AntimonyER

With Sprint releasing the Galaxy Nexus, I thought it might be a good idea to rename the Verizon Subforum as the LTE Nexus subforum. A lot of good info in the Verizon subforum will be applicable to the Sprint model as well.

__________________


Site Rules & Guidelines
Got some help? Hit Thanks!
See something you like? Hit Like!
See something you hate? Hit Report!

Unforgiven

I think this would be helpful. Maybe change the other one to include the GSM tag. May help reduce misplace LTE posts in the Samsung Galaxy Nexus forum.

__________________

AntimonyER

Or perhaps add a GSM subforum too, and let the main forum be for general topics that apply to both?

Phases

I agree we need a fix for this. This is one of the victims of our current lack of a standard to handle these situations.

Let me see what we need to do and come back to this. Remind me in a couple days if you don't see something on this.

__________________
Every forum should have a Phases.

SUroot

If my input is of use, here is my suggestion.

As most devices are gsm for the most part, with a cdma counter part, I think all devices should have a single forum.

If / when a cdma version is released, either link into a cdma sub, leaving the general as general/gsm or just have 2, one for each architecture. I think carrier branding device forums should be avoided as much as possible.

Only major deviations in architecture should warrant a sub / alternate forum.

That's what id do. Id go for the first though, as general stuff will fit both but keep it in one place. Accessories, issues with gfx, etc

__________________
"I am only responsible for what I say. Not for what you understand"

My S3 >>> [ROM] [KERNEL] [THEME] [RECOVERY]

Things to read >>> [JB Upgrade issues? Reset!][RAM. Who Cares?!]

"Android Fragmentation" is not a valid argument

Rooted Galaxy S3? Own Tasker? Check out these cool profiles
[root] [Script] Move /sdcard app data to /extSdCard [4.2.x]

Phases

Talked to Rob. What are thoughts on going from this:

-Samsung Galaxy Nexus
--Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
--Verizon Galaxy Nexus
---Verizon Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root

to this:

-Samsung Galaxy Nexus
-- (GSM) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
-- (Verizon) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
-- (Sprint) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
-- (T-Mobile) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root

If there are arch/brand specific questions in the parent forum, people can just put that in the thread title if they feel the need.

Last edited by Phases; April 23rd, 2012 at 12:39 PM.

BabyBlues

I like this idea. It makes it much more streamlined.

__________________

Unforgiven

Yes!!!!

And how about Carrier prefixes in the main forum? I know me as a guide wouldn't mind the maintenance, it will be a heck of a lot easier than moving threads between device forums. A lot of threads that do get moved are ICS / Gnex generic but the OP mentions they are a VZW customer. We could just prefix it with general. If it is a thread along the lines of VZW LTE signal issues, its easy enough to put a VZW prefix (were it available). I know of at least five of us guides with GNex's so we have the manpower to keep it clean, and like I said, it is easier than moving threads.

Last edited by Unforgiven; April 23rd, 2012 at 12:45 PM. Reason: I still can't spell

trophynuts

Phases i like that layout.

__________________
I used to be Android all the way but bought an Iphone 5 in October. Feel free to ask me how it's going via PM.
GO BRONCOS AND ROLLLLLLL TIDE!!!

VoidedSaint

wouldnt that be GSM International? considering T-Mobile would be the only GSM counterpart here to get the nexus right?

Phases

Yeah GSM International would be better I guess.

The problem with the prefix idea... there is already a prefix set assigned to device forums and I can force the usage of one.

So they would have the choice:

Verizon
T-mobile
International
Sprint
Accessories
Tips
General

...etc

..I suppose I could make new prefix sets:

(Verizon) General
(International) General
(Sprint) General
...

Last edited by Phases; April 23rd, 2012 at 12:56 PM.

Stigy

I agree with the convention a few posts up Phases with a general SGN forum and then subforums for root based on device since ROMs will be different per phone/carrier.

Good stuff!

__________________
It's kind of fun to do the impossible. - Walt Disney

If someone's out in left field, the /!\ Report button is to the left of their post.
If someone gives you right-on advice or positively contributes, the Thanks button is to the right.

agentc13

This seems like a bit more work for you now, but I think it will make it a lot easier for everyone down the road.

__________________

Unforgiven

I see, I also hadn't considered that Accessories (docks specifically) don't work between the GSM and LTE models. Maybe as Guides we could simply edit the thread title's for those general threads that are carrier specific. For example (prefix - thread title):
Support - Poor Reception --> Support - (VZW) Poor Reception

Phases

Not worried about work now, so much as implications this could have on the future. Not sure I want to invite having tons of different prefix sets to have to reference and look at each time I make a new device forum.

But, if that's what's best for the site then of course that's what we'll do

SUroot

T-mob should be GSM.

Now this is a serious question because I don't know the answer, but how different is rooting a Verizon GNEX compared to a Sprint GNEX? How different is the architecture?

Unforgiven

Rooting is pretty much the same AFAIK, it's really when you get to roms, basebands, and kernels. But each ATR would have its own root guide sticky (I assume) addressing the nuances for each phone. I imagine a disclaimer that it is for the particular variant of the device as well.

Phases

Well, the problem is we need to cater to both the technical, who understand what GSM and LTE and all that is, and the average person who walks into a T-Mobile store and buys a phone and all they know about it is that it's a T-Mobile phone call the Galaxy Nexus.

GSM maybe should be "international", and leave carriers as is.

I realize there will be some amount of stuff that could go in either - but Rob didn't want to go the redirecting route.

Maybe:
-Samsung Galaxy Nexus
--Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root

and each will have prefix sets to differentiate.

Samsung Galaxy Nexus:
General
Tips
Accessories
(Verizon) General
(Verizon) Tips
(Verizon) Accessories
(T-Mobile) General
(T-Mobile) Tips
(T-Mobile) Accessories
.....
...

And in the ATR:
General
Verizon
Sprint
T-Mobile
.....

SUroot

I'm not GNEX man, so I don't have a lot of say but I wouldn't want to see that convention continued through out every new device forum.

With other devices with which I am more familiar, there is a CDMA version and a GSM version. Although, yes basebands can be different between CDMA versions (A thread for each iteration linked in the sticky), Generally processes and ROMS are interchangeable, therefore many of the issues and pitfalls will be.

I cant help but thinking this is duplicating/triplicating effort. Theres a danger people will only look in verizon all things root and spend time trying to resolve something thats already resolved in sprint. I would have thouht having as much centralised as possible would be the best thing

Couldn't it be called "International / GSM - All things root" and "CDMA (Verizon / Sprint) - All things root"? Or a description that explains which are CDMA examples?

Edit:

Yes that would be much better...

Unforgiven

With this scenario you would be constantly adding prefixes to the list (especially if this format is used for the GS3). Plus, guides would need specific knowledge about the devices in order to properly prefix them (GSM docks are not compatible with LTE docks for the GNex but I wouldn't know that if I wasn't an owner).

I think sticking with General, Tips, Accessories, and Support would work. All guides would be able to properly prefix threads and the guides that are familiar with the device can keep up with manually adding the prefix to the actual thread title.

SUroot

So:

-Gnex
--Gnex GSM / International - ATR
--Gnex CDMA / (Sprint / verizon) - ATR

Standard prefixes?

agentc13

The more I think about it, I feel the standard prefixes should be kept. I don't think it's going to be that much harder to ask what carrier someone has if they have not been specific enough with their questions. It happens with a lot of other devices already. It will also keep every device from having it's own custom prefixes.

Unforgiven

Exactly, if we wen't down the road with different prefixes, every device would have a totally different set depending on hardware variances and carrier availability. It would be a nightmare.

AntimonyER

I think I like this the best. Plus I see some folks who reside in only the VZW or the General thread, and this would bring everyone together... A larger knowledge/experience base.

Phases

I'm torn on what to do here. A couple points in response to things I've read here though:

- Guides wouldn't have any more trouble knowing what to prefix something than they would knowing which forum to put a thread inside.

- I wouldn't need to make new prefixes for each phone, but rather just use existing prefix sets for whatever carriers are needed.

- Would it be best to group everyone together for a larger knowledge base, or would that be TOO much and a thread posted this morning would be on page 3 by tonight - thus maybe better to have the division.

I could go either way.

Unforgiven

It is a significant change, I go back and forth depending on the discussion here.
Great point. I guess a non-gnex user would easily be able to tell that a thread is a GNex accessory for example and move it to the forum and assign the generic "Accessory" prefix. A guide that has the specific knowledge could then edit the prefix if necessary in the case that it is variant specific. In the case of LTE cradles, they could assign an "LTE Accessory" prefix.

I don't know how this works on your side, so if it's no big deal, it works. I just think that each device could have multiple combinations. LTE vs GSM, VZW LTE vs. Sprint LTE. When those are combined with the existing prefixes you will already have twelve additional prefixes (assuming general would be just that).

• General
• Accessory
• LTE Accessory
• GSM Accessory
• VZW Accessory
• Sprint Accessory
• Tips
• LTE Tips
• GSM Tips
• VZW Tips
• Sprint Tips
• Support
• LTE Support
• GSM Support
• VZW Support
• Sprint Support

Maybe I'm overthinking this. Just seems like a lot of prefixes, but it may work to your last concern.

I could definitely see happening with a device like the SGSIII. Even the GNex forums were this way when it was first released, but it has slowed significantly. I also noticed this happening in the SGSII International forum since ICS was released for it.

If we went with the longer prefix list, this concern could be mitigated by users being able to filter based on their needs. For example, someone could filter on "Sprint Tips" to condense threads to those of interest to them.

I'm not ready to throw my hat behind any solution yet, I'm really just thinking out loud.

This last thought is a little bit radical but sometimes you throw something against the wall and it sticks, so here goes.

What about double prefixes? The current 4 and a second one for carriers?
Prefix 1

• General
• Support
• Tips
• Accessory

Prefix 2

• blank
• VZW
• Sprint
• GSM
• LTE
• etc...

I don't know how hard this would be to implement on your side, but it is just a thought I had. It could mitigate the proliferation of new prefixes I addressed earlier while offering flexibility as new devices are launched. If it is a non starter, feel free to edit it out of my post.

Phases

Can't do double prefixes right now

Phases

Tired of thinking about it. (At least for now) Going to try:

Samsung Galaxy Nexus
- (International) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
- (Verizon) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
- (Sprint) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
- (T-Mobile) Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root

Main forum will keep normal prefixes, if something is specific worthy user can simply note it in the title if they wish.

The current "main" Verizon Galaxy Nexus subforum need to have all threads moved out and into the main Samsung Galaxy Nexus forum. When that is done, I will remove that forum. For now, I will rename it something like "Pending deletion" and remove rights to post new threads in it.

I have a couple to make, a couple to rename and move, and some 301 redirects to put in place.

Last edited by Phases; April 24th, 2012 at 09:31 AM.

Unforgiven

On it. I will place a sticky linking to this thread in the top of the forum during the transition to prevent panic among the members.

edit: I get an error when I try to enter the VZW GNex forum. I did the report to admin message in case it gave more info that way.

Last edited by Unforgiven; April 24th, 2012 at 09:39 AM.

Phases

Done! Perhaps a sticky in the root to explain would be nice..

Unforgiven

I think everything is moved. Just my expiring redirects.

SUroot

Sorry but I don't like it. I am able to help people with root issues through experience gained, across all architectures for my device. This is because I have been exposed to threads for all types. This has been extremely beneficial to my peers and I.

With this system, that exposure is removed. I would have to view 4 subforums to get that. This is removing one persons effectiveness by 75% imho. Detrimental to the rooting community.

If this is to be a standard going forward, I would have to object in the strongest terms because using a root forum like that would remove any aspirations I had on being as helpful as I can.

Last edited by SUroot; April 25th, 2012 at 01:20 AM.

Phases

I hear ya, but is it not safer this way, less chance of users getting confused. Is it terribly troublesome to click into the other couple forums?

SUroot

I'm just saying... terribly troublesome would be a stretch. But inconvenient, yeah.

One gsm international with carrier prefixes and one cdma with carrier prefixes if necessary would be my preference, but whatever you think works.

I think people need to be schooled in what pre requisite information and knowledge is required. If they are still confused, perhaps rooting isn't for them. I think every device forum should have a rooting faq that is device specific like we have in the desire forum but this takes time to produce

Phases

Well, that's true. A user should be going into rooting with some amount of knowledge of their architecture at least, and if not - there could be a sticky in each explaining.

So you're saying something like:

Samsung Galaxy Nexus
-CDMA/LTE - All Things Root
-GSM - All Things Root

With optional carrier prefixes? Does that cover everyone?

Unforgiven

I'd be OK with that. I wasn't thinking of prefixes in the ATR section. And I trust a ROM Dev like SU would certainly know better than I if we could condense ATR subforums.

SUroot

Yeah that's a good compromise I think. I'm sorry I'm not trying to be deliberately obstructive and I'm definitely not saying I'm right or I know best... just putting out there what I feel would work best.

If the architecture is identical or even near identical, I think too many sub forums dilutes the experience and the message we give to new members. As much as can be consolidated, should be.

I.can definitely see the merit in cdma/LTE being separate to gym/international and was surprised the HTC desire forum didn't have this, but carrier segregation would be a bridge too far I think. But if differentiation must be made then further prefixes could do that job without spoiling the view for a glancing eye

Phases

Also trying to keep SEO in mind. When average Joe needs help, he googles "Sprint Galaxy Nexus", for example.

It helps to have Sprint in the title..

Dubbin1

The forum is a mess now with everything mixed into one. Please bring back the Verizon sub forum. Now there are all kinds of 4.0.4 threads that have nothing to do with the Verizon phone. This is going to cause nothing but confusion. The phones are different enough that they should be separate.

__________________
Feel free to hit the Thanks button if I helped you in any way.

Always have your stuff when you need it with @Dropbox. Sign up for free! http://db.tt/5aq8SJ6b

jkc120

Agreed entirely. What's wrong with a structure like this?

- Galaxy Nexus (for general topics)
* Verizon Galaxy Nexus
- Verizon Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
* Sprint Galaxy Nexus
- Sprint Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root
* GSM/Global Galaxy Nexus
- GSM/Global Galaxy Nexus - All Things Root

I definitely preferred it the other way. Already I've seen at least 2-3 posts from VZW owners asking about 4.0.4 thinking it was out due to seeing a bunch of threads discussing 4.0.4 (but which are GSM or Sprint customers in those threads).

IMHO, the new structure is not as efficient as the previous one.

__________________
"I drank what?" -Socrates

SUroot

Those VZW customers may not have even known 4.0.4 existed without seeing info for your phone. Them knowing is a good thing. It also helps to compare the carriers where releases are concerned. This is a community.

esmith818

I, for one, think we should be moving away from carriers and instead focusing on hardware. With that said, I suggest having two main forums for the Nexus handset divided by hardware technologies, so:

Galaxy Nexus
---Galaxy Nexus (CDMA)
------Galaxy Nexus (CDMA) - All Things Root
---Galaxy Nexus (GSM)
------Galaxy Nexus (GSM) - All Things Root

The top level forum would be read only where forum guides/mods have write access to provide stickies that point less knowledgeable users to the correct subforum (i.e. Links for the individual carriers that send visitor to GSM or CDMA). The top-level could also be for read-only information that is generic to all Nexus devices.

Regardless, I appreciate the time and effort of the "big wigs" to keeping the forums user friendly, and I will adapt to whatever the final layout should happen to be.

Dubbin1

That wouldn't be a bad idea for everyone that knew the difference from CDMA to GSM but a lot of people here don't.

Trooper

Totally agree. The forum is a complete mess as it stands. Bring back the Verizon sub forum. Right now its all just a cluttered mess.

scary alien

Just wanted to add this thread's discussion to the mix:

confused and now sad

Thanks!

__________________
androidforums Site Rules/Guidelines

[App] AFV (Android File Verifier) - file checksum (MD5, SHA1, etc.), signed jar / .zip verifier, and Nandroid backup verification
[App] OTA Verifier (beta) - verify an over-the-air (OTA) update.zip or other flashable .zip file
[App] Android Root Toolkit - useful root functions / utilities

red66charger

Since carrier plans, technical support and business practices often effect the user experience I think it is a good idea to categorize GNex sub-forums by carrier. I also feel each carrier should have a root and non-root section.

I know one thing...and apologies to those involved...but I really don't like the current structure. It is a little aggravating sifting through the board in order to find Verizon specific discussion. The change really is a head-scratcher.

Thanks for considering a re-reorginization.

SUroot

I don't understand the need to regularly discuss Verizon in a device specific forum. Doesn't much of that fit in the Verizon android carrier forum?

I understand "wheres my update" but what else fits there?

I don't care if you have Verizon, sprint general sub forums but I will fight to the death to avoid the detriment that is carrier specific root forums. What sim card or what cdma configuration the devices have has NOTHING to do with how you root or what roms you need. All that affects that is physical architecture. Sure maybe only one carrier provides cdma and that could be Verizon, there fore the cdma root section could be labelled Verizon to help identify.

I've been skulking ,around root forums for 2 years and will be skulking around them for the foreseeable future. As whatever is decided here will affect all new devices, please understand why I am so passionate about dividing the root forums as little as possible. I.don't think we need to encourage cliques where there is no separation of devices.

Troubleshooting - slight variance in topics but both architectures have more common ground than not

Accessories - are the phones the same shape?

Tips and tricks - see troubleshooting

Root - yes, maybe one sub forum per architecture as drivers, rooting methods and roms will vary.

General - I really don't care. If this is the only place you can discuss how weak the signal on the gnex is with Verizon, so be it. But how do we know its not weak on sprint too?

I.just don't get what type of device specific, carrier specific issues you guys can't find easily

Dubbin1

No the phones are not the same shape, they take different batteries and cases.

agentc13

Just remember that what is going on with the Galaxy Nexus forums has repercussions throughout the entire site. If every carrier has a subforum there then people want it for their device area as well.
Most devices currently do not have carrier subdivisions unless there is a hardware difference as well.
It can take a while to make some of these decisions, and this isn't something that should be rushed. There is a lot for them to think about in regards to this. Also, whatever is decided is not going to make everyone happy. They try their best, but that just isn't possible.

red66charger

The user experience, i.e. how the device works as a piece of hardware, how it performs on a network and the specific support it receives from the OEM and the carrier, is not the same from carrier to carrier.

You all do want you want to do, but the issues I am having with my Galaxy Nexus are VERIZON related more so than Google or Samsung (although I think that's debatable as well). I'm not talking about rooted devices, I'm talking about stock out of the box.

How a non-VZW CDMA device functions on it's proprietary network, especially if it is running 4.04 and not 4.02, could be significantly different than how my GN works on VZW. And at the rate we're going, it could be a while before these devices are equal in functionality...if ever.

My Spidey-Senses are hinting that there could be a Hatfields and McCoys division on this topic as the experienced/modding Android community appears to be getting a bit annoyed with some of us lesser experienced users. But I'm an old Spidey, my senses could be off.

Last edited by red66charger; May 1st, 2012 at 01:36 PM.