HTC says you should bump charge

[hawley.35]

So I going to buy the Dinc any day now. So I've been doing a lot of research. One of my biggest concerns was battery life. So I emailed HTC support asking them about the whole bump charging and battery drain while the phone in on the charger. Here is the meat of the conversation. Enjoy!

ME: (about the third time I explained the problem)
"... If you place the phone on the charger overnight, the phone will charge to 100% and stop charging. From this point on it will continue to run on battery power discharging the battery. The phone will not restart the charging cycle until it is removed from the charger. This means that when removed from the charger it will not be 100% charged. Is this correct? Is this how the phone is designed, or is this a known issue?"

HTC rep:

"Thank you for your response. You could try to improve the battery life of your device to see if this will fix your issue. 1. Connect the phone to the charger and charge the device until the LED turned green with the phone powered ON. 2. Disconnect the phone, and power it off. 3. Reconnect the phone to the charger, and charged the device until the LED turns green again. 4. Disconnect the phone, power it on, and then power it off. 5. Reconnect the phone to the charger and charge until the LED turns green again. 6. Power on and use. I personally have never heard of this issue before. I have checked with my supervisors and this is not a known issue at this time. Since this is not a known issue, we can give suggestions and troubleshooting options to see what works and what does not."

Sounds like the Bump Charging method to me.

Am i the only one who thinks the phone should run off of A/C power when plugged in? This just doesn't sound right.

 

[quest7]

So I going to buy the Dinc any day now. So I've been doing a lot of research. One of my biggest concerns was battery life. So I emailed HTC support asking them about the whole bump charging and battery drain while the phone in on the charger. Here is the meat of the conversation. Enjoy!

ME: (about the third time I explained the problem)
"... If you place the phone on the charger overnight, the phone will charge to 100% and stop charging. From this point on it will continue to run on battery power discharging the battery. The phone will not restart the charging cycle until it is removed from the charger. This means that when removed from the charger it will not be 100% charged. Is this correct? Is this how the phone is designed, or is this a known issue?"

HTC rep:

"Thank you for your response. You could try to improve the battery life of your device to see if this will fix your issue. 1. Connect the phone to the charger and charge the device until the LED turned green with the phone powered ON. 2. Disconnect the phone, and power it off. 3. Reconnect the phone to the charger, and charged the device until the LED turns green again. 4. Disconnect the phone, power it on, and then power it off. 5. Reconnect the phone to the charger and charge until the LED turns green again. 6. Power on and use. I personally have never heard of this issue before. I have checked with my supervisors and this is not a known issue at this time. Since this is not a known issue, we can give suggestions and troubleshooting options to see what works and what does not."

Sounds like the Bump Charging method to me.

Am i the only one who thinks the phone should run off of A/C power when plugged in? This just doesn't sound right.

Seems like alot to go through every morning. I could see if we just had to do this once. I just try and watch my usage.

 

[mobiledevice]

it is a known issue

why they would say it's not is beyond me

 

[AHanks12]

I'm quite surprised they actually recommended that as a solution, it seems more like a work around to the problem than a fix for it. Additionally, if they suggest that as the solution, then they must have acknowledged it as a problem in the first place,.....and in that case they should be looking for a permanent fix.

 

[wayrad]

Sounds like a garbled and unnecessarily complicated version of the bump charge?

 

[QMeli907]

Cant this be fixed through an update?

 

[crackers8199]

i would think it's pretty easy to change the software to say

if(phone plugged into charger) { run from AC } else { run from battery }

obviously that's a pretty extreme generalization, but i can't see why they wouldn't be able to fix this with a software update...

 

[TheSultan]

Here's what I do: I put it on my charger at night while I sleep. When I wake up, I use my phone until the battery goes low, then when I'm near a charger, either my car or at work. I top off the battery. If you're too worried about the best way to charge a phone, get a Razr.

 

[appleaj]

Is the turning off your phone part necessary? Would taking it off after full, then recharging until green again not be sufficient?

 

[sabrewings]

Is the turning off your phone part necessary? Would taking it off after full, then recharging until green again not be sufficient?

Yes, that's fine.

 

[NoRegrets78]

I charge the phone overnight powered on. When I wake up in the morning I turn it off and get in the shower. When I get out I finish getting dressed and by the time I finish putting my shoes on the light is green and its ready to go. Definite improvement in battery life.

 

[liannanator]

That is ridiculous. The phone should not start using battery power while plugged in.

Any word on if this should be fixed with the 2.2 update? I know that isn't only for HTC but maybe they could include something soon or with it?

 

[jsstritz]

I charge the phone overnight powered on. When I wake up in the morning I turn it off and get in the shower. When I get out I finish getting dressed and by the time I finish putting my shoes on the light is green and its ready to go. Definite improvement in battery life.

This.

 

[hawley.35]

Here's what I do: I put it on my charger at night while I sleep. When I wake up, I use my phone until the battery goes low, then when I'm near a charger, either my car or at work. I top off the battery. If you're too worried about the best way to charge a phone, get a Razr.

Ha HA yah I guess you have a point.

I figure I'll just charge it over night the throw it on the charger in my car on the way to work.

 

[pochaco]

So I going to buy the Dinc any day now. So I've been doing a lot of research. One of my biggest concerns was battery life. So I emailed HTC support asking them about the whole bump charging and battery drain while the phone in on the charger. Here is the meat of the conversation. Enjoy!

ME: (about the third time I explained the problem)
"... If you place the phone on the charger overnight, the phone will charge to 100% and stop charging. From this point on it will continue to run on battery power discharging the battery. The phone will not restart the charging cycle until it is removed from the charger. This means that when removed from the charger it will not be 100% charged. Is this correct? Is this how the phone is designed, or is this a known issue?"

HTC rep:

"Thank you for your response. You could try to improve the battery life of your device to see if this will fix your issue. 1. Connect the phone to the charger and charge the device until the LED turned green with the phone powered ON. 2. Disconnect the phone, and power it off. 3. Reconnect the phone to the charger, and charged the device until the LED turns green again. 4. Disconnect the phone, power it on, and then power it off. 5. Reconnect the phone to the charger and charge until the LED turns green again. 6. Power on and use. I personally have never heard of this issue before. I have checked with my supervisors and this is not a known issue at this time. Since this is not a known issue, we can give suggestions and troubleshooting options to see what works and what does not."

Sounds like the Bump Charging method to me.

Am i the only one who thinks the phone should run off of A/C power when plugged in? This just doesn't sound right.

I have no issue with my dinc using battery after charing to 100%. what actually happens is it shows 100%, but upon disconnect it quickly scurries down to 90. if you bump charge, you get a TRUE 100%, if you know what I mean.

 

[THORN74]

im not really sure what the second disconnect is for. nor am i really sure the it needs to be disconnected at all


my routine is as follows: plug in the phone (in standby mode) and charge overnight. upon waking up i turn the phones power off while leaving it connected. the light will turn red and it will continue to charge.

by the time im out of the shower its green again, and im done.

i have no idea if im getting a "full" charge or not but it seems to last longer that way.

 

[scion193]

I charge my phone turned off maybe once a week. I only do this because I like to give it a power cycle just to refresh everything (like a pc). I have personally not experienced the charge dropping by 10% within 10-20 min after being removed from the charger (when charged while powered on).

To be honest with you, the battery on the Inc is just fine. I can get 3 to 3.5 hours of up time from a single charge (excluding sleep time)...this is perfectly acceptable for me and easily gets me through the day. I mostly use 3G for my internet and leave the GPS on. Dont get freaked out by people who say the battery life sucks, everbody uses their phone differently. If you are going to have every single application sync every 2 seconds and run power hungry widgets then yes you are going to burn through the battery...just use some common sense and you'll be fine.

 

[egg_head]

Here's what I do: I put it on my charger at night while I sleep. When I wake up, I use my phone until the battery goes low, then when I'm near a charger, either my car or at work. I top off the battery. If you're too worried about the best way to charge a phone, get a Razr.

Dude, I could not agree more with this statement.

 

[Deleted User]

Cant this be fixed through an update?

This is what I've been wondering for a long time now.

 

[evan938]

I have no issue with my dinc using battery after charing to 100%. what actually happens is it shows 100%, but upon disconnect it quickly scurries down to 90. if you bump charge, you get a TRUE 100%, if you know what I mean.

wierd. i was seeing this, and being a n00b to smartphones, i was meaning to look up and see if this was common. i charge it while on to 100%, and within maybe ~10 minutes, its down to 90%. the other day though, i left it on, went to 100%, and 20 minutes after leaving my house i was still at 100. it confused me why it did it. next time i charged it, it quickly went down to 90% again.

ill try turning it off in the morning while getting ready and charge it again

and FWIW, i have my home charger, a car charger, and i keep one at work. luckily its the same charger as my old razr, so i didnt have to buy extras. already had 2

 

[rsarno]

i would think it's pretty easy to change the software to say

if(phone plugged into charger) { run from AC } else { run from battery }

obviously that's a pretty extreme generalization, but i can't see why they wouldn't be able to fix this with a software update...

haha that just gave me flashbacks of my old mIRC scripting days LOL!

 

[rsarno]

That is ridiculous. The phone should not start using battery power while plugged in.

Any word on if this should be fixed with the 2.2 update? I know that isn't only for HTC but maybe they could include something soon or with it?

Agreed.

 

[cp1]

It doesn't run off battery once charged -- if you leave it in the charger all day it won't be drained by night!

 

[zemerick]

Ok, there seems to be some confusion again.

First off: No. An update can not truly fix this. The cause is the Li-Ion battery itself. ( Explained later in this post a little more. ) They COULD "update" the battery indicator to sort of fudge over the early drop more. So, while you still don't have any more of a charge...you don't see the sudden drop. IE: An Apple fix, hide the problem.

Disclaimer: It's 4:30 AM so I might have a few mistakes here and there, but the basics should be sound.

Ok, so heres what is going on. For the initial approx. 80% of the charge, the charger puts out a constant current and increases the voltage. When the battery reaches a critical level this changes. The voltage will remain the same, and the current begins to drop. The charge is stopped when the current reaches 0.

OK. Simple enough so far. Now, you can't exactly ask a battery what percent it is at. Instead, you have to guess it based off some variable. Well, the current is going to remain constant ( It wouldn't work otherwise! ) so you have to use voltage. Problem is, voltage isn't exactly a reliable number for the total amount...and it's also different when being charged vs. unplugged. Anyways, net result is: that last 10 percent, is hard to tell. So, this has to be kinda guessed at. ( This is a small part of why battery indicators don't have some precise number...instead just using vague indicators. The numbers fluctuate, and in fact...I've seen my voltage go UP while using my phone. )

Now, for the reason why turning the phone off works. During that last bit of charge, while the phone is on, at some point you will reach a time when the power coming in equals the power going out. It doesn't matter if the power goes into the battery first, or if it just goes straight to the phone...either way, the battery does not really get that power. Now, because of this, the batteries voltage and current both remain constant. What do we know happens now? That's right, the battery appears to have a full charge! Now, you power the phone off...and suddenly the battery gets to keep that bit of power that was just powering the phone. The charge in the battery begins to increase again, and voila...more charge in your battery.

Now, you should be able to see the reason for the sudden number drop many people notice. ( If your phone isn't seeing this sudden drop...it's probably just because the phone isn't calibrated to see the top end of the battery. Drain the phone down until it shuts off, but only do this ONCE!, then charge it up. Turn the power off and charge it some more. Use per normal, and you will almost surely notice the next time that you do not power-off charge, that your battery drops fast. ) Anyways, as you have probably guessed: Because your phone THINKS it has a full charge, it initially displays 100%. Now, it knows that at say 4.118 volts ( totally random number. Each battery can vary, and really even each charge can. ) it is at approx. 90% of it's total power...so, when the voltage almost immediately starts coming down ( nominal being 4.2, though you shouldn't really actually see that number. More like 4.15 or so. ), and it quickly approaches 4.118 the percentage drops with it. If you had power-off charged however, it sits at 4.15v for awhile, then far slower begins to drop because it has a decent amount more power.

This occurs with all Li-Ion batteries: though like I said, battery indicators can easily be made to sort of "fudge over" and hide this sudden drop. This will work just as much on a laptop ( though, laptops are usually turned off frequently anyways. ) and other electronics as it does on the INC. Try it some time, you might suddenly find another 20 mins of use on your laptop

NOTE: I do NOT recommend actually "bump" charging. For starters, I think the techs reply of never hearing of the issue before shows how low on the totem pole he really is. NTM the fact that his reply was a typical copy-paste. It should be noted, that while no harm SHOULD be possible...many times in the past such bump charging has permitted a battery to be over charged. So, sure..you might see increased performance now...but 6 months down the road your battery might only hold half it's normal charge. ( I've seen it countless times. This is a part of where car-chargers frequently cause problems, and has caused my mom and dad to both burn through 2 phone batteries each in the time I've had 1 that still gets a good charge. ) I'll say it again: Yes, there SHOULD be protections in place to prevent any kind of over-charging...but it can still happen.

Ok...sleep time I'll try to remember tomorrow to come and clean this post up, hehe.

 

[kjarrett]

Not to thread jack and I know not everyone has this option but using an external charger (I got one cheap on ebay) and multiple batteries (TP2 1500s ROCK) completely eliminates this issue, and you always have a spare charged to 100% ready to go ... just sayin'...