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Old June 23rd, 2010, 07:34 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Judge who overturned drilling bans had shares in the oil industry

Judge who overturned drilling bans had shares in the oil industry

The judge who overturned deepwater drilling bans allowing BP to resume oil extraction in the Gulf of Mexico, had shares in Transocean and other firms in the industry, it was revealed today.


Yesterday, a Louisiana-based judge Martin Feldman ruled that Barack Obama's six-month drilling moratorium in the Gulf was unjustified because it assumed that all deepwater drilling was as dangerous as BP's.


The White House promised an immediate appeal.


Meanwhile environmental groups have said Feldman's ruling may have to be rescinded because of the possible conflict of interests.
Feldman's most recent financial disclosure forms show that he was paid dividends from his shares in Transocean, the firm that owned the Deepwater oil rig that exploded in April killing 11 oil workers, prompting America's worst environmental disaster.


The forms, which relate to the calendar year 2008, also show that he sold shares in Halliburton, which was also involved in the disaster.
Feldman's other interests included Ocean Energy, Quicksilver Resources, Prospect Energy, Peabody Energy, Pengrowth Energy Trust, Atlas Energy Resources, and Parker Drilling.


Obama's interior department imposed the moratorium last month in the wake of the BP disaster, halting approval of any new permits for deepwater projects and suspending drilling on 33 exploratory wells.
Feldman has yet to respond to the disclosures. He is one of many federal judges across the Gulf Coast region with money in oil and gas. Several have disqualified themselves from hearing spill-related claims, while others have sold their holdings so they can preside over many cases being filed.


Josh Reichert, managing director of the Pew Environment Group, said the ruling should be rescinded if he still held such shares.
"If Judge Feldman has any investments in oil and gas operators in the Gulf, it represents a flagrant conflict of interest," Reichert said.
At least two major oil companies, Shell and Marathon, said they would wait for the appeal before resuming drilling.


- - -


Well, whatever the merits of the opposing sides of the moratorium issue, this judge should have recused himself. He has a serious conflict of interest.

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Old June 23rd, 2010, 07:56 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Except good luck finding a financially responsible person who ISNT invested in energy as part of a retirement portfolio. I notice how your info doesn't specify if it is individual stocks or an energy fund of some kind. Until more detail is given on his investments I am not willing to agree with your conclusion.
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Old June 23rd, 2010, 08:02 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Except good luck finding a financially responsible person who ISNT invested in energy as part of a retirement portfolio. I notice how your info doesn't specify if it is individual stocks or an energy fund of some kind. Until more detail is given on his investments I am not willing to agree with your conclusion.
I think the idea that he has money invested, makes no difference. of course, the fed will use that to their advantage no doubt... but the idea of a 6 month ban is ridiculous. The MMS, TransOcean and BP allowed this mess to happen and THEY should be the ones to deal with the backlash, not oilfield workers.
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Old June 23rd, 2010, 03:45 PM   #4 (permalink)
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The MMS, TransOcean and BP allowed this mess to happen and THEY should be the ones to deal with the backlash, not oilfield workers.
But wait I thought that it was "Oilbama's" fault.
/sarcasm
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Old June 23rd, 2010, 08:13 PM   #5 (permalink)
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The oil drill ban only affected 33 exploratory rigs. There are many wells underway in the gulf which are not affected.

Many conservatives have said, "It's only one well in 50 years".

Well I say, "That's too much!"

No additional drilling should take place until procedures are put in place which GURANTEE that this will not occur again. Walk to work if you have to, ride a bike, car pool, I personally don't care who it inconveniences.

Somehow we feel we have a right to screw this planet up. Manifest destiny. God gave us dominion over the Earth. Well if he did, he didn't intend for us to screw it up just so you and I can have cheap gas to put in our cars.

You conservatives remind me of the Dutch Boy Paint company. Instead of cover the Earth with Paint, you say Cover the Earth with Oil. Drill baby Drill.

The workers in the gulf who have lost their jobs temporarily can draw from a $100 million dollar fund just for them. This is separate from the $20 billion that our president extracted from BP.
 
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Old June 24th, 2010, 12:22 PM   #6 (permalink)
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The oil drill ban only affected 33 exploratory rigs. There are many wells underway in the gulf which are not affected.

Many conservatives have said, "It's only one well in 50 years".

Well I say, "That's too much!"

No additional drilling should take place until procedures are put in place which GURANTEE that this will not occur again. Walk to work if you have to, ride a bike, car pool, I personally don't care who it inconveniences.

Somehow we feel we have a right to screw this planet up. Manifest destiny. God gave us dominion over the Earth. Well if he did, he didn't intend for us to screw it up just so you and I can have cheap gas to put in our cars.

You conservatives remind me of the Dutch Boy Paint company. Instead of cover the Earth with Paint, you say Cover the Earth with Oil. Drill baby Drill.

The workers in the gulf who have lost their jobs temporarily can draw from a $100 million dollar fund just for them. This is separate from the $20 billion that our president extracted from BP.
Yep, only affects 33 drilling rigs... and the thousands of workers that work on those rigs, and the workers at the pipe yards that supply those drilling rigs and the inspectors that inspect that pipe and the guys that work at the tool shops that make and repair the drill bits and the truck drivers that deliver the drill bits and drill pipe and the guys that fly the oilfield workers out to the rigs on helicopters and the boat crews that transport workers and gear by boat... I am sure I am missing tons of workers... but yeah, only 33 rigs...

You liberals are awesome. You blame this on the "conservatives" when the contract that was awarded to BP, Transocean and Haliburton for the Deepwater Horizon (sans deepwater blowout contingency plan) was given out by the MMS (Minerals Management Service) directly under your perfect liberal administration.

100 million dollar fund? Not a drop in the bucket. You bag on conservatives all you want but it seems to me that the current administration thinks throwing money at people will make everything all better.

At this point, there are around 3800 wells in the Gulf... and one is leaking. So lets shut down every deep water rig, lets stop the coal mining since a few of those guys die every month and lets ban white cars... because I witnessed one cause a wreck this morning. Then lets fix the problem by throwing money at the drivers of white cars, coal miners and oilfield workers.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 03:50 PM   #7 (permalink)
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At this point, there are around 3800 wells in the Gulf... and one is leaking.
With only 33 wells shut down out of 3800 I'm fine with that, its less than 1%. And one leak is actually a pretty BIG problem if you haven't noticed lol...
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Old June 24th, 2010, 04:01 PM   #8 (permalink)
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With only 33 wells shut down out of 3800 I'm fine with that, its less than 1%. And one leak is actually a pretty BIG problem if you haven't noticed lol...

Actually, there have been reports of a second well leaking in the gulf...not as big a leak as we've been discussing, but leaking nonetheless.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 08:14 PM   #9 (permalink)
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You know Mr. Cajun, or should I say Little Dutch Boy. If you really are a cajun, you seem to care very little for your marshes, beaches and wild life.

What about the people who have lost their Jobs on the shrimp and fishing boats and the oystermen. What about the dead turtles, dolphins and sea birds? I don't think you conservatives will be happy until the gulf is dead.
 
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Old June 24th, 2010, 10:04 PM   #10 (permalink)
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YouTube - President Obama Said Oil Skimmers Can't Be Sent To Gulf Because They May Be Needed Elsewhere?
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Old June 25th, 2010, 07:31 AM   #11 (permalink)
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You know Mr. Cajun, or should I say Little Dutch Boy. If you really are a cajun, you seem to care very little for your marshes, beaches and wild life.

What about the people who have lost their Jobs on the shrimp and fishing boats and the oystermen. What about the dead turtles, dolphins and sea birds? I don't think you conservatives will be happy until the gulf is dead.
Actually I do care very much for our marshes, beaches and wildlife... but I care more about the wellbeing of thousands of workers that are sitting at home. See, for me, the well being of children is more important than the well being of pelicans and crabs.

If you were actually FROM this area, you would realize that the only fisherman that have lost their jobs are the guys that are too pissed about the situation to go get hired on as clean-up crew. Sure, they aren't out shrimping in that particular area of the gulf but they have an option to go out and get a paycheck if they want it.

This time of year, dolphins wash up on shore. It's called calving... and the turtles that I have seen were not killed by the oil. See, shrimpboats that operate in the gulf have to have these things called a "TED" (Turtle Excluder Device) on their boats. When the oil spill happened, a bunch of shrimpers removed the TED's because not only do they cause turtles to be excluded from the nets BUT they also decrease the amount of shrimp flowing into the nets. They wanted to rush and shrimp as fast as they could.

I understand it is in your blood as a liberal to look past the facts and make outrageous claims to support your opinion but it wont work with me son. Go argue with a kid somewhere, you'll gain more ground and generally feel better about yourself.

Furthermore, there is the possibility that the leak wouldn't have been such a big problem if the MMS (read: Federal Entity Operating Under Obama) would have required the Transocean Deepwater Horizon to have a deepwater blowout contingency plan. But hey, lets look past that... and blame it on everyone else... you think we can maybe blame this on Bush? He is a conservative so he must have had something to do with it.

One more thing... you little comment about conservatives not being happy until the entire gulf is dead... It's funny you should mention that.

The situation in the gulf is a sad one and it needs to be fixed pronto... but us "conservatives" know that in the long run, a 6 month ban on drilling will devestate the gulf coast region. Stopping exploratory drilling is not the answer and your ignorant comment is one that I have heard parroted over and over.

Have you been to Elmer's Island? Grand Isle? Port Fourchon? Yeah, didn't think so. Go and argue with someone else that is getting all of his knowledge about the gulf and the spill from CNN and MSNBC.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 08:00 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Please don't take this personally, Cajun, but there isn't a word coming from "the right" on the BP disaster that I take seriously. Almost all of it is just plain spin. The far right seems to have an "explanation" for everything..."it's the fault of the feds, something else killed the turtles, dolphins wash up all the time, the pelicans and crabs aren't all that important."

Sorry. I'm not buying itl. And I've been to Port Fourchon. Here's another guy, a "local," who isn't buying it, either. He simply bought it.

Gulf oil spill: Boat captain, despondent over spill, commits suicide

June 23, 2010 | 11:51 am
LA Times

William Allen Kruse, 55, a charter boat captain recently hired by BP as a vessel of opportunity out of Gulf Shores, Ala., died Wednesday morning before 7:30 a.m. of a gunshot to the head, likely self-inflicted, authorities said.
"He had been quite despondent about the oil crisis," said Stan Vinson, coroner for Baldwin County, which includes Gulf Shores.
Kruse, who lived with his family in nearby Foley, Ala., reported to work Wednesday morning as usual at the Gulf Shores Marina on Fort Morgan Road in Gulf Shores, Vinson said. He met up with his two deckhands at his boat, The Rookie. One of the deckhands later told Vinson that Kruse seemed his usual self, sending them to fetch ice while he pulled the boat around to the gas pumps.
As the deckhands walked off to get ice, they heard what sounded like a firecracker, Vinson said. They turned around but didn't see anything out of the ordinary. So they proceeded to gather the ice and wait for Kruse at the pumps. "He never showed," Vinson said.

After waiting a while, the deckhands returned to the boat, which was moored where they had left it, Vinson said. They went aboard and found Kruse at the captain's bridge above the wheelhouse, Vinson said. He had been shot in the head. A Glock handgun was later recovered from the scene, and investigators do not suspect foul play, Vinson said.
Vinson said Kruse was in good health, did not suffer from any mental illness and was not taking psychotropic medications.
But he said it's not surprising the oil spill had weighed heavily on his mind, as it has on many local fishermen no longer able to support themselves with deep-sea sport fishing trips for marlin and the like, Vinson said.
"All the waters are closed. There's no charter business anymore. You go out on some of the beaches now, with the oil, you can't even get in the water," Vinson said. "It's really crippled the tourism and fishing industry here."
Vinson's office was to perform an autopsy Wednesday, and the Gulf Shores Police Department is still investigating. Det. Justin Clopton did not return calls.
Kruse's family was notified by Wednesday afternoon, Vinson said, and his deckhands were sent home for the day.
-- Molly Hennessy-Fiske
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Old June 25th, 2010, 09:19 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Please don't take this personally, Cajun, but there isn't a word coming from "the right" on the BP disaster that I take seriously. Almost all of it is just plain spin. The far right seems to have an "explanation" for everything..."it's the fault of the feds, something else killed the turtles, dolphins wash up all the time, the pelicans and crabs aren't all that important."

Sorry. I'm not buying itl. And I've been to Port Fourchon. Here's another guy, a "local," who isn't buying it, either. He simply bought it.

Gulf oil spill: Boat captain, despondent over spill, commits suicide

June 23, 2010 | 11:51 am
LA Times

William Allen Kruse, 55, a charter boat captain recently hired by BP as a vessel of opportunity out of Gulf Shores, Ala., died Wednesday morning before 7:30 a.m. of a gunshot to the head, likely self-inflicted, authorities said.
"He had been quite despondent about the oil crisis," said Stan Vinson, coroner for Baldwin County, which includes Gulf Shores.
Kruse, who lived with his family in nearby Foley, Ala., reported to work Wednesday morning as usual at the Gulf Shores Marina on Fort Morgan Road in Gulf Shores, Vinson said. He met up with his two deckhands at his boat, The Rookie. One of the deckhands later told Vinson that Kruse seemed his usual self, sending them to fetch ice while he pulled the boat around to the gas pumps.
As the deckhands walked off to get ice, they heard what sounded like a firecracker, Vinson said. They turned around but didn't see anything out of the ordinary. So they proceeded to gather the ice and wait for Kruse at the pumps. "He never showed," Vinson said.

After waiting a while, the deckhands returned to the boat, which was moored where they had left it, Vinson said. They went aboard and found Kruse at the captain's bridge above the wheelhouse, Vinson said. He had been shot in the head. A Glock handgun was later recovered from the scene, and investigators do not suspect foul play, Vinson said.
Vinson said Kruse was in good health, did not suffer from any mental illness and was not taking psychotropic medications.
But he said it's not surprising the oil spill had weighed heavily on his mind, as it has on many local fishermen no longer able to support themselves with deep-sea sport fishing trips for marlin and the like, Vinson said.
"All the waters are closed. There's no charter business anymore. You go out on some of the beaches now, with the oil, you can't even get in the water," Vinson said. "It's really crippled the tourism and fishing industry here."
Vinson's office was to perform an autopsy Wednesday, and the Gulf Shores Police Department is still investigating. Det. Justin Clopton did not return calls.
Kruse's family was notified by Wednesday afternoon, Vinson said, and his deckhands were sent home for the day.
-- Molly Hennessy-Fiske
So some nutcase popped himself in the head with a handgun.... it's the oils fault? Didn't suffer from mental illness? I would say shooting yourself in the head is the ultimate proof for mental illness!

On the other hand, everything the left is spewing about the spill is spin as well.

The flat out attacks on someone who is directly connected with this spill "wanting" the gulf dead is ignorant. LIke I stated before. i know the spill is bad... but putting tens of thousands of people out of work isn't going to fix the problem and it all stemmed from the MMS not including a blowout contigency plan for this particular rig. period.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 09:28 AM   #14 (permalink)
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So some nutcase popped himself in the head with a handgun.... it's the oils fault? Didn't suffer from mental illness? I would say shooting yourself in the head is the ultimate proof for mental illness!

On the other hand, everything the left is spewing about the spill is spin as well.

The flat out attacks on someone who is directly connected with this spill "wanting" the gulf dead is ignorant. LIke I stated before. i know the spill is bad... but putting tens of thousands of people out of work isn't going to fix the problem and it all stemmed from the MMS not including a blowout contigency plan for this particular rig. period.

Some "nutcase"? Is that the way you righties really think?
Oh, and it all stemmed from BP and the other corporations involved with that rig. They were obligated to run that rig safely and properly, and they didn't.

And if the right wants more stringent rules and enforcement from the government, maybe it should stop whining so much about "big government, " eh?

Once again, the rig blew up not because of the government, but because of BP and its partners.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 09:39 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Some "nutcase"? Is that the way you righties really think?
Oh, and it all stemmed from BP and the other corporations involved with that rig. They were obligated to run that rig safely and properly, and they didn't.

And if the right wants more stringent rules and enforcement from the government, maybe it should stop whining so much about "big government, " eh?

Once again, the rig blew up not because of the government, but because of BP and its partners.
How righties think? No, that's how "I" think. Some guy shoots himself in the head and I'm supposed to feel bad for him? Sorry, doesn't work that way. He was a coward. He likely left a wife and children behind because he was too weak to suck it up and deal with his situation like a MAN. Shit happens, you gotta learn to get over it.

You are correct that they were obligated to run that rig safely and properly... and the MMS was obligated to ensure that they had all of the proper safety precations in place... which they did not.

The rig blew up due to hitting a methane pocket that shot up the drill column, blowing natural gas into a control room. Not because of BP and it's partners. The reason the blowout has not been controlled is because there was no contingency plan to control it. The reason there was no contingency plan is because the MMS didn't require one.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 09:43 AM   #16 (permalink)
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How righties think? No, that's how "I" think. Some guy shoots himself in the head and I'm supposed to feel bad for him? Sorry, doesn't work that way. He was a coward. He likely left a wife and children behind because he was too weak to suck it up and deal with his situation like a MAN. Shit happens, you gotta learn to get over it.

You are correct that they were obligated to run that rig safely and properly... and the MMS was obligated to ensure that they had all of the proper safety precations in place... which they did not.

The rig blew up due to hitting a methane pocket that shot up the drill column, blowing natural gas into a control room. Not because of BP and it's partners. The reason the blowout has not been controlled is because there was no contingency plan to control it. The reason there was no contingency plan is because the MMS didn't require one.

Uh, you obviously know absolutely nothing about depression, so I will let it go for the moment.

The rig blew up because BP and its partners were sloppy, careless, and driven solely by profit motives, and cared little for the safety of their crews and the environment. Oh..and it is the responsibility of these companies to run their rigs safely.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 10:19 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Uh, you obviously know absolutely nothing about depression, so I will let it go for the moment.

The rig blew up because BP and its partners were sloppy, careless, and driven solely by profit motives, and cared little for the safety of its crews and the environment. Oh..and it is the responsibility of these companies to run their rigs safely.
You assume I know nothing about depression. You know what they say when we assume.

No, the rig blew up because they hit a methane pocket that expanded exponentially as it rose through the drill column. The blowout was allowed to get out of hand because of the BOP not functioning correctly. It happens. You can believe what you want to believe and I understand that liberals have this anti-industry mentality... you know... but the simple fact is that nothing would have prevented this blowout and the only thing that would have stopped the oil leak any faster than it is being stopped now is if there was another rig, drilling a secondary column into this well.

I agree that it is the responsibility of the companies to run their equipment safely... but I also SEE that it is the responsibility of the MMS to ensure that all precations are being taken. Your liberal blindness will not allow you to see both sides of it. You are the one blaming ONE... not I, sir.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 12:05 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Mr. Cajun
I don't know how old you are sonny, but I bet you haven't caught me yet. And you know, you care so much about the kids, how about the kids inheriting a dead gulf. The people who fish and shrimp for a living, I suspect would rather be doing that than lowering oil booms into the water that are ineffectual at best and skimming oil off the surface and inhaling the sulfurous stench of the oil slime. You think that is a viable option for them, if it is then a viable option for the oil rig workers who have TEMPORARILY lost their jobs is to collect short term subsidies from the $100 million fund put aside for them.

You say the MMS caused the explosion and they didn't require safety procedures. They did require safety procedures, they just didn't enforce them. Obama bears his share of responsibilty for not reforming that agency. But reform it from what, reform it from the way it was when he inherited it and yes that also puts some of the blame on Bush. I suppose you think he bears no blame for any of the situations we find ourselves in. I will grant that Obama has made mistakes, will you grant that Bush has? Lax enforcement was one of the causes of the disaster but the major cause was that BP disregared its OWN safety guidelines that would have prevented the accident. Of course enforcing existing and probably adding to existing regulations means more government. Well we better not go there, huh? And regulating Wall Street and Insurance Companies also will require more government. Well we better not go there, huh? Why don't we just get rid of our government and replace it with a corporation?

The explosion was caused by methane but methane which came up the drill column, was sucked into the intake of the generator engine, caused it to overspeed and blow. Just adding a little touch of fact to your discourse.

Yeah, a few dophins, turtles and seabirds die of natural causes every day, but not the number that are dying now. Why don't you cover yourself in black slime and see how long you last.

And I suspect you are born again, praise the lord and to hell with the looney cajun who blew his head off. He was probably more sane than you because he opened his eyes and saw the reality around him and couldn't take it any more.

Drill baby drill!
 
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Old June 25th, 2010, 01:34 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Mr. Cajun
I don't know how old you are sonny, but I bet you haven't caught me yet. And you know, you care so much about the kids, how about the kids inheriting a dead gulf. The people who fish and shrimp for a living, I suspect would rather be doing that than lowering oil booms into the water that are ineffectual at best and skimming oil off the surface and inhaling the sulfurous stench of the oil slime. You think that is a viable option for them, if it is then a viable option for the oil rig workers who have TEMPORARILY lost their jobs is to collect short term subsidies from the $100 million fund put aside for them.

You say the MMS caused the explosion and they didn't require safety procedures. They did require safety procedures, they just didn't enforce them. Obama bears his share of responsibilty for not reforming that agency. But reform it from what, reform it from the way it was when he inherited it and yes that also puts some of the blame on Bush. I suppose you think he bears no blame for any of the situations we find ourselves in. I will grant that Obama has made mistakes, will you grant that Bush has? Lax enforcement was one of the causes of the disaster but the major cause was that BP disregared its OWN safety guidelines that would have prevented the accident. Of course enforcing existing and probably adding to existing regulations means more government. Well we better not go there, huh? And regulating Wall Street and Insurance Companies also will require more government. Well we better not go there, huh? Why don't we just get rid of our government and replace it with a corporation?

The explosion was caused by methane but methane which came up the drill column, was sucked into the intake of the generator engine, caused it to overspeed and blow. Just adding a little touch of fact to your discourse.

Yeah, a few dophins, turtles and seabirds die of natural causes every day, but not the number that are dying now. Why don't you cover yourself in black slime and see how long you last.

And I suspect you are born again, praise the lord and to hell with the looney cajun who blew his head off. He was probably more sane than you because he opened his eyes and saw the reality around him and couldn't take it any more.

Drill baby drill!
I like the emphasis on the word "temporarily". Those exploratory rigs are going to sail on over to the coast of Africa if they aren't drilling in the Gulf. So temporary job loss isn't quite the right word.

Once again, I didn't say the MMS caused the explosion. The filter between your brain and your fingers is obviously faulty. I agree that Bush made mistakes but he was our past president and I don't harp on what happened in the past... just as I didn't blame Clinton for stuff that happened during Bush's presidency.

The comment about the generator intake is pure speculation.

Its always a liberal that will toss humans under the bus to save a flock of seagulls... The birds that have been washing up on shore were covered in oil are obvious. The dolphins, not so much. That happens every year. The turtles... none since a couple days after the halt of shrimping in the area.

Your last comment. You used the word suspect when you should have used assume. You should really look into the quote about making assumptions because you are WAY off base...

I love when you ignorant folks use the line "Drill Baby Drill" every chance you get. How about this... tell me how we are going to survive without oil from the gulf since you are so "enlightened".

You couldn't stop that last gush of bullshit from streaming through your keyboard so lets see what you can come up with now.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 02:01 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I love when you ignorant folks use the line "Drill Baby Drill" every chance you get. How about this... tell me how we are going to survive without oil from the gulf since you are so "enlightened".
By weaning ourselves off oil. There are many ways to do this, right now, and more will be available in the future.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 02:45 PM   #21 (permalink)
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By weaning ourselves off oil. There are many ways to do this, right now, and more will be available in the future.
Enlighten me. How are we going to wean ourselves off of petroleum? Give me some examples.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 02:50 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Thank you for the spirited debate. Very entertaining.

You are all correct in my eyes. While you are fighting with each other Obama and the Oil companies are spending their time trying to think of a way to stick their big cocks up everyones ass.

Difference between you and the people you are arguing for is that you believe in doing what is right. Obama and Corporations believe in winning elections and making money.

What do we do with the illegals? Obama and corporations want them. Votes and cheap labor. Has nothing to do with what is good for 300 million american citizens.

I'm a registered independent because I can think for myself.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 03:06 PM   #23 (permalink)
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By weaning ourselves off oil. There are many ways to do this, right now, and more will be available in the future.
honestly in this regard i couldnt agree with hackr more... there are so many ways we can distance ourselves from oil its ridiculous. dont get me as a full on yay go hybrid person, the carbon footprint used to make most hybrid vehicles is so crazy i dont see how anyone justifies buying them but the electric vehicle was and still is a marvel of engineering.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 03:09 PM   #24 (permalink)
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honestly in this regard i couldnt agree with hackr more... there are so many ways we can distance ourselves from oil its ridiculous. dont get me as a full on yay go hybrid person, the carbon footprint used to make most hybrid vehicles is so crazy i dont see how anyone justifies buying them but the electric vehicle was and still is a marvel of engineering.
Name some of these so many ways though. I have done some research and see none as being feasible due to one reason... almost all of them require tons of petroleum to manufacture... or produce.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 04:26 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Thank you for the spirited debate. Very entertaining.

You are all correct in my eyes. While you are fighting with each other Obama and the Oil companies are spending their time trying to think of a way to stick their big cocks up everyones ass.

Difference between you and the people you are arguing for is that you believe in doing what is right. Obama and Corporations believe in winning elections and making money.

What do we do with the illegals? Obama and corporations want them. Votes and cheap labor. Has nothing to do with what is good for 300 million american citizens.

I'm a registered independent because I can think for myself.
Illegal aliens can vote? And all politicians only care about winning elections and then getting cushy jobs and fat paychecks from the corporations who they fought for when the retire. We need campaign reform soooo bad....
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Old June 25th, 2010, 04:56 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Illegal aliens can vote? And all politicians only care about winning elections and then getting cushy jobs and fat paychecks from the corporations who they fought for when the retire. We need campaign reform soooo bad....

Once amnesty is granted they can vote. Who will they vote for? Common sense says they will vote for the people who give them a free pass along with free benefits.

San Francisco is trying to allow illegals to vote for the local school boards.

You nailed it regarding to politicians.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 05:20 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Once amnesty is granted they can vote. Who will they vote for? Common sense says they will vote for the people who give them a free pass along with free benefits.

San Francisco is trying to allow illegals to vote for the local school boards.

You nailed it regarding to politicians.
The San Francisco proposal would allow non-citizen parents of kids in city schools to vote in school board elections. It would not allow them to vote in elections for national office.

Oh, and all people tend to vote for office seekers who best represent the interests of those people.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 05:43 PM   #28 (permalink)
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non-citizens? Is this your word for illegals?

I understand they can't vote in the national elections. ONCE THEY ARE GRANTED AMNESTY THEY ARE POSITIONED TO VOTE!


"Oh, and all people tend to vote for office seekers who best represent the interests of those people"

This statement shows you are a total liberal ******. How about you and your friends pays for the "interests" of the illegals. The majority of americans choose to keep their hard earned money.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 05:45 PM   #29 (permalink)
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The San Francisco proposal would allow non-citizen parents of kids in city schools to vote in school board elections. It would not allow them to vote in elections for national office.

Oh, and all people tend to vote for office seekers who best represent the interests of those people.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 08:07 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Mr. Cajun (aka: Dutch Boy)
Let me start my comment by saying, "Drill Baby Drill".
Next, let me say that if they took your brain and put it into the cavity of an ant's tooth, it would be like a bb rolling around in a box car! Just a little factual humor there.

If the part about the generator engine sucking up the methane and exploding is speculation, it was speculated by one of the surviving members of the exploratory rig who was interviewed on 60 minutes and if BP had allowed the transocean crew to pump mud down the well instead of seawater, the explosion may never have occurred. You see a column of mud is 2 or 3 times heavier than a column of sea water. That's why they use it. It would help contain the pressure of the oil reservoir.

The part about the 33 rigs leaving to drill off the coast of Africa is bull. They're blowing smoke up our collective butt. You really think as greedy as those oil guys are that they're going to just let all that oil sit there once drilling is allowed again?

Since that oil in the water down there is so healthy for the native wildlife I think I'll add a little to my aquarium here at home I'm sure my fish will love it. Don't recall any stories about children dying down there from the spill. Let me know if they do and and I'll personally come down their and kick the crap out of some of those oil covered birds.

As far as doing without oil, I don't think I said anything about not drilling again or doing without it. We just need to put measures in place so it CAN'T happen again. If such measures can't be put in place then hell no, "Don't Drill Baby Drill" .

As far as reducing our consumption of oil, we can do that. Hybrid cars, how about converting the oil guzzlers over to natural gas, could be done if we required our automotive manufacturers to do it? Would take a decade maybe. How about hydrogen fuel vehicles, hell, I bet we could generate electricity with hydrogen. Must come up with a better means to crack the water molecule. Speaking of molecules, I think I've got a new nickname for you, MOLECULE.

We simply havn't invested the braintrust of this nation into solving this problem but don't stick your head in the oily sand and say it can't be done.

And finally, you may refer to me as the "Enlightened One"
 
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Old June 26th, 2010, 07:36 AM   #31 (permalink)
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non-citizens? Is this your word for illegals?

I understand they can't vote in the national elections. ONCE THEY ARE GRANTED AMNESTY THEY ARE POSITIONED TO VOTE!


"Oh, and all people tend to vote for office seekers who best represent the interests of those people"

This statement shows you are a total liberal ******. How about you and your friends pays for the "interests" of the illegals. The majority of americans choose to keep their hard earned money.

1. Many "non-citizens" are residing here in the United States legally.
"Non-citizen" does not necessarily mean "illegal."

2. Many voters look out for their own interests and vote for politicians who they think will best represent those interests.

Go ahead, refute either of those statements
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Old June 26th, 2010, 07:40 AM   #32 (permalink)
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I'm ashamed that you own an incredible. You are a classic iPhone owner.
I have no idea what that means. Do you? I like iPhones. I'd own one instead of an Incredible if AT&T had decent coverage in my area. It doesn't.

I'm not a fanboy of any product, nor do I resent Apple for its success with the iPhone or any of its other products. I have two Apple computers, a 27" iMac and a 15" Macbook Pro, and I find the OS on them and the ergonomics to be superior to anything in the PC world.
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Old June 26th, 2010, 11:31 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Attack the judge that is keeping thousands of people in work. Don't mention that Salazar should be locked up for putting the ban through with bogus information.

Experts Disavow Salazar’s Drilling Moratorium - Washington Wire - WSJ

Obammy just wants the rigs to pick up stakes and move off the coast of Brazil so his puppet master Soros, who has a HUGE stake in the oil industry there, will get even more money

http://gulfnews.com/business/oil-gas/soros-hedge-fund-invests-811m-to-buy-petrobras-stake-1.125134

WH Takes Cues from Liberal Think Tank on Spill - Washington Wire - WSJ


Obammy doesn't care about American jobs, he just cares about paying back his pals and grabbing all the power he can.
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Old June 26th, 2010, 02:04 PM   #34 (permalink)
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It's funny that people think that the rigs will just sit there in the gulf. Guess they don't realize that it costs them $500,000.00 a day, for each rig, just to sit there and do nothing. Yea, they'll just wait for the this government to lift the ban in six months...if they don't impose another 6 months or even longer on top of that.
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Old June 26th, 2010, 02:23 PM   #35 (permalink)
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bunnymud

Do a little research before you post something in a thread. This is for 2004 so I'm sure it's gone up some but $500,000/day. No wonder gas is so high.

CONTRACT DRILLING RESULTS
Contract drilling rig rates for the fourth quarter averaged $14,857 per day, up 56% from the comparable quarter of 2004. Operating margins for the fourth quarter reached an all-time record averaging $7,283 per day (before elimination of intercompany drilling rig profit of $3.0 million) as compared to $3,410 per day (before elimination of intercompany drilling rig profit of $0.9 million) for 2004, an increase of 114%. Unit’s current dayrates average $17,129 per day, or $2,272 per day higher than the 2005 fourth quarter average and $1,486 per day higher than the December 2005 average. Contract drilling revenues increased 61% between the comparative fourth quarters to $139.8 million, primarily due to an increase in dayrates and the number of drilling rigs utilized. Average drilling rig utilization was 106.2 drilling rigs in the fourth quarter of 2005, up 12% from 2004’s fourth quarter of 95.0 drilling rigs. Operating margins for the year averaged $5,481 per day (before elimination of intercompany drilling rig profit of $8.6 million) as compared to $2,823 per day (before elimination of intercompany drilling rig profit of $3.7 million) in 2004, an increase of 94%. Contract drilling revenues increased 55% in 2005 to $462.1 million, while drilling rig utilization increased to an average of 102.1 drilling rigs operating during 2005, compared to 88.1 drilling rigs operating during 2004.
 
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Old June 26th, 2010, 03:13 PM   #36 (permalink)
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It's funny that people think that the rigs will just sit there in the gulf. Guess they don't realize that it costs them $500,000.00 a day, for each rig, just to sit there and do nothing. Yea, they'll just wait for the this government to lift the ban in six months...if they don't impose another 6 months or even longer on top of that.
One would think with that much money at stake, they'd spend some bucks on research and technology so they could properly clean up the messes they make.
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Old June 26th, 2010, 06:23 PM   #37 (permalink)
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If they didn't have to drill so deep it wouldn't be so difficult to fix. But never mind the fact that this is playing into Soros hands (the new Cheney) and Obammy is doing everything he can to put those dollars into his pockets. And brab, you think those rigs can squat there without having to pay rent?

Also, the drilling Petrobras is going to do is far deeper. Wether you like it or not, there will always be drilling in the gulf. This ban will only put workers out of jobs and, the obammy hopes, force them to go on welfare. The gulf is federal waters, the federal government should be fixing this and not taking over banks and health care.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:27 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Old June 27th, 2010, 10:25 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Man, if this is news, then it should be really big news that Obama's investment firms dumped all their BP stock a few weeks before the Deepwater explosion.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 03:33 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Man, if this is news, then it should be really big news that Obama's investment firms dumped all their BP stock a few weeks before the Deepwater explosion.

Obama personally owns investment firms? Wow...that should be really big news.

Do tell.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 04:39 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Obama personally owns investment firms? Wow...that should be really big news.

Do tell.
Where did I say he owns them..? rofl.. dumbass. I have investment firms as well.. it doesn't mean I own them.

Look up "Vanguard BP stock" if you're capable of doing so after all that sodium fluoride has rotted away your brain functionality.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 04:44 PM   #42 (permalink)
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My guess is that if Obama has "investments" via "Wall Street," they are held in a blind trust, so it is unlikely he has contact on his own behalf with investment firms. If you know otherwise, perhaps you'll grace us with the documentation, eh?

And what's with the personal insults? Do you think statements like the ones you've just made that I've requoted below add to your credibility?


"dumbass"

"if you're capable of doing so after all that sodium fluoride has rotted away your brain functionality."
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Old June 27th, 2010, 04:58 PM   #43 (permalink)
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I guess it doesn't matter that financial decisions that go against expert financial adviser recommendations and market trends don't throw up a red flag to you. Especially when decisions are made at just the right time in one specific company.

I only think you're brain damaged because you can't add 1+1 when it is right in front of you, and you also jump to false conclusions in order to change topics to irrelevant petty issues of forum semantics.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:16 PM   #44 (permalink)
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You made a claim about Obama and "his" investment firms. Then I asked you for documentation about this, and evidence that whatever "Wall Street" investments Obama might have weren't in a blind trust.

You've offered no documentation or evidence.

I'm not the one jumping to conclusions.

And as far as "expert financial adviser recommendations," well, I wouldn't put much faith in those...many of them are the same folks who brought us the Bush Recession.

Once again, I ask you why you feel it necessary to put this sort of comment in your post: "I only think you're brain damaged because you can't add 1+1 ..."

Please explain how a comment like that adds to the level of discussion.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:21 PM   #45 (permalink)
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I gave you the information you need.. I just think you're lazy and don't want to find the truth. Hence, complacency from brain damage due to sodium fluoride. You a diet soda drinker too?

I'm not the one who can help you. Because even if I provide you direct links, you'll just dismiss it all. You need to help yourself if you ever want to wake up.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:28 PM   #46 (permalink)
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I gave you the information you need.. I just think you're lazy and don't want to find the truth. Hence, complacency from brain damage due to sodium fluoride. You a diet soda drinker too?

I'm not the one who can help you. Because even if I provide you direct links, you'll just dismiss it all. You need to help yourself if you ever want to wake up.
You provided no documentation. And once again, you resort to personal insults.

Did you miss this directive from Slug, the moderator, in this very thread:

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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:43 PM   #47 (permalink)
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You provided no documentation.
I'm sure you still won't believe it, but I'll link it for you.

http://pfds.opensecrets.org/N00009638_2009.pdf

Yes, that shows the president holds ALL of his wealth in 2 Vanguard funds. Good thing they foresaw the BP accident and dumped all their holdings in it, because Obama will now be making roughly $85M over the course of 10 years instead of taking a huge hit. Tony Hayward and Goldman Sachs were pretty good at predicting the same thing in order to make money instead of losing money. Since pretty much all of the president's close advisers in the White House are Goldman Sachs right on down the line, I'm sure they were advising him well.

Oh, it's all a crazy theory and didn't happen, so dismiss it.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:48 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Once again, Obama's investments are in a blind trust. There's nothing in the documents you provided that indicate otherwise, or that there was some insider info that the BP well was going to blow. Surely you are not claiming that, are you?

The filings do indicate, though, that my investments are worth more than Obama's. But, then, I've earned more in income than he has for many, many years, and controlled my investments directly.

I have about 1% of my net worth invested with or through Wall Street. No one in business is less worthy of trust than "investment" houses. I own a couple of thousand shares in one company, and a couple of thousand shares in another, both companies I follow closely for personal interest. I didn't lose a dime in the Bush Recession/Crash, a fact that makes this aging liberal smile.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 05:53 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Yup, thought you'd just brush it off. Black is white, right is wrong, war is peace, right is left. I'll pray for you.

Must be nice to be so ignorant to cold hard factual information with the president's signature on it.
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Old June 27th, 2010, 06:00 PM   #50 (permalink)
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All you have proved is that Obama has a modest investment portfolio, invested mostly in the same funds millions of other Americans hold.

Now, do you have actual proof of anything nefarious?
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