We might have to scratch Lance armstrong off this list. Cheaters don't count.
Ah yes the great debate. Its like in baseball if a juiced pitcher is pitching to a juiced hitter who is cheating who? If a doped cyclist beats another doped cyclist who cheated whom?
Now it does not take much to draw the conclusion that Lance was enhanced or Bonds or frankly almost any athlete in that era. Only the undereducated are naive enough to think that PED's don't or didn't transcend most sports including things like golf and tennis. Where again only the undereducated fail to see how and why they would be used.
But still I return to the point of indifference on the subject. Since virtually everyone was doing it, to me the playing field was/is level. We must remember the purpose of professional sports/games/athletics is to win. That's all that matters. If you can gain a competitive edge thru any means you do. Whether its thru equipment, a better car, a better club, a better racket or thru personal enhancement you gotta do what you gotta do. Across sports guys/teams are always bending the rules till they break. If you don't push the envelope then [here's a play on words for ya] you are cheating yourself.
Only the undereducated are naive enough to think that PED's don't or didn't transcend most sports including things like golf and tennis. Where again only the undereducated fail to see how and why they would be used.
Tennis...eh....maybe. Golf? That's a stretch. You seriously think phil michelson, anthony kim, lee westwood are juicing up? Golf is a mental game more than a physical one. Even if one do juice up, it would only help with driving and that only a small part of the game.
Quote:
But still I return to the point of indifference on the subject. Since virtually everyone was doing it, to me the playing field was/is level.
That's a very big assumption. Even though I think cycling is a dirty sport, that doesn't mean there aren't any cyclists who are clean and can compete at a high level.
Quote:
We must remember the purpose of professional sports/games/athletics is to win. That's all that matters. If you can gain a competitive edge thru any means you do. Whether its thru equipment, a better car, a better club, a better racket or thru personal enhancement you gotta do what you gotta do. Across sports guys/teams are always bending the rules till they break. If you don't push the envelope then [here's a play on words for ya] you are cheating yourself.
I understand why athelete try to gain competitive advantage. It's just apart of sports...in fact it's apart of competition in general. I don't have a problem with that. What I do have problem with are those that try to gain competitive advantage by breaking rules. Even with equipments there are regulations. You can't use anything you want. The equipment has to fall within some boundary.
Last edited by dylo22; May 24th, 2011 at 02:06 AM.
Tennis...eh....maybe. Golf? That's a stretch. You seriously think phil michelson, anthony kim, lee westwood are juicing up? Golf is a mental game more than a physical one. Even if one do juice up, it would only help with driving and that only a small part of the game.
That's a very big assumption. Even though I think cycling is a dirty sport, that doesn't mean there aren't any cyclists who are clean and can compete at a high level.
I understand why athelete try to gain competitive advantage. It's just apart of sports...in fact it's apart of competition in general. I don't have a problem with that. What I do have problem with are those that try to gain competitive advantage by breaking rules. Even with equipments there are regulations. You can't use anything you want. The equipment has to fall within some boundary.
Terrific points. Im not so sure we actually disagree with each other just maybe looking at the same issue from slightly different angles.
As far as ped's in golf. I'd say Tiger 100% used both steroids and hgh. Now he did it very correctly and based on my knowledge of the subject he used the perfect combo and doses for golf. There is a steroid called masteron, a testosterone derivative. Its is widely used in mma because it enables one to get physically stronger without weight gain or significant muscle mass bulking. The classic side effect is male pattern baldness and if you've ever seen Tiger with the cap off, its looks a lot like masteron induced hairloss. Its true Tiger hasnt gained a ton of bodyweight since he turned pro but his strength to weight ratio is up moderately from 10-12 years ago. I mean shoot the guy is purported to bench press 350lbs. As you mentioned above how many golfers can do that. How many guys who weigh 185lbs can bench press 350lbs naturally? Further masteron has a known condition for boosting the male sex drive since after all it is merely a testosterone derivative. Few would argue against Tiger having an active sex drive in recent years.
As for hgh also seems like a no brainer. In the era up till around 2007-2008 Tiger was supremely dominate but around 08 they did start testing golfers. And look at him since. The injuries in the last 3 years mounting. His driving distance avg lower in 2009 and 2010 compared with 2007 and earlier? I mean look at pictures of his face and head circa 2000 vs present day. Like Barry Bonds and others you can see his forehead literally grew, classic HGH telltale. The drugs were in addition to giving him performance edge also a recovery edge. Now granted its said there is no accurate HGH test but my hunch is that Tiger gave up the HGH sometime around that same 08-09 era. Rest assured had he been on HGH it would have done wonders for his knees.
Granted all the above is speculative conjecture, however its very easy to connect the dots when you know a thing or two about a thing or two.
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On another note was there anybody more dominant than Mike Tyson before he lost to Buster Douglas.
That was one of the most dominant runs ever in any sport I believe.
I was looking at his career today. It was part 2, I missed part 1. Part 2 started with him just turning pro with his first pro fight. I wonder what part 1 was...
From fight 1 to about 27.....was an amazing run. One fight the guy was actually catching Mike with some clean shots. It was like Mike didnt even feel em and one punch...the guy was down. he got knocked down again, ref stopped the fight. Mike was acting like it was a sparring session..lol
Just looked it up. It was Reggie Gross.
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I was going to state the same quote. If anything, Marino or Peyton Manning would be my choice for the NFL.
If you were drafting out of those two it would be the same pick 100% of the time...Field General he makes nobodies into somebodies, Dan Marino did not.
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Originally Posted by saps
Since virtually everyone was doing it, to me the playing field was/is level. We must remember the purpose of professional sports/games/athletics is to win. That's all that matters.
The ends justify the means? I must disagree
And not EVERY one was/is doing it. For me Ken Griffey Jr > Barry Bonds ANY day of the week.
Ricky FTW. Guy completely demolished everyone during his prime, and even gave Stewart several seasons to try and beat him but never could. I remember Carmichael saying one time that it was his goal in every race to lap up to 5th place.
Pac-man is the athlete that is dominating his sport more than anyone else at this time. I'm talking about active players only, btw. Manny is just outclassing every boxer in, or around, his weight class (and I'm just a casual boxing fan, but an avid NFL and MMA fan).
That said, I don't think they're is one player in the NFL that is head and shoulders about the rest, but gun-to-my-head I'd say Peyton Manning (just edging out Brady and Ray Lewis.
Pac-man is the athlete that is dominating his sport more than anyone else at this time. I'm talking about active players only, btw. Manny is just outclassing every boxer in, or around, his weight class (and I'm just a casual boxing fan, but an avid NFL and MMA fan).
While ultimately I agree with you, I won't call him the most dominate boxer yet. Floyd Jr. needs to finally man up and take his beating from Pacman.
how about this?? most dominant player in the world and in the history of basketball is Lebron James... for the first 3 quarters. but for the whole game.. Kobe Bryant.
I don't care how much u guys may disagree, but for one game for the championship, KB24. All the hours he spent in the gym wasn't for nothing, and it shows.
I don't care how much u guys may disagree, but for one game for the championship, KB24. All the hours he spent in the gym wasn't for nothing, and it shows.
Ya cause none of the other players mentioned have worked for what they are/were.
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There are many!
Roger Federer In Tennis ( Till 2009)
Lance Armstrong (Cycling)
Floyd Maywhether (Boxing)
Valentino Rossi (MotoGP)
and
Now Lionel Messi (Football)
Efren Reyes, anyone who is a billiards fanatic will know who I'm talking about. 100+ championships under his belt dating back to 1985 and he's still racking them in!!
He still holds the record for most money made through billiard championships (2006), he made $646,000 off of his wins.
Something in filipino blood that makes them naturally good at pool :P
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Last edited by JRich8389; September 13th, 2011 at 10:37 AM.
Most dominate
