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Apple's next iPhone

We've yet to see how "quick and reliable" the technology is as apples applied it.

See multiple hands-on video, including Anandtech. Quick and reliable are accurate.

Actually... It is you that seems to be misinformed. Won't cut off a finger? Puhlease people get their fingers and hands cut off for expensive jewelry all the time. Heck do that to about 5 people. That's a used car!

Also yes fingerprint scanning is easy as pie to hack! If you don't wipe off a fingerprint scanner it's a 50/50 chance they can just put their fingers on it and it will open!

There is about 15 well known ways amongst criminals to bypass fingerprint scanners. Like I said, most big government agencies won't even use fingerprint scanners. There's a reason.

And I think most of us could care less about iOS7. That was the lamest feature of the phone.

You miss my point. Basically, you cannot bypass fingerprint by cutting one's finger and using it. See above linked article in post before mine.

Want to bet that it won't be 50/50? This ain't your laptop fingerprint reader. BTW, Bank of America relies on fingerprint to verify and access your account (and your safe deposit box).

iOS7 is a copycat...fine. So, when Samsung et al. come out with 64-bit processors, will you guys say that it is the lamest feature of the phone? Note 3 was rumored to have fingerprint reader...does that make it the 2nd lamest feature of Android?

For me, as a consumer, it is OK to get a product that may not be 1st, but as long as it works better, then i don't give a crap who's first or last. And Android will take a long long time to convert to 64 bit...to even make Samsung 64 bit chip be worth a dime! Now, next year, be sure to call Samsung out for being a copycat and adding a useless feature like a 64bit processor with the whole Android still being 32-bit.
 
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We've yet to see how "quick and reliable" the technology is as Apple applied it.

Let's wait til it's actually in peoples hands and really tested before making any claims about how great it is.

We have no clue how easy it is to trick yet

How many of us use PATTERN unlock on our phones? I do. Which do you think is easier to crack? TouchID or Pattern?

Face Unlock? That's secure? Hell no. And so damn finicky even after "training" it that it is absolutely useless.

What if you look over the shoulder of someone entering their PIN? Isn't that a problem? Do you go to a dark corner and enter in the PIN while using the other hand to cover the screen? No.

Anything can be hacked, copied, or stolen. TouchID offers quick access to your phone at the same security level as PIN.

Lets be realistic and not be blinded by fanboyism.
 
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Geez, this thread is all about mis-information and fanboyism to the extreme! Yet, it is these same folks who call out Apple fanboys! Instead of blatant ignorance, we need to be more open-minded!

For me, Apple is like Toyota. They do copy and that is clear with iOS7...just like Toyota copying Germans' tech. Difference is that Toyota makes the tech smoother and more reliable. This is what Apple does...and ever so often, does indeed innovate.

I will address a few points:

1. TouchID is far more advance than the clunky unreliable Moto Atrix fingerprint reader. Remember, Apple is aiming for businesses. They won't release something that can be bypass easily. This ain't Face Unlock. No, you can't cut a finger!

2. Camera. Yes, it is still 8MP. But, Apple did many behind the scenes to improve it. And yeah, 8MP may in fact be better than 13MP because of what Apple did with the sensor and pixel size. Why?

Ask Anandtech: AnandTech | Some Thoughts about the iPhone 5S Camera Improvements

Or: A Photographer

Read it and educate please!

3. A7 processor. No, 64 bit is not useless on a smartphone...and yes, it does provide better performance...marginal to significance all depending on how complex (either mathematical and/or graphics) the program/app is. The more complex, the more A7 shines. According to CHAIR (maker of Infinity Blade series), A7 is almost 5 times faster than A6 when a game/app/program is coded for 64-bit with Apple compiler, such as Infinity Blade 3.

READ: Apple's iPhone 5s, the A7 Chip, and That 64-Bit Question - John Paczkowski - Mobile - AllThingsD

Here is another post that addresses this:
"The performance advantages of going to 64-bit very much depend on the entire software stack (kernel, drivers, compilers, apps) being optimized for 64-bit. The ability to address more than 4GB of memory is one clear advantage. But even if the smartphones today don't have 4GB of memory, there are some other performance advantages as well - provided that the entire software stack is optimized for 64-bit processing. The data paths, register files, caches, etc. are now 64-bit, so more data can be processed per clock than with 32-bit architecture - but the key here is that the compiler (part of the software development kit) must know how to take advantage of the wider data paths and 64-bit resources. If the compiler is optimized, then the kernel, drivers, and apps (which are compiled with that compiler) will see performance boost. I would expect that integer operations, and especially floating point operations (which often need 64-bit data representation), would be faster. Data-intensive games in particular will stand to gain the most if they are properly compiled and optimized.

If the compiler is not optimized, then there is really not much performance gain by just merely going from 32-bit to 64-bit.

When Apple said that the iOS kernel, drivers, etc. have been "re-engineered for 64-bit", I suspect that they did a lot of performance tuning that I mentioned above.

In addition, note that Apple also doubled the sizes of the register files in the A7. This means that more data can be kept in the register files, which can be accessed by the processor's computational units much quicker than the data in memory (or even in caches).

Note also that Apple mentioned "modern instruction set". I suspect that this means that the 64-bit instructions are optimized with the underlying 64-bit hardware. This is different from the Intel world where the performance of the existing x86-64 architecture is severely hindered by the old legacy stuff.

Having said that, I suspect that, in order to get the 2X performance gain over A6, Apple might also do something else in the A7, such as adding more computational units, tweaking pipelines, memory fetching units, cache / branch prediction, etc. Of course, this is just pure speculation as I have no inside knowledge of what Apple has done.

By the way, I think the rest of the industry is moving to 64-bit soon. I heard that Samsung will have 64-bit processors in their smartphone lineup next year (2014). If there is no performance gain for moving to 64-bit, then Samsung and others would not do it. Note also that the AllThingsD article points out that the road to 64-bit for Android will be harder and longer than for Apple.

With Google acquiring Motorola and Microsoft doing the same with Nokia, I think the rest of the industry recognizes that the tight integration of hardware and software has some good values after all...."
------------------------------------------------------------

BTW, this is what the A7 is based on: ARM Launches Cortex-A50 Series, the World?s Most
 
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And what I said about Apple having a track record of blowing initial releases of new operating systems and fixing them on updates stands firm.

Doesn't that apply to just about everyone? Didn't 4.2.2 broke a few things? No one is perfect...and yeah, updates is why they are called updates.

I am sure that iOS7 will have issues that will be addressed on subsequent updates. I was referring to the other "controversial" issues (TouchID, camera, and A7). I am not saying that iOS7 is pioneering anything...in fact, i wrote multiple times that it is a copy Android (and Windows).
 
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How many of us use PATTERN unlock on our phones? I do. Which do you think is easier to crack? TouchID or Pattern?

Face Unlock? That's secure? Hell no. And so damn finicky even after "training" it that it is absolutely useless.

What if you look over the shoulder of someone entering their PIN? Isn't that a problem? Do you go to a dark corner and enter in the PIN while using the other hand to cover the screen? No.

Anything can be hacked, copied, or stolen. TouchID offers quick access to your phone at the same security level as PIN.

Lets be realistic and not be blinded by fanboyism.

We're not being blinded by fanboyism lol. If anything it seems like you are.

http://www.gizmag.com/galaxy-s4-vs-iphone-5s/29030/

Incomplete but it seems to me 5S is losing much. Fingerprint scanner? Woooohhhhhooo! Maybe Wozniak will finally dump android for it (
 
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Oh and to the guy who said calling Samsung copy cats of 64 bit processor..

What's the 5C? Plastic?? Something they made fun of Samsung for for years!! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Apple died right along with Jobs.

I stand by everything I am saying.

Yeah, but unlike Samsung (which i have BTW), the plastic on 5C is seamless and creakfree. It is steel-reinforced to prevent flexing. That is the difference.

Keep your "factoids" coming...i would suggest that you stop because you don't know much.
 
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Doesn't that apply to just about everyone? Didn't 4.2.2 broke a few things? No one is perfect...and yeah, updates is why they are called updates.

I am sure that iOS7 will have issues that will be addressed on subsequent updates. I was referring to the other "controversial" issues (TouchID, camera, and A7). I am not saying that iOS7 is pioneering anything...in fact, i wrote multiple times that it is a copy Android (and Windows).

64-bit computing in the mobile space - if that's not pioneering, it'll do until pioneering happens.

And the Apple A7 processor doesn't exist in a vacuum - it exists as part of that space.

And 4.2.2 breaking things isn't on par with my complaint. I'm not saying that it must happen - but I am saying that new Apple stuff at this level has a track record of going beyond breaking things and screwing the pooch.

That's not a secret and it's better known as a fact within the Apple camp than outside of it.

After years of not changing and improving QA on that level, I'm simply saying to give it a chance. I'll be paying zero attention to performance comparisons, pro and con, with the A7/64-bit until after at least one revision update.

Apple has a far, far better, but again not perfect like anyone else, track record on cameras. What's with the new lens? Will they stick to the expensive multi-coating of the past or cut corners in production? Do you think that the media experiences are being vetted as well since Steve Jobs passed away?

I expect the blogosphere to love the camera. I'll continue to wait to see for myself.
 
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Yeah, but unlike Samsung (which i have BTW), the plastic on 5C is seamless and creakfree. It is steel-reinforced to prevent flexing. That is the difference.

Keep your "factoids" coming...i would suggest that you stop because you don't know much.

Have you used an iPhone 5s yet?

Or are you, like him, forming opinions based on the blogosphere?

Please don't tell people to stop posting unless you have a red name tag here. :D

All opinions are welcome.

Attack issues, not other people.

No one wants to test mod staff on that last point.

I wouldn't. ;) :) :D
 
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Have you used an iPhone 5s yet?

Well, difference is that my opinions are formed around well-reasoned facts and/or well-known sources.

If your criteria is true, then why have a thread about 5S at all? Should you restrict it till 9/20 and only for those with purchase receipt?

The point is that one should have knowledge based on verifiable source. Do you not agree?
 
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Read it again...48 hrs or rebooting. But, is this any different from what you do now with ANY smartphone? The difference is that TouchID allows for QUICK and RELIABLE unlock while still maintaining strong security, on par with PIN.

What do WE Android users have? Face Unlock crap? That is the biggest joke! I can't believe Google actually came out with that crap! That is a problem when software and hardware don't match a damn! Pattern unlocking? Oh yeah, just look at the smear on the display and voila! Instant access.

Be fair guys. Give credit where it is due. Unlike recent past, Apple did good this time around. They have managed to surge ahead of competition where it counts...customer interface and future proofing. What has Samsung added that is worthwhile this year? Eye scrolling crap that only works sometimes and requires perfect conditions to work. They can't even make a chip worth owning!

You should do a little reading.

Security is as strong as the weakest link. Saying what apple released is "strong security, on par with PIN" doesn't mean anything to a sophisticated thief.

And when apple says "Passcodes and the "slide to unlock" options will remain as backups if, for example, you're wearing gloves and can't access Touch ID." I know that it takes one tap for me to bypass biometric ID and get right to cracking the PIN. So no time wasted here.

And for you to say apple "surged ahead" is quite humorous when the Motorola Atrix had fingerprint unlock 2 years ago and something called an HP Ipaq had it 8 years ago. Of course now you will say apple made it "QUICK and RELIABLE" - but of course you've never seen it or used it.
 
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You should do a little reading.

Security is as strong as the weakest link. Saying what apple released is "strong security, on par with PIN" doesn't mean anything to a sophisticated thief.

And when apple says "Passcodes and the "slide to unlock" options will remain as backups if, for example, you're wearing gloves and can't access Touch ID." I know that it takes one tap for me to bypass biometric ID and get right to cracking the PIN. So no time wasted here.

And for you to say apple "surged ahead" is quite humorous when the Motorola Atrix had fingerprint unlock 2 years ago and something called an HP Ipaq had it 8 years ago. Of course now you will say apple made it "QUICK and RELIABLE" - but of course you've never seen it or used it.

Huh? Oh nevermind. Geez.
 
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Well, difference is that my opinions are formed around well-reasoned facts and/or well-known sources.

If your criteria is true, then why have a thread about 5S at all? Should you restrict it till 9/20 and only for those with purchase receipt?

The point is that one should have knowledge based on verifiable source. Do you not agree?

Nope.

This is a community resource.

Posts flow unrestricted so long as our rules for polite decorum are followed - and only because that just makes it more fun for everyone.

You're free to believe that you have the market cornered on the truth.

Just respect that others have the right to same freedom. No sources out there are going to allow you to ignore that right.

Knowledge and wisdom flows from many sources.

Many of your well-reasoned facts on the A7 for example - if I were you, I'd wait before continuing to claim how it's destroying everything out there.

But you do what you think best. :)

Up until the point that others rights here are involved. ;)
 
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Well, difference is that my opinions are formed around well-reasoned facts and/or well-known sources.

If your criteria is true, then why have a thread about 5S at all? Should you restrict it till 9/20 and only for those with purchase receipt?

The point is that one should have knowledge based on verifiable source. Do you not agree?

Lol okay then what is credible?

Since when has the name tigmd been the leader in what's credible and what's not?

I would think almost all of the links I provided are credible. Gsmarena has been a highly respected name for a very very long time.

Nokia has the camera on way more lock down than iphone 5S.

Next?
 
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Posts flow unrestricted so long as our rules for polite decorum are followed - and only because that just makes it more fun for everyone.

I am NOT asking you to stop ss1992 from posting...i am suggesting that ss1992 stop posting himself because he clearly has no idea what he's talking about. See below! :D

Gsmarena has been a highly respected name for a very very long time.

Did you post a gsmarena link?? Gizmag is not gsmarena. ;)

Look up Anandtech dude.

Want to bet?? GS4 vs. 5S in sales. Put money where your mouth is. Come on!
 
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then why have a thread about 5S at all? Should you restrict it till 9/20 and only for those with purchase receipt?

Nobody is against discussion, but when it degenerates into personal opinion being touted as fact, or tit-for-tat brand-bashing, it's time to cool the collective jets. That's not how we roll here. :)

The point is that one should have knowledge based on verifiable source. Do you not agree?
See posts #105 & #111. I think that answers the question nicely. ;)

Fair warning to all: the Dept Of Arguments is down the hall, manned 24/7 by our nice Vorlon secretary. Let's all keep this thread civil and constructive, please.
 
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I am NOT asking you to stop ss1992 from posting...i am suggesting that ss1992 stop posting himself because he clearly has no idea what he's talking about. See below! :D



Did you post a gsmarena link?? Gizmag is not gsmarena. ;)

Look up Anandtech dude.

Want to bet?? Put money where your mouth is. Come on!

Wait I will apologize for the fact that I called phonearena Gsmarena.

But hhmm........
I think this says phonearena.. Not gizmag...
At least have the decency to have enough respect to read everything someone is posting. Courtesy man.

Trust me you don't need to put yourself on some pedestal.
 

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I'm sure I was clear about dropping the fanboy talk.

I'm sure I was clear about not playing moderator and telling people to shut up.

I'm really sure that I just removed three posts after Slug's warning to drop the bickering.

I'm sure that we never wanted to have to issue warnings.

And I'm sure that this is being read.

Infractions for continuing to ignore the warnings will be based on that if the silliness doesn't stop.
 
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