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Old August 19th, 2012, 08:16 AM   #101 (permalink)
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Old August 23rd, 2012, 12:55 AM   #102 (permalink)
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This is kinda depressing to read.

Share of middle class income shrinking : Stltoday

Just show how the middle class as a whole is suffering.
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Old August 23rd, 2012, 06:25 AM   #103 (permalink)
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This is kinda depressing to read.

Share of middle class income shrinking : Stltoday

Just show how the middle class as a whole is suffering.
Well they obviously arent working hard then.

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Declining wealth: Median net worth for the middle class fell 28 percent over the last decade, from $129,000 in 2001 to $93,000, wiping out two decades of gains. Among upper-income families, net worth edged higher, to $574,000 from $569,000. Lower-income families saw net worth fall 45 percent to $10,000.
If this happened anywhere else there would be riots. More wealth transfers are needed. And yes, obviously falling house prices are part of this, but look at the lower-income statistic...
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Old August 23rd, 2012, 07:32 AM   #104 (permalink)
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More wealth transfers are not needed. The idea is ridiculous. My wealth falls (and a lot of those declines cited are because home prices have fallen) therefore the solution is to go to someone who's wealth is not declining, take it from them and give it to me. I'm sorry, but that is flat out ridiculous. And don't even get me started on the idea that the government should be involved in monitoring my wealth for me lest it get too low. Nanny state much?
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Old August 23rd, 2012, 01:51 PM   #105 (permalink)
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More wealth transfers are not needed. The idea is ridiculous.
Who are you kidding?
The US's GINI before wealth transfers is 49. In Germany its 50. After them in the US its 38. In Germany its 29. You either raise wages, or transfer money. And wages would need to be raised to uncompetitive levels in America.

Income distribution - Inequality

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My wealth falls (and a lot of those declines cited are because home prices have fallen) therefore the solution is to go to someone who's wealth is not declining, take it from them and give it to me.
No, the solution is to tax those whose wealth is increasing more, and tax others less and/or provide them with services and financial supports.

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And don't even get me started on the idea that the government should be involved in monitoring my wealth for me lest it get too low. Nanny state much?
Talk to the Department of Homeland security.
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Old August 23rd, 2012, 03:34 PM   #106 (permalink)
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... No, the solution is to tax those whose wealth is increasing more, and tax others less and/or provide them with services and financial supports. ...
I good start is to at least tax earned and capital income the same.
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Old August 23rd, 2012, 06:34 PM   #107 (permalink)
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Another Flawed Study on the 'Rich' | Fox Business
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Old August 24th, 2012, 04:18 AM   #108 (permalink)
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How did the Roaring Twenties turn out ? Concentration of power/wealth wherever it occurs leads to disaster.

I conjecture the love of money maybe discernible at a billion dollars, it's at least more serious than a friendship ring.

"We are free today substantially but the day will come when our Republic will be an impossibility. It will be impossibility because wealth will be concentrated in the hands of a few. A republic cannot stand upon bayonets, and when that day comes, when the wealth of the nation will be in the hands of a few, then we must rely upon the wisdom of the best elements in the country to readjust the laws of the nation to the changed conditions."

Attributed to James Madison, in an interview during his presidency (1809-1817) by the New York Post (cited by George Seldes, Great Quotations)

A Guide to Statistics on Historical Trends in Income Inequality — Center on Budget and Policy Priorities

"The concentration of income at the very top of the distribution rose to levels last seen more than 80 years ago (during the "Roaring Twenties")."
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Old August 24th, 2012, 07:23 AM   #109 (permalink)
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Did you read the article at all? It basically says the middle class shrank because the upper class grew.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 05:46 AM   #110 (permalink)
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Did you read the article at all? It basically says the middle class shrank because the upper class grew.
Actually I did read the Republican propaganda site track, that's why I posted a factual based peer reviewed article.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 07:59 AM   #111 (permalink)
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Actually I did read the Republican propaganda site track, that's why I posted a factual based peer reviewed article.
Which was totally irrelevant, but at least it was peer reviewed right?

The middle class shrank because the upper class grew. People left the middle class and are now upper class. Are you really advocating that we go to those people, slap them on the wrist, take their money away and force them to be middle class again? I guess success must be punished right?
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Old August 25th, 2012, 08:10 AM   #112 (permalink)
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Lets hope this'n doesnt ever get a chance:

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Old August 25th, 2012, 09:04 AM   #113 (permalink)
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OH! Didnt You all KNOW who rools??!




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Old August 26th, 2012, 04:39 AM   #114 (permalink)
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Did you read the article at all? It basically says the middle class shrank because the upper class grew.
I didn't see that.

Quote:
Declining wealth: Median net worth for the middle class fell 28 percent over the last decade, from $129,000 in 2001 to $93,000, wiping out two decades of gains. Among upper-income families, net worth edged higher, to $574,000 from $569,000. Lower-income families saw net worth fall 45 percent to $10,000.
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Old August 29th, 2012, 09:29 PM   #115 (permalink)
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Romney was an early adapter of the "bust out", which was a tactic of Michael Milken, whom Romney obtained funds from prior to Milken's imprisonment. Buy a company with as much debt as possible, have bought company borrow even more, hollow out the company by extracting a huge dividend & commission paid by the companies new debt, leave others with the debt, rinse and repeat.

How Private Equity Firms Like Bain Capital Earn Profits : The New Yorker

"... The real reason that we should be concerned about private equity’s expanding power lies in the way these firms have become increasingly adept at using financial gimmicks to line their pockets, deriving enormous wealth not from management or investing skills but, rather, from the way the U.S. tax system works. Indeed, for an industry that’s often held up as an exemplar of free-market capitalism, private equity is surprisingly dependent on government subsidies for its profits. Financial engineering has always been central to leveraged buyouts. In a typical deal, a private-equity firm buys a company, using some of its own money and some borrowed money. It then tries to improve the performance of the acquired company, with an eye toward cashing out by selling it or taking it public. The key to this strategy is debt: the model encourages firms to borrow as much as possible, since, just as with a mortgage, the less money you put down, the bigger your potential return on investment. The rewards can be extraordinary: when Romney was at Bain, it supposedly earned eighty-eight per cent a year for its investors. But piles of debt also increase the risk that companies will go bust. ..."

"... This approach has one obvious virtue: if a private-equity firm wants to make money, it has to improve the value of the companies it buys. Sometimes the improvement may be more cosmetic than real, but historically private-equity firms have in principle had a powerful incentive to make companies perform better. In the past decade, though, that calculus changed. Having already piled companies high with debt in order to buy them, many private-equity funds had their companies borrow even more, and then used that money to pay themselves huge “special dividends.” This allowed them to recoup their initial investment while keeping the same ownership stake. Before 2000, big special dividends were not that common. But between 2003 and 2007 private-equity funds took more than seventy billion dollars out of their companies. These dividends created no economic value—they just redistributed money from the company to the private-equity investors. ..."
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Old October 6th, 2012, 04:40 AM   #116 (permalink)
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Just another example of the Golden Rule.

Special Report: The casualties of Chesapeake's land grab across America | Reuters

"Chesapeake wanted to drill there, and the offers could have netted the couple thousands of dollars in a bonus and royalties. But Bhandari says they ultimately declined the deals because they oppose fracking in residential areas. Fracking, slang for hydraulic fracturing, is a controversial method used to extract gas and oil.

Their repeated refusals didn't stop Chesapeake, the second-largest natural gas producer in the United States. This June, after petitioning a Texas state agency for an exception to a 93-year-old statute, the company effectively secured the ability to drain the gas from beneath the Bhandari property anyway - without having to pay the couple a penny."
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Old October 17th, 2012, 06:10 AM   #117 (permalink)
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M-O-N-E-Y
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Old October 17th, 2012, 08:38 AM   #118 (permalink)
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Default Re: Who REALLY Rule The World...(including "AMERCIA"...)

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M-O-N-E-Y
....nuff said...
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Old October 19th, 2012, 03:15 AM   #119 (permalink)
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Lets hope this'n doesnt ever get a chance:

Please, this is only for Republicans select private entertainment. If you have to ask the price, you can't afford.
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Old October 19th, 2012, 06:04 AM   #120 (permalink)
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Please, this is only for Republicans select private entertainment. If you have to ask the price, you can't afford.
Okay, but first, how much is it?
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Old October 19th, 2012, 09:34 PM   #121 (permalink)
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You have to earn over $200,000 or more per year to qualify...
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Old October 19th, 2012, 10:25 PM   #122 (permalink)
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You have to earn over $200,000 or more per year to qualify...
Would it matter which denomination and/currency type. I have THIS! Its been folded but the spindle is still in good shape. I never spindle mine. Will they take this as a downpayment and only a mere 199,999 to go!?

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Old October 20th, 2012, 03:36 AM   #123 (permalink)
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We are a third world country. Warlords, Kings, Fuhrers, divine right of the rich, etc are now in control. It always ends badly.

Koch Social Media Policy May Be Unlawful; Employers Still Have Broad Leeway to Limit Employee Speech | PR Watch

"Since the U.S. Supreme Court's 2010 decision in Citizens United v. FEC, the Kochs and other employers can now make partisan political communications directly to their employees. As a private employer the Kochs can even limit their employees' speech, since the First Amendment only protects against government infringement on free speech and expression. Employers are also afforded wide latitude to fire workers for their political activities."
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Old October 20th, 2012, 08:09 AM   #124 (permalink)
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I hate to tell you this, but unions have been making partisan political communications to their members for decades. As well as every other organization that I've ever been apart of. And companies have been able to fire people for what they say on social networks for years. None of this new or shocking.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 08:57 AM   #125 (permalink)
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I hate to tell you this, but unions have been making partisan political communications to their members for decades. As well as every other organization that I've ever been apart of. And companies have been able to fire people for what they say on social networks for years. None of this new or shocking.
VERY true. in fact, I currently live in a "Fire At Will" state (...well guns included). But a company here can fire you for any reason they feel like it.

The sad thing is see today, however, is how F A C E B O O K has been used as a tool for reason. I am getting at the "content" of what a person has on their facebook page, the "type of friends", the type of comments, messges and even activities gets included in a company's decision to fire you if they feel its "not fitting of the company's character".

What i dont "get" is W H Y people feel compelled to put their personal info online like where they work, their phone numbers, email inf, even birthdate! I sure as heck didnt fill all that in by-golly, and by-repuglican decree i sure as hayale didnt turn on the feature where my co workers could see every post i made....but anyway I stopped using that "thang" long ago but first de-friended persons i was linked to on the job.

Just yesterday there was a news report on college grads and tips on how to land a job.. ONE of the tips was to "not delete" your facebook but watch what you do with it...lol

I guess u can say thats political.......right?..
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Old October 20th, 2012, 12:50 PM   #126 (permalink)
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I hate to tell you this, but unions have been making partisan political communications to their members for decades. As well as every other organization that I've ever been apart of. And companies have been able to fire people for what they say on social networks for years. None of this new or shocking.
Unions don't fire or hire, see the difference ? You don't see a problem when companies base firing/hiring on political views, politicians they support ? Think Third Reich.

It appears conservatives get their panties in a wad when the government bans private ownership of weapons of mass destruction, but when corporations that finance (ALEX) the political process tell their employees who to vote for, it doesn't raise an eyebrow. When that attitude becomes the rule, kiss living in a free country goodbye.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 01:18 PM   #127 (permalink)
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Unions don't fire or hire, see the difference ? You don't see a problem when companies base firing/hiring on political views, politicians they support ? Think Third Reich.

It appears conservatives get their panties in a wad when the government bans private ownership of weapons of mass destruction, but when corporations that finance (ALEX) the political process tell their employees who to vote for, it doesn't raise an eyebrow. When that attitude becomes the rule, kiss living in a free country goodbye.
I hope I NEVER end up working for, or be in the mercy of a company that tells me how to vote. Any companies to mention that does?
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Old October 20th, 2012, 02:23 PM   #128 (permalink)
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... Any companies to mention that does?
It appears Citizens United opened up the floodgates for this propaganda/coercive war.

Is Your Boss Going to 'Mine' Your Vote? More Corporations Step Up Coercion | The Nation

"In recent weeks, a flurry of news coverage has focused on an undemocratic trend in workplaces around the country: employers telling their workers which politicians they should vote for. CEOs for Murray Energy, Koch Industries, ASG Software and Westgate Resorts have pressured their employees to vote for particular political candidates, like Mitt Romney.

The Nation has found that the phenomenon appears far more wide-ranging than previously known. Businesses throughout Washington State, along with a loose network of hundreds of coal and mining companies, are preparing to urge employees to vote for specific political candidates. Meanwhile, lobbyists in Washington are working furiously to encourage more corporations to adopt these tactics.

One of the lesser-known consequences of the Citizens United decision is how corporations gained the power to explicitly recommend candidates to their rank-and-file workers. Before, corporations were limited to mostly encouraging civic participation. Now, managers can make political appeals for a candidate in the workplace."
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Old October 20th, 2012, 03:32 PM   #129 (permalink)
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It appears Citizens United opened up the floodgates for this propaganda/coercive war.

Is Your Boss Going to 'Mine' Your Vote? More Corporations Step Up Coercion | The Nation

"In recent weeks, a flurry of news coverage has focused on an undemocratic trend in workplaces around the country: employers telling their workers which politicians they should vote for. CEOs for Murray Energy, Koch Industries, ASG Software and Westgate Resorts have pressured their employees to vote for particular political candidates, like Mitt Romney.

The Nation has found that the phenomenon appears far more wide-ranging than previously known. Businesses throughout Washington State, along with a loose network of hundreds of coal and mining companies, are preparing to urge employees to vote for specific political candidates. Meanwhile, lobbyists in Washington are working furiously to encourage more corporations to adopt these tactics.

One of the lesser-known consequences of the Citizens United decision is how corporations gained the power to explicitly recommend candidates to their rank-and-file workers. Before, corporations were limited to mostly encouraging civic participation. Now, managers can make political appeals for a candidate in the workplace."
Its really sad...sad.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 03:33 PM   #130 (permalink)
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Unions don't fire or hire, see the difference ? You don't see a problem when companies base firing/hiring on political views, politicians they support ? Think Third Reich.

It appears conservatives get their panties in a wad when the government bans private ownership of weapons of mass destruction, but when corporations that finance (ALEX) the political process tell their employees who to vote for, it doesn't raise an eyebrow. When that attitude becomes the rule, kiss living in a free country goodbye.
But this is nothing new. It's happened literally for generations by both sides of the spectrum.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 05:58 PM   #131 (permalink)
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Wrong again, it was illegal prior to S.C. decision Citizen United.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 06:12 PM   #132 (permalink)
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Still wrong, not until the S.C. case Citizens United. The U.S. is going back to the Republican loved age of plantations and company towns.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 10:02 PM   #133 (permalink)
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Wrong again, it was illegal prior to S.C. decision Citizen United.
No, it's been legal long before that. Hate to break it to you. Companies can fire you because they don't like the shoes you're wearing that day.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 10:38 PM   #134 (permalink)
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Companies can fire you because they don't like the shoes you're wearing that day.
With a union, the company won't be able to do that! If nothing else, that is one thing a union was good for, keeping the company from firing you for no real reason.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 10:59 PM   #135 (permalink)
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And then the union drives the company into bankruptcy and everyone loses their job. I've never understood that "logic".
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Old October 20th, 2012, 11:01 PM   #136 (permalink)
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Old October 20th, 2012, 11:08 PM   #137 (permalink)
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And then the union drives the company into bankruptcy and everyone loses their job. I've never understood that "logic".
I've never understood all the companies executives who are making $millions or close to it if not, decides they need more millions, so they lay off the lower level workers to save money. I don't see the logic in that. Why not start laying off alot of the big shots first? That's what driving them into bankrupcy. But then we both know, most of these companies i'm referring to are making profits.
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Old October 21st, 2012, 01:56 AM   #138 (permalink)
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If a company doesn't make a profit then it goes out of business and isn't a company any more. The union then becomes irrelevant because there are no jobs.
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Old October 21st, 2012, 02:58 AM   #139 (permalink)
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Because the folks who already have the $billions have made their wealth. Don't want to upset the apple cart, preservation of wealth is the game. So what if society stagnates, I've got mine, status quo is just fine.
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Old October 21st, 2012, 03:26 AM   #140 (permalink)
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If a company doesn't make a profit then it goes out of business and isn't a company any more. The union then becomes irrelevant because there are no jobs.
But as long as the company is in business and making profits, with a union the company can't fire an employee because the boss doesn't like his shoes, looks, hair or skin color. He will not be able to fire you and hire his friend, relative etc.

This is what is happening with majority of companies now, no union to protect the employees, so they are doing as they please with or without profits.

You mean to say you would rather work for a company without a union than to work for one with a union? Interesting.
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Old October 21st, 2012, 04:45 AM   #141 (permalink)
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Whoa whoa whoa!

HOLD the phone here!



I can't BELIEVE no one here knows the CORRECT answer to this so very basic and SIMPLE question!

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He is the TRUE ruler of Yankee Doodle Land (US of A)... uhh and I guess he also rules those "other" places in the world we just don't ever mention!



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Old October 21st, 2012, 04:51 AM   #142 (permalink)
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Chuck Norris' dire warning for America - 2012 - YouTube

And there we have it!

"1,000 years of darkness!"

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Old October 21st, 2012, 08:25 AM   #143 (permalink)
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Unions don't fire or hire, see the difference ?
There was a time where they certainly did. That's a situation that's pretty much gone now, but still.
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Old October 21st, 2012, 11:58 AM   #144 (permalink)
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You mean to say you would rather work for a company without a union than to work for one with a union? Interesting.
I work for myself.
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 05:10 PM   #145 (permalink)
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Perhaps who rules Romney is a better title.

Mitt Romney's Dirty Dozen | Politics News | Rolling Stone

"Not so long ago, Mitt Romney used to blast deadly coal-fired power plants and talk up emission caps to curb the "dramatic warming of our planet." But as the GOP nominee for president, Romney has become dirty energy's biggest cheerleader. As his running mate, Rep. Paul Ryan, slams federal investment in wind and solar energy as "green pork," Romney is loudly championing Big Oil, Big Coal, fracking and the disastrous Keystone XL pipeline that will bring climate-killing Canadian crude to the global export market.

What accounts for Mitt's extreme energy makeover? Millions of dollars in campaign spending from fossil-fuel titans and advice from the drill-baby-drill crowd might have something to do with it. Here's a look at Romney's Dirty Dozen – the lobbyists, CEOs and advisers who are driving his radical dirty-energy agenda."
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 05:42 PM   #146 (permalink)
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I work for myself.
Everyone works for themselves.
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 07:18 PM   #147 (permalink)
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Perhaps who rules Romney is a better title.

Mitt Romney's Dirty Dozen | Politics News | Rolling Stone

"Not so long ago, Mitt Romney used to blast deadly coal-fired power plants and talk up emission caps to curb the "dramatic warming of our planet." But as the GOP nominee for president, Romney has become dirty energy's biggest cheerleader. As his running mate, Rep. Paul Ryan, slams federal investment in wind and solar energy as "green pork," Romney is loudly championing Big Oil, Big Coal, fracking and the disastrous Keystone XL pipeline that will bring climate-killing Canadian crude to the global export market.

What accounts for Mitt's extreme energy makeover? Millions of dollars in campaign spending from fossil-fuel titans and advice from the drill-baby-drill crowd might have something to do with it. Here's a look at Romney's Dirty Dozen – the lobbyists, CEOs and advisers who are driving his radical dirty-energy agenda."
Your question just MADE me hit the info-hwy to seek the answer......one word:




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Old October 22nd, 2012, 09:04 PM   #148 (permalink)
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Hate to break it to you. Companies can fire you because they don't like the shoes you're wearing that day.
Where did/do you work, in a coal mine in 1920? MOST (Burger King, McDonalds etc. not included) companies require documentation (union or not) before a person is terminated. Unless they have a huge screw up (i.e commercial driver having a preventable accident with a death and it was their fault) or if you say something stupid (racist or sexist) to the wrong person. Some circumstances do dictate immediate termination but after the proper investigation.

There are certain circumstances where you can get sent home or turned away for improper footwear. One example is in the iron ore mines here in Minnesota, you MUST have steel toe shoes (bare minimum with metatarsal boots preferred) and a hard hat just to enter their property. Most mines also require MSHA training as well.

If you do your job, nothing more, nothing less, you should not have to keep looking over your shoulder worried about getting fired.
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 09:43 PM   #149 (permalink)
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If you do your job, nothing more, nothing less, you should not have to keep looking over your shoulder worried about getting fired.
Or . . . that is how it SHOULD work.

I recall a supervisor who was hired by a manager who biked with the director of HR, who once said something like "I hire Vietnamese line assistants because they are smarter than whites. I would never hire a woman because my wife (a non-English speaking person from Vietnam) will not tolerate it" Or words like that.

This HR Director was hired and he brought along his friends and put them into positions they did not understand. When a problem arises, there was no reason to waste your time talking to HR.

This Super said it out loud and was unapologetic. HR listened to some others "whine" and said it was the Supervisor's prerogative to hire anyone he wants to hire. The same HR person who had people fired for cheating on their numbers (as they should have been) did nothing when his friends did exactly the same thing.

This wonk's wife was supposed to run a precision production line and she could not speak a lick of English, or understand a circuit or use a modem.

I recall the incestuous relationships between our Director of HR, several Line Managers and several Supervisors. You had to do your job, naturally, but you had to be careful not say anything that upset a Supervisor or Manager. Should they not like you, HR was no use. This is the same group that openly said they will look at a dozen whites before hiring a black person.

Lots of politics in the workplace and not only do you need to do your job, you have to play lots of games that make it very difficult to do that very job. You must CYA bigtime. Sometimes, you are screwed no matter how good you do your job and getting fired can be a matter of internal politics and BS.
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 09:45 PM   #150 (permalink)
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Everyone works for themselves.
I am self-employed, but I always work for my clients. Just sayin'
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