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Internal storage discussion (apps, errors)
The HTC Rezound specs said 16gb internal but when I bought it(work phone) it only had 2gb for apps. I know you can move most to the sd card but why cant HTC set aside 16gb for apps? Is the Evo 4g LTE going to be the same?
Still better than my evo with it's 300mb free space.
The HTC Rezound specs said 16gb internal but when I bought it(work phone) it only had 2gb for apps. I know you can move most to the sd card but why cant HTC set aside 16gb for apps? Is the Evo 4g LTE going to be the same?
Still better than my evo with it's 300mb free space.
not sure if any of those specs are released yet, with 16gb internal AND an SD card slot i would HOPE that the default partition is atleast 5gb for apps... i also HOPE that the partitions are easily resized
Although, it's very possible that it'll be 3GB partitioned for apps, which is what the Photon has. Here's the breakdown of how the 16gb was partitioned on the Photon:
8.92GB - internal storage (whatever you'd like on here)
3 GB - apps only
4.08 GB - Split up between Room for future updates and other miscellaneous needs for the phone
What I didn't mind about this partition was that, I already had an external 32GB SD card and when moving the apps to SD, it would go into the internal storage partition (not the external SD). Some didn't like this, while I found it was easier to manage the files that were needed and the ones that weren't.
That said, there's no guarantee that HTC follows the same partitioning, but figured I'd throw that out there since the 3vo only had 4GB.
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Although, it's very possible that it'll be 3GB partitioned for apps, which is what the Photon has. Here's the breakdown of how the 16gb was partitioned on the Photon:
8.92GB - internal storage (whatever you'd like on here)
3 GB - apps only
4.08 GB - Split up between Room for future updates and other miscellaneous needs for the phone
What I didn't mind about this partition was that, I already had an external 32GB SD card and when moving the apps to SD, it would go into the internal storage partition (not the external SD). Some didn't like this, while I found it was easier to manage the files that were needed and the ones that weren't.
That said, there's no guarantee that HTC follows the same partitioning, but figured I'd throw that out there since the 3vo only had 4GB.
If I'm not mistaken, on the Sprint website it said 12.1 will be for the user! I guess the breakdown will begin from this point!? I'm not clear, I'm asking!? Question; You say 3GB was for apps only right!? So when you run out of that space, will you be able to use the other 8.92GB to throw apps on there!?
I really hope this phone gets good internal storage memory. If not I guess I'll have to get a 64FB SD card. The more memory, the better the chance of it having more future updates.
If I'm not mistaken, on the Sprint website it said 12.1 will be for the user! I guess the breakdown will begin from this point!? I'm not clear, I'm asking!? Question; You say 3GB was for apps only right!? So when you run out of that space, will you be able to use the other 8.92GB to throw apps on there!?
Not if the remainder (about 9 or 10 GB, whichever) is set aside as the internal sd card.
Internal sd card: obviously, not an actual physical card, but rather, some storage-memory (meaning: not ram) that acts like an sd card as far as you're concerned. OK to think of it as a "virtual sd card" if that helps.
The point: whatever you can do today with an actual sd card is what you can do with that 9 or 10 GB of space. And whatever you can't do with an actual sd card, you can't do there, either.
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Not if the remainder (about 9 or 10 GB, whichever) is set aside as the internal sd card.
Internal sd card: obviously, not an actual physical card, but rather, some storage-memory (meaning: not ram) that acts like an sd card as far as you're concerned. OK to think of it as a "virtual sd card" if that helps.
The point: whatever you can do today with an actual sd card is what you can do with that 9 or 10 GB of space. And whatever you can't do with an actual sd card, you can't do there, either.
I like that description.
one way to look at: it's like having two sd cards, too. That is what you will see when you plug the device into your computer, anyway. (assuming you add your own sd card to the device)
Agreed?
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Not if the remainder (about 9 or 10 GB, whichever) is set aside as the internal sd card.
Internal sd card: obviously, not an actual physical card, but rather, some storage-memory (meaning: not ram) that acts like an sd card as far as you're concerned. OK to think of it as a "virtual sd card" if that helps.
The point: whatever you can do today with an actual sd card is what you can do with that 9 or 10 GB of space. And whatever you can't do with an actual sd card, you can't do there, either.
So will you be or not limited to app space!?
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenChase7
I like that description.
one way to look at: it's like having two sd cards, too. That is what you will see when you plug the device into your computer, anyway. (assuming you add your own sd card to the device)
Agreed?
I will add my own sd, and it was a nice description he gave!
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If I'm not mistaken, on the Sprint website it said 12.1 will be for the user! I guess the breakdown will begin from this point!? I'm not clear, I'm asking!? Question; You say 3GB was for apps only right!? So when you run out of that space, will you be able to use the other 8.92GB to throw apps on there!?
Sorry, thought I was clear. 3gb dedicated to apps. Any apps moved to sd, go in the 8.92 storage, so no apps actually get moved to the external card. Only app related things that go on external card are backup from apps that can be directed to the external card.
Again, this is just for the photon, so who knows if htc follows the same format.
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one way to look at: it's like having two sd cards, too. That is what you will see when you plug the device into your computer, anyway. (assuming you add your own sd card to the device)
Agreed?
Yes. To date, that's how all large-memory phones are laid out.
If you use Astro File Manager or EStrongs File Explorer, on your present phone, you will see an /sdcard folder.
On any typical large-memory phone like this, you will still see /sdcard (this is on the large-memory) and a new folder often called something like /sd_ext (ext=external=actual, physical, sd card).
As drex says, we have to wait and see on the exact details. But what I'm describing appears to be the new de facto standard for manufacturers to handle this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sauske
So will you be or not limited to app space!?
Limited. Exact details to be seen, but much more than you are used to having on your Evo.
But overall, much like any standard SGS2, or Photon, or Rezound, or RAZR, or...
Unless the LTEVO breaks away and uses a totally new layout. Possible, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Last edited by EarlyMon; April 5th, 2012 at 11:37 PM.
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what really bothers me is why android can't handle the internal storage as just that, open storage. Linux works the same general way as windows does when it comes to HDD's ( on PC's) so why can't the entire internal storage (16gb) just be open to use however, open folders, no hidden directories, no partitions (unless you WANT to create partitions) and then if you have an SD card it can just act as another drive (like having two hdd's in your pc, your main one has your OS on it and is used by default for install and storage location and the second is basically up to the user)
it really doesn't seem that complicated to me but if i were to put money on it i'd say its for app security so that users can't mess around with the app files
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agreed, that is somewhat what i meant though, the OS has its own partition of course but everything else is open. there isn't a separate partition for software installation that is predetermined and then another for other files, it's all open and usable
the whole root issue for android thing though i agree with, they are both linux, but on ubuntu or any distro the USER has root access anytime he wants it, android on the other hand, the OEM's lock you out which i think is completely wrong
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The old unix standard was to install all user apps in /usr/local, the newer standard uses /opt per the storage white paper, but Linux ignores that.
Either way, a standard partition for user apps is established as a best practice in a disciplined Linux configuration. Android is consistent with that idea.
Why our phones have a chastity belt controlled by the carriers is anyone's guess.
I'm confused, what ever happened to the unified storage model introduced in honeycomb? Why do no manufacturers use it? It seems pretty great. It looks like the tradeoff is no USB mass storage, but I think I am ok with that.
From Dan Morrill (google engineer):
"With the unified storage model we introduced in Honeycomb, we share your full 32GB (or 16GB or whatever) between app data and media data. That is, no more staring sadly at your 5GB free on Nexus S when your internal app data partition has filled up -- it's all one big happy volume."
with 32GB internal storage coupled with the cloud, and google's local caching features in most their media apps I think i am ready to drop the sd card in favor of a better filesystem.
It's something you get used to, and as someone else noted it's like having two SD cards in your phone. Not a big deal, really, since a lot of the larger apps (at least in my experience) either automatically install to SD card or have the option available at this time. My biggest gripe is that some apps do not recognize the physical SD card as available storage, and so do not give you the option to store data there. I believe Google Music is in this camp; it's happy to read from it, but you can't set it to save purchased music there.*
*At least that's what I remember with my Photon. I forgot it at home today so I can't double-check.
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Once in the 90's I had a PC with a 20GB Hdd. I ran out of space and ever since then, I like to have WAY more space than I actually need.
I have 3 x 16GB USB sticks, 2 x 8GB SD Cards for me camera, 32GB Micro in my EVO, 2TB in my PC, 1.5 TB ext HDD for my PC, extra 1TB Ext HDD for my PC, lol.
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i remember my first tech job... back in early 90s... put in this monster size hardrive.. huge in physical size .. 40mbs! i thought.. why anyone needs something that big??
then came the 170mb hardrive.. 1/4 it physical size.. I was.. now there that guy will never need anything more!
PCs started with cassette drives...NO Harddrive..
then 1 5" floppy
then 2 5" Floppys
then 3.25" floppy drive... I remember loading games with 20 3.5" floppies.
then came the CD-drives.. wow.. that is bigger than Harddrives..
then came DVD Drives...
programs are always getting bigger!!!
and the files we create (photos, vids) are always getting bigger too
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then 3.25" floppy drive... I remember loading games with 20 3.5" floppies.
LOL. I remember those days too. I remember when my dad ordered the the upgrade from windows 3.1 to windows 95 back in 1995. I was so excited! It was something like 40 3.5" floppy disk's.. talk about a long tedious upgrade process. (and to think, this was just the upgrade).
LOL. I remember those days too. I remember when my dad ordered the the upgrade from windows 3.1 to windows 95 back in 1995. I was so excited! It was something like 40 3.5" floppy disk's.. talk about a long tedious upgrade process. (and to think, this was just the upgrade).
LOL...I remember when it was all about DOS!...hahaha. Growing up in Generation X really had its advantages, just seeing technology grow in the timeframe that it has.
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You kids should have been there when my new computer had dual (yes, dual) 160K floppy drives. Boy that was somethin. And the fantastic CP/M operating system and famous Zilog 80 cpu. That thing was next to useless.
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Brandon: I'm a little confused by the phone storage shots; they seem to suggest that you only get 2GB of space for apps, and the other 10 gigs is for storage of media. I'm a bit disappointed if 2GB is all I get for apps.
John: That's a great question, and I'm happy to clarify. I actually just addressed it last night in the video walkthrough, but it's worth revisiting here, too. Apps are automatically installed to "internal storage" (that's the 2GB you were talking about), while around 10GB of "phone storage" is set aside for anything else you want to put on the phone. However, it's really easy to move apps over to phone storage: just go to Settings > Apps > On phone storage. You'll see a list of apps that you can move to phone storage, if you want, freeing up more space in your internal storage. It works exactly the same way as moving apps to your SD card.
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Well the EVO only had like 500mbs for apps and the 3D says 1.15GB so I'll take two. Cause I am low on space now but was planning on not putting as much stuff on the new phone. I have alot of apps I don't use and I can't even update apps now I have no space. So I'll take the 2 which is about double of what I have now knowing I am not putting every single app back on this new phone. But being able to move to phone storage like app to sd seems good. My Archos tablet was like that and I didn't know it. I thought since it had 16 gigs and then I ran out of app space quick. I now have the 32 gig Transformer Prime and I don't know how much is for apps only but It's been great so far. But i can't move apps to sd card on it. It has ICS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hootie
Read this over at Good and Evo:
Last edited by Rose4uKy; May 15th, 2012 at 11:54 PM.
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What's the difference between internal storage and phone storage? I thought they were the same.
Evo 4G LTE Internal Memory Allocation:
9.93GB - Phone Storage (internal but used like a MicroSD card/Mass Storage)
2.09GB - Internal Storage (Applications)
~3GB or Remaining portion of 16GB after formatting - System Storage (Operating System and Sense files)
Last edited by PyroSporker; May 16th, 2012 at 12:59 AM.
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That's pretty much how the MoPho works. For the most part it's not a big deal, but some apps won't recognize an SD card as a valid storage location. For example, Google Music will happily read any media files you have on the physical SD card, but if you buy anything it will go on to the phone's internal storage. I have yet to find a setting telling it to save to the actual SD card.
Otherwise, as I said, not a big deal. Those apps (and pieces of apps) that refuse to move to the internal storage don't amount to a ton of space in general, unless you have hundreds of apps.
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Repeating info already stated, as a convenient wrap-up post -
App space on -
Evo 4G - 427 MB
Evo 3D - 1.15 GB (about double an Evo)
LTEvo - 2.09 GB (about double a 3vo, quadruple an Evo)
The 9~10 GB of user space will show up on your favorite file browser (EStrongs, Astro) under the /sdcard folder (even though it's not really a physical sd card).
The rest of the 16 GB is used by the operating system and necessary included apps (phone dialer for example), radio firmware and the bootloader.
Again - nothing new here, just a wrap-up post. Hope it helps!
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On the 9 to 10 GB of phone storage, what can be placed there? Can apps, music and pictures be placed there?
Exactly what can be placed on your Evo 3D's sd card. Music, pictures, vids, some app data.
Some apps can moved there with apps2sd or the equivalent built-in.
Many apps moved to the sd card will continue to store data into the 2GB apps area.
Here's how a phone is laid out (very simplified version) in terms of partitions. They're just like partitions (or logical drives, if you will) on a PC hard disk. Instead of drive letters, they get folder names -
/boot
kernel goes here, it's not big
/system
Android, Sense, and included apps (when you open the box) go here
/data
your apps go here (this area is pretty rich, it's the 2 GB part of the LTEvo)
/sdcard
a physical sd card on most phones, but actually a reserved space of 9~10 GB from the 16 GB storage on the LTEvo
Android always expects to see this folder/area
acts just like the sd card on an Evo or 3vo
/cache
the operating system cache - ignore this, it doesn't concern you as a user as far as managing things go
various hidden areas
bootloader, radio firmware, etc - ignore this, it doesn't concern you as a user as far as managing things go
/sdcard/ext_sd or /sdcard2
if you install an actual sd card into the LTEvo, it will be accessed with either one of these names - both will exist, both are shortcut to the physical, removable sd card
Last edited by EarlyMon; June 2nd, 2012 at 07:47 PM.
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Exactly what can be placed on your Evo 3D's sd card. Music, pictures, vids, some app data.
Some apps can moved there with apps2sd or the equivalent built-in.
Many apps moved to the sd card will continue to store data into the 2GB apps area.
Here's how a phone is laid out (very simplified version) in terms of partitions. They're just like partitions (or logical drives, if you will) on a PC hard disk. Instead of drive letters, they get folder names -
/boot
kernel goes here, it's not big
/system
Android, Sense, and included apps (when you open the box) go here
/data
your apps go here (this area is pretty rich, it's the 2 GB part of the LTEvo)
/sdcard
a physical sd card on most phones, but actually a reserved space of 9~10 GB from the 16 GB storage on the LTEvo
Android always expects to see this folder/area
acts just like the sd card on an Evo or 3vo
/cache
the operating system cache - ignore this, it doesn't concern you as a user as far as managing things go
various hidden areas
bootloader, radio firmware, etc - ignore this, it doesn't concern you as a user as far as managing things go
/sdcard/ext_sd or /sdcard2
if you install an actual sd card into the LTEvo, it will be accessed with either one of these names - both will exist, both are shortcut to the physical, removable sd card
Thanks, I understand it better now. I like how that works.
Last edited by EarlyMon; June 2nd, 2012 at 07:48 PM.
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By the way - Android apps are small. They're often less than 5 MB, up to 50 for the bigger ones.
You can store hundreds of typical apps in 2 GB.
The problem comes from games and lazy app developers. Not uncommon for those clowns to download 300, 400 MB or more to your internal app space for game data.
Write them and let them know that you don't appreciate the Apple storage model, and that this is Android. Game data, like any app drawing a large data space, ought to go to your internal or external sd card, by your choice.
With the original EVO I was always watching my memory. With the 3VO and the Photon I don't worry about it as much. But my problem is I tend to be an app whore. lol. But I'm learning.
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moving apps to sd.card
Loving the phone. But have a question as this maybe an I'v thing. When I dl an app, am I missing something as far as moving it to the sd card?
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Loving the phone. But have a question as this maybe an I'v thing. When I dl an app, am I missing something as far as moving it to the sd card?
On the photon, moving apps to the sd translates to moving them to the media storage area. Apps can't be moved to the external sd. I don't have the LTEvo, so couldn't tell you how the partition is divided or if apps can be moved to the external sd, but there are done that have the photon that can likely tell you if it's the same on the LTEvo.
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All I did was put the sd cars in the phone and did the format. I reminder with the og evo and app 2 sd you did it that way. Now with ics, you have internal with 2.09 gigs, phone storage with about 9+ gigs and sd with 59+.
Earlymon I know what you said, but there has to be away to save to sd card and the sd card to reflect that. Anyone have any ideas?
All I did was put the sd cars in the phone and did the format. I reminder with the og evo and app 2 sd you did it that way. Now with ics, you have internal with 2.09 gigs, phone storage with about 9+ gigs and sd with 59+.
Earlymon I know what you said, but there has to be away to save to sd card and the sd card to reflect that. Anyone have any ideas?
Actually, in the pre-release root and across the forums for months, I've been calling for an Android mod to do just that.
The issue started with the expanded storage phones - LTEvo is one of them.
Problem is that the consumer expectation is that the physical SD card will continue to work as before.
First comes the legacy problem -
Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyMon
So long as sd cards are formatted using Windows vfat, rather than a Linux filesystem like the rest of the phone, moving things to the card will have its limits.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frisco
Was the philosophy of vFAT to share data across platforms to Windows?
The reason why this plagues users?
Root required and locked bootloaders everywhere.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyMon
It's almost the standard to allow moving the card to any media devices and have it just work. Example, not only being able to plug in to your PC, but you can also put that card right into many HP photo printers and go to town.
Plus, it's likely easier to mount it on any make/os pc and transfer data.
Right now, the issue is fixed partitions and direct mount points for them, as well as their order, in Android.
What's needed is for the /data area to be configurable to point anywhere the user wants. Problem solved.
The holdup? Locked bootloaders and no root, out of the box, to let such a thing work.
Unix admins run into this on most every default unix install, and do just as I suggest where things like /system, /data and /etc are on disk, rather than memory.
The techniques are so well known that the cure for this could be trivial - were it not for the artificial, but quite real, constraints we face.
All of the disclaimers apply. Try that only if you know what you are doing and accept the risks.
The good news is that you can learn what's required and get help from developers forums from those who came up with these tricks or from folks on our forums who have been there, done that.
Hope this helps!
Android is Linux.
In Linux, you get root privileges from day one.
With Android, you get things locked to just one way - until the dev community steps in to help.
Please note well - the above links are to inform all of the methods that have been deployed in the past.
Please do NOT try them on your LTEvo unless you have crazy-high unix skills, know what those commands do without asking, and are quite certain that you want to guinea pig that sort of thing for others here.
Meanwhile - you now have more storage than ever before.
(PS - "phone storage" is really used to refer to the whole 16 GB that comes with the phone, and may cause confusion talking to others. Perhaps best to refer to 2 GB apps, 9+ GB as either "additional user storage" or "internal sd card" - that may help ease communicating with others as we move down the road.
All I did was put the sd cars in the phone and did the format. I reminder with the og evo and app 2 sd you did it that way. Now with ics, you have internal with 2.09 gigs, phone storage with about 9+ gigs and sd with 59+.
Earlymon I know what you said, but there has to be away to save to sd card and the sd card to reflect that. Anyone have any ideas?
That's the point I was trying to make though. It really depends on how HTC set up the partition.
The Photon has 3gb for apps only, 8.92gb for media (e.g. internal storage) and then the remainder of the 16gb for internal storage is filled up by all the files to run the phone and format the internal storage.
If someone adds an external SD card, I have never found a way to actually move apps onto the external SD because the partition is set up to only move apps to the internal storage (which acts as the "SD" because of the partition with the internal storage...e.g. 3gb/8.92gb).
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Ok this is why I never should have left Android. Its like never land, once you leave you forget.
I downloaded appear free version just like I originally did on the og evo. You gotta remember it's up to the developer to allow it to be saved to the sd card. For example dl appear and then dl Amazon. Once you do at the top you will see a little icon of a card and you pull down the notification and it will say this app can be saved to the sd card.
Then use app2sd to move it. So class not all apps can be moved as it is up to the developer to allow it to happen. If I am wrong let me know.
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Ok this is why I never should have left Android. Its like never land, once you leave you forget.
I downloaded appear free version just like I originally did on the og evo. You gotta remember it's up to the developer to allow it to be saved to the sd card. For example dl appear and then dl Amazon. Once you do at the top you will see a little icon of a card and you pull down the notification and it will say this app can be saved to the sd card.
Then use app2sd to move it. So class not all apps can be moved as it is up to the developer to allow it to happen. If I am wrong let me know.
Here's the difference with the OG EVO. The OG EVO didn't have any on board storage. It only had storage for apps. In this case, you have on board storage that is partitioned specifically for certain purposes. The 2+gb partition would be similar to the storage the OG EVO had for apps. The remaining 9gb is partitioned out separately, so majority of the phones that I'm aware of will allow for any applicable apps (that can be moved) to be moved to the 9gb of on board storage. Basically, you'd have to pretend as if you never purchased an external memory card. When you move the app to SD, it'll go to the on board storage that's partitioned out from the storage made specifically for apps only.
As far as I know, even with apps2sd, the apps don't get moved to the external SD card...that is, unless, HTC set it up differently where you can have a choice between the two.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drexappeal
Here's the difference with the OG EVO. The OG EVO didn't have any on board storage. It only had storage for apps. In this case, you have on board storage that is partitioned specifically for certain purposes. The 2+gb partition would be similar to the storage the OG EVO had for apps. The remaining 9gb is partitioned out separately, so majority of the phones that I'm aware of will allow for any applicable apps (that can be moved) to be moved to the 9gb of on board storage. Basically, you'd have to pretend as if you never purchased an external memory card. When you move the app to SD, it'll go to the on board storage that's partitioned out from the storage made specifically for apps only.
As far as I know, even with apps2sd, the apps don't get moved to the external SD card...that is, unless, HTC set it up differently where you can have a choice between the two.
I understand what is going on. I just think there has to be a way to be able to move apps to the actual sd card.
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Ok I have App2SD on the new phone it says move to phone storage and then back to onternal storage. So is phone storage your sd card? I moved a 26mb netflix app to phone storage then on APP2SD it's under sd card now but only shows 1.05mb. So I am assuming phone storage is your card right? And I am guessing it means out of the 26 mb it only moved 1.04mb of the app. I know all apps have to have stuff stay and that the whole entire app doesn't go to the card. But I moved Netflix back if it's only going to move 1.04 out of 26 I didn't I didn't think it needed to be on the card. Should I just not put anything on the card until I have too. Right now I have 1.65gb free out of 209 I know my 3D always said I had 1.15 so this is 50 more plus I am not downloading everything I had on my 3D. Just important stuff I need for now.
But I was told if you do see an X next to an app on APP2SD that you should leave it on the phone and that it means it will run better if not moved.I see the x now on some apps what does it mean? And my sense kept reloading on my 3D and I was low on space. Someone told me to take all apps with the x and put them back on phone to make it run better but eventually I was out of space and couldn't move anymore. I had 86 updates I never could update apps anymore neither. This phone ROCKS!
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Originally Posted by Rose4uKy
Ok I have App2SD on the new phone it says move to phone storage and then back to onternal storage. So is phone storage your sd card? I moved a 26mb netflix app to phone storage then on APP2SD it's under sd card now but only shows 1.05mb. So I am assuming phone storage is your card right? And I am guessing it means out of the 26 mb it only moved 1.04mb of the app. I know all apps have to have stuff stay and that the whole entire app doesn't go to the card. But I moved Netflix back if it's only going to move 1.04 out of 26 I didn't I didn't think it needed to be on the card. Should I just not put anything on the card until I have too. Right now I have 1.65gb free out of 209 I know my 3D always said I had 1.15 so this is 50 more plus I am not downloading everything I had on my 3D. Just important stuff I need for now.
But I was told if you do see an X next to an app on APP2SD that you should leave it on the phone and that it means it will run better if not moved.I see the x now on some apps what does it mean? And my sense kept reloading on my 3D and I was low on space. Someone told me to take all apps with the x and put them back on phone to make it run better but eventually I was out of space and couldn't move anymore. I had 86 updates I never could update apps anymore neither. This phone ROCKS!
No its not moving it to the sd cars like it did on the og evo. Its moving it to the phone storage. The one that is like 9 gigs.
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The HTC EVO 4G LTE is Sprint's version of the HTC One X. It comes with all the same specs, except for the processor, internal storage and radios (includes LTE). And aesthetics are also significantly different.
While many users have complaine... Read More
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Internal storage discussion (apps, errors)
