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Old September 13th, 2012, 06:20 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Who said anything about them paying it off? I know that I didn't. I only asked to keep the interests rates what they are or attempt to lower them. That's not unreasonable.

Either way, it needs to be easier for EVERYONE to go to college. Not just myself or those who are more affluent than me.
Government already keeps them low by backing student loans in the first place. If it didn't back them, the rates would be excessively higher. Also, most students who take out private loans don't even utilize the government loans that are available.

Private Student Loan Report Amended, Majority Of Students Didn't Exhaust Federal Aid: Consumer Financial Protection Bureau

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Old September 13th, 2012, 07:04 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Government is not evil in and of itself. When it oversteps it self to the point that citizens are not being served, but instead being kept it becomes evil. If you choose to bury yourself in debt, it is not the government's job to bail you out. ...
Unless you are politically connected and finance the politicians.
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Old September 13th, 2012, 07:12 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Government already keeps them low by backing student loans in the first place. If it didn't back them, the rates would be excessively higher. Also, most students who take out private loans don't even utilize the government loans that are available.

Private Student Loan Report Amended, Majority Of Students Didn't Exhaust Federal Aid: Consumer Financial Protection Bureau
Interesting that for-profit colleges push private loans, but not surprising.

"According to the July report, students at for-profit colleges were four times more likely to take out private loans than students at traditional public and non-profit private colleges and universities. The Education Department found students at for-profit colleges are more than twice as likely to default on their loans when compared to peers at public and private nonprofit colleges."
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Old September 13th, 2012, 07:18 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Unless you are politically connected and finance the politicians.
Those bailouts were bad ideas. I've said so before and I'll say it again.
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Old September 13th, 2012, 10:50 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Unfortunately, we were under the gun and it was done badly. We should have learned if they're too big to fail, they're too big, break em up.
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Old September 13th, 2012, 11:11 PM   #56 (permalink)
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So how is it a democracy when you only have a choice of party A or party B?
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Old September 14th, 2012, 03:07 AM   #57 (permalink)
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Well its 50% better then just party A. You are correct there should be more choices, but first past the post is reality, at least in the U.S.
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Old September 14th, 2012, 10:45 AM   #58 (permalink)
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Government already keeps them low
$500 is low. Not $50k

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So how is it a democracy when you only have a choice of party A or party B?
...because you have a vote equal to anyone else's vote?
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Old September 14th, 2012, 11:35 AM   #59 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=ElasticNinja;4952344]$500 is low. Not $50k/QUOTE]

Interest rates. Not the size of the loan. If the feds limited the size of the loans lots of students and parents would be ticked.
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Old September 14th, 2012, 12:32 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ElasticNinja View Post
$500 is low. Not $50k
Interest rates. Not the size of the loan. If the feds limited the size of the loans lots of students and parents would be ticked.
I thought you meant tuition fees, sorry.

Just FYI I was talking about tuition fees the whole time.
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Old September 14th, 2012, 05:49 PM   #61 (permalink)
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So how is it a democracy when you only have a choice of party A or party B?
Douche vs. Turd 2008 - YouTube

+ 1 to you ebusinesstutor
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Old September 14th, 2012, 06:08 PM   #62 (permalink)
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I thought you meant tuition fees, sorry.

Just FYI I was talking about tuition fees the whole time.
Well, $50k is pretty high for college. According to one source I found it's $20k a year for a state college and about twice that for a private school. Still, this can be paid for by simple savings. I mean you've got 18 years to save up $60k if we go for the lower number. Even if we go with $120k for the higher number you've still got 18 years to save that up. Do people have no responsibility to save?

CollegeData - Pay Your Way - What's the Price Tag for a College Education?
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Old September 14th, 2012, 07:04 PM   #63 (permalink)
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U.S. Incomes Fell More in Recovery, Sentier Says - Bloomberg

"Real median annual household income fell to $53,508 from $54,916 during the 18-month recession from December 2007 to June 2009, according to the firm’s study of income data for the 36- month period ended in June 2012. Incomes kept falling during the 36-month period since then, dropping to $50,964 in June 2012"
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Old September 15th, 2012, 03:53 AM   #64 (permalink)
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That's ok. Polls in 2008 showed that if we elected Obama, the world would love us. World still hates us. We still don't care.
OK, it appears Obama will be reelected, unless there is an October Surprise. How's the House and Senate going to go ?

Sept. 13: After Convention Bounce, Holding Obama's Polls to a Higher Standard - NYTimes.com
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Old September 15th, 2012, 09:13 AM   #65 (permalink)
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Obama got a bounce from the convention. That's all. I still think he gets re-elected though I'm a bit shocked that the GOP isn't making a bigger deal of the fact that the economy isn't better and Obama hasn't done anything at all. Not the GOP is going to make anything better, but this is a winnable election for them.
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Old September 15th, 2012, 09:37 AM   #66 (permalink)
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Well, $50k is pretty high for college. According to one source I found it's $20k a year for a state college and about twice that for a private school. Still, this can be paid for by simple savings. I mean you've got 18 years to save up $60k if we go for the lower number. Even if we go with $120k for the higher number you've still got 18 years to save that up. Do people have no responsibility to save?
Ah here, that's ridiculous and naive, to expect families to save $10K a year, for two kids doing 4 years of college. What is this, China?
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Old September 15th, 2012, 11:26 AM   #67 (permalink)
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Obama got a bounce from the convention. That's all. I still think he gets re-elected though I'm a bit shocked that the GOP isn't making a bigger deal of the fact that the economy isn't better and Obama hasn't done anything at all. Not the GOP is going to make anything better, but this is a winnable election for them.
The electorate has realized that voodoo economics doesn't work.
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Old September 15th, 2012, 12:19 PM   #68 (permalink)
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My side of the family: Depending on how my kids perform academically/atheletically, I'll recommend they attend the county community college, get their 2yr degree, then decide whether to go on to a 4yr school.
My wife's side of the family: Work hard, find a good blue-collar job, and make big bucks w/o student loans.

Whatever works...
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Old September 15th, 2012, 12:22 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Ah here, that's ridiculous and naive, to expect families to save $10K a year, for two kids doing 4 years of college. What is this, China?
You don't have to save $10k a year. There's a little thing called compound interest that works for you. How many parents get to the college age and have absolutely nothing at all saved for their children?
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Old September 15th, 2012, 12:22 PM   #70 (permalink)
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The main issues of the 2012 election, IMO.
1. Economic solution. (Obama will retain Bernanke, Romney won't.)
2. War. (Frankly, I see no difference between Obama and Romney in this regard.)
3. Social issues. (Which my right-wing friends summarize in 2 words: Supreme Court.)

Doing my best to see both sides of the issues...at this point, I'm contemplating a third party vote.

(Besides, I'm in KS. If Romney doesn't win KS, we go to bed early on Nov 6.)
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Old September 15th, 2012, 12:35 PM   #71 (permalink)
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The electorate has realized that voodoo economics doesn't work.
Well, clearly Obama's economics doesn't work either.
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Old September 15th, 2012, 12:46 PM   #72 (permalink)
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The main issues of the 2012 election, IMO.
1. Economic solution. (Obama will retain Bernanke, Romney won't.)
Well, Romney's policies will damage the living conditions of the majority, economic growth isnt much use if it only benefits the few.

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2. War. (Frankly, I see no difference between Obama and Romney in this regard.)
Well, Romney doesnt have a policy on War/Foreign Policy. His only idea is to wage war against Iran. Time and again he has proved he doesnt have any idea of how the world works, or how diplomacy does.

As for Obama, I pretty much agree with most of his policies. From Afghanistan, to the drone attacks, to the bootless intervention in Libya. Probably should have dithered less on Egypt but thats going ok now.

Foreign Policy is probably the area where me and Obama are most similar.

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Doing my best to see both sides of the issues...at this point, I'm contemplating a third party vote.
Well a third party vote wont make any difference, but it will send out a signal or something, seeing as you arent in a swing state anyway.
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Old September 15th, 2012, 05:56 PM   #73 (permalink)
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I hate the argument that we should just pick the lesser of two evils. You're still getting evil that way are you not?
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Old September 16th, 2012, 01:32 AM   #74 (permalink)
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I hate the argument that we should just pick the lesser of two evils. You're still getting evil that way are you not?
Generally, one of the choice is more conductive to your views than the other.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 01:38 AM   #75 (permalink)
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Well, Romney's policies will damage the living conditions of the majority, economic growth isnt much use if it only benefits the few.
Where Obamas policies only damage the living conditions of EVERYONE.

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Originally Posted by ElasticNinja View Post
Well, Romney doesnt have a policy on War/Foreign Policy. His only idea is to wage war against Iran. Time and again he has proved he doesnt have any idea of how the world works, or how diplomacy does.
If youre going to stick your nose into American business at least TRY to read a newspaper or even the most extreme liberal rag...... they all have more of a clue than this.

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As for Obama, I pretty much agree with most of his policies. From Afghanistan, to the drone attacks, to the bootless intervention in Libya. Probably should have dithered less on Egypt but thats going ok now.
YEP ....... Libya and Egypt are working out great ...... again..... try reading a newspaper or some type of news media

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Foreign Policy is probably the area where me and Obama are most similar.
so your theory is to sit on the sidelines and let the world explode as well.......... nice

It was a good post... Im glad you made it.... solidifies even more the reason why you should mind your own business and worry about that craphole you live in...... and youre welcome for the welfare checks my crappy country sends yours..... YAWN
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Old September 16th, 2012, 06:01 AM   #76 (permalink)
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Where Obamas policies only damage the living conditions of EVERYONE.
I see.

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If youre going to stick your nose into American business at least TRY to read a newspaper or even the most extreme liberal rag...... they all have more of a clue than this.
Well, maybe I should have mentioned unwavering support for Israel and a policy of insulting allies.

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YEP ....... Libya and Egypt are working out great ...... again..... try reading a newspaper or some type of news media
Well, Libya has feck all security right now, but its parliament is a lot more secular than Gadaffi. As for Egypt, Morsi is keen to maintain peace with Israel and keep the US on side, but he also has to keep to public opinion, as he is the democratically elected President of Egypt, the most populous Arab state by far.
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so your theory is to sit on the sidelines and let the world explode as well.......... nice
Uhm.. no, I'm quite the interventionist. What could Obama have done differently? He's done nothing with regard to Israel/Palestine sure, but it seems he has done well with regard to the destruction of Earth.

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It was a good post... Im glad you made it.... solidifies even more the reason why you should mind your own business and worry about that craphole you live in......
Well, I mean I get upset about living here sometimes myself, but our standard of living is a bit ahead of America in all fairness.

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and youre welcome for the welfare checks my crappy country sends yours..... YAWN
Where are these welfare checks and how can I acquire them?!?
Ireland isnt even in NATO lolololol etc.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 08:55 AM   #77 (permalink)
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Couple of things. First of all, sentiment in the US tends to run pretty strongly pro-Israel. A pro-Palestinian candidate is not likely to be elected. At the very least he is going to have a very hard time.

Not sure where you get the stats about the standard of living being better in the UK. I guess it depends on how you measure it. The quality of life index I looked at recently had the US in the top 15 and the UK in the top 30. This was like a 5 yr old survey though. I seem to recall that the US has more cars per capita than any other nation in the world. It's not unusual here for people to own more cars than they have drivers, but I would wager that is not the same across the world. Our GDP per capita is higher than the UK. None of this should be very surprising though given that US workers work more hours than workers in the UK. It would make sense that they'd have more disposable income.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 10:11 AM   #78 (permalink)
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Couple of things. First of all, sentiment in the US tends to run pretty strongly pro-Israel. A pro-Palestinian candidate is not likely to be elected. At the very least he is going to have a very hard time.
Yeah, but nonetheless, not doing anything is a foreign policy blunder IMO.

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Not sure where you get the stats about the standard of living being better in the UK.
Thats not my country etc.

U.N. HDI Index 2011 (Very basic, really)
Norway 0.943 ()
Australia 0.929 ()
Netherlands 0.910 ()
United States 0.910 ()
New Zealand 0.908 ()
Canada 0.908 ()
Ireland 0.908 ()

As you see Ireland is .002 below the US, and of course our GDP per capita (PPP) is $10,000 less. There is far less shootings, crime, etc, we have a stronger welfare state, friendlier people. Yada yada you get the picture.

As for the Quality of Life index, well.... Quality-of-life Index - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:
Community life: Variable taking value 1 if country has either high rate of church attendance or trade-union membership; zero otherwise. Source: World Values Survey
How union membership has grown - and shrunk | News | guardian.co.uk

As one can see, Union membership is low (and needless to say, Brits dont go to church, Americans do).

That basically knocks one point off the UK, while gifting 1 point to the US, remove that and the UK is higher.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 11:40 AM   #79 (permalink)
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... (Besides, I'm in KS. If Romney doesn't win KS, we go to bed early on Nov 6.)
Believe KS is a safe state for Romney, even though Johnson is on the ballot.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 11:44 AM   #80 (permalink)
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The US doesn't have a high union membership though. I would lay odds the UK has far more union members per capita than the US does. Most US jobs are non-union. The US has higher church attendance though.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 12:02 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Believe KS is a safe state for Romney, even though Johnson is on the ballot.
Yeah. KS is a very safe state for Romney. Mr. Obama wins KS only if Mr. Romney says something like "I want to eat your children" at the debate. And if Mr. Obama wins KS, then he's probably had an election like Reagan '84.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 12:21 PM   #82 (permalink)
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The US doesn't have a high union membership though. I would lay odds the UK has far more union members per capita than the US does. Most US jobs are non-union. The US has higher church attendance though.
Yes, keyword is or.

Would be nice to see my post addressed.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 02:18 PM   #83 (permalink)
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Romney's foreign policy, shoot first, aim later, implements Chaney's hunting policy.

Mitt Romney Response To Libya, Egypt Attacks Called 'Irresponsible,' 'Craven,' 'Ham-Handed'

"The Romney campaign drew fire on Wednesday morning for issuing a blistering statement condemning the American embassy in Egypt for speaking against an incendiary anti-Muslim film, even though the embassy made the statement before any attacks had taken place. NBC's Chuck Todd, for instance, called the statement "irresponsible" and a "bad mistake." ABC's Jake Tapper said that Romney's attack "does not stand up to simple chronology.""
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Old September 16th, 2012, 02:40 PM   #84 (permalink)
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Romney's foreign policy, shoot first, aim later, implements Chaney's hunting policy.

Mitt Romney Response To Libya, Egypt Attacks Called 'Irresponsible,' 'Craven,' 'Ham-Handed'

"The Romney campaign drew fire on Wednesday morning for issuing a blistering statement condemning the American embassy in Egypt for speaking against an incendiary anti-Muslim film, even though the embassy made the statement before any attacks had taken place. NBC's Chuck Todd, for instance, called the statement "irresponsible" and a "bad mistake." ABC's Jake Tapper said that Romney's attack "does not stand up to simple chronology.""
Seriously, this is not a man for foreign policy at all at all.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 03:38 PM   #85 (permalink)
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Well, clearly Obama's economics doesn't work either.
We don't know since the Republicans have blocked it.

Political Animal - The incentive behind GOP obstructionism

Consider, though, the significance of a quote like this one.
“If Romney and Obama were going head to head at this point in time I would probably move to Romney,” said Dale Bartholomew, 58, a manufacturing equipment salesman from Marengo, Ill. Bartholomew said he agrees with Obama’s proposed economic remedies and said partisan divisions have blocked the president’s initiatives.

But, he added: “His inability to rally the political forces, if you will, to accomplish his goal is what disappoints me.”
Got that? This private citizen agrees with Obama, but is inclined to vote for Romney anyway — even though Romney would move the country in the other direction — because the president hasn’t been able to “rally the political forces” to act sensibly in Washington.

That is heartbreaking, but it’s important — Republicans have an incentive, not only to hold the country back on purpose, but also to block every good idea, even the ones they agree with, because they assume voters will end up blaming the president in the end. And here’s a quote from a guy who makes it seem as if the GOP’s assumptions are correct.
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Old September 17th, 2012, 11:42 PM   #86 (permalink)
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Well, Romney is toast. Well he at least knows he doesn't have to release those tax returns showing he received amnesty for his illegal Swiss bank account.


Today, Mitt Romney Lost the Election - Bloomberg

Romney is the most opaque presidential nominee since Nixon, and people have been reduced to guessing what his true feelings are. This video provides an answer: He feels that you're a loser. It's not an answer that wins elections.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 08:15 AM   #87 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by OutofDate1980 View Post
We don't know since the Republicans have blocked it.

Political Animal - The incentive behind GOP obstructionism

Consider, though, the significance of a quote like this one.
“If Romney and Obama were going head to head at this point in time I would probably move to Romney,” said Dale Bartholomew, 58, a manufacturing equipment salesman from Marengo, Ill. Bartholomew said he agrees with Obama’s proposed economic remedies and said partisan divisions have blocked the president’s initiatives.

But, he added: “His inability to rally the political forces, if you will, to accomplish his goal is what disappoints me.”
Got that? This private citizen agrees with Obama, but is inclined to vote for Romney anyway — even though Romney would move the country in the other direction — because the president hasn’t been able to “rally the political forces” to act sensibly in Washington.

That is heartbreaking, but it’s important — Republicans have an incentive, not only to hold the country back on purpose, but also to block every good idea, even the ones they agree with, because they assume voters will end up blaming the president in the end. And here’s a quote from a guy who makes it seem as if the GOP’s assumptions are correct.
And Obama has blocked the GOP's proposals as well.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 10:40 AM   #88 (permalink)
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Mitt Romney tells donors Palestinians 'have no interest' in peace in new video | World news | guardian.co.uk

This guy is some spanner...

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And Obama has blocked the GOP's proposals as well.
You generally block crap ideas.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 11:55 AM   #89 (permalink)
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You generally block crap ideas.
This is where I go back to some of my previous rants about how f---ed up politics is. An idea is immediately crap because it's your opponents idea. Yet if your opponent opposes your idea it's because they are bad/evil/ignorant/want to send us back to the dark ages. So you become the hero for blocking every single think your opponent tries to do and the other party becomes the villain for even daring to question any of your ideas.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 12:26 PM   #90 (permalink)
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This is where I go back to some of my previous rants about how f---ed up politics is. An idea is immediately crap because it's your opponents idea. Yet if your opponent opposes your idea it's because they are bad/evil/ignorant/want to send us back to the dark ages. So you become the hero for blocking every single think your opponent tries to do and the other party becomes the villain for even daring to question any of your ideas.
Yeah thats what Republicans do.

Its nice, even in Ireland Sinn Féin don't do it that much, and offer more realistic solutions to problems than Republicans. Still socialist nationalists mind, and unvotable, but yeah.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 12:29 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Yeah thats what Republicans do.

Its nice, even in Ireland Sinn Féin don't do it that much, and offer more realistic solutions to problems than Republicans. Still socialist nationalists mind, and unvotable, but yeah.
Again, just proving my point. The Republicans do that. The Democrats don't as they are pure as the driven snow.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 12:38 PM   #92 (permalink)
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Again, just proving my point. The Republicans do that. The Democrats don't as they are pure as the driven snow.
Oh, they both do it, of course. But the thing is, the Republicans are worse.
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Old September 18th, 2012, 12:46 PM   #93 (permalink)
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Old September 19th, 2012, 06:22 PM   #94 (permalink)
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It appear Kansas has become a vassal state of the Koch Empire.

The End of a Kansas Tradition: Moderation - NYTimes.com

A long tradition of centrist Republicanism in Kansas — exemplified by politicians like former Senator Bob Dole and former Gov. Bill Graves — was dealt a near-fatal wound last month when a group of state senators, deemed insufficiently conservative, were defeated in Republican primaries.

Kansas had been a reliably conservative state for years, and Mitt Romney is all but guaranteed the state’s six electoral votes. But until recently, Kansans still preferred a government far from the ideological poles.
“A moderate coalition ran the state for 40 years,” Mr. Loomis said.

That era appears to be over. The primaries were the culmination of a gradual, two-decade drift to the political right in Kansas, but they also came after several years of faster-paced conservative ascension, as well-financed interest groups capitalized on a backlash against President Obama and his policies, local political analysts said.
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Old September 19th, 2012, 06:29 PM   #95 (permalink)
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And Obama has blocked the GOP's proposals as well.
Yep, two whole vetoes.
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Old September 19th, 2012, 09:35 PM   #96 (permalink)
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It appear Kansas has become a vassal state of the Koch Empire.

The End of a Kansas Tradition: Moderation - NYTimes.com

A long tradition of centrist Republicanism in Kansas — exemplified by politicians like former Senator Bob Dole and former Gov. Bill Graves — was dealt a near-fatal wound last month when a group of state senators, deemed insufficiently conservative, were defeated in Republican primaries.

Kansas had been a reliably conservative state for years, and Mitt Romney is all but guaranteed the state’s six electoral votes. But until recently, Kansans still preferred a government far from the ideological poles.
“A moderate coalition ran the state for 40 years,” Mr. Loomis said.

That era appears to be over. The primaries were the culmination of a gradual, two-decade drift to the political right in Kansas, but they also came after several years of faster-paced conservative ascension, as well-financed interest groups capitalized on a backlash against President Obama and his policies, local political analysts said.
Kansas isn't a moderate state. It never has been. I live here. The right wing nutjobs run this state not the moderates.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 12:33 AM   #97 (permalink)
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Kansas isn't a moderate state. It never has been. I live here. The right wing nutjobs run this state not the moderates.
I defer to your proximity.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 04:44 AM   #98 (permalink)
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Yeah. KS is a very safe state for Romney. Mr. Obama wins KS only if Mr. Romney says something like "I want to eat your children" at the debate. And if Mr. Obama wins KS, then he's probably had an election like Reagan '84.
Hum, some claim he said something like that before the debate.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 08:14 AM   #99 (permalink)
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I defer to your proximity.
Our state elections board is actually entertaining arguments from birthers who want Obama removed from the ballot. They've actually scheduled hearings to hear these people out. This is not the action of moderates. It's the action of right wing nutjobs.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 03:17 PM   #100 (permalink)
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its actually the actions of someone doing their jobs..... their responsibility is to at least hear the argument
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