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Our (not so) Great president.

I would be outraged if this were true, but it's not. Please try a little fact checking: snopes.com: Nancy Pelosi's Jet

Me too: I love Snopes.com :D

Guys, can we at least try to get our facts straight. Snopes is a great resource and does not just debunk - it also confirms where true such as the anti-christian basis of The Golden Compass etc.
 
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Iirc that was in response to a post from me, so I'd just like to say that I was in no way offended. :)

It's discussions like this that prove, despite a common language and shared history, just how disparate our two nations are. Your definitions of and associations with certain terms are completely different to those accepted over here, which is why I'd never presume to get involved in the debate - I'd find it too confusing. :D This isn't a criticism either, just another example of how cultures naturally vary.

Agreed. Like I know what we call an 'Elevator' you call it a lift? Or escalator?

And what we call an escalator you call something else as well.
 
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Ever notice how when people don't understand a phenomenon they put some unrealistic label on it?
Osama? Socialist? Savior?
yeah, just like bush and cheny were labled Hitler, etc.... Dems are even better at it than conservatives, because they get the media to quote and repeat their mantra...
Clearly you don't understand what is going on here. Our country has a number of very large issues that it needs to deal with. Health Care costs, Education, Energy policy, and the national debt to name a few. For the last several presidencies these issues have been ignored. Obama has stated a clear intent to address these issues. That is the appeal. No doubt it will be done imperfectly, but he is willing to try.
and he's done NOTHING on these issues, except to say he's against earmarks while signing a bill with billions of earmarks... The road to HELL is paved with good intentions...


The electorate doesn't believe that Obama is any sort of "savior" and the electorate doesn't want "socialism" (despite for some very backwards opportunists, there is zero reason to question his faith). The case has been made that we have problems to address and opportunities to pursue. The electorate agrees with this case.
He was elected by black americans by a margin not much greater than george bush by the way. Bush's election was called "stolen", Obama's a "mandate" by the media... hmm.. can we say the media are in the hot-tub with Obama???

I am amazed at how effectively Reagan pulled the wool over the conservatives eyes.

Reagan is given credit for ending the cold war, when it was effectively over before he took office.
I call bullshit. Prove what you say or go home. Yes, russia was collapsing, but only because conservatives in the senate - even during Carter's crappy reign - kept up defense spending and kept Europe fortified...
Reagan started the policy of raiding the SS trust fund
False. You obviously have less understanding of the constitution than a gnat has of the meaning of life. CONGRESS (all democrats, back then...) raided social security to pay for their socialist programs in spite of the budget cuts that Regan wanted...
Reagan oversaw the sale of arm to our enemies (and got to duck the charge because he either lied or was so unfit for office that he no longer remembered what he did from day to day --take your pick)
Um, the Contra's fought AGAINST the communist Sandinistas...

Be very careful if you want to criticize Americas healthcare system. I grew up in Austria and experienced their system which is pretty close to the UKs from what I understand.And I assure you its terrible compared to ours.
TRUTH! Thank you for speaking the TRUTH! For every person who says a great thing about 'government run healthcare', I'm sure there are 5 who had a bad one...

He's Godzilla to America's Tokyo, romping and stomping as fast as he can before the mind-warped public finally catches on -- and he's betting everything on that being too late for him to be stopped.

Love that analogy.
He's Godzilla, and our CONSTITUTION is tokyo... He's ignoring it as much as possible... Putting verbiage in a bill that makes it "repeal proof"?? Really? Can you say "not constitutional" to even consider such a provision??


Agreed. We need a 3rd, or even 4th party. Or abandon the parties altogether, and be all independents.

I consider myself a Constitutional Libertarian.
I support organizations like:
logo.jpg



Nobody said healthcare is cheap. It's one of the UK government's biggest budgets. I'm not advocating the USA uses the UK model (the USA is too big to afford it) but I am saying that you need to do better for the poor and downtrodden in your society. (Not the the lazy of your society before you flame me). It could be done by having compulsory insurance for the employed and extending medicare to people on welfare. That will not destroy your business model - which I do understand is needed for investment in new medicines etc.
Disabled and unable to care for themselves = yes, deserving of charity.
Everyone else? **** off. Get your damn hand out of my wallet.

Er...no. Where did that come from?


Kind of what I have been saying elsewhere.


What are these "Death Panels" you speak of? Maybe that did happen in the communist Soviet Union - I don't know - but this I do know: nothing like that exists in the UK.
You sure as shit have them in UK... Committees that say how much can be spent to save a persons life at a certain age... They exist, and they determine that, if you get sick at 70, good luck with that.
 
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Ah yes, the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence - not perfect but certainly not a Death Panel. They do determine cost effectiveness and do sometimes get it wrong - very wrong but the notion about being on your own if you are over 70 is a myth peddled by vested interest in the USA when they argue against reform.
 
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I dont know. I cannot read when a website has a "lounge" area and things like politics and religion are discussed. I'd rather go to a site that is specifically for that purpose and topic. The reason our economy sucks is because politicians spend out money lousily. Dont blame anyone but yourself. WE ELECT EVERYONE.

There. Now I am a participant.
 
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I've read threw most of these threads, and I just have a few impartial questions, because frankly guys, he's our President for the next 3 years, deal with it.

One year ago, President Obama stated that healthcare discussions in the House and Senate would be open door, and broadly displayed on CSPAN. Why is this not the case?

President Obama stated during his state of address that Healthcare would not be offered to illegal immigrants, but it is, in the latest iteration of the healthcare bill. Why is this?

Why do I lay restless in my bed everynight wondering if I'm going to be able to afford my healthcare after this new bill is passed? Everything I've heard so far about the bill affecting the middle class has been that our premiums will rise, with no increase in benefits.

I work hard for my family, and I enjoy the nice things that I am able to afford with that hard work. I pay an incredible amount of taxes living in Massachusetts. Income Tax, excise tax, property tax, town sales tax, state sales tax, etc. Now, supposedly, I'm going to have to pay even more for healthcare, for people who are undeserving of it.

People in this this thread claim that there are "rights" for people. Why should healthcare be one of those? In the 14 places that I've lived, there has ALWAYS been a free healthcare clinic. Why is it that people who cannot afford healthcare, go to these clinics? The healthcare bill benefits the least desirable people (i.e., illegal aliens, people skirting employment, welfare, etc.). Legitimate people who do not have healthcare are already covered under local State insurance policies currently. Of course if you're an illegal, you may have issues using those benefits.

----------

Despite all of the Obama bashing by other folks, these are all issues that have plagued our country for the last decade primarily. Our country has over extended it's hand to the rest of the world, without cleaning it's own house. The term "don't defecate where you sleep" is very applicable to our current times. I just believe we're tackling those issues in the wrong way. The sad state of affairs is, the Democrats are going to railroad as much legislation they can in the next 3 years, with provisions not allowing them to be revoked. Wait and see, you will see the most wide changing liberal policies invoked before President Obama is out of office, not because of him, but because "it's pay back".
 
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yeah, just like bush and cheny were labled Hitler, etc.... Dems are even better at it than conservatives, because they get the media to quote and repeat their mantra...

Everyone is more sensitive when their guy gets piled on. While extremests may have labeled your heroes as such, I recall no such statements from my liberal friends. My response was to labels applied in this thread.

and he's done NOTHING on these issues, except to say he's against earmarks while signing a bill with billions of earmarks... The road to HELL is paved with good intentions...
Wrong. He has taken action that you disagree with. However you disagree that he should take action, so if you think that he's done nothing, be happy.

He was elected by black americans by a margin not much greater than george bush by the way. Bush's election was called "stolen", Obama's a "mandate" by the media... hmm.. can we say the media are in the hot-tub with Obama???
The pointless point. Even a conservative newspaper like The Wall Street Journal notes that Obama's victory was "decisive": Obama Sweeps to Historic Victory - WSJ.com

I call bullshit. Prove what you say or go home. Yes, russia was collapsing, but only because conservatives in the senate - even during Carter's crappy reign - kept up defense spending and kept Europe fortified...
Call bull and than agree. Nice flip flop. I said Reagan, not "conservatives in the senate".

False. You obviously have less understanding of the constitution than a gnat has of the meaning of life. CONGRESS (all democrats, back then...) raided social security to pay for their socialist programs in spite of the budget cuts that Regan wanted...
Ha Ha. This was proposed by Reagan's budget director. You are right enough in that congress went along with it.

Um, the Contra's fought AGAINST the communist Sandinistas...
Reread your history. (Hint: There are two countries implied in Iran-Contra and more involved...)
 
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A more honest analysis of the "victory mandate" of obama is this: A charming young man running against a Republican party debilitated by its association with an unpopular war and a politically toxic incumbent won a solid 7-point victory nationally. He sounded reasonable and moderate, and won for his party something important, if not necessarily epoch-making: a chance to govern after the other side had blown it.

The media were complict:

The three broadcast networks treated Obama to nearly seven times more good press than bad
 
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A more honest analysis of the "victory mandate" of obama is this: ...

Another tip that most of us learn in 5th grade or so: If you are going to use someone else's words, it is considered good form to cite the reference. In fact not doing so is called plagerism.


To the content, complaining about a lack of balance comes off as whining. Balance occurs, on the whole, where statistically independent events of equal likelyhood and frequency are measured. That assumption does not apply here, so it is not surprising to see a lack of balance.
 
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Too many kool aid drinking conservatives around here. Nothings ticks me off more than people who fight for others to keep more of their "Hard earned millions" as if these people really care about them.

Wake up! It is the politicians job to see that rich people can legally rob us. And Texans got over a hundred billion out of the Iraq war and that's why the economy is so good there right now.
 
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And Texans got over a hundred billion out of the Iraq war and that's why the economy is so good there right now.

Yeah, it has nothing to do with the fact that the majority of the U.S. refining capacity is in Texas, not to mention a large chunk of the oil & natural gas production, a very large agricultural diversity, tremendous cattle ranching enterprise, high tech industry, etc., etc. Nope, we got our money from the Iraq war...
 
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Another tip that most of us learn in 5th grade or so: If you are going to use someone else's words, it is considered good form to cite the reference. In fact not doing so is called plagerism.


To the content, complaining about a lack of balance comes off as whining. Balance occurs, on the whole, where statistically independent events of equal likelyhood and frequency are measured. That assumption does not apply here, so it is not surprising to see a lack of balance.

So wait, your advocating that wealthy people deserve to be pubished for being successful? If that was the case, half the inventions we have wouldn't exist, probably even your phone. People would have no reason to be innovative or successful bc they would just get it taken away. So what would be the point? When people like you post things like that it just shows that little green eyed monster inside of you. The better question is... why do you or others deserve someone elses money? What did you do for it? If you want millions quit being lazy and invent something. There are self made millionaires every day.
 
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Too many kool aid drinking conservatives around here. Nothings ticks me off more than people who fight for others to keep more of their "Hard earned millions" as if these people really care about them.

Wake up! It is the politicians job to see that rich people can legally rob us. And Texans got over a hundred billion out of the Iraq war and that's why the economy is so good there right now.

Oh, don't act like the libs aren't drinking the kool-aid too. Acussing either side of the aisle of trespasses is merely the pot calling the kettle black. Until you see this you know nothing of politics.

btw in case of shtf-day I'm moving to texas.
 
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MonkeyK said:
Another tip that most of us learn in 5th grade or so: If you are going to use someone else's words, it is considered good form to cite the reference. In fact not doing so is called plagerism.


To the content, complaining about a lack of balance comes off as whining. Balance occurs, on the whole, where statistically independent events of equal likelyhood and frequency are measured. That assumption does not apply here, so it is not surprising to see a lack of balance.
So wait, your advocating that wealthy people deserve to be pubished for being successful? If that was the case, half the inventions we have wouldn't exist, probably even your phone. People would have no reason to be innovative or successful bc they would just get it taken away. So what would be the point? When people like you post things like that it just shows that little green eyed monster inside of you. The better question is... why do you or others deserve someone elses money? What did you do for it? If you want millions quit being lazy and invent something. There are self made millionaires every day.

I think that you quoted the wrong post.
 
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More proof of obamas communism

Behold... obamacare

Little gems from the Health Care Bill

After reading that... how could you support this loon.

I call treason

I call stupidity. Sorry, there is no other explanation for calling "treason" based on a chain e-mail message that you can't even bother to verify.
Twenty-six Lies About H.R. 3200 | FactCheck.org

Grow some integrity.

Whenever something seems completely ridiculous, one should feel compelled to verify it before repeating it.
 
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I call stupidity. Sorry, there is no other explanation for calling "treason" based on a chain e-mail message that you can't even bother to verify.
Twenty-six Lies About H.R. 3200 | FactCheck.org

Grow some integrity.

Whenever something seems completely ridiculous, one should feel compelled to verify it before repeating it.

I hope nobody uses this thread as a source of information because it's full of biased, unverified sources. Almost everything I've read in this thread has a site that debunks it. Researching your sources, while not apparent in this thread, is actually important if you want truthful information. ;)
 
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