battery lives to get better

[adi19956]

hey,
thought I'd share this.
IBM thinks this technology will be in all phones by 2015
Breathing batteries could store 10 times the energy - tech - 19 May 2009 - New Scientist

Updated article:
http://spectrum.ieee.org/green-tech/fuel-cells/batteries-that-breathe

"lithium-air battery could hold 5 to 10 times as much energy as a lithium-ion battery of the same weight"
"the energy density could be comparable to that of gasoline."
"No other battery has that kind of energy density, as far as we know"
"Au [not gold, he's a scientist, ironic, I know] points out that lithium-ion batteries were first described in 1976 but weren't for sale until 1997."

Now you don't have to read it

 

[Musky]

Interesting, thanks for sharing!

 

[Hrethgir]

That would be sweet to only have to charge once a week instead of once a day!

 

[Snow_Fox]

I dunno.. call me crazy but, I find it hard to understand what the big deal about battery life is in the firstplace.

As long as it gets you through the day.. I don't think it is that big of a deal, I am excluding people who don't sleep and get a chance to charge their phone at night.. they have a right to gripe I suppose.

But, does your average user *really* need a week long charge? I am wondering if that won't result in *More* people forgetting to charge the bat and running out of juice when they really need it.

Also has anyone given thought about increased use of phone's?

I mean laptops don't make it 24 hours yet.. (well most don't not saying there aren't exceptions).

Phones are only going to increase in power..

 

[adi19956]

I dunno.. call me crazy but, I find it hard to understand what the big deal about battery life is in the firstplace.

As long as it gets you through the day.. I don't think it is that big of a deal, I am excluding people who don't sleep and get a chance to charge their phone at night.. they have a right to gripe I suppose.

But, does your average user *really* need a week long charge? I am wondering if that won't result in *More* people forgetting to charge the bat and running out of juice when they really need it.

Also has anyone given thought about increased use of phone's?

I mean laptops don't make it 24 hours yet.. (well most don't not saying there aren't exceptions).

Phones are only going to increase in power..

I agree, we don't need it all the time, but it's for those times when we go to a friend's house for a night or two and forget the charger, we just won't need it.
Or the weekend away or the all nighter or (with restricted use) a week long holiday.

Plus it annoys me that I need to worry about my battery life all the time. I'd rather just leave my WiFi on and not have a care in the world.
any more increase in power with today's batteries and we won't be able to cope, phones won't even last a day.
will laptops ever get to 24 hours? mine does about 8, which is what it says it does, and when I bought it a year ago, it was almost the longest battery life out there (excluding those silly batteries that you buy separately that stick out hugely)

 

[Snow_Fox]

Well, I am not trying to protest just for the sake of protesting here..

I take phone's probably more seriously than I should. I sold them for a year, I've oogled smartphones for a long time now and I don't think a lot of people out there really think about their needs vs wants or the fact that when you get a phone it is usually a commitment.

When you go to get a phone particularly a smartphone. You are paying a premium price for a premium device.

This device is designed to bring the web to your hands. That alone is an incredible power. (Perhaps its the geek in me talking but, I view the web as quite literally a part of our lives that is very important in modern society).

When you choose to opt for a smartphone, your going for the "high end" your going for the Sports car, The Suv, or the Truck. I usually hate car analogies but, the fact is your paying a premium and that sucker is going to use a lot of gas. Sure if your responsible its going to use gas at a lower rate but, its never going to match the econo cars (dumbphone's).

Now.. the advantage of those vehicles are they usually have much bigger tanks to compensate. Unfortunately if we increase size of phone, that makes people mad.

So this means the customer has to recharge more.

When you decide to go with that smartphone, you decide to deal with its battery life. You want your small little phone (or in some cases you just don't want the evo to be any bigger than it already is!).

So, while I understand people's desire to want more battery life out of the phone... It also gets under my skin when I see too many complaints on battery life.

I understand the desire for longer battery life yes.. But, it also bugs me that in a lot of ways.. that is also a cry to not want to be responsible for the battery life..

 

[DaedalusxX]

For the average user, yes, I totally agree with the statement that "as long as it gets me through the day, then it's okay" (not intending to rhyme, but w/e ).

My Evo lasts me throughout the day normally, when I do not do anything special. So I don't complain normally but I do think that battery technology does need to increase. I say this because as we move into the future, we will use more and expect more of the devices we are using (phones, computers, etc.... Moving into the future and using these devices to their full capacity means that the "Average" user's use of the device will undoubtedly increase with time, meaning that the technology needs to improve and will improve eventually.

In short:
Again, I am normally happy with my battery life but the devices today promise/do so much that it is unfair (IMO) to have crappy battery life when the consumer wants to utilize these services.

The technology will improve, it's just a matter of time

 

[Snow_Fox]

In short:
Again, I am normally happy with my battery life but the devices today promise/do so much that it is unfair (IMO) to have crappy battery life when the consumer wants to utilize these services.

The technology will improve, it's just a matter of time

I think its perfectly fair.

You have a great experience for a shorter time.

I mean would you rather a week long charge on a phone that is only used to talk?

Or would you rather a "days" use on a device that can play games, send email, browse youtube, has 100,00 apps ect ect.

I mean If it is not "fair" to smartphone users they don't have longer battery life..

Then I think its also safe to say that its not "fair" to qmd users as they don't get more power out of their devices.

I mean.. they could do a lot more with feature phones and still not cross into "smartphone" territory..

Although the differences are already so vague, it would be like shooting yourself in the leg.

 

[Jammy]

There's a story every three months about how battery lives are going to improve dramatically.

I've stopped paying attention to them :/

 

[Pryomancer]

Extending battery life is always important. I don't understand how you can say that you're fine with it only lasting a day. There are myriad circumstances where you might not get a chance to recharge your phone, and what if you desperately need it, only to find it's totally depleted, has been for hours. What if it's an emergency and someone's life is at stake, because your phone ran out of battery.

 

[gallandof]

I can understand where your coming from snow-fox with batteries being fine now-a-days, but if they can manage to improve battery tech with out increasing physical dimensions at all I dont see why any one wouldnt want this. the only way that this would happen is if people complain about current battery life, and dimensions.

The one thing I would like to see change, since I work in cell phones, is price of battery to go down. as a human being I hate selling someone a battery out of my store since they are so overpriced. but its my job and it makes me money so I have to.

 

[DaedalusxX]

I think its perfectly fair.

You have a great experience for a shorter time.

I guess I'm not comprehending how you could say that making the most out of your phone for a shorter time is better than a longer time.

Or would you rather a "days" use on a device that can play games, send email, browse youtube, has 100,00 apps ect ect.

Truth be told, you cannot get a "days" worth on these phones if you are using apps all day, or part of the day for that matter. You will get maybe a few hours (or slightly more).

I'm sure no one (including myself) actually uses apps all day, but at the end of the day, my battery is most times less than 10%. For this reason, I charge my phone in the evening as well.

 

[adi19956]

going back to the car analogy... wouldn't we all love it if we only had to fill up 10 times less? and therefore had to pay less because of it?
I certainly know I would

 

[Snow_Fox]

Extending battery life is always important. I don't understand how you can say that you're fine with it only lasting a day. There are myriad circumstances where you might not get a chance to recharge your phone, and what if you desperately need it, only to find it's totally depleted, has been for hours. What if it's an emergency and someone's life is at stake, because your phone ran out of battery.

I'm not trying to be a total jerk here.. but, this goes back to responsibility.

The only reason why I am being this overly critical on the subject is because, even *IF* they extend battery life to last a week.

Manufacturers are only going to come up with more battery intense phone's and apps.

So then what "can last a week" is going to last "about a day" and we are going right back to square one.

I have already thought about the cons of a smartphone and should I get one, I am going to know when and where I'm going to have an opportunity to charge it at all times.

I hate to say this but, phone's are something we need to be responsible with. Part of responsibility is not playing games on your phone and running the battery down.

I only even have a phone for "safety" reasons.

If your not getting enough battery life, time to downgrade to a device that requires less responsibility.

I can understand where your coming from snow-fox with batteries being fine now-a-days, but if they can manage to improve battery tech with out increasing physical dimensions at all I dont see why any one wouldnt want this. the only way that this would happen is if people complain about current battery life, and dimensions.

I am not against battery life increasing. However, my problem is this. Most people here had a choice. They chose to have phone's with inferior battery life.

Is battery life going to get better as time goes on? yes and no.

As battery life gets better they are only going to create more juice heavy phone's.

People are still going to pick the juice heavy phone's and they are STILL going to complain about battery life.

Its part of why I get tired of hearing about battery life as a whole :/

The one thing I would like to see change, since I work in cell phones, is price of battery to go down. as a human being I hate selling someone a battery out of my store since they are so overpriced. but its my job and it makes me money so I have to.

I actually sold cell phone's myself. I do agree with you on cost of batteries.

I even agree with you on cost of accessories. I hate that my company forced us to push car charges, cases and everything else.

I always advised customers to get a car charger with smartphones.. the phone itself uses up way to much battery not to at least have one on hand.

I guess I'm not comprehending how you could say that making the most out of your phone for a shorter time is better than a longer time.

My lg neon last 2 weeks (not really but, lets just say it does).

Would you rather use my lg neon that last 2 weeks but, does NOTHING besides text and talk.

Or would you rather the upcoming Motorola Olympus with 2 cores even if it only gets one day of moderate usage?

Truth be told, you cannot get a "days" worth on these phones if you are using apps all day, or part of the day for that matter. You will get maybe a few hours (or slightly more).

I am really doing my best to keep my self in check here.

But, You are basically complaining that you can't play video games all day on your phone.

If you pick a smartphone, you are responsible for the apps you chose to use.

I'm sorry I fail to see how it is so "unfair" to you.

You can turn off robo defense and angry birds and get a decent "days" use out of your phone.

Someone with a quick messaging device never has the option of turning on angry birds or robo defense.

I don't know if you have ever heard this but, the general rule of thumb is.

you can have 2 of the 3
size
battery life
power

And I am actually annoyed because even *IF* these phones had a battery life that did last a week on stand-bye guess what?

2 hours of games and its gunna be gone just like my gameboy advanced

*IF* they had a more powerful battery, you would only play more intense games on a more powerful phone, and you would still be here making the same complaint you are making now.

There is nothing 'unfair' about your situation. Think of fuel.. the faster you go the more you burn. The better apps you get the more you use.. thats the way the world works.

I'm sure no one (including myself) actually uses apps all day, but at the end of the day, my battery is most times less than 10%. For this reason, I charge my phone in the evening as well.

My point was never that these apps can be run all day, it is that you have access to these apps and your not going to ever get more than a days charge out of them.

If battery life is really that big of a deal, you can go get a quick messaging device.

You are complaining because its "unfair" you are going 120 miles an hour in random spurts using a sports car and your running out of gas.. Well there is always the econo car option.

going back to the car analogy... wouldn't we all love it if we only had to fill up 10 times less? and therefore had to pay less because of it?
I certainly know I would

There is a flaw in your analogy.

Filling up less just means your filling up less. If your using a bigger tank, you are still going to pay more.

My step dads tundra holds a lot more gas and has a lot bigger of a tank but, it still fills up about as often as my yaris.

@EVERYONE.

Look guys... If any of you were completely unaware Smartphones used up that much power, you would have some valid complaints.

However, you all had a 30 day trail period in which you could get your money back.

I am not trying to bash or insult anyone here but, I am assuming your all adults who made a decision.

However, if you don't want to be responsible and manage battery life, don't get a smart phone.

There is a push for more and more power in smartphones. Not battery life.

If battery life does manage to get that much better, your only going to be tempted by the newest battery sucking apps to go right back to square one :/

 

[adi19956]

I'm not trying to be a total jerk here.. but, this goes back to responsibility.

The only reason why I am being this overly critical on the subject is because, even *IF* they extend battery life to last a week.

Manufacturers are only going to come up with more battery intense phone's and apps.

So then what "can last a week" is going to last "about a day" and we are going right back to square one.

I have already thought about the cons of a smartphone and should I get one, I am going to know when and where I'm going to have an opportunity to charge it at all times.

I hate to say this but, phone's are something we need to be responsible with. Part of responsibility is not playing games on your phone and running the battery down.

I only even have a phone for "safety" reasons.

If your not getting enough battery life, time to downgrade to a device that requires less responsibility.

I'll be honest, I only read the first bit of your long speech.
If manufacturers are going to make it so phone usage time is much less... wouldn't you like technology to evolve with it? for instance what would be the point in filming in higher and higher quality (now 1080p aren't we?) if our TVs were still crappy, huge 480p capable? (shit example, I know, don't tell me)

I'm responsible, but I like to have fun too, and as sad as it may sound, using the apps and games on my phone (especially for long bus journeys which I frequently and annoyingly have to take) is fun for me.

If you only have a phone for safety reasons, I have an extremely old Nokia (which does calls and texts, memos etc. even has a game or two on it, fits in your pocket, colour screen) which you're very welcome to have if you want?

 

[Snow_Fox]

I'll be honest, I only read the first bit of your long speech.
If manufacturers are going to make it so phone usage time is much less... wouldn't you like technology to evolve with it? for instance what would be the point in filming in higher and higher quality (now 1080p aren't we?) if our TVs were still crappy, huge 480p capable? (shit example, I know, don't tell me)

Your missing my point completely.

If you increase battery life manufacturers will only make more powerful phones.

This means your back to square one :/

My point is that as technology evolves.. its going to evolve all around and your still going to be where you are now with the same complaint.

I'm responsible, but I like to have fun too, and as sad as it may sound, using the apps and games on my phone (especially for long bus journeys which I frequently and annoyingly have to take) is fun for me.

You are choosing power over battery life. I am not saying it is wrong of you to do so but, it is a choice you are actively making.

If you only have a phone for safety reasons, I have an extremely old Nokia (which does calls and texts, memos etc. even has a game or two on it, fits in your pocket, colour screen) which you're very welcome to have if you want?

I already have a crappy feature phone I can use.

The safety aspect is addressed to another user who mentioned phone's being a safety issue.

 

[adi19956]

@Snow_Fox
I've now read it.
I didn't mean have a bigger tank... I was just thinking about a new technology in fuel (electric/ gas/ petrol, not sure how they compare to each other tbh)

I'm not legally considered an adult yet, no.
If there's a push for more power, then these things are going to become unusable without developments in battery life.
And I have no idea what you're trying to say...
As far as I know, once they're developed, the batteries aren't going to cost much more, we'll all be happier and the (British ) scientists researching this (if it's patented) will be held in high regard and could get rich.
The environment will suffer less because of less environmentally friendly power consumption (they're starting to struggle)
Our wallets will suffer less because of less electricity usage
Our forgetfulness will breathe a sigh of relief as forgetting to put your phone on charge daily won't matter
Leading phone manufacturers will rejoice as they use their '10x the battery life of most smart phones' as a selling point
The makers of the battery will rejoice as their sales go through the roof because people want to put them in their phones
EVERYBODY WINS

 

[adi19956]

@Snow_Fox again
well when battery lives are timesed by ten, I doubt power will instantly go up by that much so I don't have to think about it for a while
I choose power because I use power (part of being a smart phone user)
If I'm missing the point... maybe you could explain what's wrong with having longer battery lives... I don't understand why you're dismissing them?

 

[Snow_Fox]

See.... let me explain it like this.

You chose your phone because it is powerful.

If those batteries come out.. I assure you more powerful phone's won't be a week later.

Your only going to make the same choice in the future picking the more powerful phone over the phone with better battery life :/

 

[adi19956]

See.... let me explain it like this.

You chose your phone because it is powerful.

If those batteries come out.. I assure you more powerful phone's won't be a week later.

Your only going to make the same choice in the future picking the more powerful phone over the phone with better battery life :/

smart phones are powerful.
I thought that the processors and other shiz that use power are being implemented as soon as they're developed?
Well I made that choice because I'm a smart phone user, I like using power to do various things such as play games, edit Word documents etc.
If I wanted an amazing battery life, I would've picked those Nokia's, that are still coming out with black and white screens, they do come with snake after all, but no, I wanted something that I have wanted all my life, something that is powerful and does what I want, something I can change, something... Android

 

[Snow_Fox]

lol.

The point I am trying to make is

Power vs. Battery life.

will ALWAYS be an issue.

These are two concepts which have always been and always will be at odds with each other.

More powerful battery life only means more powerful phone's in the smartphone world.

What I am saying is in the future by the time these batteries actually get out..

Your not going to want the phone that gets the better battery life out ofit.

Which would you rather a bugatti veyron or a toyota yaris?

The bugatti veyron can literally burn all of its gas in like 15 minutes.. an entire tank.

But, it will go faster than that yaris can ever dream of going.

In the future your going to have the option of playing world of war craft for an hour or two on your phone..

or getting a phone you can only check facebook with that last a week.

I am willing to bet your going to go with the warcraft phone.

 

[adi19956]

lol.

The point I am trying to make is

Power vs. Battery life.

will ALWAYS be an issue.

These are two concepts which have always been and always will be at odds with each other.

More powerful battery life only means more powerful phone's in the smartphone world.

What I am saying is in the future by the time these batteries actually get out..

Your not going to want the phone that gets the better battery life out ofit.

Which would you rather a bugatti veyron or a toyota yaris?

The bugatti veyron can literally burn all of its gas in like 15 minutes.. an entire tank.

But, it will go faster than that yaris can ever dream of going.

In the future your going to have the option of playing world of war craft for an hour or two on your phone..

or getting a phone you can only check facebook with that last a week.

I am willing to bet your going to go with the warcraft phone.

nah, I don't like World of Warcraft.

And I went with the HTC Legend, not the Desire you may note, though that's because of the price, but still

 

[Snow_Fox]

My point remains valid.

I don't know what the kids are playing these days.. but, odds are you will want the phone that can play more and better games..

Which will use more battery life.

 

[adi19956]

so your point is that as phones use more power, the battery life gets shorter?
well that's why batteries need to evolve.
Oh and it's not only kids who like the odd game of something you know

 

[Outlaw71]

My point remains valid.

I don't know what the kids are playing these days.. but, odds are you will want the phone that can play more and better games..

Which will use more battery life.

You are perfectly welcome to your beliefs, but we don't have to agree with them. And I don't.

With every technology that advances, there are usually a number of subcatagories that have to evolve at the same pace or the one that's lagging behind will slow the other one down. If you look at motorcycle racing in the 80's and early 90's there was a huge divide between horsepower technology and tire grip. Tire manufacturers weren't moving along at the same pace as the Japanese motorcycle OEM's were bringing up the horsepower of the bikes. So the bikes were over powering the tires with ease

Lots of racers were crashing, so they had to learn to be 'responsible' with tire management, or crash the bike in the process. In the mid to late 90's tire technology made major leaps and bounds, and caught up with the rest of the components (horse power, chasis, suspension, etc...). Now this doesn't mean racers no longer have to pay any attention to tire management, it just helps move the entire sport forward.

Imagine if the bike manufacturers told tire companies back in the 80's "oh don't worry about developing tires any further, the racers should just watch what they're doing out there on them". Racing would have hit a brick wall long ago. They would have reached a certain limit they could take their bikes around the track, and no matter what else they came up with, they wouldn't have been able to get any more grip then they had 25 years ago.

If battery technology never moves forward, then smartphones will hit a brick wall as well. Maybe you're ok with that, but I'm not. I would love to see how far they can push these things. For the record, you are absolutely right btw, if they make batteries that last a week, then the phone OEMs most certainly will keep adding things to them until they only last a day. But where you and I differ on viewpoints here, is that I don't see that as a bad thing. I'm having a hard time understanding why you do?

Responsibility is important I agree, it just seems as though you have a misguided sense of it (IMO that is). I have a 16 year old boy who's getting ready to drive. I will teach him how to drive responsibly in the snow, by making sure his car has good tread and are well equiped to handle snowy roads. But I'd never discourage snow tire makers from continuing to look for even better technologies to help cars find even more traction on snowy/icy roads. Better traction is always a good thing if you ask me.

And I feel the same way about battery technology. I remember my 1st Blackberry lasting 4 & 5 days on a single charge easy. My DX does a hell of a lot more things than the BB did, so it doesn't last that long. So yeah I have to manage this thing way more than I ever did the BB. Now if they increase battery life so I no longer have to shut my GPS off, don't have to limit how ofter my email gets pushed to my device, no longer have to keep adjusting the screen brightness... I'm all for that.

Then they'll cram the next gen devices with even more coolness and you're right, we'll be right back where we are now having to watch what we leave on and what not. But there will be more cool things to have to be responsible with on them.

I just don't see how that's a bad thing? But hey like I said, you're welcome to think whatever you want bro.