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Old March 24th, 2013, 10:22 AM   #51 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by toad6386 View Post
Interesting comparison video. First time I've seen someone not care for the pics from the Lumina. Not surprising the guy preferred the iPhone pics, as I believe one the Verge reviews I read seemed like it should be coming from iVerge. I really thought the line "it looks like a cell phone camera picture..." was brilliant .... I mean, really. I want a better camera than my 3VO, but am under no illusion that a phone can take the place of a point and click... Seems like I'm going to be happy with it.
But I do have to say that my experience with HTC cameras was spot on with what that Verge guy was saying. He incorrectly uses the term "washed out" when describing the white hazy look that HTC cameras often produce. Basically it's an artifact of glare. Anyone who's ever used a coated vs non-coated filter in front of an SLR lens will recognize this. Kinda wish more manufacturers would start using coated glass. It will make a big difference. But coated glass does cost more... about 2x than non-coated.

You can somewhat correct this with pre-processing by bumping up the contrast (or some combo of contrast and exposure adjustment), but often these adjustments will wreck photos taken under darker light conditions, so you're constantly adjusting the settings.

My wife has an iPhone 4s, and it does take very good photos. Under low light however, it also take bad photos quite often. But you know, all bets are off in low-light conditions, even with my Canon 5D, unless you have super steady hands or a tripod. But even this won't help if your subject is moving.

I do agree that the person taking the shots is much more important than the camera. Based on this review, I don't think any of the cameras are that much more outstanding than the next. They are all pretty darn good for what they are. The difference will be how you frame your shot and how you utilize the available light you have.

BTW, the correct definition of "washed out" is when the photo is overexposed to the point that the details in the bright areas are lost and become pure white. Sometimes this is desired if it's detail in the shadows you are after. If a photo appears brighter than it should but doesn't experience the clipping in the brights, it's just "overexposed."

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Old March 26th, 2013, 06:38 PM   #52 (permalink)
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It looks like HTC's ultrapixel gamble did not pay off in the end. The S4 beats it even in low light, kills it in good lighting.

Samsung Galaxy S4 vs. HTC One: Army of two - GSMArena.com

And kudos to gsmarena for ignoring the marketing hype and calling a megapixel a megapixel.
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Old March 26th, 2013, 08:25 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by CafeKampuchia View Post
It looks like HTC's ultrapixel gamble did not pay off in the end. The S4 beats it even in low light, kills it in good lighting.

Samsung Galaxy S4 vs. HTC One: Army of two - GSMArena.com

And kudos to gsmarena for ignoring the marketing hype and calling a megapixel a megapixel.
Cool article, but its just one article. I'm not about to claim a camera "killing" another one with just one review. I'm not a "phone photographer" my any means, so a camera on a phone means squat to me personally, though i use my EVO camera, if the photo is not blurry upon a 1 second observation by myself, then its an awesome picture

I am finally happy to see, however, a review comparing the two phones side by side.. and this one is 11 pages long.. awesome find.
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Old March 26th, 2013, 11:21 PM   #54 (permalink)
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"Kills it" is more my assessment after seeing the pictures myself and utter lack of detail evident in what the One captured.
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Old March 26th, 2013, 11:44 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Unfortunately, I have to agree. While this is just one article, we can't ignore that it is a well done article that is in depth and thorough. The article did seem a little bias to me (in favor of the GS4), but that is just my opinion based on the tone of the article. The jury is still out on my quest for the next best smartphone. But this article does cause me to waver a bit now. I was solid on the ONE.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 02:44 AM   #56 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

Mobile-review have their (Russian) S4 camera review up, which includes camera comparisons with the One and other handsets. http://mobile-review.com/review/samsung-galaxy-s4-camera.shtml

There have been reports of a One camera update in the last few days, but I assume none of these reviews includes that.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 04:40 AM   #57 (permalink)
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The field of view difference between the One and the S4 is quite striking.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 05:02 AM   #58 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by PyroSporker View Post
Theres been a few more comparisons in the past few days
Not a lot of science here, but I always enjoy looking through these no matter what. I tend to ignore the commentary and try let the photos do the talking

UltraPixel vs PureView: HTC One & Nokia Lumia 920 Camera Shoot-Out | Pocketnow
The color of the HTC One seems to be deep.And some photos of Lumia 920 seems more comfortable to common people, just like me.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 05:20 AM   #59 (permalink)
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The trick with colour comparisons is knowing what the original scene actually looked like, so that you can tell which is more accurate. With the samples shown it looks like the 920 has corrected more for the white balance on the indoor shots, I think is probably too warm in some of the others, but without being there I cannot be certain which is more accurate.

Of course colours are also a matter of taste. Many people prefer slightly warm and over-saturated, and manufacturers are going to be aware of this.

Edit: came across another comparison here, this time from PhoneArena: http://www.phonearena.com/reviews/Samsung-Galaxy-S4-vs-HTC-One_id3282. The camera comparison is on page 3. The shots are all outdoor, so don't really tell us much about low light.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 05:42 AM   #60 (permalink)
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Wow, review really condemns htc one! Hoping mine turns up today, will be interesting to see what pictures are like! !

Anyone with the One already comment on the review & pictures?? Are they that bad?
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Old March 27th, 2013, 09:17 AM   #61 (permalink)
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HTC have released a software update to improve camera performance. HTC say though that final retail units will ship with this new update in April.

HTC One software update improves camera performance - GSMArena.com news
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Old March 27th, 2013, 02:01 PM   #62 (permalink)
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HTC have released a software update to improve camera performance. HTC say though that final retail units will ship with this new update in April.

HTC One software update improves camera performance - GSMArena.com news
This reinforces what I said earlier in this thread before any reviews hit - expect the One software to lose detail due to their compression software, expect a root solution to fix that just like happened on the One X.

HTC addressing this so people don't have to root to solve that is just icing on the cake for rooters and salvation for non-rooters.

I'd also point out that none of that addressed video, another area benefiting from a selection of bit rates (just as a choice for level of compression is best).
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Old March 27th, 2013, 07:03 PM   #63 (permalink)
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This reinforces what I said earlier in this thread before any reviews hit - expect the One software to lose detail due to their compression software, expect a root solution to fix that just like happened on the One X.
But that will not change the fact that it's 4mp camera isn't capturing as much detail as an 8 or 13mp camera.

BTW, here's a good article on getting the most out of the One's hardware:

HTC One camera tips: How to take better pictures | Android Central
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Old March 27th, 2013, 07:15 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

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But that will not change the fact that it's 4mp camera isn't capturing as much detail as an 8 or 13mp camera.

BTW, here's a good article on getting the most out of the One's hardware:

HTC One camera tips: How to take better pictures | Android Central
When perceiving details, the eye goes to color saturation and contrast first, dpi resolution last.

Inescapable eye-brain physics and why I'd stack a good 3.2 MP point and shoot (larger sensor) against any of the phone wunderkind cameras and win for overall quality.

The megapixel myth is just that.

If you capture more pixels and think that is the critical factor in final perceived detail, it's like saying that a Rubik's cube is solved because you have just one side all the same color.

I still maintain that unless HTC gets it right, rooting and getting rid of the compression is needed to get the most out of an HTC camera.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 07:28 PM   #65 (permalink)
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That's all fine and good until you decide to crop a picture. Then megapixels suddenly start mattering. Besides, I don't think it's really been proven that HTC's UltraPixel strategy is really producing better results, at least not consistently.
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Old March 27th, 2013, 07:50 PM   #66 (permalink)
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That's all fine and good until you decide to crop a picture. Then megapixels suddenly start mattering. Besides, I don't think it's really been proven that HTC's UltraPixel strategy is really producing better results, at least not consistently.
Ok.

If it fails, I've always got my old 3.2 MP Olympus.
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Old March 28th, 2013, 10:57 AM   #67 (permalink)
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By my not being much of a shutterbug, the Zoe thing has about got me hooked , and know the MP myth is just that. But I understand and can see where Cafe and Novox are coming from, too.
*Putting on my Amazing Carnac turban* I predict that before too long, will start hearing more from the physical film crowd about the lack of 'nuance' in any digital pic, much like you have the vinyl record folks now.
When ANYTHING gets processed, it cannot, by definition, remain in its true unadulterated, original form, and a certain amount of give and take is required. I don't care how many or of what flavor mega-pixels there are, there's going to someone that says "it just doesn't look 'right.'" Hence why some like the hues of the superamoled over SLCD3, etc.
The pics I take are my memories, and regardless of how I take them, or with what, are usually clearer than the ones in my head, so just about ANY camera would work for me But again, I also understand the points of the true photogs, and value their opinions. Thanks!
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Old March 28th, 2013, 11:04 AM   #68 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

The best camera is the one you're carrying when you need to take a picture.
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Old March 28th, 2013, 11:21 AM   #69 (permalink)
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The best camera is the one you're carrying when you need to take a picture.
Agreed. I use my phone for those times when I don't want to carry a dedicated camera but for important occasions nothing can compare to a dedicated Camera. Living in New Orleans there are a lot of tests, parades, bar nights/days, etc where carrying a camera just isn't convenient and those shots just end up on Facebook or Instagram so most phone cameras are more than enough to handle the task; Not to mention generally the photographer has had a libation or two so they aren't the greatest shots anyway. I am most interested in the One's low light shots as the bulk of mine tend to be in these situations.
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Old March 28th, 2013, 11:28 AM   #70 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by EarlyMon View Post
This reinforces what I said earlier in this thread before any reviews hit - expect the One software to lose detail due to their compression software, expect a root solution to fix that just like happened on the One X.

HTC addressing this so people don't have to root to solve that is just icing on the cake for rooters and salvation for non-rooters.

I'd also point out that none of that addressed video, another area benefiting from a selection of bit rates (just as a choice for level of compression is best).
That's an update that's already came and passed. Phandroid updated their post about it. There is no incoming update.
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Old March 28th, 2013, 03:27 PM   #71 (permalink)
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That's an update that's already came and passed. Phandroid updated their post about it. There is no incoming update.
Yep, I was commenting in reference to that - my point was - none of the blogs that have done their shoot-outs are going to go back and take that into account.

At least one has a detailed review of the One with pre-release software and the reviewer came right out and erroneously said, don't expect anything to change. While his same org, another reviewer, did a comparison and came to all sorts of conclusions, without stating what he had at all.

My point isn't "boo hoo, HTC lost" - my point is that people are going to be trusting untrustworthy review results as consumers.

What does it mean - "update?" It means that the maker has their opinion of what the new revision, but we may have ours.

Regardless of brand, I have no trust in these early reviews. I can point GNex and various Samsung threads for phone releases where users found better results after updates from initial release, and I know that's been my consistent experience with HTC.

They don't wait until the platforms are stable to review. We don't pay them. They live on clicky advertising. They'll crank out anything, most of it ridiculous imo, and call it a "test" - because, hey - blog writer=qualified tester.

That's my beef.

By design, the One has a larger sensor with larger pixels than others. It will gather more light with less noise at the hardware level at the expense of actual dots, and with an F/2.0 aperature, it will have less depth of field than other cameras - those are the hardware tradeoffs and facts.

I don't see fair reviews trying various custom exposure settings. If you're outside, take a picture, and it's crappy, thanks to the magic of immediate feedback with a digital camera, there are 343 exposure adjustments on top of various additional adjustments for ISO and white balance.

The adjustments possible with any modern Android will number over a thousand for many of the pictures used in the so-called tests.

Which - are all done by taking default snaps and going,
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Oh wow, lookie my review, this side by side proves that I can take default pictures and put them up side by side on a web page. Where, thanks to digital sampling, may not show on my web what was on my camera, and thanks to your monitor and web browser, may not show proper mapping if they did match. Isn't that great?!? Let's all swoon over my in-depth conclusions, I are an Expret!
The reviews tell of possibilities, and now we're past that into the exciting horse-race era - which - disgusts me to no end, because now as far as I'm concerned, we might as well be asking Elvis' ghost which is better.

Just spent an hour comparing photos with a pal with an SGS3 vs my LTEvo. We had a blast, and found a lot to like - and criticism in agreement - about each other's setups.

I expect that the One and SGS4 this year is better than last year's models because - it's this year. And there will be differences.

I've lived in film too long, I guess.
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Old March 28th, 2013, 10:07 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Based on that iFixit guide the HTC One main camera sensor has optical image stabilisation (gyroscope). Is that new to HTC phones?
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Old March 28th, 2013, 10:09 PM   #73 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

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Based on that iFixit guide the HTC One main camera sensor has optical image stabilisation (gyroscope). Is that new to HTC phones?
Yep.
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Old March 29th, 2013, 04:21 PM   #74 (permalink)
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The HTC One was given to a couple of people and this is what was achieved. Quite impressive really.

UltraPixel Photography with the New HTC One — HTC Blog

HTC need to promote more of this kind of thing and make a big deal about it! Everyone's saying the camera sucks, but in actual fact it doesn't. Not in the slightest.
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Old March 29th, 2013, 04:35 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSuper View Post
The HTC One was given to a couple of people and this is what was achieved. Quite impressive really.

UltraPixel Photography with the New HTC One — HTC Blog

HTC need to promote more of this kind of thing and make a big deal about it! Everyone's saying the camera sucks, but in actual fact it doesn't. Not in the slightest.
That's awsONE!!!
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Old March 29th, 2013, 04:49 PM   #76 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

Yeah.

If only this picture had, oh, I don't know - moar dots.



Then it might be ok. But, just look at how terrible that is.

/sarcasm
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Old March 29th, 2013, 05:29 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyMon View Post
Yeah.

If only this picture had, oh, I don't know - moar dots.

Then it might be ok. But, just look at how terrible that is.

/sarcasm
To paraphrase Christopher Walken:

SNL-MORE COW BELL!! - YouTube

We need more dots......

Maybe there's an app for that,just so the naysayers can say "Told ya so".Wouldn't want them to walk disappointed........
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Old March 29th, 2013, 06:37 PM   #78 (permalink)
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I have been reading as many reviews as I can find on the One and its camera. In all fairness, much of the criticism about its camera is centered around outdoor photos where there is far more light involved. Most of the low/lower light shots do look good. It would have been nice if the two HTC customers had also taken outdoor shots, as well. In my case, I would like the phone to not only do well in low light, but also with outdoor shots. Early, I have been following your posts for many years, I and I highly respect your opinions. You also seem to have knowledge in the area of photography and taking photos. My question is - Will there be a way to get the One to take good photos outside? You mentioned getting ride of the compression. In my ignorance, I do not really know why HTC would be doing this, but anytime I see the word "compression" it usually is not good. I love everything else about the One but I have to have a good "all around" camera too.
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Old March 29th, 2013, 08:53 PM   #79 (permalink)
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I started developing my own film over 40 years ago. In film, I've done about 40% of my shooting with medium format cameras (2 1/4 twin lens Rolleis, various Mamiyas) and the rest in 35 mm.

I'm a babe in the woods on a lot of digital photography compared to many around here (novox is especially current and much more informed), but I know a _lot_ about digital signal processing and digital imaging processing, I did that professionally including for space-based platforms.

So, let's get down to cases on compression.

We'll begin with RGB model that you've all heard of. Maybe you've seen things where you can do color adjustments on your desktop - sliders for red, green and blue with values of 0 to 255 for each. I have that for fonts coloring on my email, for example. That's a 24-bit color model - used on your monitor, your TV, mostly everywhere. It gets its name because an 8-bit byte can contain decimal values from 0 to 255, and 3 bytes is 24 bits - aka - 16,777,216 colors.

Let's do the math - on a 4.3 MP camera such as we're talking about here, an uncompressed 24-bit color picture would take (4.3 MegaPixel * 3 Bytes/Pixel=) 12.9 MB.

For an 8 MP camera, that's 24 MB for each picture.

Enter the jpeg format. Virtually all jpegs are compressed, and it's what we call a lossy compression method - it doesn't preserve everything. Your PC zip files are lossless - you can reverse it and get out what you put in. Jpegs are not, and actually use the same sort of math that's used in making CD music discs.

Jpeg compression is controllable, it's not just one thing. On my favorite, simple desktop image tool, I get a slider when I'm converting and saving jpeg files to control low-quality/high-compression up to best-quality/low-compression.

If you have a digital camera, you may have options on it for file size expressed in quality terms - that's a jpeg compression adjustment.

Phone cameras are typically fixed for that.

Because HTC is all about photo sharing and social stuff, they've always chosen a higher compression as their preset to get smaller file sizes - and that compression introduces noise.

When you compress an image and lose quality, we describe that introducing noise or introducing artifacts depending on the crowd discussing it. It means things don't look perfect and detail is lost - and how much can vary quite a bit.

Here's a nice series of the same picture with varying levels of compression to illustrate -

JPEG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In my next post, I'll take some screen shots to show these mystical adjustments that I have and that I expect to eventually come to the custom community for this phone.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Let's talk about detail.

Earlier I said that the eye perceives detail from color saturation and contrast first and actual dots last. Every television engineer and SMPTE member knows that's a stone cold fact. If I could have a controlled situation where you could view a low def large TV with color and contrast right, next to a same-sized HDTV with the same image and those things wrong, you'd swear in court that the wrong one was the HDTV. I didn't believe it either, but I've seen it, I've failed the test, and it's no joke. Including still images of text.

marctronixx is a professional expert in this area, probably has forgotten more than I've known.

Here's an example that really hits home - which of these was taken with more megapixels?





Obviously, I spoiled the fun and you probably know that that is the exact same image just adjusted for color.

Anyway - come back in half an hour, forget the words and just look at the pictures. Tell me if you don't see more detail in one than the other.

Courtesy of Colorfulness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Let's talk about depth of field vs. aperture.

The HTC features an F/2.0 aperture. That's the ratio of the diameter of the lens opening to it's focal distance. Think of the pupil of one of your eyes. When it's wide open, it takes in more light, when it's smaller, it doesn't (look at someones eyes in dim light vs the same person in bright light).

A low number means more open. On phone cameras, unlike your eyes, that's fixed to one size.

The HTC is more open to light than anything else, that's before we even hit the light-sensitive 1/3" 4.3 MP sensor.

But - it comes with a trade-off.

It's called depth-of-field.

Put two people in a shot, one behind the other. Are they both in focus? Then they're both in the lens (or your eyes) depth-of-field. Have the one in back move further back. More. More. A little more... OK. If they're both not in focus at the same time, they've moved out of the depth-of-field.

A bigger opening, like the F/2.0 setup here, has a lower depth-of-field than a smaller opening.

That means for wide-area photos, you want to pick your point of focus for what you're most interested in coming out the sharpest. Actually, you want to do that on any camera, but maybe more so with this one.

It's never been an issue for me on my One X with the same F/2.0 setup, but I tend to always tap my subject for focus anyway, rather than trust the phone to guess.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Finally, let's talk about those pesky daylight photos.

Or any light photos for that matter.

You don't have to just point and shoot. You can, and you'll usually get decent results.

However - if you can take the time (and often you can if you want), you can try nudging the adjustments on the camera app to adjust exposure (see novox's earlier post explaining that what some of the weenies (my word, not his) call washed out are simply not exposed properly).

The light meter in any camera will only make a best guess. Maybe some of what you've seen or heard about was a bit of mis-metering. Maybe some of it was color adjustment. And maybe your results will vary if you're taking pictures into the light or away from it, at noon or 4 pm, near the shore or up in the mountains.

You can adjust for light sensitivity in your exposures outdoors with an ISO adjustment, and for light temperature with a white adjustment.

I'll go ahead and toss in the light adjustments on my HTC in my next post as well.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

With the exception of the megapixels, I heard a lot of this criticism about the One X camera when it came out.

And a whole lot of it was hogwash.

If you want quality pictures, take time to make adjustments. If you want more quality, get a camera app with even more adjustments.

If you don't have time in general to make adjustments, get a decent desktop photo editor, and make the adjustments after the fact. You can't do as much, but you can do a lot.

You can also edit quite a bit on the phone. I use this -

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.wheadon.photoenhancepro

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Already a photographer and want a handy app for your other camera, just because? Check out -

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=be.hcpl.android.phototools



Hope this helps a little.

Now - for some app shots to show the adjustment ideas.
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Old March 29th, 2013, 09:02 PM   #80 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

This is from my One X.

The compression and video bitrates are custom, the rest are stock HTC.

Do the math - there are thousands of combinations of adjustments there.

You don't have to settle for default - but you can, and still get good results.
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Old March 29th, 2013, 09:17 PM   #81 (permalink)
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I do one of these every year, I guess it's about that time. If you know me, you've seen this before.

If you think that you need high tech to take emotionally satisfying and fun pictures, then I offer this short video made on a Fisher-Price toy camera from years ago, the PXL2000 - 120x90 interlaced video - that's 10,800 pixels per frame.

About .01 MP video, right here.



Even if we're all wrong and megapixels do matter:

No. No, they do not.
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Old March 29th, 2013, 11:22 PM   #82 (permalink)
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These are some great posts, Early. Very educational. Even though you didn't answer my question, directly, I believe your intent was to say that "yes" you should be able to take good "all around" pictures with the One - but..... it sounds like you have to be willing to fuss, fiddle and adjust to do it.

For those of us that are "photographically challenged," I think that what we are looking for is a bit of a holy grail. Point - shoot - SHAZAM! Instant great picture. I guess I learned more than I wanted to today
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Old March 29th, 2013, 11:59 PM   #83 (permalink)
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Default Re: Camera talk - the Ultrapixel and more (Keep thread on topic)

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You don't have to just point and shoot. You can, and you'll usually get decent results.
You're liable to get decent pictures just clicking.

If you want better, you can get that too.
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Old April 1st, 2013, 10:31 AM   #84 (permalink)
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I did a really simple proof that 2-3 megapixels is sufficient back in another forum here a few years back.

Basically I took two photos of a bird feeder in my back yard. It is intricate and has a delicate mesh.

One photo was taken by an entry-level dSLR at 3 megapixels. The other was taken by my current smartphone at the time that boasted 8 megapixels.

When looking at the detail at native 1:1 resolution, it was clear that way more detail was present on the 3 megapixel dSLR shot than the 8mp phone shot.

Some of you might be saying, "Well duh, a dSLR obviously takes better photos than a cell phone camera." To which I say, "Duh, that's not the point." The point is that if you have high quality optics and a high quality sensor, and a good implementation of these components, you will capture good detail even if you are "restricted" in pixels.

Blu-ray at 1080p, absent of high jpeg lossy compression (which Early explained in a few posts before this one), looks really, really good and sharp. I was floored when I saw it for the first time in a Sony store circa 2008. And what's the megapixels for a given frame of 1080p? It's 1920x1080=2.073 megapixel. Just 2mp.

Any perceived image quality problems in the HTC One camera can't be blamed from their megapixel downsizing. It's something else that's still not quite up to snuff.

I used to shoot exclusively at 3mp with my dSLR until more recently when I upgraded to a pro dSLR and the minimum setting was 6mp. So now I shoot at 6mp. I have no need to shoot at the full 21mp because I won't need to be printing billboard-sized photos.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 12:32 AM   #85 (permalink)
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Thanks for the input, Novox. Early and I have had a brief volley of posts about this and I remain concerned that the One will require more "user input" for good photos than just - point and shoot. Personally, I am not a photo fiddler, but I do like decent photos and need a good camera on my next phone for work reasons. I am undecided now between the One and the GS4. I have been reading reviews in both forums looking for clues to push me one way or the other. Boom sound... that one is hard to beat, but reviewers are saying the GS4 is nearly as good. What? Really? How is that with a single rear-facing speaker? But all we have to go on here in the US is the professional and some personal reviews for both of these phones. My long winded point is that the professional reviewers are really giving the GS4 high marks in the camera department. So my question to you photo experts is this. Even though I get both you and Early's point about the ability to get good shots with lower pixels, is it more user friendly and easier to get a better "all around" set of photos if the pixels are high like the GS4's 13 megapixels? I am sure others are wondering about this as well.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 12:55 AM   #86 (permalink)
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Megapixels has nothing to do with it.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 04:20 AM   #87 (permalink)
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It will also depend on where you shoot. If the S4 is like the S3 (not seen enough to know yet) then the One will take usable pictures in lighting conditions the S4 won't take anything in. Remember that "low light" is an imprecise term, and a bar at night will be a lot lower light than say GSMArena's "low light" test.

Whether this matters at all depends on the individual.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 06:06 AM   #88 (permalink)
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I'm posting this here too. I posted it in another thread as I was specifically asked a question but it is more relevant in this thread.

Honestly, for my uses, the camera on the One is absolutely fine in comparison to the iPhone. I've found a number of uses for the extra functionality and the low light is way better on the One than the iPhone. I can't really see much difference between the two to the naked eye. I'm pleased as Punch.

iPhone 5 picture using standard settings. No zoom, no alterations.



HTC One picture using standard settings as above. No zoom, no alterations.



In both pictures, the focus is on the waxy gold top of the bottle in the middle.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 09:17 AM   #89 (permalink)
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Sometimes I feel like we ought to make our phone camera selection based on which post-processing filter we prefer the most.... These days, the optics, sensor, pixels, etc probably have less impact than the post-processing.

From an optical physics standpoint, I think we've mastered the pinhole camera. What makes the "camera" stand out is the intelligence of the post processing: can the firmware figure out the best settings to apply to a given shot?

When we're comparing photos taken in a bar, we're not comparing megapixels, or optics, or sensor quality. We're comparing which firmware can fix the crappy photo the best.

Garbage in, garbage out. If you take a photo in the worst physical conditions possible, you aren't going to get a good picture. But maybe the "auto-photoshop" in the firmware can salvage it somewhat.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 04:18 PM   #90 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scootmien View Post
I'm posting this here too. I posted it in another thread as I was specifically asked a question but it is more relevant in this thread.

Honestly, for my uses, the camera on the One is absolutely fine in comparison to the iPhone. I've found a number of uses for the extra functionality and the low light is way better on the One than the iPhone. I can't really see much difference between the two to the naked eye. I'm pleased as Punch.

iPhone 5 picture using standard settings. No zoom, no alterations.



HTC One picture using standard settings as above. No zoom, no alterations.



In both pictures, the focus is on the waxy gold top of the bottle in the middle.
Trying to be as objective as possible, I would say the One's picture is better. I say that not only because the label of the foremost bottle and the gold top in the iPhone's pic seems washed, (that may be because it seems a tad closer). But look at the Jack Daniels bottle in the back (I was weened off Jack before I got married ). Tho not a focal point of either pic, the detail is clearer in the One's pic than the iPhone's. At least in this comparison, I would think the advantage goes to the One.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 04:38 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toad6386 View Post
Trying to be as objective as possible, I would say the One's picture is better. I say that not only because the label of the foremost bottle and the gold top in the iPhone's pic seems washed, (that may be because it seems a tad closer). But look at the Jack Daniels bottle in the back (I was weened off Jack before I got married ). Tho not a focal point of either pic, the detail is clearer in the One's pic than the iPhone's. At least in this comparison, I would think the advantage goes to the One.
The iPhone has a great reputation for its camera.

Every situation and picture will vary but -

I think that you just got your question answered, in large part if not completely, about the suitability of the One camera and you just identified the one with fewer megapixels as having better detail. On a close-up.

Megapixels. Myth.

Color and contrast. Fact.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 04:39 PM   #92 (permalink)
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Bottom line is, if you are taking a pic with your phone, it's as a memory, a keepsake of a situation you are in, and have the phone camera to hand, you ain't gonna start blowing stuff up to unrealistic sizes......if you are, then it's not a phone you need to carry with you.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 06:52 PM   #93 (permalink)
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Default HTC ONE Camera Talk

Just a short Q&A with HTC's director of special projects regarding the ONE's UltraPixel Camera,may clear up a question or two regarding such:

HTC One, take 1: An in-depth discussion with the company's camera guru | Computerworld Blogs
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 04:14 AM   #94 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toad6386 View Post
Trying to be as objective as possible, I would say the One's picture is better. I say that not only because the label of the foremost bottle and the gold top in the iPhone's pic seems washed, (that may be because it seems a tad closer). But look at the Jack Daniels bottle in the back (I was weened off Jack before I got married ). Tho not a focal point of either pic, the detail is clearer in the One's pic than the iPhone's. At least in this comparison, I would think the advantage goes to the One.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyMon View Post
The iPhone has a great reputation for its camera.

Every situation and picture will vary but -

I think that you just got your question answered, in large part if not completely, about the suitability of the One camera and you just identified the one with fewer megapixels as having better detail. On a close-up.

Megapixels. Myth.

Color and contrast. Fact.
Yep, this is what clinched it for me. The iPhone camera is great, sure, but the One camera edges it out for the type of use I will be putting it through. I think the picture from the iPhone might be a tad closer but it didn't really change that the Balvenie bottle stayed washed out at any short distance on the screen of the iPhone as I took the picture.

I'm more than happy to take a couple more comparison shots of something else if it would assist though?
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 04:18 AM   #95 (permalink)
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Please, I'd love to see them.
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 04:51 AM   #96 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Please, I'd love to see them.
No worries, i'll go out into the garden in a bit. It's very grey and overcast here as we only seem to get summer between 14:17 and 15:23 on the 23 July every year...

I can't wait to move to LA...
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 05:10 AM   #97 (permalink)
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Please try a few HDR shots if it's overcast.
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 06:05 AM   #98 (permalink)
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OK, here are a couple of pictures from each taken in my garden. I'm using standard settings on the iPhone 5 and HTC One barring both have HDR enabled. I've made sure that both of the pictures were taken from the same distance away from the subject too.

On each of these first two pics, the focal point is the flower at centre middle of the frame.

iPhone 5



HTC One



The focal point of these next two pictures is the closest knotted right angle branch.

iPhone 5



HTC One



I honestly prefer the HTC one pictures. The colours might not be so bright but I feel they are more natural given that I know what the original scene looks like with my naked eye. I'm afraid you'll have to take my word for that, sorry.

Anyway, in comparison, I really do think the HTC One has the better camera.
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 07:17 AM   #99 (permalink)
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Can you post the 2 photos from the One, with "auto enhance" applied in the gallery as well please Scootmien?
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 07:46 AM   #100 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craftycarper View Post
Can you post the 2 photos from the One, with "auto enhance" applied in the gallery as well please Scootmien?
Sure thing. Here they are. I think I did it right. Gallery > Edit > Effects > Auto Enhance

I think I prefer them non-enhanced, personally.



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The HTC One is the manufacturer's flagship device for 2013. The device's specs put it in the top of the smartphone pyramid, featuring a 1.7 GHz quad-core Snapdragon 600 processor, 2 GB of RAM, a 4.7-inch 1080p display and Android 4.1.2. Its... Read More

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