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Old July 23rd, 2010, 06:20 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Verizon data plan

I have an incredible on order and was charged $213 for the phone.....to be delivered Monday the 7/26.....

The price on the phone is $500 plus and is paid for my upgrading a 2 year contract.....

I want the phone but not sure if i want to pay for a data plan,,,,,i can be wifi almost any where I go.....i know I lose 24/7 connection and GPS (is there any FREE stand alone GPS app for android????).

I bought a used ERIS to play w/ while waiting for the incredible......no phone service......just wifi and has worked great for me.

If I don't activate the incredible, HOW DOES VERIZON bill the difference for the new phone, $300 plus dollars different from what I paid?

Thanks in Advance,


Moxie...................78-)

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Old July 23rd, 2010, 06:26 AM   #2 (permalink)
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If you cancel service they'll charge you an etf, if you don't activate I think I remember a disclaimer saying you will be billed full retail price? They will NOT put voice only on a smartphone.

If you want an Incredible with voice only service I think page plus might be your only option?
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 06:46 AM   #3 (permalink)
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If you don't pay full retail price, you have to have unlimited data.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 07:11 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I currently have a env2 and like the phone for a phone.....just wanting to stay away from paying for a data plan,,,,,i think around $24 a month w/ my wife's 20% discount.......

what i was looking for was if verizon would bill the difference of $500 plus dollars if i did not make any changes to my current plan/contract,,,,never activating the incredible like the Eris i am using.

don't get me wrong....i would love to be 24/7 connected. just am having trouble swallowing the extra cost of the data plan. If it allowed me to drop my home connection, i would do it in a heartbeat. Turn my driod into a hotspot....78-). But i do have about 6 pc's connected at home and that includes the neighbor's 2 pc's.

Still looking for a stand alone FREE gps app for andriod, does 1 live?

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Old July 23rd, 2010, 07:34 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Google Maps includes Navigation. IDK if this is what you are looking for, but it's free from the market. Any navigation/gps app you could find won't be 100% free -- there will always be a data charge if you don't have a data plan. Might as well strap in for the unlimited data plan to make the best use of a $500 phone. IDK if it's worth the money to get it and not have a data plan.

I don't fully understand your need for this phone.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 07:35 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I'm really confused.

But yea, Google Maps/Navigation is free and the bomb! Need a data plan though!
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 07:38 AM   #7 (permalink)
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You will be billed the extra $340 for the phone...that's essentialy the cost of 14 months of the data plan at $24/month....makes no sense at all not to activate the unlimited data plan.

Keep in mind though that only the main line gets the 20% discount. Sounds like your wifes line may be the main line. That said, it's only $6/ month difference.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:12 AM   #8 (permalink)
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It doesn't matter what you pay for the phone , full retail or the discount , VZW will NOT activate ANY smartphone WITHOUT a data plan. There is no seperate voice plan . If you don't get a data plan , the phone won't be activated so you can't use it at all.
You can play around with it on WI-FI but will have to get another phone to make calls on.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:18 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Sell your eris and then you'll have the money for the data plan.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:23 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by moxyspirit View Post
I want the phone but not sure if i want to pay for a data plan,,,,,i can be wifi almost any where I go.....i know I lose 24/7 connection and GPS (is there any FREE stand alone GPS app for android????).
GPS doesn't care if you're connected to Verizon's network. It's using satellites. The only thing that it might need a connection for is Google Maps which would download map data and directions as well. There are plenty of apps on the market that will give you the raw GPS data though, if you just want that.

Also, Google Maps is free for every Android device out there. It includes navigation GPS (directions, location, etc).
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:36 AM   #11 (permalink)
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GPS doesn't care if you're connected to Verizon's network. It's using satellites. The only thing that it might need a connection for is Google Maps which would download map data and directions as well. There are plenty of apps on the market that will give you the raw GPS data though, if you just want that.

Also, Google Maps is free for every Android device out there. It includes GPS functionality (directions, location, etc).

Can someone verify this?

My navigation doesn't seem to work unless 3g is on.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:43 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Can someone verify this?

My navigation doesn't work unless 3g is on.
You need 3g or WI-FI for the navigation programs to function , the phone has to download the data for the maps to work.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:48 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Not to pee in anyone's Cheerios, but isn't there talk about Verizon changing its unlimited data plan?

Verizon stays quiet on tiered data plans

So, yes you do need a data plan...but NOW you need to try and determine just how much you'll be using on a monthly basis to purchase on of their tiers.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:50 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Can someone verify this?

My navigation doesn't seem to work unless 3g is on.
There's a difference between GPS functionality and navigation. GPS is the phone's ability to know its exact location via its GPS receiver. Navigation uses GPS to give you directions.

GPS functionality works without a network connection since it uses satellites. For navigation, you need the network to download the route and maps.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:52 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Not to pee in anyone's Cheerios, but isn't there talk about Verizon changing its unlimited data plan?

Verizon stays quiet on tiered data plans

So, yes you do need a data plan...but NOW you need to try and determine just how much you'll be using on a monthly basis to purchase on of their tiers.
Last I heard Verizon won't start tiered plans until their 4G rolls out. 3G would stay unlimited. If they do tier 3G, we'll all be grandfathered in just like AT&T did.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:54 AM   #16 (permalink)
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It doesn't matter what you pay for the phone , full retail or the discount , VZW will NOT activate ANY smartphone WITHOUT a data plan. There is no seperate voice plan . If you don't get a data plan , the phone won't be activated so you can't use it at all.
You can play around with it on WI-FI but will have to get another phone to make calls on.
^^This^^ If you want to use your phone as nothing more than an iPad, you can just use it. But you will NOT be able to make calls, that requires activating the phone. And to activate you need the data plan.

When I got my phones I have to call CS to push through the activation. The problem? We didn't have the $29.99 data plan on our previous LG Dare's and we had to add that plan before we could activate. Once it was added, we activated with no problem. So it's a must.

It CLEARLY states right there on Verizon's website that a $29.99 a month data plan is required for this phone. It's not a secret. If you change your mind after the fact, you have 30 days to return the phone.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:55 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Last I heard Verizon won't start tiered plans until their 4G rolls out. 3G would stay unlimited. If they do tier 3G, we'll all be grandfathered in just like AT&T did.
When they put this into effect, older plans will be grandfathered in. It will only apply to new customers. So if you already have unlimited, it will stay unlimited.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 08:59 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by sabrewings View Post
Last I heard Verizon won't start tiered plans until their 4G rolls out. 3G would stay unlimited. If they do tier 3G, we'll all be grandfathered in just like AT&T did.
I hope you're right sabrewings; I was a little put off when I read about this change. I couldn't find anything on the 4G vs 3G thing, but it sounds more feasible. Thanks!
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 09:22 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 09:26 AM   #20 (permalink)
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There's a difference between GPS functionality and navigation. GPS is the phone's ability to know its exact location via its GPS receiver. Navigation uses GPS to give you directions.

GPS functionality works without a network connection since it uses satellites. For navigation, you need the network to download the route and maps.

Right but when someone asks about GPS they are typically talking about navigation which requires a data plan.

So saying you don't need a data plan for GPS is misleading.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 09:28 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Right but when someone asks about GPS they are typically talking about navigation which requires a data plan.

So saying you don't need a data plan for GPS is misleading.
Not to me. I've had GPS devices since they first came out. GPS gives you latitude and longitude. Navigation devices give you maps and turn by turn directions. Strong difference, and I can't help if people don't know the difference anymore.

Also, if you read the post again, you'll see that I did say you need to have a network connection for maps and directions:

Quote:
Originally Posted by sabrewings View Post
GPS doesn't care if you're connected to Verizon's network. It's using satellites. The only thing that it might need a connection for is Google Maps which would download map data and directions as well. There are plenty of apps on the market that will give you the raw GPS data though, if you just want that.

Also, Google Maps is free for every Android device out there. It includes navigation GPS (directions, location, etc).
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 09:39 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by moxyspirit View Post
I have an incredible on order and was charged $213 for the phone.....to be delivered Monday the 7/26.....

The price on the phone is $500 plus and is paid for my upgrading a 2 year contract.....

I want the phone but not sure if i want to pay for a data plan,,,,,i can be wifi almost any where I go.....i know I lose 24/7 connection and GPS (is there any FREE stand alone GPS app for android????).

I bought a used ERIS to play w/ while waiting for the incredible......no phone service......just wifi and has worked great for me.

If I don't activate the incredible, HOW DOES VERIZON bill the difference for the new phone, $300 plus dollars different from what I paid?

Thanks in Advance,


Moxie...................78-)
Last I heard when i was upgrading my wife's cell phone (not Incredible) is that you need the data package. Some of verizon's data package policy has changed (October of last year i think)backed then if you had a 3g capable phone but didn't need the data plan you can just get the voice service only, take for example the LG chocolate touch (wife), its 3G capable, I was able to get only the voice plan, but now if you buy this phone you need the data plan minimum data plan which is $10. However, in the case with "smartphones" you NEED to get the data plan which is $30 otherwise you can't activate it, i'm not even sure if they sell if to you at the 2 year discounted price if you don't get the plan (you can buy it at full price and not activate it)

I've also been told that SMS (text) are being sent via internet and not similar to regular MMS (Picture message), which is another reason why they want you to get the data plan.

All I can say is that i love verizon coverage but they are getting greedy by making some more $$ by forcibly selling us data plans.

Last option, just pay full price and flash it to cricket (good luck with the phone quality/coverage)

Just my 2 cents, good luck
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 09:43 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Can someone verify this?

My navigation doesn't seem to work unless 3g is on.
When using Google Maps you will need 3G coverage so you can "see" the actual map, streets, directions etc. If you don't have coverage at that time you won't be able to see anything, however, your GPS still works just not in Google Maps.

A good way to get around this is by using Google Maps when 3g coverage is available, configure your route and then if you 3g coverage is no longer available during your route, google maps will still be able to "work", the only problem here is if you get off the original route then i don't think it will be able to re-route you.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 10:14 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I've also been told that SMS (picture messages) are being sent via internet and not similar to regular MMS (text), which is another reason why they want you to get the data plan.
This is accurate.

I have a friend with only Phone/Text, no data plan at all. He has an LG Dare. He contacted Verizon and actually had them turn off his ability to receive texts with attachments because people would send them and he would get charged 25 cents, even if he didn't open it.

I told him to stop being cheap and get a $10 data plan but ehh... not my choice

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All I can say is that i love verizon coverage but they are getting greedy by making some more $$ by forcibly selling us data plans.
Maybe, but in all fairness, what the hell is the point of getting a smartphone if you are only going to use it to call/text? Sure you can use WiFi to connect like the OP wants to do, but it's still dumbing down your phone.

If all you want is phone/text, get a regular phone or a media phone. Though like someone mentioned, media phones now require a $10 data package, but I guess it's better than $30.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 10:21 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Maybe, but in all fairness, what the hell is the point of getting a smartphone if you are only going to use it to call/text? Sure you can use WiFi to connect like the OP wants to do, but it's still dumbing down your phone.

If all you want is phone/text, get a regular phone or a media phone. Though like someone mentioned, media phones now require a $10 data package, but I guess it's better than $30.
Yes i wouldn't have it any other way, you really can't enjoy the phone without internet.

I don't mind paying $30 for unlimited data plan, love it i have coverage wherever I go and with my phone i usually get pretty good speed, also surfing the net for quick answers is always nice!
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 10:22 AM   #26 (permalink)
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I've also been told that SMS (picture messages) are being sent via internet and not similar to regular MMS (text), which is another reason why they want you to get the data plan.

All I can say is that i love verizon coverage but they are getting greedy by making some more $$ by forcibly selling us data plans.
Yes, but you've got it backwards. SMS is text only, MMS is picture/video message...

My current phone (Samsung i760 running WinMo 6.1) was the last phone you could get from VZW without the mandatory data plan. Up until recently I had the "pay per Kb" plan and had them put a data block on the line. This prevented me from using the 3G connection and getting charged for data. However, when I ordered my Incredible, apparently the data block was removed... Since I was upgrading and had to get the data plan anyways, I went ahead and changed it to prevent getting charged (I found out the hard way that I had already used some data due to my phone not connecting to my WiFi when I thought it had).

Long story short, if you buy ANY smartphone and want to activate it on VZW, you are required to add the $29.99/mo data plan.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 10:27 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Yes, but you've got it backwards. SMS is text only, MMS is picture/video message...

My current phone (Samsung i760 running WinMo 6.1) was the last phone you could get from VZW without the mandatory data plan. Up until recently I had the "pay per Kb" plan and had them put a data block on the line. This prevented me from using the 3G connection and getting charged for data. However, when I ordered my Incredible, apparently the data block was removed... Since I was upgrading and had to get the data plan anyways, I went ahead and changed it to prevent getting charged (I found out the hard way that I had already used some data due to my phone not connecting to my WiFi when I thought it had).

Long story short, if you buy ANY smartphone and want to activate it on VZW, you are required to add the $29.99/mo data plan.
ah right my bad, yes MMS (picture) SMS (text). Thanks

i remember the i760, my "pre Android" days ;-)
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 07:56 PM   #28 (permalink)
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I hope that existing customers are going to be able to go to the tiered data plan and not have to stick with the unlimited. I dont use THAT much data and would appreciate less $$ going out every month.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 10:55 PM   #29 (permalink)
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I was in the Verizon store yesterday asking the same question. My son is giving his Eris to his father and getting the incredible. He can't stand Mom having a better phone.

Since I know my husband won't use the data plan I asked if we could just get the phone plan. No was the answer.
I don't see the rationale.
Yes it would be a waste of a smart phone but we have it already so why not use it.

I too feel that Verizon is getting greedy. Just because they have the best coverage doesn't mean they have to nickel and dime us to death.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 11:19 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I was in the Verizon store yesterday asking the same question. My son is giving his Eris to his father and getting the incredible. He can't stand Mom having a better phone.

Since I know my husband won't use the data plan I asked if we could just get the phone plan. No was the answer.
I don't see the rationale.
Yes it would be a waste of a smart phone but we have it already so why not use it.

I too feel that Verizon is getting greedy. Just because they have the best coverage doesn't mean they have to nickel and dime us to death.
Easy solution: Sell the Eris and pick up a dumb phone. You'll come out a couple bucks richer and not have to pay for a data plan.
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 11:20 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Taking advantage of your data plan, using friends and family wisely, and apps like google voice may allow you to lower your plan's minutes, thus negating some of the cost of the data packages.

Just a thought.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 12:29 AM   #32 (permalink)
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About the tiered pricing that may be in the future: Basically companies have to continue offering the plans that you signed a contract with (a la unlimited data) or fear class action lawsuits. once you choose to change to their new plans (ie getting a new 4g phone) you will be required to pay their pricing option at the time of you accepting the changes.

My 2 cents about smartphones and required data plans: this is America where we are supposed to be able to choose things so why can't people choose to use good quality phones without paying data?
There is no rational reason that any company should force you to use a data plan. maybe recommended and have it be the default option but you should be able to choose and block data if you really want it.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 03:43 AM   #33 (permalink)
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My brother works for Verizon, and he has stated that all newer smart phones (such as the DI), require the $30 data plan and that the billing system requires the feature. He said if your phone model is of a certain type classified as a smart phone, then even if the rep removes the data plan from your account, the billing system will automatically force the data plan back onto your account.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 04:59 AM   #34 (permalink)
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I would love to be able to have the option to switch off the data plan on my Incredible. Not because I want to, but because should I run into any budgetary issues it would be nice to know that I could shut off data for a while until I have the money again.

But I suppose that's what my dumbphone is still sitting around for. Just in case.

I'm being paranoid though, I should be able to afford this phone just fine, especially since I planned around having a smartphone for months before I actually got it.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 09:26 AM   #35 (permalink)
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GPS on the Incredible is different than on a navigation only type of device.

Stand alone Navigation device has all mapping saved in its memory, Incredible downloads this same information when its demanded from Google maps.

A far as I have seen downloading all the maps and using GPS only to get direction cannot be done without being connected to a data source.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 09:38 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knebel22 View Post
I was in the Verizon store yesterday asking the same question. My son is giving his Eris to his father and getting the incredible. He can't stand Mom having a better phone.

Since I know my husband won't use the data plan I asked if we could just get the phone plan. No was the answer.
I don't see the rationale.
Yes it would be a waste of a smart phone but we have it already so why not use it.

I too feel that Verizon is getting greedy. Just because they have the best coverage doesn't mean they have to nickel and dime us to death.

Well a required data plan helps pay for your $600 phone, that most pay $199 or less for, thats why they force data.

Even the Eris has to paid for in this way, the Eris had a much higher price point than was paid for in the beginning, I think by them closing this forced Data Plan would cause all kinds of people trying to get around this, this is why they wont allow any smart phones without data ... since you have to pay for this anyway and Data Plan costs does go toward the subsidation of their phones, so its wise to upgrade to a New phone whenever possible, because you are getting charged for it through the forced Data plan anyway, if you don't need this I would choose a dumbphone from Verizon (they prolly would give you a free one) and sell the Eris

I understand what you mean here, why not charge a lesser rate on and Older Smart Phone (Eris) instead of giving you a new phone and costing them more money by subsidation of the New Phone, I just think they have to do it this way because once they say ok some people can get a smart phone without a Data Plan on our network would cause all sorts of people trying to get it for free somehow by messing with the internals of their phones.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 12:52 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Tmobile and AT&T use GSM for voice. This means their phones work on one another for voice plans. But they use different frequencies for 3g service, so you could theoretically buy an att phone (or an htc desire, or a made-for-att nexus one) and put it on tmobile and use it for voice-only. They wouldn't be able to charge you for 3g because your phone wouldn't work with 3g. Check this out more before trying it, but it might suit your needs.

Personally, I would like to be able to have a regular voice plan with an inc. I really am around wifi 95% of the time so a $30/mo 3g charge is hard to justify over other, more useful, expenses. It does come in handy though.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 03:05 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CM67 View Post
GPS on the Incredible is different than on a navigation only type of device.

Stand alone Navigation device has all mapping saved in its memory, Incredible downloads this same information when its demanded from Google maps.

A far as I have seen downloading all the maps and using GPS only to get direction cannot be done without being connected to a data source.
If I can plug a GPS antenna into my laptop and install mapping software, with ALL map data saved on the hard drive, why can't I do the same with my Inc (given that an app exists and I have enough memory for all the map data)?

My laptop becomes a standalone GPS, including maps and nav, without having a data connection and after all, the Inc is just a small computer with limited power and storage.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 03:52 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natty View Post
If I can plug a GPS antenna into my laptop and install mapping software, with ALL map data saved on the hard drive, why can't I do the same with my Inc (given that an app exists and I have enough memory for all the map data)?

My laptop becomes a standalone GPS, including maps and nav, without having a data connection and after all, the Inc is just a small computer with limited power and storage.
The Garmin City Navigator install on my laptop consumes more than 1.7GB of disk space and it covers all of North America. Until recently, smartphones didn't have sufficient storage to make developing such an app worth the effort. You may see it in the future, but for now we get the freebie nav that needs data.

Also, I don't see Garmin jumping in to develop software that obsoletes their standalone units but if they do, it's not going to be a $3.99 Market app.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 07:05 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callmeox View Post
The Garmin City Navigator install on my laptop consumes more than 1.7GB of disk space and it covers all of North America. Until recently, smartphones didn't have sufficient storage to make developing such an app worth the effort. You may see it in the future, but for now we get the freebie nav that needs data.

Also, I don't see Garmin jumping in to develop software that obsoletes their standalone units but if they do, it's not going to be a $3.99 Market app.
Garmin has an Android phone (the Garminfone on Tmobile, made by Asus), so the HAVE the software. However, I'd doubt they'd undercut that by releasing their product for other hardware.
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Old July 24th, 2010, 07:07 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natty View Post
If I can plug a GPS antenna into my laptop and install mapping software, with ALL map data saved on the hard drive, why can't I do the same with my Inc (given that an app exists and I have enough memory for all the map data)?

My laptop becomes a standalone GPS, including maps and nav, without having a data connection and after all, the Inc is just a small computer with limited power and storage.
Co Pilot does this why not use that? its just as good as the Garmin app was on my old Omnia
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