About M / F

[EarlyMon]

I'm not a female if that is what you thought. Don't know where you thought I said I was a female?

I instantly thought of our guide, sharondippity, and her signature when I read your exchange -

In space, no one can hear ice cream.

And I think that is a good metaphor for exactly what just happened and what this is all about, yeah?

In forums, no one can hear your tone of face. (see what I did there?)

So maybe there's a lot more to this issue for many here that extends beyond pronouns.

We vary in details concerning our avatars, sigs, user names and posting styles - because all of those things add up to identity. Gender is but one more parameter. (And for some, a selection of the two isn't always sufficient and I think that's fair enough and deserves some thought.)

But this is a forum space and in space, no one can hear ice cream.

 

[Martimus]

Personally, and this is simply my opinion, I do not think it would be prudent to display gender information in member posts. After all this isn't a dating web site where gender roles play a part in the interaction between members. That said I do understand that in the Lounges and in some discussions they can find their way into the conversation. One example that comes to mind is that a growing number of people respond to others with things like "Thanks Man!". Apparently I must be ancient since I only say "Thanks!"...

If something like this were to be implemented I'm thinking that the site owner would probably want it to be completely optional. In other words, someone could indicate "Male", "Female", or nothing at all. And we probably would not want that field to be populated manually from a field in User Control Panel. Otherwise we could end up with people responding with "Often", or "Yes Please", or "Huh?", etc...

If someone needs to make this information known then they currently have options oto do so. If they are a Premium member they can add this information to their custom title. If they aren't a Premium member, or would prefer to not display this in the title field, they could add it to their signature (though it will only be displayed once per page). If I recall correctly, one of our Guides, Baby Blues, added an icon to her signature identifying herself as a "Girl Guide".

 

[cwhatever]

Personally, and this is simply my opinion, I do not think it would be prudent to display gender information in member posts. After all this isn't a dating web site where gender roles play a part in the interaction between members. That said I do understand that in the Lounges and in some discussions they can find their way into the conversation. One example that comes to mind is that a growing number of people respond to others with things like "Thanks Man!". Apparently I must be ancient since I only say "Thanks!"...

If something like this were to be implemented I'm thinking that the site owner would probably want it to be completely optional. In other words, someone could indicate "Male", "Female", or nothing at all. And we probably would not want that field to be populated manually from a field in User Control Panel. Otherwise we could end up with people responding with "Often", or "Yes Please", or "Huh?", etc...

If someone needs to make this information known then they currently have options oto do so. If they are a Premium member they can add this information to their custom title. If they aren't a Premium member, or would prefer to not display this in the title field, they could add it to their signature (though it will only be displayed once per page). If I recall correctly, one of our Guides, Baby Blues, added an icon to her signature identifying herself as a "Girl Guide".

Then why display google+. Twitter. Ect... and likes, now thanks, I see for being helpfull to people and them being experienced. Lets get rid of date of birth, location, interests, occupation, and all that stuff in user profile, WHICH IS OPTIONAL. Alot of people fill all that out too!!!!!!! So why not 1 more thing. I know it was your opinion, so I can express mine too.

 

[EarlyMon]

Then why display google+. Twitter. Ect... and likes, now thanks, I see for being helpfull to people and them being experienced. Lets get rid of date of birth, location, interests, occupation, and all that stuff in user profile, WHICH IS OPTIONAL. Alot of people fill all that out too!!!!!!! So why not 1 more thing. I know it was your opinion, so I can express mine too.

I think that all Martimus was saying is that at present, you can fill it in under biography, and anything more ought to be optional for the members, without making a big deal of it.

And that going further may take a high level ok or approval, that's all.

And yes, we respect all opinions and everyone's right to them.

Please understand that our opinions as staff members carries the same weight as yours because staff members are simply members first just like you.

As staff members, we see the negative behaviors and try to keep those out of everyone's view, so that makes us more conservative to these matters.

No big deal, ok.

 

[Unforgiven]

Then why display google+. Twitter. Ect... and likes, now thanks, I see for being helpfull to people and them being experienced. Lets get rid of date of birth, location, interests, occupation, and all that stuff in user profile, WHICH IS OPTIONAL. Alot of people fill all that out too!!!!!!! So why not 1 more thing. I know it was your opinion, so I can express mine too.

I think the difference here is that this would be a custom modification to the standard forum software where the other things you listed are standard. Adding something like this means that future upgrades to the software supporting the forum would need to be pretested for a custom modification like this before the update could be applied.

Over that past couple of months we have seen custom mod after custom mod disappear due to unacceptable degradation to the performance of the site. Many of these are missed by several members (especially me) but were removed necessarily (as deemed by the Admin and site devs) in order to make the site useable for the members.

We all want the best site possible and care about the membership having the best experience.

 

[EarlyMon]

I think the difference here is that this would be a custom modification to the standard forum software where the other things you listed are standard. Adding something like this means that future upgrades to the software supporting the forum would need to be pretested for a custom modification like this before the update could be applied.

Over that past couple of months we have seen custom mod after custom mod disappear due to unacceptable degradation to the performance of the site. Many of these are missed by several members (especially me) but were removed necessarily (as deemed by the Admin and site devs) in order to make the site useable for the members.

We all want the best site possible and care about the membership having the best experience.

Exactly.

And at this point in the conversation, we don't know, admin hasn't spoken for the site devs yet.

That will come later.

Right now, our focus is on the merit of evaluating the changes involved - that includes member views: what are the upsides, what are the downsides.

 

[cwhatever]

I think that all Martimus was saying is that at present, you can fill it in under biography, and anything more ought to be optional for the members, without making a big deal of it.

And that going further may take a high level ok or approval, that's all.

And yes, we respect all opinions and everyone's right to them.

Please understand that our opinions as mods carries the same weight as yours because mods are simply members first just like you.

As mods we see the negative behaviors and try to keep out of everyone's view, so that makes us more conservative to these matters.

No big deal, ok.

Yes is cool, but most don't think of this stuff unless it is put in front of you.

 

[cwhatever]

is it me or what? on tapatalk i'm up to 54 or so posts and here is only on 50???? maybe my pc or what?


wired after this post it updated, all is ok. sorry about that.

 

[Unforgiven]

is it me or what? on tapatalk i'm up to 54 or so posts and here is only on 50???? maybe my pc or what?


wired after this post it updated, all is ok. sorry about that.

You threw me off with the 54. Your post was 58 on the web and 58 in TT. Nope, were good, but you did make me check.:rofl:

 

[Gmash]

Hey just today a well known member with a very masculine user name was mistaken for a woman, so I put that with Petra's comments and I am seeing the benefits.

Definitely a post registration option though, yeah.

I don't know if this is doable or not, I'm not the guy that would know, it depends on our forum software and dev support priorities. I can say that we'll make sure that this gets admin attention, but please be patient on this, there's most likely a list of needs in front of this one.

This goes both ways as well. One member I think is still around goes by the user name Cammycool, and he used to have an avatar of his girlfriend's picture. So I'm thinking, name is Cammy, teenage girl avatar, must be a girl. Not so much. Another guy that I talked to in the Ascend forum all the time went by the name Lulu and had a pink Android as his avatar. He even talked about his girlfriend and skateboarding all the time, and it still never occurred to me that he was a guy, I honestly just thought he was a skateboarding lesbian lol. Turns out Lulu is the name of a male anime character I guess. Don't know why the pink Android, though.

 

[Martimus]

Then why display google+. Twitter. Ect... and likes, now thanks, I see for being helpfull to people and them being experienced. Lets get rid of date of birth, location, interests, occupation, and all that stuff in user profile, WHICH IS OPTIONAL. Alot of people fill all that out too!!!!!!! So why not 1 more thing. I know it was your opinion, so I can express mine too.

I'm guessing that your view of the Google+, Twitter, etc. fields in User CP are somewhat different than mine. My view is that they are standard parts of the vbulletin package and are there because they provide additional avenues for people to interact with each other. As for age, it's SOP with most implementations of vbulletin that I've seen. It helps site ownership in showing that they are making some sort of attempt to verify the age of a member (unreliable as it is!). This would be especially important in sites where the subject matter is more, um, adult in nature!

And as others have stated, implementing this would most likely require custom programming. And custom programming both costs the site owner money... and makes it impossible for the developers to upgrade the vbulletin software in the future without a lot more testing and modification... and that costs the site owner more money. Since it wouldn't be prudent of us to spend Rob's money... or maybe it would ... I suspect that the final decision on any sort of custom programming would be his to make.

As for sharing opinions, your opinion is always welcome and appreciated! And I would hope the same can be said for mine?

 

[cwhatever]

15 posters and only 13 votes, ok........

 

[Unforgiven]

15 posters and only 13 votes, ok........

Hey buddy, I haven't voted as I'm kind of indifferent to it being added and I don't have that option in the poll.

I see both the benefits for informational purposes where it adds value and the drawbacks from a technical perspective.

 

[cwhatever]

I just want to say that I really like this place and all the people here (yes all of them) and since you can't hear my voice to tell if I'm yelling or not, I'm not. Just trying to talk about this. so don't want anyone getting mad at me or think I'm mad at them.

 

[Unforgiven]

I just want to say that I really like this place and all the people here (yes all of them) and since you can't hear my voice to tell if I'm yelling or not, I'm not. Just trying to talk about this. so don't want anyone getting mad at me or think I'm mad at them.

Your plenty good by me. ARE YOU YELLING AT ME PRIVATE (IN my best drill sergeant voice). I like folks raising issues like this. I like folks like you doing what you do being friendly here. BTW, that's my opinion, not a site one. I'm here as Unforgiven, pup, chris, the member, not the guide badge.

 

[Rxpert83]

I assure you that even though I am posting views mostly contrary to what youre proposing, I would consider this a civil discussion between people just trying to talk through a new idea.

In the end, everyone just wants whats best for this place. We can agree on that

 

[treb1797]

I say just make it an option. Just like device(s) & members location. If not required than really what's the harm ?

 

[cwhatever]

they say updating, so just incorperate it into next update, don't need to go out of anyones way. also it would be an OPTION not manditory, and can even lie about it if the poster wants. would make it even better for the female that purposely comes up with a male type name maybe to hide they are female and can check male which will really fool people more. so in the end that might be a better idea to help out a female that doesn't want to be known as a female. maybe less of a chance of sexual harassment. so you can look at it that way too. This will help out females and it can be changed later if so desired because it is OPTIONAL.......

 

[Rxpert83]

The problem others are saying with updating forum software is that you have to pay someone to code the change. Then each time the forum software gets updated you typically have to incorporate all of the custom changes all over again.

I think a perfect example for this would be ROM devs. Each time an update is pushed out for your device they basically have to start all over adding in their modifications and removing bloat from the new base. The same would have to be done for the forums each time it gets its software updated

 

[cwhatever]

The problem others are saying with updating forum software is that you have to pay someone to code the change. Then each time the forum software gets updated you typically have to incorporate all of the custom changes all over again.

I think a perfect example for this would be ROM devs. Each time an update is pushed out for your device they basically have to start all over adding in their modifications and removing bloat from the new base. The same would have to be done for the forums each time it gets its software updated

right!!!! so just put this in the files and when the next update is, just add this in, or are you saying that is it??????? no more updates here???? such a shame!!!!!

just keep it on the back burner, when update time just fit it in , changing everthing anyways???? right or wrong ???????on how updating works???

 

[cwhatever]

The problem others are saying with updating forum software is that you have to pay someone to code the change. Then each time the forum software gets updated you typically have to incorporate all of the custom changes all over again.

with rom development they keep taking everyones problems and after it is worth fixing you create an update, right???????? so when its time for an update incorperate it in with all the new updates??? This isn't an overnight request change. that is what you are making this sound like that it should be done now. maybe incorperate in the next update, whether 1 month or 6 months from now. so how is it and update expense or problem, unless never going to update again!!!!!!!!

 

[EarlyMon]

right!!!! so just put this in the files and when the next update is, just add this in, or are you saying that is it??????? no more updates here???? such a shame!!!!!

just keep it on the back burner, when update time just fit it in , changing everthing anyways???? right or wrong ???????on how updating works???

Please see comments earlier.

It's too soon to make assumptions based on our site development cycle or web development.

We're not at that point.

Anything arguing as if we are is off-track and based on assumptions for facts not in evidence.

Cheers, thanks.

 

[cwhatever]

Please see comments earlier.

It's too soon to make assumptions based on our site development cycle or web development.

We're not at that point.

Anything arguing as if we are is off-track and based on assumptions for facts not in evidence.

Cheers, thanks.

I understand, but then why say this:

The problem others are saying with updating forum software is that you have to pay someone to code the change. Then each time the forum software gets updated you typically have to incorporate all of the custom changes all over again.

I think a perfect example for this would be ROM devs. Each time an update is pushed out for your device they basically have to start all over adding in their modifications and removing bloat from the new base. The same would have to be done for the forums each time it gets its software updated .

so that is why if this was accepted it could wait till next update and would not be done by itself. he thinks this,(if accepted) needs its own attention, (by his post), no it can wait till next update.

 

[Xyro]

I think we're getting off track a little.

The time/money costs involved in adding any new feature must be weighed against the benefits (if any) the feature would bring to the site. So the question is not can this be done, but is it worth it?

That should really be what we're discussing

 

[cwhatever]

I think we're getting off track a little.

The time/money costs involved in adding any new feature must be weighed against the benefits (if any) the feature would bring to the site. So the question is not can this be done, but is it worth it?

That should really be what we're discussing

I get that. But if and when a new update for the forums comes out, if you have to redo the whole thing (which you have to do or if in there redoing things anyhow) how hard is it to incorperate this too (if accepted) is what i'm saying??? some and you are talking about cost/money, if have to update you need to redo????? RIGHT?????

you all think i'm wanting this done now today, NO, when a new update is ready to come out.