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Old August 29th, 2012, 10:08 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Footmouth President Ryan

What did you think about his speech...I think it was powerful I feel like Im a republican now lol

Anyways I feel like they like Ryan better then Mitt lol

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Old August 29th, 2012, 10:28 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Oh, Outofdate1980 is going to eat you alive.
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Old August 29th, 2012, 11:09 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Oh, Outofdate1980 is going to eat you alive.
Well only reason im going for them is because they look so sure they can fix everything that if they dont do the job, Americans are going to be disappointed that we will make them look like clowns and they can't afford that. I like Ryan but Mitt he seem to fake i could tell by body language and fake laugh when smiling at us regular people "trying" to be friendly seems so fake. When I smile and I fake laugh is more realistic comes all natural ....he does it like all fake makes me think everything he says is fake...
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Old August 29th, 2012, 11:23 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Well only reason im going for them is because they look so sure they can fix everything that if they dont do the job, Americans are going to be disappointed that we will make them look like clowns and they can't afford that. I like Ryan but Mitt he seem to fake i could tell by body language and fake laugh when smiling at us regular people "trying" to be friendly seems so fake. When I smile and I fake laugh is more realistic comes all natural ....he does it like all fake makes me think everything he says is fake...
Well, he has taken at least two sides on every issue...
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Old August 30th, 2012, 12:51 AM   #5 (permalink)
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What did you think about his speech...I think it was powerful I feel like Im a republican now lol

Anyways I feel like they like Ryan better then Mitt lol
Well Ryan never lets the facts get in the way with his lying. Don't worry, Ryan is like a powerful drink, feels great for awhile, then the hangover, then you recover.

Paul Ryan Address: Convention Speech Built On Demonstrably Misleading Assertions
"Ryan then noted that Obama, while campaigning for president, promised that a GM plant in Wisconsin would not shut down. "That plant didnít last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And thatís how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight," Ryan said."

Except Obama didn't promise that. And the plant closed in December 2008 -- while George W. Bush was president."

"... And it comes just days after Romney pollster Neil Newhouse warned, defending the campaign's demonstrably false ads claiming Obama removed work requirements from welfare, "We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers."
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Old August 30th, 2012, 01:17 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I think that Romney and Ryan are so far right that even right center would seem like far left.

Their plans and promises have been proven impossible in our country, but by a previous administration, the GWB. Trickle down economy = failure due to the employers pocketing the tax cuts instead of hiring more employees, putting additional workload on the middle class by expecting increased production with the same amount of employees. The potential repeal of the Affordable Care Act is appalling considering it is based off the exact same model as Romney enacted in Massachusetts, yet is unsuitable for the other 49 states. Continuing tax cuts for the wealthy is not encouraging hiring, it is encouraging the increase of the national debt by less taxes being collected vs the optimal solution of a hire per tax benefit law.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 07:21 AM   #7 (permalink)
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People who get their panties in a twist because a politician is lying amuse me as much as those who get their panties in a twist because Apple came out with something proprietary. You're surprised?
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Old August 30th, 2012, 09:48 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I'm not surprised, but when their lies are convincing enough to grab someone like the OP of this thread, then I'm certainly angered.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 10:06 AM   #9 (permalink)
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It blows my mind that the Christian Right hates Obama so much that they would vote for a wealthy hardcore Mormon.

My Mom does volunteer work with a Christian group who deprogram cult kids and not only do her refernce books claim Mormons are a cult but 1 that should concern Christians greatly because of their Financial and Political influence.

If you are a conservative and are thinking about voting for these guys. Do me a small favor. For just a minute leave Obama out of the picture and listen to what this Ryan guy is saying when he is not bashing Obama. This guys politics are radical and from my moderate point of view quite harmful.

Obama has not proven himself to be a true Liberal. He catches flak from the far left for being a moderate dem. He didn't pass any gun legislatin or policy to the best of my knowledge has tried very hard to stay away from the abortion. So while he didn't give the right what they wanted he didn't give it to the left either.
He did cary on Bush policies that were working.

It just blows my mind that moderate conservatives like myself would vote for these far rigt fascists over a moderate dem. Let alone put up with all the lies and just plain BS coming from the Fringe who's only goal is to defeat Obama.

And yes I know the left is guilty of there crap and on issues where I'm an on the fence independent I give them an earful to.

God we need a real 3rd party. We should call it the Reality Based Middle Party.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 10:53 AM   #10 (permalink)
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It blows my mind that the Christian Right hates Obama so much that they would vote for a wealthy hardcore Mormon.
Iíd rather vote for a wealthy hardcore Mormon than someone who spent twenty years at the altar of Reverend Wright.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 11:21 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Iíd rather vote for a wealthy hardcore Mormon than someone who spent twenty years at the altar of Reverend Wright.
And what public policy decisions has Obama made that have anything to do with any connection to Wright?

Romney has no qualms with inflicting his religious beliefs onto the country by attempting to codify them into law.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 01:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
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People who get their panties in a twist because a politician is lying amuse me as much as those who get their panties in a twist because Apple came out with something proprietary. You're surprised?
Looks like Sally Kohn will be looking for "other opportunities".

Fox News' Sally Kohn: Paul Ryan's RNC Speech 'Was Attempt To Set World Record For Blatant Lies'

According to Fox News columnist Sally Kohn, vice presidential nominee Paul Ryan's speech at the Republican National Convention on Wednesday "was an apparent attempt to set the world record for the greatest number of blatant lies and misrepresentations slipped into a single political speech."
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Old August 30th, 2012, 02:17 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Yep hopefully he just tanked Romney just like Palin did Mccain in her early TV interviews.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 02:47 PM   #14 (permalink)
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What does Romney's religion have to do with anything?
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Old August 30th, 2012, 03:03 PM   #15 (permalink)
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What does Romney's religion have to do with anything?
Like many politicians who fail to grasp the concept of separation of church and state, he has openly pledged to attempt to codify laws that would be based on his religious tenets. This is far from old news, and should come as a surprise to no one.

EDIT: And should anyone try to bring up Obama's religion, let us not forget that it's a much more central part of Romney's platform, he panders to the religious right by touting his agreement on their theocratic laws. Indeed, religion is a much more central part of his personality, he served as a Mormon bishop in Boston for several years. Obama has acknowledged his mistake in believing religion to be a sufficient excuse to continue infringing on the rights of Americans (inb4 calculated political move blah blah); we must continue to progress forward, not allow ourselves to sink back into intolerance.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 03:27 PM   #16 (permalink)
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The above reason and my question is why it doesn't seem to bother Christians. I've heard preachers go on at length about Mormon's and see where this belief spans denominations.

It seems like they are having to choose Romney as the lesser of 2 evils but you wouldn't be able to tell that by the actions of the dlegates at the convention.

I realy just don't get why Christians come down on the side that really doesn't represent a world view in line with the teachings of Jesus of Nazereth and who have not delivered on anything much they have been promising Christians for 2 decades.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 04:50 PM   #17 (permalink)
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except the liars in this thread and the "fact checkers" themselves need to be fact checked.......

what Ryan said was entirely accurate

Fact:

Obama made a campaign appearance at a GM plant in 2008 (before he was elected)..... at which time he stated that if government did its job properly that plant would be operating for another hundred years

Fact:

in December 2008 (before Obama was elected) that plant stopped producing SUV's...... this has nothing to do with Obama or his promise..... other than a bunch of people have stopped here and considered this to be the end of the witch hunt for Ryan lies

Fact:

that same plant continued operation until June 2009.... producing light duty trucks...... the plant closed in June 2009...... if memory serves me correct Obama became president in January 2009

and yes.... although some on the left may not be able to comprehend calendar dates.... January occurs before June

now explain to me how Ryan told a lie?????? he stated Obama made a speech in which he told a GM plant if the govt does its job properly that plant will not close......... 5 months after Obama started running the govt..... that plant closed

any questions?
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Old August 30th, 2012, 05:15 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Fact Check has an article on the Ryan speech. It would appear there is little in there that is a bald faced lie other than his claim that Obama is funneling money away from Medicare and claiming American people were cut out of the stimulus package. The rest is basically half-truths.

http://factcheck.org/2012/08/ryans-vp-spin
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Old August 30th, 2012, 06:24 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Evo 5oh View Post
What did you think about his speech...I think it was powerful I feel like Im a republican now lol

Anyways I feel like they like Ryan better then Mitt lol
Here you have it guys, the voice of the average American voter lol


From the bits I saw, I think the man is really hittable. And at least Romney at some point in time had a reasonable centre-right policy platform.
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Old August 30th, 2012, 07:28 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Fact Check has an article on the Ryan speech. It would appear there is little in there that is a bald faced lie other than his claim that Obama is funneling money away from Medicare and claiming American people were cut out of the stimulus package. The rest is basically half-truths.

FactCheck.org : Ryan’s VP Spin
Ryan is lying though his teeth. Each point that Ryan blames Obama is because Ryan & his thugs opposed.

"Obama, Feb. 13, 2008: And I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years. The question is not whether a clean energy economy is in our future, itís where it will thrive. I want it to thrive Ö"
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Old August 30th, 2012, 08:31 PM   #21 (permalink)
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You left wing guys sure sound bitter and angry. We're told the left is understanding, tolerant and embraces diversity but I don't see it. Diversity isn't just colors and accents. It's thought and opinion too. How can everyone you disagree with be a liar?
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Old August 30th, 2012, 09:28 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by copestag View Post
except the liars in this thread and the "fact checkers" themselves need to be fact checked.......

what Ryan said was entirely accurate

Fact:

Obama made a campaign appearance at a GM plant in 2008 (before he was elected)..... at which time he stated that if government did its job properly that plant would be operating for another hundred years

Fact:

in December 2008 (before Obama was elected) that plant stopped producing SUV's...... this has nothing to do with Obama or his promise..... other than a bunch of people have stopped here and considered this to be the end of the witch hunt for Ryan lies

Fact:

that same plant continued operation until June 2009.... producing light duty trucks...... the plant closed in June 2009...... if memory serves me correct Obama became president in January 2009

and yes.... although some on the left may not be able to comprehend calendar dates.... January occurs before June

now explain to me how Ryan told a lie?????? he stated Obama made a speech in which he told a GM plant if the govt does its job properly that plant will not close......... 5 months after Obama started running the govt..... that plant closed

any questions?
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Originally Posted by A.Nonymous View Post
Fact Check has an article on the Ryan speech. It would appear there is little in there that is a bald faced lie other than his claim that Obama is funneling money away from Medicare and claiming American people were cut out of the stimulus package. The rest is basically half-truths.

FactCheck.org : Ryan’s VP Spin
http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/30/politics/pol-fact-check-ryan-gm/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

While Obama did give a speech at the Wisconsin GM facility, the decision was made to close it in June 2008. 4 months after Obama's speech, 7 months before he took the presidential office, and a year before the doors were shut in June 2009.

This plant ceasing operations does not hang on Obama's shoulders, but GM's. Maybe more research and fact checking should go into these statements before claiming that Obama's speech was a lie/failure.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 01:35 AM   #23 (permalink)
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You left wing guys sure sound bitter and angry. We're told the left is understanding, tolerant and embraces diversity but I don't see it. Diversity isn't just colors and accents. It's thought and opinion too. How can everyone you disagree with be a liar?
What about all the centrists and those on the center-right who oppose Romney-Ryan?
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Old August 31st, 2012, 01:42 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Seems like differences of preference in politics and religion start wars.

Why do we need either?
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Old August 31st, 2012, 05:56 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jhtalisman View Post
CNN Fact Check: Did Ryan get Obama's GM speech right? - CNN.com

While Obama did give a speech at the Wisconsin GM facility, the decision was made to close it in June 2008. 4 months after Obama's speech, 7 months before he took the presidential office, and a year before the doors were shut in June 2009.

This plant ceasing operations does not hang on Obama's shoulders, but GM's. Maybe more research and fact checking should go into these statements before claiming that Obama's speech was a lie/failure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by copestag View Post
except the liars in this thread and the "fact checkers" themselves need to be fact checked.......

what Ryan said was entirely accurate
nobody including Ryan said Obama closed this plant....... what Ryan said was Obama made a campaign speech in which he stated that if the govt does its job the plant will last another 100 years....... which Obama did say

Obama was then elected........ despite what the phony fact checker orgs.... or the left wing media rags say....... the plant closed in June 2009..... instead of talking points sheets go do some research........nobody said the plant closing was due to Obama.......EVERYONE.... including Ryan has stated the plant was already slated for closure

Obama inferred it wouldnt close to receive votes........ he won....... the plant still closed as scheduled...IN JUNE 2009... this is the point Ryan made
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Old August 31st, 2012, 07:01 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copestag View Post
nobody including Ryan said Obama closed this plant....... what Ryan said was Obama made a campaign speech in which he stated that if the govt does its job the plant will last another 100 years....... which Obama did say

Obama was then elected........ despite what the phony fact checker orgs.... or the left wing media rags say....... the plant closed in June 2009..... instead of talking points sheets go do some research........nobody said the plant closing was due to Obama.......EVERYONE.... including Ryan has stated the plant was already slated for closure

Obama inferred it wouldnt close to receive votes........ he won....... the plant still closed as scheduled...IN JUNE 2009... this is the point Ryan made
The decision to close that plant wasn't made until 4 months after that speech. Maybe reading it would help. Seems like the government under the previous administration didn't do it's job. Of course they were too busy squeezing every last nickel from the American taxpayers to line their wealthy friends pockets.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 08:16 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Im one of those center slightly right people and I hate most of what these guys are about.

But im very unhappy with Obama as well, half dozen of one 6 of the other. Like getting the choice of where to be shot.

Apathy is going to be the end of us all.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 09:39 AM   #28 (permalink)
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This is why I don't vote for President. I can't recall a single candidate in my lifetime I actually liked. Maybe Reagan, but I was a little kid at the time. What do kids know?
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Old August 31st, 2012, 10:02 AM   #29 (permalink)
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I feel the same way but can't jump on the soapbox about voter turn out if I don't vote so I usually write in. I actually liked what Nadar was selling as a Green so was the only clear conscience vote Ive cast for some one on the ballot.

Last time I voted for Obama because write ins are like pleading no contest and I hoped he would deliver on some of his promises. A write in would have been a defacto vote for McCain/Palin so I voted against them.

To bad Bushco had a fire sale right before he took office. He might have done some good.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 11:56 AM   #30 (permalink)
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I'll vote, just not for President. There are local weasels on the ballot as well and those guys have a far greater potential to mess with my life than anyone on Pennsylvania avenue does. I vote on those guys. I leave the President blank.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 01:51 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Yet more proof of Romney just telling people what they want to hear:

Factchecker: Romney’s '12 million jobs' promise | The Washington Post

So basically Romney and Ryan are only promising that they'll create the jobs we're already on track to see thanks to Obama's policies. Classy: Obama does the heavy lifting, Romney and Ryan claim all the glory. This ranks right up there with the $780 billion Medicare cut thing.

The article also points out that Romney's so-called pledge "amounts to an average of 250,000 jobs a month, a far cry from the 500,000 jobs a month that Romney claimed in May would be created in a 'normal recovery.'" However, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the U.S. economy has come close to or exceeded adding 500,000 jobs in one month only 14 times in the past 65 years - just under 2 percent.

This tells us three things: 1) Romney has no idea what sustainable job growth is supposed to look like; 2) He took the excuse to slam Obama for something that was totally untenable; and 3) His own "plan" (really Obama's plan) wouldn't even live up to the expectations that he listed.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 03:25 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Facts Take a Beating in Romney, Ryan Acceptance Speeches - NYTimes.com

Another well-written piece. Yet another blatant falsehood pointed out from Ryan's speech:
Quote:
One of Mr. Ryanís most pointed attacks on Mr. Obama was on the deficit. "He created a new bipartisan debt commission," Mr. Ryan noted. "They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way and then did exactly nothing."

Left unsaid: Mr. Ryan served on that commission himself, and his opposition to its final proposals helped seal its fate. The panel, known as the Simpson-Bowles deficit commission, made a number of recommendations that Mr. Ryan ultimately opposed on the grounds that they would have raised some taxes while failing to cut enough from health programs.
Even FOX News was staggered by the blatant falsehoods, misleading statements, and lies of omission that Ryan attempted to perpetrate:

Paul Ryanís speech in 3 words | Fox News
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Old August 31st, 2012, 04:00 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Aug. 30: Remember the Economy? - Five Thirty Eight - NYTimes.com

The NYT polling and analysis blog Five Thirty Eight looks at nationwide polls and breaking economic data each day and updates projections and forecasts for the election. What's particularly interesting is that while most candidates receive a boost in ratings around the time of their party's convention (called "a convention bounce"), Romney's chances of winning the election have actually shrunk since the start of the RNC. From the link, click "Now-cast" on the right side; on August 22, Obama and Romney were at their lowest and highest respective chances of winning the election since data collection began - Obama at 62.6 and Romney at 37.4. Yesterday's numbers have Obama at 72.6 and Romney at 27.4.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 06:59 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by RazorSharp View Post
Facts Take a Beating in Romney, Ryan Acceptance Speeches - NYTimes.com

Another well-written piece. Yet another blatant falsehood pointed out from Ryan's speech:
Same half truth that politicians always tell. His story is true. He just neglects his part of it. Same with his story about why the credit rating was downgraded. It was absolutely the fault of Obama and the Democrats. He neglected to mention the fact that it was also the fault of the Republicans as well.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 07:15 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Same half truth that politicians always tell. His story is true. He just neglects his part of it.
His part was blocking the commission's proposals from even getting to Obama. I think that's a little worse than a half truth.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 07:46 PM   #36 (permalink)
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His part was blocking the commission's proposals from even getting to Obama. I think that's a little worse than a half truth.
Ryan also put forth a plan though that Obama blocked.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 08:01 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Ryan also put forth a plan though that Obama blocked.
But then his story isn't true. Ryan's plan was not the plan approved by the majority of the Bowles-Simpson Commission.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 08:08 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Seems like differences of preference in politics and religion start wars.

Why do we need either?
Problem is, the right has made opposition to Obama and paying taxes into a religion.
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Old August 31st, 2012, 10:01 PM   #39 (permalink)
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This is why I don't vote for President.
A true 21st-century American...
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Old September 1st, 2012, 03:47 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A.Nonymous View Post
Same half truth that politicians always tell. His story is true. He just neglects his part of it. Same with his story about why the credit rating was downgraded. It was absolutely the fault of Obama and the Democrats. He neglected to mention the fact that it was also the fault of the Republicans as well.
Half truths are lying, please stop excusing this behavior. An BS on the downgrade of the debt, it was the Republicans, which is well documented.

Half-truth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The purpose and or consequence of a half truth is to make something that is really only a belief appear to be knowledge, or a truthful statement to represent the whole truth, or possibly lead to a false conclusion. According to the justified true belief theory of knowledge, in order to know that a given proposition is true, one must not only believe in the relevant true proposition, but one must also have a good reason for doing so. A half truth deceives the recipient by presenting something believable and using those aspects of the statement that can be shown to be true as good reason to believe the statement is true in its entirety, or that the statement represents the whole truth. A person deceived by a half truth considers the proposition to be knowledge and acts accordingly.
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Old September 1st, 2012, 06:01 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by A.Nonymous View Post
Same half truth that politicians always tell. His story is true. He just neglects his part of it. Same with his story about why the credit rating was downgraded. It was absolutely the fault of Obama and the Democrats. He neglected to mention the fact that it was also the fault of the Republicans as well.
The downgrade occurred because Republicans weren't trusted by rating agencies to do what's necessary.
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Old September 1st, 2012, 07:53 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Standard and Poors blamed both parties so pointing the finger at just one of them is ridiculous.

http://www.standardandpoors.com/servlet/BlobServer?blobheadername3=MDT-Type&blobcol=urldata&blobtable=MungoBlobs&blobhead ervalue2=inline%3B+filename%3DUS_Downgraded_AA%2B. pdf&blobheadername2=Content-Disposition&blobheadervalue1=application%2Fpdf&blo bkey=id&blobheadername1=content-type&blobwhere=1243942957443&blobheadervalue3=UTF-8

They said,

Quote:
We lowered our long-term rating on the U.S. because we believe that the
prolonged controversy over raising the statutory debt ceiling and the related
fiscal policy debate indicate that further near-term progress containing the
growth in public spending, especially on entitlements, or on reaching an
agreement on raising revenues is less likely than we previously assumed and
will remain a contentious and fitful process.
And

Quote:
Republicans and Democrats have only been able to agree to relatively modest savings on discretionary spending while delegating to the Select Committee decisions on more comprehensive measures.
So the people who actually downgraded the rating blamed both parties.
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Old September 1st, 2012, 07:55 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Problem is, the right has made opposition to Obama and paying taxes into a religion.
And the left has made opposition to Romney and punishing the rich into a religion.
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Old September 1st, 2012, 08:44 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Quote:
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And the left has made opposition to Romney and punishing the rich into a religion.
Opposition to Romney has been just typical politics and hasn't been particularly heinous. Is asking the rich to pay slightly more in taxes really such a punishment? Didn't seem to hurt them under Clinton, and that's at the max of what's been proposed. Cry me a river. Poor rich people can't catch a break. Not all Democrats are poor bastards either, you know.
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Old September 1st, 2012, 08:46 AM   #45 (permalink)
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Oppose Obama = religious war
Oppose Romney = typical politics

Spin much?
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Old September 1st, 2012, 09:52 AM   #46 (permalink)
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I wouldn't call the Republican opposition to Obama a "religion," but their desperate desire to get him out of office has been thoroughly documented; the meetings where they resolve to oppose him at any cost, and the subsequent execution of the plan where they blocked him on everything possible by any means - for example, more filibusters have been used in this session of Congress than in all the ones before combined.

Robert Draper Book: GOP's Anti-Obama Campaign Started Night of Inauguration | The Huffington Post

Daily Kos: Eric Cantor, Paul Ryan & Kevin McCarthy: Plot To Sabotage US Economy with Frank Luntz
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Old September 1st, 2012, 10:30 AM   #47 (permalink)
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Been catching up on The Newsroom. Love to here fellow Centerist bash both left and right fringes.

One segment made me ask why we didn't hear from Ryan a big theme Rush would't shut up about. The topic is still popular with under educated far right idiots on the net
But no canidate I've heard mentions it. It points out the true agenda of the right is to beat Obama not to servee our interests like they are being paid t.
Here's the clip on youtube.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

And some equal bashing of bothe extremes just because I'm annoyed with all the ultra partisan posturing in the thread. Proof its possible both sides are wrong.
Please watch this and contemplate its meaning for just a few minutes. Is a dose of reality worth 10 minutes of your day?

YouTube - TTAT THE NEWSROOM #5 - Obama vs. Gun Laws
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Old September 1st, 2012, 10:32 AM   #48 (permalink)
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*..big theme from 08...
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Old September 1st, 2012, 10:45 AM   #49 (permalink)
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PH8AL, you know you can edit your posts, right? You don't need to post another with an asterisk correction.
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Old September 1st, 2012, 10:47 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Actually no I can't for an undetermined amount of time.
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