mrdrh99

Ok, my upgrade is tomorrow, this will be my final ne2, I'll get $30 since I'm on a family plan. With that I can get either a razr or spectrum for about $160, or get the cpo bionic for free since it's now $29!

My issues with the spectrum is the horrid product support and slow ota updates stories I've heard. I dont really have anything against the razr other than not bring able to remove battery I have endless sd cards laying around. But the bionic has the basic things I was looking for (4g, dual core), although that screen on the spectrum is rockin!

Anyone have an opinion? I'm updating from a cpo X, I have no issues buying a cpo?
Thanks

rexboe

Go with the Bionic I think it is the best phone out and free is always good.

Lucidot

Personally, after the issues I have been having with the Bionic (and I'm not alone) I would opt for the RAZR.

So you can't take the battery out. Whoopty Crap!!

IMO, the ones that think that is such a big deal are the ones that are anti-apple and it just makes them feel that much closer to an iPhone.

hurricane630

I agree with this lol. The bionic is a good phone, but I've also had many problems with it. But I believe I am the minority of bionic owners. The update fixed most peoples problems, but i've been through 3 phones and still have problems. If non removable battery is a problem for you, then go bionic. If its not, then go razr

wichita6

The Bionic is a good phone. I really think the tower problem is the reason some go through 3 or more phones and still have problems. I am on my second bionic and since the update I have had no problems.
The razer's lack of removable battery would turn me away if I was looking at changing phones.

Thom Little

The Bionic and Razr are both great. I don't like the way the Razr "feels" when I pick it up. I like everything about the Bionic.

The data drops in the Bionic are a problem. They have been whittled down on both sides. The supposed next release (5.9.902) should get the remainder. How soon that will happen is not known. If you absolutely must have a reliable data connection today ... install the leaked 5.9.901 on the Bionic.

I suggest you compare the Bionic and Razr side-by-side and pick the one you like ... you'll be intimate with it for quite a while.

... Thom

__________________

mrdrh99

Thanks guys, anyone have any hands-on with the spectrum and that dual 1.5 or do you think that it's over rated?

mbtech

Don't forget about the RazrMaxx coming very soon and also the Droid 4(If you want an external keyboard) I personally love my Bionic since I put the leaked 5.9.901 on it. Just wish it had ICS like the Nexus.

htceris

How are you able to get it for free? I am in similar situation, and when I try to upgrade to cpo bionic it is $29.99 even after $30.00 credit was apply toward it (according to rep. I chatted online).

PowerBomb

Uh oh. I was under the assumption that I'd be able to grab a Bionic for free too once my loyalty credit finally kicks in this week, in combination with the $29.99 sale going on. I was even about to call in this evening and ask if they'd be willing to bump up my loyalty discount by a few days so I can make sure I place an order before things run out of stock. Maybe they won't combine discounts with the sale that is going on? If that's the case I'm perfectly fine getting a Bionic at $29.99 and not worrying about my discount, but so far I've been thinking free-is-free and was waiting to combine it with a loyalty credit.

Edit: I just called and asked and the rep claimed she was able to get the loyalty discount to stack on top of the sale price. The only reason I can't confirm this for myself is that my credit doesn't kick in until Saturday so I can't go test this on the website. But according to her this should work and still be able to get a credit in addition to sale prices.

Last edited by PowerBomb; January 25th, 2012 at 08:17 PM.

mrdrh99

We're thinking the same way powerbomb, I got the idea and double checked with a rep before posting. I'm honestly not seeing anything worth the extra money with this being free! Esp since I can just return it if I hate it. What a way to use your final ne2, free 4g dual core droid!

htceris

True, there is no reason not to get the 4g dual core for free! However, I have chatted with more than one rep online, and all of them claimed that I can't get it for free & $29.99 is the price regardless of loyalty credit of $30.00. I am going to be calling rep tomorrow to check it again, and hope I can use my loyalty credit of $30.00 toward this cpo bionic.

htceris

Just a little input to help with your decision. Before I saw this post about cpo bionic is on sale, I played with bionic, razr, spectrum & a few other 4g phones at local store, and I noticed a few interesting things: razr seem to have fastest 4g connection speed @ over 20 mbps while LG spectrum, bionic, & other 4g phones are just above 10 mbps (I tested a few times on each phones & they are all within a few feet of each other.) I know that 10mbps is more than fast enough for most people, but somehow razr is always faster at over 20mbps, I don't know how or why.
While LG spectrum has really nice screen i found one odd thing .... long pressing on spectrum home button doesn't seem to be working as it should. Just my observation base on testing out at local store. Hope it helps

Lucidot

Again...IMO...This is complete misinformation.

I am on my 4th Bionic and 3rd new SIM card and I still have this issue.
My wife has a T-Bolt (4G phone) and while my data issues persist, her phone does not miss a beat. Her phone holds on to 4G constantly while my Bionic loses data completely. All of this happens while I have the phones directly next to each other.

So, to me, this is a Bionic issue, not a tower issue.

Who knows. Maybe you'll get lucky and get a Bionic that was made by foreign person living in China that they don't beat for not hitting their numbers and that cares about how your phone is put together and it was on a Wednesday so that he/she had plenty of time to recoup from the drunken weekend they had at the local tavern.

Hell, it's free. Roll the dice. The worst that could happen is that your stuck posting in here about your 8th Bionic you just received in the mail and it doesn't work either.

Best that could happen is that you realize it's a POS before your 14 days are up and you can take it back and get a different phone.

Lucidot

Update with my most recent replacement.

This phone is right out of the box. Nothing has been installed and the only thing done was activation.

Data drops galore and now a BSOD. Never had one of those before.

If I were you, I would stay as far away from this phone as possible. I might even go as far as saying that you may want to stay away from Motorola all together.

Admittedly I haven't lurked or read anything in the RAZR forum so I'm not sure if they have many issues or not.

Last edited by Lucidot; January 26th, 2012 at 06:18 AM. Reason: Typo

Thom Little

The recommended courses of action for the Bionic are ...

BSOD - BSOD (Black Screen of Death). If you run through that and get to the end you may be replacing the device (again).

Data Drops - install the leaked 5.9.901 or wait for 5.9.902.

... Thom

Lucidot

So for data drops the fix is to install a non-official version of the firmware or wait for God knows how long for an official release?

I find it a little hypocritical of you to suggest a fix that your not willing to do since it's not official. I think I recall when people updated to the 5.7.893 (unofficial) and then found themselves screwed at that moment you made comments to the affect of that is why you were staying stock on your phone, so you didn't find yourself in a situation like that. I could be mistaken though.

Thom Little

You reported the two major problems with the Bionic with your new phone and indicated you had never had a BSOD before.

The first reference is the accumulation of a lot of experience with people having BSOD problems that includes people who had defective devices. I pointed you to it in case you had not reviewed it.

I am running 5.5.893 with the original SIM card that came with my Bionic. Consistent with what I wrote, I have chosen to wait for 5.9.902. I can absorb the data drops. If you absolutely cannot absorb the data drops then many people have had success with 5.9.901.

5.7.893 was a leaked version that came out the back door someplace. It had some really strange problems and was a challenge to remove and get back. When it came out it was obvious that it was very risky.

5.9.901 was not released. There is some risk attached to getting back to stock if you install it. The risk seems fairly low. The reason is that unlike 5.7.893 Motorola pushed 5.9.901 directly to end user phones (apparently those that had formally reported the data drop problem). The assumption is that you will be able to upgrade from 5.5.893 or 5.9.901 to 5.9.902. That is not known for sure. That is the reason for recognizing there is some risk.

My recommendation to people about to upgrade to a Bionic is to stay on 3G a while longer and wait until 5.9.902 is released.

The most conservative approach (with guarantee) is the one I am taking ... wait for 5.9.902.

... Thom

Last edited by Thom Little; January 26th, 2012 at 09:40 AM. Reason: typo

Lucidot

I thought you were on 5.5.893? As per another one of your posts.

Thom Little

Typo ... corrected ... thanks.

... Thom

PowerBomb

Let us know what you figure out about that. As I mentioned above, a phone rep told me she was able to get the discounts to combine and make the phone free, but others are telling you the opposite.


Other than that, interesting debate going on in this thread. I'd hate to finally upgrade to a newer device and walk into a world of faults and complications. The Ally suffered from enough problems and was a bit of a pain sometimes. I even wondered if it's a bad sign that the Bionic is even part of this 4G sale promotion, I can understand them wanting to get rid of some Revolutions and other 4G devices, but Droid Bionics being given away at $29.99? Makes me think there must be a huge stockpile of CPOs from all the returns.

I'm not sure what I want to do now. Almost feel like not upgrading at all!

amazinz5

There are faulty Bionics, that's no secret. But what the haters want to keep from you is the countless Bionic owners that haven't had a single issue. Don't let anyone tell you they're certain the problem is this or isn't that....some Bionics are faulty, while others are perfect. Sometimes 4g goes out nationwide, for all phones. Maybe the people complaining were too eager to try to turn other people off of a great device to realize there is absolutely no risk in the first 30 days....if you don't like it take it back and get a rezound or whatever. I honestly believe the bionic haters are just jealous of the people that got (really really) good ones and want to keep other people from doing so. Otherwise they'd be telling you try it out, some are great, if not you can return it within 30 days.

We should start compiling info on where/how people are getting good and bad bionics, like costco/vzw store/internet, region of the country, etc

PowerBomb

Yeah I know no device is perfect (unfortunately). I think in the case of a certified preowned, you may only get 14 days of a return/exchange window instead of 30, but still, it would provide enough of a safety net if I get a Bionic and hate it, I can get rid of it. I'll likely end up giving it a try. Unlike OP I'm not even considering anything like the Razr or Spectrum because I'm not looking to spend that much, so my choices are either Tbolt, Charge, Revolution, Bionic, or choosing to stick with 3G devices. I think I'll try out the Bionic and go from there. I'm gonna be annoyed if I wait for my loyalty discount to start on Saturday and then find out the rep was wrong and I can't stack the discount on top of the sale price lol.

Thom Little

We tried that survey in the past and the results were not conclusive.

There was one really bad batch of Bionics turned back by Radio Shack and a couple more that were not disclosed.

The people who are happy with their Bionics are not typically visiting here so assuming anything about happiness/unhappiness from visitors here is going to be an error.

The biggest problem that I see is that many people want a simple label to apply to something so they can bitch about it. Here that is BSOD and data drops. Both of these are the result of multiple causes and are all clumped together so complainers can have a warm fuzzy feeling.

There is a recommended course of action for BSODs at ... Post Your Tips for the Bionic Here.

The data drops on the tower side seem to be mostly corrected and 5.9.901 or 5.9.902 seem to solve the remainder on the Bionic side.

It seems likely that if it is a defective device it will be weeded out by the referenced BSOD evaluation.

... Thom

doogald

I'm not sure if certified pre-owned is different from new sales, but Verizon's return policy for new devices sales is 14 days, not 30 days, with a $35 restocking fee. There is no 30 day return policy at Verizon for new handsets, and I imagine CPO is the same. I would definitely ask about that ahead of time.

23skidoo

Just to smooth the curve a little:

My Bionic came straight from Verizon, activated...I dunno, sometime in the middle of December. The standard 5.5.893 update was immediately applied OTA.

Haven't had a single problem with a "BSOD" or a "data drop."

I live in Central Virginia, in the metro Richmond area, and we're fairly blanketed with 4G coverage, but there are plenty of dead spots. Phone transitions between 3G and 4G without a problem.

My talk time is roughly 2 hours a day; network data usage probably averages a 100 megs (I have a grandfathered unlimited plan); and Wi-Fi data usage is easily a gigabyte+.

I run the extended battery, and it leaves me with plenty of room to spare at the end of the day (I dunno, 30%, maybe more?).

The screen is brilliant, the phone is blistering fast, and the size is perfect for my medium build.

Good luck on your choice!

Last edited by 23skidoo; January 26th, 2012 at 02:10 PM.

Thom Little

That's third absolutely positive report ...

-- San Jose, California
-- Central Virginia
-- TBD

... in a forum that doesn't usually attract totally satisfied users.

... Thom

Last edited by Thom Little; January 26th, 2012 at 02:48 PM.

rogue_slc_vzw_rep

I think for the price for the bionic it will be hard to beat. I guess it really comes down to what youll be most happy with for the next few years. I bought my parents each a cpo Bionic for Christmas and they have been just as good as my new bionic I purchased on day one. I cant confirm data drops as its not something I've experienced but if one 4g phone has data drops so would another imo (but thats for another topic). I have the extended battery and being able to swap it out if I'm away from a charger has been priceless.

I'm considering getting another cpo bionic for my wife as she is up for an upgrade so if I feel good enough about it for my wife to have that should say something lol. Good luck on your decision!


Btw I know its comparing older devices but pay attention especially to the screen comparison. Its almost shocking how much better the bionic is compared to the other devices.
http://www.phonearena.com/reviews/Motorola-DROID-BIONIC-vs-HTC-ThunderBolt-vs-Samsung-Droid-Charge-vs-LG-Revolution_id2820

Last edited by rogue_slc_vzw_rep; January 26th, 2012 at 02:42 PM.

PowerBomb

I feel like I hijacked OPs thread lol.

I'm definitely going to give the Bionic a shot. Just waiting until Saturday to see if I can combine it with my loyalty discount that kicks in. Just ordered a case so it'll have a head start getting in the mail and I won't have to worry about dropping a new phone.

Thom Little

Where are you located?

... Thom

Last edited by Thom Little; January 26th, 2012 at 02:47 PM.

Lucidot

Just to update on what I got resolved today.

I called tech support (L2) and they informed me that my issue was a known issue and that is what a manufacturer issue and they transfered me to Motorola tech support.

I spoke with the gentleman there and he said it was an issue with their software on the phone and not a network issue with VZ. He said that they had accidently released a software revision to roughly 100,000 people that appears to have resolved a lot of those issues and they had also released a later revision for a soak test and were having really good results.

He then busted my bubble by saying that he could not manually push the update to my phone and that it could be 6 months before it was actually released as an OTA update to all Bionic owners.

Long story short. I'm getting a new phone, and not a Bionic. I can't wait 6 months for a phone to work. Especially one I paid a good amount of money for.

So I guess you could look at my story in two ways. It's either good news that an update is in the works or bad news that it could be 6 months.

PowerBomb

Hmm that kinda sucks but thanks for sharing what you found out.

Thom Little

I am sorry to hear of your decision but I understand. It seems that you pretty much had your mind made up before you talked to him.

What you reported he said was it could be 6 months and you have interpreted that as is will be 6 months.

I'm a little new i this arena but is seems to me ...

-- None of these dudes people talk to really know much about when anything is coming down the pike.

-- "accidentally" sending a potential release to 100,000 users doesn't sound to "accidental" to me. They seem to be those who filed a complaint with Motorola about data drops.

-- They know they have a much improved product ... they will be dumb not to release it.

-- 5.5.893 came out 3 months after initial release. 5.9.902 in early March would be consistent with that.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

... Thom

Lucidot

First things first.

I had not made up my mind before I spoke to him. I was actually hoping he could do something. And when he started talking about the update that was released before they thought it was ready, I started getting excited because I thought he was going to send it to me, or at least point me to where I could get it "OFFICIALLY". So I was pretty bummed when he said he couldn't get it to me. Contrary to what you have assumed, I really do like this phone. Other than the data drops, it's a solid phone. But data drops are a pretty big deal.

Next. I never interpreted that the word "Could" meant "Will". I even reiterated that it "Could" be 6 months in my last sentence. But if you want to try and pick fly crap out of pepper in my post that's fine.

Thom Little

I was supporting what you are doing and sharing some new ideas. It sounded to me like the person you talked to had close to no information.

I was really ready for 5.9.902 and expected it at any minute until I reexamined when 5.5.893 was released. It is too soon to expect the next release. (My guess is it will go to testers at the end of February and release the beginning of March. If my guess is correct I will be on 5.9.902 in a little more than a month.)

I have heard of no one who was successful in getting a copy of the accidental 5.9.901 sent to them and I have heard of no one who has gotten 5.9.902 yet. (I also have heard of no one who got added to the soak testers by asking to be included.)

Good luck.

... Thom

Lucidot

I may have misinterpreted the Moto tech now that I think of it.

He stated that 901 was released before it had been fully tested. Then he made a reference to new software being tested. He may have very well been talking about 901 and not 902.

Now as I am typing this, I am sure he was talking about 901. (Try to play the convo back through my head). He stated that there are 3 software releases.
The original - .886 I think
The second - .893 supposedly, according to him, fixed a lot of the data issues.
The Third - .901 Seems to have fixed most if not all of the software related data issues.

He then said that he was not sure when it would be an official release to the masses but it could be next week or 6 months from now.

I just wish he could have escalated me and I could have been pushed the update. But I'm assuming VZW would actually have to push the update. Is that a correct assumption? I've never heard of an update coming directly from the mfg. before the carrier approves it and then sends it.

Thom Little

I did a little date calculation based on work days and straight days. If it is consistent with the last schedule then it will be released to us March 15, 2012 (Ides of March).

It is likely that the part you and I care about is done and is in 5.9.901 and that they have to add/test those changes that you read about and a few that are likely ... change in bloatware ... do the install the old bloatware that is no longer current bloatware or leave it? Do they make that an option? The policy change. And the new one ... my guess ... make it possible to upgrade from either 5.5.893 or 5.9.901.

It sure looks like tower-side issues were corrected before 5.5.893 came out and from reports the Bionic-side issues were close to totally fixed by 5.9.901.

... Thom

Last edited by Thom Little; January 27th, 2012 at 11:27 AM.

doogald

I don't think that the OEMs can target OTA releases like that. They do have a collection of users/devices that are part of the testing release, but I imagine that they were testing their OTA procedure and accidentally pushed it out to the first group of recipients.

Of course, but they cannot release it without Verizon approval.

I wonder if 901 and 902 are the same thing? In other words, the same update project that wasn't quite ready when it went out accidentally. However, since it was accidentally released, they have to bump the version number up so that all of the phones that now have 901 will also get the OTA when it goes out (since OTAs check software version numbers.)

I believe that the OTA delivery is the responsibility of the OEMs. After Verizon approves the release, the OEMs must set up the delivery servers. I guess this only from recalling all of the trouble Motorola had trying to deliver the first OTA update for the OG Droid. (See this old news story: Verizon Motorola Droid Android 2.1 Update Has Been Going Out, Very, Very Slowly (Rumor) )

mrdrh99

Guys, thanks for all the info, in the end I just couldn't pass on the bionic, I ordered this morning, after applying my discount I got it for free with 14 days to return it if I dont like it. 4g won't be available where I live until march but I can't wait! I should have it monday and I'll def let you know how I like it compared to my droid x!
Thanks

mrdrh99

Btw, I will def be rooting and overclocking to about 1.2, so the razr kiss my ass

Thom Little

It was my understanding that the people who got 5.9.901 pushed to them were not on any test group. They were people who had reported data drop problems.

When you report a problem you also give the MEID as part of the report. My interpretation of the reports is those were the devices getting 5.9.901 pushed to them.

Do they push the soak test out the same way or do you have to call into the server?

... Thom

PowerBomb

Cool! Thanks for letting us know your final decision. Glad to hear you were able to stack the discount on top of the sale price and get it for free. I'm planning to do the same thing... just a half day left until the 28th when my loyalty credit finally kicks in.

mrdrh99

Yeah, connection issues aside, I couldn't pass on the chance of getting a free phone, if I dont like it I'll swap for the razr next week!

htceris

I have ordered cpo bionic also, and loyalty discount do stack with online sale/discount. However, it is a 2 steps process, you have to order online to get promo discount $29.99 & then call the customer service or whatever the verizon department to give you the $30.00 credit toward your new order. Unless you call via phone, online order won't apply the loyalty credit toward your order.

PowerBomb

Yeah I just experienced the same thing, logged onto the VZW site today and all the other phone prices were adjusted to show the additional $30 loyalty discount but not the Bionic or the other 4G CPO phones, so I had to call in as well. I placed my order and they just pushed the $30 credit to my account. Now to impatiently wait for it to arrive in the mail. 8)

BigCiX

Well the spectrum has been out a week and it already had a small update. Being with Verizon you should have better support then my LG Thrill and sorry ass at&t. To be on the safe side I'd stick with the Bionic or RAZR.

__________________
I hate at&t!!!!

mrdrh99

Guys, thanks for all the feedback, I have my bionic and loving it! I guess the screen will take some getting used to, but it isn't that bad.

htceris

I received mine on Wednesday, and it is absolutely worth it (FREE with loyalty discount). Only thing I see that is different from new vs cpo is the pre-installed micro sd card; cpo came with 8GB instead of 16GB. Already rooted & has the 901 update no issue so far.
4g speed is great @ 1bar ~3Mbps, @ 2bars ~8Mpbs download speed. Where I am at I was able to get 2 bars only, but still a lot faster than what I was getting at 3g speed.

Thom Little

Could you go to Settings | About Phone
Scroll to the bottom so System version is at the top and PRL version is at the bottom
Take a ScreenShot (ScreenGrabber is a good app for this)
Post it here

Thank you.

... Thom

htceris

here is the link for screenshot, since I cannot attach it due to its resolution.