had some magical password would be able to go to Settings > Login as Root. Don't think of root access as an administrative user. Think of it as a level of security clearance. And that security clearance is simply not granted to anyone using, or any application running on top of, the stock Motorola Android OS.
...
root is a user account, why shouldn't it be that easy unless they disabled root entirely?
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like I said before, just looks like a "bootloader" enabled feature from the last few pages, but you would need the bootloader and config for the devices, etc.
Don't think we have access to functionality of what to do when the phone firsts get a signal it has a call... right now the phone automatically accepts it and that sucks.
We should have 100% control and that means deciding whether we want to have our phone recognize the signal or just reject it, just like Mclean does for the iphone.
Why do you need to buy out your contract to root the phone?
You don't, The is for the guy to sacrifice his phone to try to find a why to copy/modify/trace the nvram/bootrom from the phone using what appears to be a jtag port on the main board of the phone. The only way to get to the pins is to completely disassemble the phone.
i'm not the most tech savy person alive (somehow i'm technically in IT though) so i have a question. the only thing i can think of that would be a plus for me personally would be tethering. how does that work on a rooted phone? does that mean you can tether without having to pay VZ? so anytime i hook my phone to my computer i can get online assuming i have a signal?
i'm not the most tech savy person alive (somehow i'm technically in IT though) so i have a question. the only thing i can think of that would be a plus for me personally would be tethering. how does that work on a rooted phone? does that mean you can tether without having to pay VZ? so anytime i hook my phone to my computer i can get online assuming i have a signal?
You don't need to root to tether. Download PDAnet.
Rooting will allow us to flash custom roms, make modifications to the core apps, etc.
You don't need to root to tether. Download PDAnet.
Rooting will allow us to flash custom roms, make modifications to the core apps, etc.
thanks for the response, i found a thread talking about that app literally as i got the email with your response in it. sorry for the noobness. thanks again
It would allow us to clean off our phone from the unwanted facebook crap and all the other annoying programs we wouldn't use. (those of us who don't use it anyway.)
There are a ton of other reasons I have for wanting to root my phone, but that is definitely one of them. I think there are at least 5 apps on here that I don't need or want, but the phone won't let me delete them.
__________________ Blogging: Never before have so many people with so little to say said so much to so few.
root is a user account, why shouldn't it be that easy unless they disabled root entirely?
While I have not browsed but a fraction of the source code, I find it probable that they have done away with unnecessary protocols like user accounts.
Because we are not dealing with the command line I think it would be helpful for at least newbies to view root access as a security clearance level, and not as a user account that if only they had the password they would be able to log into it.
Tehtering
As previously mentioned you can already tether your phone to your computer without root access and without paying Verizon's exorbitant monthly fee.
However to do this you need to have software running on both your phone and your computer, and a bluetooth signal or USB cable. The advantage of tethering a rooted phone is that you can setup your cellphone as a wireless access point. Meaning you can connect to your phones internet from your laptop exactly like you would connect to your wireless router. Pretty freaking cool, especially since your wireless signal will travel a lot farther than Bluetooth and be faster.
Sadly, your internet connection speed through tethering will not be any faster than your phone's. Something to note is that paying Verizon to allow tethering might actually get you tangible benefits, in the form of increased throughput and lower latency (much faster internet).
in an attempt to make me and everyone else learn more, i decided to make the first post a bit more informative to the topic of rooting. (after all, who's gonna want to donate towards something they just don't understand)
When you guys mention the phone becoming bricked, you make it sound like the phone will become completely useless and unfixable. Am I just reading into this wrong?
I am new to the android platform, but when I would "brick" my blackberry I would simply just flash a default OS and be on my way and try again. Can this not be done on "bricked" android phones?
A true brick with any device means it is gone for good. The term gets thrown around a little to loosely.
__________________ So I'm guessin' there's questions that need addressin' like how he fresh in the adolescence and wreckin em' Rules & Guidelines, Zero Tolerance Policy.
i guess, technically, SOME people would still be able to recover your phone if your rooting goes bad. but these people are probably not spending their time on forums, because they're busy creating Androids.
Well some of the posts above are ignorant to the OS and gaining root.
If gaining root, is truly gaining the pwd for the "root" user or whatever it's called, it will happen.
Let's just be thankful that we don't have ssh enabled for a rick roll, like on iphone.
Again, I'm still investigating a lot, and I've been around linux systems since the 80's, and do this isht for a living, as in compiling kernels/programs.
IDE is more java based, but a native level c program with all the bells and whistles is what we need more than rooting
Totally sorry for being an ass... But Linux wasn't around in the 80's at all.. I've used it since 98, and it started in 91.. I run slackware which has been around since shortly after it's birth... Being able to log into root is not doing anything more then being able to control your phone like it's yours... Messing with the droid now, i feel a bit like logging into the libraries computer.. I can pull up a terminal but I'm not able to most of the things that i take for granted on my computer at home.. even though it's running the same kernel... and the commands are there.. they are just locked out...
The bottom line is.. we should be able to use our products that we pay a lot of money for... So that guy that acted like it was some sort of horrible thing that we would want to do this.. is talking out of total ignorance... and shouldn't spread his ignorance around..
[COLOR=Black]There's a group of people working towards rooting the Droid, and they've set up a Paypal account to get donations towards paying $450 for paying off the ETF + fees on one of the guy's Droids. then he can move forward with reverse engineering it. here's his plan:
Id be perfectly happy with the droid as is IF I could screen capture on the go without root access... seems silly that there is no app for that.
Id be perfectly happy with the droid as is IF I could screen capture on the go without root access... seems silly that there is no app for that.
There is. I can't remember what it is called, though. Do some poking around with the search on this forum. I think the thread was something like "Show us your home screen".
Yes. Rooting the Droid is like the kernel hacks for the PSP (I'm not really all that familiar with them), or like the "Game Cards" that are for the Nintendo DS that you put a SD memory card into and boot the SD off of the memory card.
What Rooting will do is like has been said before it will provide "Root" access to the Droid. All of the settings, features, and options (A lot of which 90% of the people out there will never mess with) will be available for the tinkering with.
It's a bit tedious to explain, but in a nutshell the phone goes through a certain sequence on power on/boot up. At this time the phone is looking at different things like the memory and the SD card, and intializing the memory card etc (so it can read it). Rooting is where a reverse engineer looks closely at what information is being called/looked up and sees where he can substitute it or change it. Doing that can make errors happen, or provide different results. It's a bit more complicated, but in the end it will allow us end users to be able to load whatever software we want on our phones, as well as make changes that would otherwise be impossible.
A few cool examples:
Other Operating Systems
Changing the Camera's Zoom to use the Volume Rocker instead of screen
Probably better control over applications and power usage (BETTER BATTERY LIFE)
Multi-Touch
I'm new to the whole PDA thing, so I can't think of a bunch just a few that I'd like. It's very similar to the "Modding" an Xbox. It'll let you put what you want on the device that YOU PAID $150 to $400+ to own, and is rightfully yours.
I'm FOR Rooting. It's like buying a car and Toyota telling you, NOPE, you can ONLY have a factory radio, not allowed to change it to aftermarket, or the wheels or well you get the idea. You'll be able to change a TON of stuff.
There is. I can't remember what it is called, though. Do some poking around with the search on this forum. I think the thread was something like "Show us your home screen".
ORLY I thought the only way to do screen caps, was to download the drivers, Java, and the Android SDK and run DDMS.bat, connect to the phone via USB and capture the screen that way... *goes to the search button* That would be sweet. I already uploaded a bunch of screen caps to Androlib because a bunch of sweet apps didn't have screen caps (Anywhere GPS Text, a few screens for Wifi Analyzer, Gasbot etc).
Moderators were unsure what to do on this one and asked us to look at it. Rob and I reviewed it, talked and decided to leave it - but with this post put in. I will edit it into the original post as well.
Donate to this fund at your own risk. By leaving the thread intact we are not saying we endorse this project (though do hope it works out well ). As per usual - keep it civil. I know there are a few unhappy with the solicitation. All talk to this project of rooting the Droid are to stay confined to this thread. Other accounts created to promote this cause will (and have already) been banned.
Thanks for understanding.
__________________
Every forum should have a Phases.
Last edited by Phases; November 22nd, 2009 at 11:28 PM.
The bottom line is.. we should be able to use our products that we pay a lot of money for... So that guy that acted like it was some sort of horrible thing that we would want to do this.. is talking out of total ignorance... and shouldn't spread his ignorance around..
+1! Don't spread misinformation on here! If you want to play in a safe little sandbox then go get an iphone. We need this thing rooted stat! lol
I'm looking forward to seeing custom ROMs, brings me back to the old days at XDA when I'd flash a new rom every week! The first rom chef who can bring the multi-touch features of the moto milestone to our droids gets a beer on me!
Yes. Rooting the Droid is like the kernel hacks for the PSP (I'm not really all that familiar with them), or like the "Game Cards" that are for the Nintendo DS that you put a SD memory card into and boot the SD off of the memory card.
What Rooting will do is like has been said before it will provide "Root" access to the Droid. All of the settings, features, and options (A lot of which 90% of the people out there will never mess with) will be available for the tinkering with.
It's a bit tedious to explain, but in a nutshell the phone goes through a certain sequence on power on/boot up. At this time the phone is looking at different things like the memory and the SD card, and intializing the memory card etc (so it can read it). Rooting is where a reverse engineer looks closely at what information is being called/looked up and sees where he can substitute it or change it. Doing that can make errors happen, or provide different results. It's a bit more complicated, but in the end it will allow us end users to be able to load whatever software we want on our phones, as well as make changes that would otherwise be impossible.
A few cool examples:
Other Operating Systems
Changing the Camera's Zoom to use the Volume Rocker instead of screen
Probably better control over applications and power usage (BETTER BATTERY LIFE)
Multi-Touch
I'm new to the whole PDA thing, so I can't think of a bunch just a few that I'd like. It's very similar to the "Modding" an Xbox. It'll let you put what you want on the device that YOU PAID $150 to $400+ to own, and is rightfully yours.
I'm FOR Rooting. It's like buying a car and Toyota telling you, NOPE, you can ONLY have a factory radio, not allowed to change it to aftermarket, or the wheels or well you get the idea. You'll be able to change a TON of stuff.
I am for rooting and had a rooted G1. It made it a whole new phone. I understand as a manufacturer though why they don't allow root access by default. How coud they possibly support a product or warranty a product that has had all the default software replaced by a custom ROM that a 14 year old made in his spare time. The potential for causing a lot of damage and more problems exists by allowing complete access to the phone. Go to XDA Developers forum and look at all the posts about people f'ing there phones up trying to root it that don't have the first clue about what they are doing. The phone has enough issues in stock form.
Moderators were unsure what to do on this one and asked us to look at it. Rob and I reviewed it, talked and decided to leave it - but with this post put in. I will edit it into the original post as well.
Donate to this fund at your own risk. By leaving the thread intact we are not saying we endorse this project (though do hope it works out well ). As per usual - keep it civil. I know there are a few unhappy with the solicitation. All talk to this project of rooting the Droid are to stay confined to this thread. Other accounts created to promote this cause will (and have already) been banned.
Thanks for understanding.
i just went ahead and edited the first post, since it seemed like I was getting heat for trying to scam people (???). To be clear, im not a developer, im not trying to figure out how to root the droid, i dont work for any other forum and am therefore not trying to promote other forums, and i was NEVER trying to scam anybody.
i AM the owner of a droid, and have a grasp on the benefits of rooting. therefore, i'd like to have this thing rooted asap so i can get my money's worth (and start having even more fun with the phone). i WAS trying to spread the word that some developers are working towards rooting the droid, and wanted to let people know how they could help.
i just went ahead and edited the first post.......
We know you're not trying to scam people. You're fine. At least that's the view we have. Yes, there was another account created to spam this, that's all it was posting. It was banned. No biggie. That's regular practice.
You can leave your post as it was originally. But leave our disclaimer as well.
Again, it's not a big deal ajm, feel free to put it back. If you edit back to as it was, here was the disclaimer:
Wrapped in red:
------------------------
Note from Admin: Donate to this fund at your own risk. By leaving the thread intact we are not saying we endorse this project (though do hope it works out well ). As per usual - keep it civil. I know there are a few unhappy with the solicitation. All talk to this project of rooting the Droid are to stay confined to this thread. Other accounts created to promote this cause will (and have already) been banned.
Thanks for understanding.
-------------------------
Last edited by Phases; November 22nd, 2009 at 11:54 PM.
There is. I can't remember what it is called, though. Do some poking around with the search on this forum. I think the thread was something like "Show us your home screen".
Either my googlefu is rusty or there isn't. I know I can do it in usb debug but I want to take screen grabs on the go.
ORLY I thought the only way to do screen caps, was to download the drivers, Java, and the Android SDK and run DDMS.bat, connect to the phone via USB and capture the screen that way... *goes to the search button* That would be sweet. I already uploaded a bunch of screen caps to Androlib because a bunch of sweet apps didn't have screen caps (Anywhere GPS Text, a few screens for Wifi Analyzer, Gasbot etc).
It would seem I've made a mistake. As I have not had any use at all for home screen capture at the moment, I also have not been reading close enough. All of the programs and writeups I have come across state very clearly that the phone needs to be rooted in order for it to work.
My apologies.
Ninja Edit: There is a program mentioned which doesn't require root, but I am having no luck finding any more about it, and to be honest... I am getting bored and need video games right now. lol. Anyway, the program is called "Drocap".
Quote:
Just for encouragement I would like to say that on Android Developer Challenge 2 there is an application called 'drocap' that does exactly this - takes screenshots on the phone. This is running on my stock european Hero, so no root access required.
But I have no idea how it works. So - keep looking
I am posting this here only because I haven't been able to receive an answer on other android forums I have been on and I feel someone here can help.
I want to know where is the check for call signal acceptance or denial...
Is it done on the root level or non root level.
Airplane mode rejects the calls signal and the phone doesn't acknowledge the call, we know this. But is this piece of software accessing something that a standard application can not access?
That is my question, will I need root access to customize and decide when I want my phone to accept a call signal, and from who I want it to accept a signal from.
I want control of my device, even the iPhone has control of this type of functionality.
If it requires root to kick a project like this off then I'm donating for sure.
Personally, I have become quite suspicious of this fund. For one thing, I have seen on multiple forums posts from the fundraisers saying "we have $391, only $35 more to go!" then responses on each forum from a unique user stating that they just donated $35... Which means the fund got more than it asked for.
And now that they have more than enough money there is a new fund for incentives to root the droid. Except none of the excess money from the old fund was carried over and we already bought a guy a bloody phone to play around with, what more does he want?
I hope I am wrong, but this just don't seem right.
Personally, I have become quite suspicious of this fund. For one thing, I have seen on multiple forums posts from the fundraisers saying "we have $391, only $35 more to go!" then responses on each forum from a unique user stating that they just donated $35... Which means the fund got more than it asked for.
And now that they have more than enough money there is a new fund for incentives to root the droid. Except none of the excess money from the old fund was carried over and we already bought a guy a bloody phone to play around with, what more does he want?
I hope I am wrong, but this just don't seem right.
Yevar has hit his target of 425 begin the teardown process. He has found out some information and he gets it all written up it will be showing up in the Wiki. The 425 that was raised was to buy that phone and get him out of contract so he can take it apart and reverse engineer it.
The root the droid fund is a different approach that I'm trying to try and attract people to wanting to help out on rooting the droid. Its for a different purpose and is a "winner take all" incentive to the first to find a way to root the droid. This was the same approach that was used to get the iPhone jail-broken.
So in short the 425 we raised is going to Yevar so he can tear down the phone. Any other donations that are raised in the root the droid fund will be awarded to the first person (or team) that roots the droid.
I'm not doing this to make any money. I am actively trying to root the Droid and have tried 10-15 exploits and still havn't gotten it rooted. Should I get lucky and root the Droid I will not keep the money, it will be donated to Hackers for Charity.
With all that said please do not donate anything that you do not feel comfortable with.
I am posting this here only because I haven't been able to receive an answer on other android forums I have been on and I feel someone here can help.
I want to know where is the check for call signal acceptance or denial...
Is it done on the root level or non root level.
Airplane mode rejects the calls signal and the phone doesn't acknowledge the call, we know this. But is this piece of software accessing something that a standard application can not access?
That is my question, will I need root access to customize and decide when I want my phone to accept a call signal, and from who I want it to accept a signal from.
I want control of my device, even the iPhone has control of this type of functionality.
If it requires root to kick a project like this off then I'm donating for sure.
This isn't really a good place to ask your question but I'll answer anyway. Airplane mode completely disables the radio - it does not "reject the call signal."
You can already send calls from a particular number straight to voicemail - look in your contact settings. As far as I know, that's what the iPhone does (via the iBlacklist app), and that's the best you'll be able to do with or without root access.
I have to say, i was getting ready to donate to this fund but when i decided to check up on the alldroid.org forum today, only to find it doesn't exist anymore i'm sure glad i didn't! Not having the xda dev's on board for this phone is a significant handicap
It would allow us to clean off our phone from the unwanted facebook crap and all the other annoying programs we wouldn't use. (those of us who don't use it anyway.)
There are a ton of other reasons I have for wanting to root my phone, but that is definitely one of them. I think there are at least 5 apps on here that I don't need or want, but the phone won't let me delete them.
Corporate Calendar, anyone? Gods know that there are things I want gone from my awesome phone....
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajm144k
in an attempt to make me and everyone else learn more, i decided to make the first post a bit more informative to the topic of rooting. (after all, who's gonna want to donate towards something they just don't understand)
but please, tell me what to correct/add in there!
At this point that post looks pretty good now, ajm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fadelight
There is. I can't remember what it is called, though. Do some poking around with the search on this forum. I think the thread was something like "Show us your home screen".
Never found it.... (see below)
Quote:
Originally Posted by syntrix
I was thinking late 80's but you are right, there was talk in the 90's
How many of you were compiling kernels in the early 90's?
'93 early enough? I got my start in computers using a TI-99/4A, and played around with a couple of HeathKits and Sinclairs over at my best friend's house down the road....
I am going on 39 (March) if it helps put it in perspective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fadelight
Ninja Edit: There is a program mentioned which doesn't require root, but I am having no luck finding any more about it, and to be honest... I am getting bored and need video games right now. lol. Anyway, the program is called "Drocap".
The only way to take screen captures on an Android device requires
root. This application made no indication that it required root, did
not request root permission from me, and proceeded to attempt to gain
root through the use of a vulnerable exploit path (which has since
been patched in Android 1.6, and the Motorola CLIQ; however, I cannot
say about whether this is true on other Android 1.5 devices). I had
this app to review in the Round 1 of voting (I thought I flagged it as
inappropriate, but maybe not), and got it again in Round 2, which
disappointed me. I did not flag it as inappropriate in the second
round because I decided that if Google allowed an exploit to go
through into Round 2, who was I to argue.
That being key. However, I also found the .APK, so....
Anyone want to take up donations for me to try this out to see if it bricks my phone
The Motorola Droid - the first ever Verizon Android Phone - exploded onto the mobile market with an incredibly successful ad campaign that brough Android to the masses. With a huge and vibrant touchscreen, solid metal body, full QWERTY keyboard, 5M... Read More
It would seem I've made a mistake. As I have not had any use at all for home screen capture at the moment, I also have not been reading close enough. All of the programs and writeups I have come across state very clearly that the phone needs to be rooted in order for it to work.
)
