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Old January 24th, 2013, 11:47 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Smoking Bill in Oregon

A new bill is being proposed by the idiots in Oregon that would make possession of cigarettes without a written doctor's prescription punishable by one year in prison and/or a $6300.00 fine.

Oregon wants to make cigarettes a schedule 3 drug.

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Old January 24th, 2013, 12:33 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Idiots is right.. Even as a non-smoker (former, that is) I feel smokers are getting a bad rap and have to put up with a bunch of crap that they otherwise shouldn't have to.
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Old January 24th, 2013, 01:50 PM   #3 (permalink)
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possession of cigarettes without a written doctor's prescription
Never seen a prescription for smoking...
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Old January 24th, 2013, 01:51 PM   #4 (permalink)
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A new bill is being proposed by the idiots in Oregon that would make possession of cigarettes without a written doctor's prescription punishable by one year in prison and/or a $6300.00 fine.
Well, the logical thinker in me sees a big problem here--doctors aren't supposed to do anything to harm a patient, so how could they prescribe something that kills? I mean something whose only effects are harmful, unlike drugs that do good but may have harmful side effects.

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Oregon wants to make cigarettes a schedule 3 drug.
I can understand that, sort of, but it still doesn't make the logic of it all work, as physicians are supposed to "first, do no harm."
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Old January 24th, 2013, 02:13 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Well, the logical thinker in me sees a big problem here--doctors aren't supposed to do anything to harm a patient, so how could they prescribe something that kills? I mean something whose only effects are harmful, unlike drugs that do good but may have harmful side effects.


I can understand that, sort of, but it still doesn't make the logic of it all work, as physicians are supposed to "first, do no harm."
Smokes are legal and there is likely a way a doctor can prescribe should the law pass. And I doubt it will. There will be likely a few in the Cig Prescription business just like the dopers have in those quasi-legal MJ states.

The whole thing is a mess.
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Old January 24th, 2013, 02:27 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Smokes are legal and there is likely a way a doctor can prescribe should the law pass.
But would they? I mean, any physician worth her/his salt should refuse outright to prescribe cigarettes! There isn't one single argument that can make cigarettes necessary or warranted for a patient. So how would this work?

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And I doubt it will. There will be likely a few in the Cig Prescription business just like the dopers have in those quasi-legal MJ states.
Oh...maybe that's how it'd work! Like those 'pain management' clinics where the doctor walks in, asks the 'patient' if they're in pain, the 'patient' says yes, and the doctor writes a prescription--which has to be filled on premises--for oxycodone or similar. And, of course, they don't accept health insurance...or checks...credit cards...just CASH.

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The whole thing is a mess.
No kidding.
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Old January 24th, 2013, 03:12 PM   #7 (permalink)
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This shows why we need to make following politics a full time job. We just do not know what laws they want to pass.
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Old January 24th, 2013, 03:25 PM   #8 (permalink)
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If this passes, which I doubt, I assume that because they will have "ended" smoking in their state that they will opt out of future payments from the tobacco lawsuit settlement fund.
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Old January 24th, 2013, 03:29 PM   #9 (permalink)
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If this passes, which I doubt, I assume that because they will have "ended" smoking in their state that they will opt out of future payments from the tobacco lawsuit settlement fund.
People do not believe just how much smoking benefits their state fiscally. Not just Oregon, either.
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Old January 24th, 2013, 09:22 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Bull x 1000
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Old January 25th, 2013, 02:41 AM   #11 (permalink)
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No way would that pass, and higher courts would overturn it if it did. Kind of ironic that Washington just legalized weed, and some dumbass in Oregon wants to ban cigs. But it sounds like this is just one guy looking for some publicity for himself.

New Oregon law might make cigarettes prescription only — RT
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Old January 25th, 2013, 02:47 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by big_z View Post
If this passes, which I doubt, I assume that because they will have "ended" smoking in their state that they will opt out of future payments from the tobacco lawsuit settlement fund.
I don't know about other states, but in Ohio the politicians sold off their rights to future tobacco money for a lump sum long ago. Now Kasich is trying to sell off the highways and turnpikes to private companies who will collect all of the tolls. Short sighted idiots.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 07:12 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Can’t drink Big Gulps in New York. Can’t smoke in Oregon. And they call this a free country.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 06:07 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Idiots is right.. Even as a non-smoker (former, that is) I feel smokers are getting a bad rap and have to put up with a bunch of crap that they otherwise shouldn't have to.
No, there is no such thing as a "bad rap" for people who insist on being reckless and rude in public.

1. First of all, smoking isn't an inalienable right. The privilege of being able to inhale noxious fumes doesn't negate personal responsibility when it comes to not poisoning others.

2. The technology to keep your smoke to yourself exists. Pot smokers have been very clever about coming up with devices for this purpose. Smokers have no excuse for not using these tools to keep their smoke to themselves.

3. When it comes to selfish indulgences, the burden is always on those who indulge themselves, not the people who they harm with their selfishness. Asking people to leave the environment no worse than when they found it is hardly an unreasonable expectation.

I've seen enough militant smokers hanging around doorways and other places where others must pass, blowing their smoke on others on purpose. There is no excuse for this! Hurling poisons at people is a criminal act under most states' laws already. I say that they should step up and enforce those laws and put militant smokers in prison, where they can smoke to their hearts' content.
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Old January 26th, 2013, 02:50 PM   #15 (permalink)
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The law is beyond ridiculous and that's coming from a non-smoker. It's beyond preposterous. The facts on smoking are out there and are well known. If people choose to harm themselves, that's their business. Nanny state much?
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Old January 27th, 2013, 10:27 PM   #16 (permalink)
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No, there is no such thing as a "bad rap" for people who insist on being reckless and rude in public.

1. First of all, smoking isn't an inalienable right. The privilege of being able to inhale noxious fumes doesn't negate personal responsibility when it comes to not poisoning others.

2. The technology to keep your smoke to yourself exists. Pot smokers have been very clever about coming up with devices for this purpose. Smokers have no excuse for not using these tools to keep their smoke to themselves.

3. When it comes to selfish indulgences, the burden is always on those who indulge themselves, not the people who they harm with their selfishness. Asking people to leave the environment no worse than when they found it is hardly an unreasonable expectation.

I've seen enough militant smokers hanging around doorways and other places where others must pass, blowing their smoke on others on purpose. There is no excuse for this! Hurling poisons at people is a criminal act under most states' laws already. I say that they should step up and enforce those laws and put militant smokers in prison, where they can smoke to their hearts' content.
Not all smokers are rude in public. Some deliberately smoke in the vicinity of squeamish people. Some people also deliberately use profanity in front of those offended by it. Rudeness isn't a smokers exclusive.

1) i imagine its pretty hard to poison someone in the open air, especially with a cigarette or cigar.

2) i imagine this is more inconvenient than carrying around a pack of cigarettes.

3)so because its their burden they should be inconvenienced beyond reason? They already pay ridiculous taxes. What next? Wear a badge at all times to show that you're a smoker?

Is cigarette smoke really that much worse than all those cars burning fuel? Is walking by someone who is smoking a cigarette gonna suddenly cause more damage than all the years of inhaling the toxic air in our cities? And is a rude blow of smoke really bad enough to be punished by a date with Bubba? Might as well send anyone who uses excessive profanity that way too. Its just as rude.
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Old January 27th, 2013, 11:13 PM   #17 (permalink)
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1.) Levels of toxic and/or malodorous substances that you're happy to belittle as being no big deal are unacceptable by many.

2. Not my problem, and it shouldn't be. I like to listen to loud music, and I make sacrifices so that I may indulge my pleasure without harming others. It's called being a responsible adult.

3.) Not my slippery slope.

The last time I checked, in the US it was mandatory for cars made since the late '60s, and catalytic converters since the late '70s. These standards are getting increasingly tough. If car owners can live with it, then so can tobacco smokers.

4.) There's smokeless tobacco, gum and patches for the addicts. You don't have to smoke to get your fix.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 01:01 AM   #18 (permalink)
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1.) Levels of toxic and/or malodorous substances that you're happy to belittle as being no big deal are unacceptable by many.

2. Not my problem, and it shouldn't be. I like to listen to loud music, and I make sacrifices so that I may indulge my pleasure without harming others. It's called being a responsible adult.

3.) Not my slippery slope.

The last time I checked, in the US it was mandatory for cars made since the late '60s, and catalytic converters since the late '70s. These standards are getting increasingly tough. If car owners can live with it, then so can tobacco smokers.

4.) There's smokeless tobacco, gum and patches for the addicts. You don't have to smoke to get your fix.
1)no big deal when there's a whole planet to accommodate smokers and non smokers.

2)again, with a place big enough for both sides, why the fuss? Walking by isn't gonna kill you. "but its offensive". But those courteous enough don't do it in areas where the offended have nowhere to go.

3)fair enough. Still, inconvenience beyond reason for something that can easily be avoided and most smokers don't go above and beyond to piss off people. Like i said, rudeness is available in variety. My new job has the most smokers ive seen in one place in my life. The non smokers deal with it. The smokers have their smoking areas that aren't little glass boxes like some would like them to be. Everyone gets by just fine there so why not other places? Just because one smoker behaves a certain way doesn't mean we should pass laws that prohibit that behavior and more. Not all smokers are inconsiderate or rude.



Standards or not, the smell of tobacco isn't any worse.

4) there's also beer and vodka, krispy kreme and mom's donuts, hockey and chess, android and apple. If i prefer one to the other then ill get what I prefer. At least until its outlawed.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 06:33 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Being offensive is a bogus argument. I can walk through the mall and see tshirts that are offensive to me. Heck, I can see 12 yr olds who dress like whores in the mall. That's offensive to me, but 100% legal.

I don't buy the second hand smoke argument. It's bogus at all. You might have an argument if you sat around in a smoke filled room all day long, but spending 10-15 seconds walking by someone who is smoking hurts no one.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 08:11 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Regardless, this bill won't go anywhere. Nothing to get bent out of shape about unless a politician craving publicity is actually surprising to anybody.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 09:52 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
No, there is no such thing as a "bad rap" for people who insist on being reckless and rude in public.

1. First of all, smoking isn't an inalienable right. The privilege of being able to inhale noxious fumes doesn't negate personal responsibility when it comes to not poisoning others.

2. The technology to keep your smoke to yourself exists. Pot smokers have been very clever about coming up with devices for this purpose. Smokers have no excuse for not using these tools to keep their smoke to themselves.

3. When it comes to selfish indulgences, the burden is always on those who indulge themselves, not the people who they harm with their selfishness. Asking people to leave the environment no worse than when they found it is hardly an unreasonable expectation.

I've seen enough militant smokers hanging around doorways and other places where others must pass, blowing their smoke on others on purpose. There is no excuse for this! Hurling poisons at people is a criminal act under most states' laws already. I say that they should step up and enforce those laws and put militant smokers in prison, where they can smoke to their hearts' content.
And I've seen a large number of militant non-smokers go out of their way to harass smokers who are nowhere near them. And I work for a company that mandates that you cannot smoke in your own car in the parking garage. Sure, you have a right to breathe clean air but that doesn't give you the right to harass someone who chooses to pollute themselves.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 10:49 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Regardless, this bill won't go anywhere. Nothing to get bent out of shape about unless a politician craving publicity is actually surprising to anybody.
You are likely correct. That said, bad laws are passed every day. No reason to automatically assume this one will fail. Again, it likely will.

This is why we must police the politicians and pay attention to the laws being considered.

Here in Utah, the state decided that they own the rainwater that falls in Utah. Therefore, the state wanted to charge us for the rain. It almost passed.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 01:34 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
No, there is no such thing as a "bad rap" for people who insist on being reckless and rude in public.

1. First of all, smoking isn't an inalienable right. The privilege of being able to inhale noxious fumes doesn't negate personal responsibility when it comes to not poisoning others.

2. The technology to keep your smoke to yourself exists. Pot smokers have been very clever about coming up with devices for this purpose. Smokers have no excuse for not using these tools to keep their smoke to themselves.

3. When it comes to selfish indulgences, the burden is always on those who indulge themselves, not the people who they harm with their selfishness. Asking people to leave the environment no worse than when they found it is hardly an unreasonable expectation.

I've seen enough militant smokers hanging around doorways and other places where others must pass, blowing their smoke on others on purpose. There is no excuse for this! Hurling poisons at people is a criminal act under most states' laws already. I say that they should step up and enforce those laws and put militant smokers in prison, where they can smoke to their hearts' content.
Nope, can't smoke in prison now. Have to go outside on your break, just like downtown, LOL.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 08:12 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Nope, can't smoke in prison now. Have to go outside on your break, just like downtown, LOL.
I'm fine with that too.
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Old February 3rd, 2013, 02:50 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I was just talking with a friend about this the other day...

I remember being a kid back in the mid 80's and still seeing cigarette machines everywhere, and I remember every other person would be smoking a cigarette and drinking a mountain dew....

Boy how things have changed.

Now you see more people with granola bars and water bottles....

I remember people thought the people who ate granola and didn't drink pop were fruitcakes....

lol, crazy how much things have changed.
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Old February 4th, 2013, 03:26 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Yeah, I remember the ecology movement in the '70s. Remember this?



We used to laugh at them back then! Now...not so much.
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Old February 4th, 2013, 04:45 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I was just talking with a friend about this the other day...

I remember being a kid back in the mid 80's and still seeing cigarette machines everywhere, and I remember every other person would be smoking a cigarette and drinking a mountain dew....

Boy how things have changed.

Now you see more people with granola bars and water bottles....

I remember people thought the people who ate granola and didn't drink pop were fruitcakes....

lol, crazy how much things have changed.
Think back a little farther than that, and people smoked everywhere. When I was a kid, people smoked in grocery stores, banks, you name it. It wasn't that long ago people still smoked in office buildings. The weird thing is how fast we have gotten used to the changes. People smoking in a grocery store or waiting in line at the bank seems insane now.
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Old February 4th, 2013, 09:23 AM   #28 (permalink)
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I remember as a kid playing with the cigarette machines in K-Mart while my mom checked out. We would go through all the little vending machines and turn the handles and look in the dispensers to see if there was anything like kids do. The cigarette machine was literally right next to the kids vending machines so we would hit them all.

I also remember flying on planes and having to choose between smoking and non-smoking sections.
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Old February 4th, 2013, 10:20 AM   #29 (permalink)
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I remember as a kid playing with the cigarette machines in K-Mart while my mom checked out. We would go through all the little vending machines and turn the handles and look in the dispensers to see if there was anything like kids do. The cigarette machine was literally right next to the kids vending machines so we would hit them all.

I also remember flying on planes and having to choose between smoking and non-smoking sections.
I remember when cigarette machines were just about everywhere you looked. And not too long ago, you could smoke inside restaurants, bars, malls and the like. No more machines or smoking inside.
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Old February 4th, 2013, 11:16 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
Yeah, I remember the ecology movement in the '70s. Remember this?



We used to laugh at them back then! Now...not so much.
lol

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Originally Posted by Gmash View Post
Think back a little farther than that, and people smoked everywhere. When I was a kid, people smoked in grocery stores, banks, you name it. It wasn't that long ago people still smoked in office buildings. The weird thing is how fast we have gotten used to the changes. People smoking in a grocery store or waiting in line at the bank seems insane now.
I remember the shopping carts had ashtrays by the handle.

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I remember as a kid playing with the cigarette machines in K-Mart while my mom checked out. We would go through all the little vending machines and turn the handles and look in the dispensers to see if there was anything like kids do. The cigarette machine was literally right next to the kids vending machines so we would hit them all.

I also remember flying on planes and having to choose between smoking and non-smoking sections.
I remember playing with one of those machines outside our local IGA store when I was a kid, I remember one time the machine was messed up and I got my dad 2 packs of Marlboro reds.

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I remember when cigarette machines were just about everywhere you looked. And not too long ago, you could smoke inside restaurants, bars, malls and the like. No more machines or smoking inside.
I even remember 10 years ago going into bars/restaurants here in Indiana and people smoking inside...now you can get arrested.

Heck we even had smoking break rooms...that stopped 6 years ago or so. The ceiling tiles are still yellow, its funny because the non smoking room is next to the (old) smoking room. The non smoking room is bright white, and the old smoking room had a tinge of yellow.
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Old February 5th, 2013, 06:09 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Yep, there were ashtrays everywhere, those big sand filled ones. You could even smoke in the waiting room at the doctors office. Going outside to smoke? Nobody ever thunk of such a thing lol.
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Old March 4th, 2013, 01:54 AM   #32 (permalink)
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I'm from medford oregon - they passed a law a few years ago where you cant smoke within I think within 10ft or so of a business - havent heard about them trying to ban smokers lol. It is coming from the idiots north of us here in soutern oregon. Hopefully it doesn't pass. We arent all crazy in oregon...just some
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Old March 4th, 2013, 02:45 AM   #33 (permalink)
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I wouldn't be upset personally if they completely banned cigarettes and alcohol for that matter, as someone who does neither and doesn't like being around them. It makes more sense than marijuana being illegal.

However I wouldn't actually do that. Its a pretty big tax boost after all, hate to lose that revenue. What the sensible thing to do in my opinion is just get it over with and legalize pot already and tax it. Everybody knows it's less harmful than both of those, and less intoxicating than alcohol. What's the big deal? I'm not saying legalize hard drugs, but if this is such a free country why are we still criminalizing something less harmful than what we already allow?
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Old March 4th, 2013, 10:39 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by lightsleeper23 View Post
I wouldn't be upset personally if they completely banned cigarettes and alcohol for that matter, as someone who does neither and doesn't like being around them. It makes more sense than marijuana being illegal.

However I wouldn't actually do that. Its a pretty big tax boost after all, hate to lose that revenue. What the sensible thing to do in my opinion is just get it over with and legalize pot already and tax it. Everybody knows it's less harmful than both of those, and less intoxicating than alcohol. What's the big deal? I'm not saying legalize hard drugs, but if this is such a free country why are we still criminalizing something less harmful than what we already allow?
Then we ban something deemed unsafe that you want to use and you blow up. How dare they ban that, you might say. Perhaps we ban the sale of salt and all fast food because it makes large numbers of fat people with heart failure right round the next corner.

Perhaps we ban alcohol. Kills tens of thousands of people in one way or another. We all know an alcohol bans have worked in the past, right?

Explain why we should ban smoking but legalize pot; a product that must be smoked. Seems rather odd that we make legal something that not only hurts your lungs (Second hand pot smoke perhaps) but damages society to some extent. And it is smoked, so what about the idea that they ban smoking because it is dangerous, but legalize a product that will largely be smoked?

Would you get behind my plan to make sales of hard drugs legal? Clean heroin is something you can live with for many years. If the heroin is free from adulterants and at a consistent strength, you can actually live with the habit for a very long time.

I believe the UK government tried this in 1960 or so. Clean heroin, reasonably priced and delivered through sterile syringes. Some experts say you can quit heroin cold turkey but you can't just quit alcohol (assuming a serious long term drinking problem) without serious complications. So in a way, heroin might be safer than alcohol.

Or, we keep pot illegal and make the smoking laws reasonable? Give people the right to smoke in certain areas and let a business owner decide if he or she wants to allow smoking in his or her place of business. Let us have smoking rooms. Let US decide rather than a bunch of morons that simply want us to die off sad and unhappy.
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Old March 4th, 2013, 10:43 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Gmash View Post
Yep, there were ashtrays everywhere, those big sand filled ones. You could even smoke in the waiting room at the doctors office. Going outside to smoke? Nobody ever thunk of such a thing lol.
I remember the local mall let you smoke almost anywhere in the mall proper and you could smoke in most stores. Nobody thought much about it. Smoking was everywhere. Few people complained.

Now, you cannot smoke in most places including your office, on the train platforms, near the bus shelters, by most buildings, etc.

They want to simply ban it from every square inch of the country. The play the BS "Second Hand Smoke" card and the fools believe the BS.
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Old March 4th, 2013, 10:49 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Caleb L View Post
I'm from medford oregon - they passed a law a few years ago where you cant smoke within I think within 10ft or so of a business - havent heard about them trying to ban smokers lol. It is coming from the idiots north of us here in soutern oregon. Hopefully it doesn't pass. We arent all crazy in oregon...just some
I love Oregon. My grandparents were from Woodburn, Oregon. Lovely people and amazing scenery. Sadly, like most states, the idiots are in charge.

Here in SLC, the rule is generally 25 feet although I have seen signs saying to keep back 100 feet. I think the law says two different things: if the business owner provides an ashtray in a fixed location, that is where you can smoke. The other law says it is X number of feet, regardless. Not sure what the law actually is.
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Old March 4th, 2013, 01:07 PM   #37 (permalink)
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I said I PERSONALLY wouldn't care because I don't smoke or drink, but that I wouldn't actually ban them. Learn to read more carefully.
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Old March 4th, 2013, 01:08 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Prohibition never works. Ever. And this is tantamount to prohibition.

For example: The alcohol prohibition of the 1930's only lead to illegal speakeasies that lead to the growth of the Chicago alcohol gangs. Most notably, Al Capone. Prohibition simply made it so criminals could make more money.

Same thing goes for the current 'war on drugs'. We banned drugs. Yet every year, more and more drugs get smuggled into the US. Drug cartels get more and more powerful. It should be called "the war of attrition over drugs", because it is exactly that. It doesn't matter how much money we throw into stopping the drug trade. They will always come back with more until we're outspent and the program falls apart.

Let people kill themselves with drugs if they want to. As long as it isn't done while operating a car (if they currently are driving) or as long as it doesn't endanger a child or affects people in a public space, I have no qualms about it. Let people get cancer and other maladies if they so choose. Sure, let's educate them about it, but it's ultimately their choice.

I agree with the clean air acts and think they serve a good purpose, though. There really shouldn't be smoking in public, indoor places. Without special permits and it being marked as a smoking area. Like if bars want it, they should be able to because they cater to specific clientele.
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Old March 28th, 2013, 02:10 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Jerofld,

Agree with your last post - ultimately it is a personal choice on if someone wants to do drugs - albeit a stupid idiotic choice - banning will never stop people from doing it - just make them want to do it more.

Its all about the $$$ trail ultimately & for the government drugs pay......
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Old March 28th, 2013, 05:35 AM   #40 (permalink)
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I remember the excuse of a shared ciggy being the best way to get to know the cute secretaries when I were a lad. I have to wonder how young fellas manage these days ..

Have to say, I went to a dance venue in Spain a years or two back where it seemed everyone was smoking (most Spaniards apparently having been born with a Ducados in their mouth) and it was absolultely grim! By the end of the night, I felt like I'd smoked an entire pack myself. If I ever had any doubts about the wisdom of smoke-free venues, that killed them.

I also agree that getting an unexpected face full of smoke when out on the street is pretty unpleasant, though being nowhere near as pervasive, it's got to be a lot less detrimental to health than car exhaust: you can hold your breath for a few paces to avoid cigarette smoke - good luck trying to avoid car exhaust.

Having said all that, I think this proposed law is absurd. Quite apart from the ridiculous way it's framed - doctors prescribing cigarettes? C'mon! - prohibition just doesn't work.

The way smoking is currently handled is way more effective: controlling usage and gathering taxes has dramatically reduced smoking. Which is quite an achievement, given how addictive nicotine is (way more than heroin*, for instance, as any fule kno). The current system may not be perfect, but it does at least work: a ban simply wouldn't.


* apparently most of the problems with heroin come from the crap it's cut with. The worst affect of clean heroin is apparently really bad constipation .. which I guess explains the rather strained look of junkies ..
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Old March 30th, 2013, 10:34 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Making laws to protect people from themselves...is ludicrous.

Adopting a federal law that prohibits smoking in designated public areas and in marked private businesses would make a lot more sense. A similar law in Texas makes it illegal to carry a concealed hand gun into businesses marked with the 30.06 sign and designated areas...government buildings, educational institutions, public fairs, etc. THAT would make sense and would be enforceable.
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Ooops! It is going wrong
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Old July 21st, 2013, 10:56 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Don't know if these avoid the smoking ban. It appears to me these cause less harm than tobacco.

Electronic cigarette - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

An electronic cigarette, also known as an e-cigarette, personal vaporiser or PV, is an electronic inhaler that vaporises a liquid solution into an aerosol mist, simulating the act of tobacco smoking. Electronic cigarettes are no longer marketed as smoking cessation aids or tobacco replacement in most countries. There may be similarities between conventional and some electronic cigarettes in the physical design and the nicotine release, which may approximate the same amount of nicotine as a conventional cigarette. There are many electronic cigarettes that do not resemble conventional cigarettes at all.
The benefits and risks of electronic cigarette use are uncertain among health organizations and researchers. Limited controlled studies are available due to its recent invention. Laws vary widely concerning the use and sale of electronic cigarettes and accompanying liquid solutions, with pending legislation and ongoing debate.
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Old July 22nd, 2013, 07:50 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
Yeah, I remember the ecology movement in the '70s. Remember this?



We used to laugh at them back then! Now...not so much.
Says you.

Many of today's eco-freaks Deserve and Get much more raucous laughter. People believed Rachael Carson because no one had proof then to the contrary. (She is probably one of the world's worst Mass Murderers from all the 3rd world kids who have died from Malaria because of her anti-insecticide rants.)

Today's nutcases STILL plunge together off the cliff of BS Global warming IN SPITE of there being contrary irrefutable information.

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Old July 22nd, 2013, 10:27 AM   #45 (permalink)
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They are just going to far.. I am a non smoker, always have been, and always will be. I thought that the smoking ban in ALL public places was bad enough.

Looks like Obama might have to avoid going to Oregon.

And The electronic cigs do avoid the smoking ban, I have a few friends that carry one on them when they go to bars, no one has ever said anything to them about it.
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Old July 22nd, 2013, 11:04 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Really?? But its legal everywhere else, why do they want to make some restrictions on it.
How do you get a prescription to smoke anyway? I've never heard of that.
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Old July 23rd, 2013, 01:10 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Today's nutcases STILL plunge together off the cliff of BS Global warming IN SPITE of there being contrary irrefutable information.
Yeah, the level of climate change denial is shocking really, giving the scientific evidence and such. If you notice many don't deny the climate is changing anymore, because that's undeniable, but instead claim that CO2 (and other) emissions aren't causing it, which basically means they are denying the natural greenhouse effect caused by the physical properties of these chemicals.

Sad stuff anyway, but that's humans for you. Just hope our kids don't have to clean up too much of our mess eh?
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