Can we behave if the Official thread unlocks?

[Norril]

okay people, this is the deal, i am trying to determine a problem in the EVO thread and until i can determine if my theory is correct, it will have to stay closed.

Maybe i should explain my self to avoid 100 posts asking what the hell do i mean.

Okay, I encountered the very same issue that fell on the recently closed Incredible thread and that issue is that moderators cannot see the thread. Thereby we cannot moderate it.
In that Incredible thread problem, we could not see any page except the last one. Only Admins and Guides could, but the owner and us mods could not.

A week or so ago, the same thing happened to the EVo thread to me on page 133 or was it 136, can't remember now, but rest assured that it did happen. But this time it was the reverse. at that time the last page was 136, and i could not see it, a total blank page. Anything before and thereafter i could.

Some say that the database could be corrupt and yes that would be true if the EVO thread was 5000 pages long like the Incredible one, but the EVo is 1 third the size. I think its a bug. A bug that occurs every so often when a thread is repeatedly has it posts, merged, deleted moved etc. now don't take this as fact, its only my theory and opinion. But anyway, after Saturdays-Sundays fiasco, i had to go in and clean it up. i finally finished at 1:30 in the morning (3 hours past my bed time) and then I noticed i could not see page 169, the last page in the thread. So here we are.

Now I'm thinking that since that last page has 44 posts in it and its 50 posts per page, if i post another 7 posts, it will push it onto another page and thus we mods can see the thread again and moderate it. but if it doesn't work, then rest assured that there is no way in hell I am going to re-open that thread if it cannot be moderated by staff, since as we can purely see, letting you guys self moderate is not working out.

So there you have it, the reason why the EVO thread is not re-opened yet.
i will try again in a few minutes and see.

But if i can open it up again, be aware that we will not tolerate any crap in that thread. That thread is too important and to heavily watch by outside sources for it to be destroyed by a few vindictive egotistical troll jerks from another forums.

Which reminds me, ajac09 has been banned, and once I re-read the thread at a more leisurely pace instead of rushing like I did last night, i will issue infractions to those that contributed to its closing. After tomorrow Tuesday, there will be other staff members keeping tabs on this sections and will not hesitate to do whats necessary to keep it in line.

TS out

Thank you TS for the explaination. I personally would not mind if the main thread stayed closed and we just started a replacement going forward. Make Bill the OP and put all the facts/speculations in the first post, to summarize everything from the last thread. Put pointers at the start and end of the closed thread to redirect everyone to the new official thread? That should help fix any buggyness

 

[Trident]

Thank you TS for the explaination. I personally would not mind if the main thread stayed closed and we just started a replacement going forward. Make Bill the OP and put all the facts/speculations in the first post, to summarize everything from the last thread. Put pointers at the start and end of the closed thread to redirect everyone to the new official thread? That should help fix any buggyness

If he posts 7 more times, it will add another page to the thread.
By doing this, if TS is correct, he and the other mods will be able to properly view and moderate the thread again.
That would be a whole hell of a lot easier than making a new thread.

 

[UniqueNate]

Thank you TS for the explaination. I personally would not mind if the main thread stayed closed and we just started a replacement going forward. Make Bill the OP and put all the facts/speculations in the first post, to summarize everything from the last thread. Put pointers at the start and end of the closed thread to redirect everyone to the new official thread? That should help fix any buggyness

Yea thanks a lot TS and yea your right Norril.
Things will get back to normal.

 

[LatinP]

okay people, this is the deal, i am trying to determine a problem in the EVO thread and until i can determine if my theory is correct, it will have to stay closed.

Maybe i should explain my self to avoid 100 posts asking what the hell do i mean.

Okay, I encountered the very same issue that fell on the recently closed Incredible thread and that issue is that moderators cannot see the thread. Thereby we cannot moderate it.
In that Incredible thread problem, we could not see any page except the last one. Only Admins and Guides could, but the owner and us mods could not.

A week or so ago, the same thing happened to the EVo thread to me on page 133 or was it 136, can't remember now, but rest assured that it did happen. But this time it was the reverse. at that time the last page was 136, and i could not see it, a total blank page. Anything before and thereafter i could.

Some say that the database could be corrupt and yes that would be true if the EVO thread was 5000 pages long like the Incredible one, but the EVo is 1 third the size. I think its a bug. A bug that occurs every so often when a thread is repeatedly has it posts, merged, deleted moved etc. now don't take this as fact, its only my theory and opinion. But anyway, after Saturdays-Sundays fiasco, i had to go in and clean it up. i finally finished at 1:30 in the morning (3 hours past my bed time) and then I noticed i could not see page 169, the last page in the thread. So here we are.

Now I'm thinking that since that last page has 44 posts in it and its 50 posts per page, if i post another 7 posts, it will push it onto another page and thus we mods can see the thread again and moderate it. but if it doesn't work, then rest assured that there is no way in hell I am going to re-open that thread if it cannot be moderated by staff, since as we can purely see, letting you guys self moderate is not working out.

So there you have it, the reason why the EVO thread is not re-opened yet.
i will try again in a few minutes and see.

But if i can open it up again, be aware that we will not tolerate any crap in that thread. That thread is too important and to heavily watch by outside sources for it to be destroyed by a few vindictive egotistical troll jerks from another forums.

Which reminds me, ajac09 has been banned, and once I re-read the thread at a more leisurely pace instead of rushing like I did last night, i will issue infractions to those that contributed to its closing. After tomorrow Tuesday, there will be other staff members keeping tabs on this sections and will not hesitate to do whats necessary to keep it in line.

TS out

TS it sounds like maybe it could be a usergroup problem. If guides can see a page back but not admins or mods maybe you should go into vbulletin's admincp and check your usergroup permissions. As an alternative you could always create an alias account under the same usergroup as a guide and go in through that and have a look, but I'm pretty sure you might want to look at the usergroup permissions first.

 

[BeLikMike23]

okay people, this is the deal, i am trying to determine a problem in the EVO thread and until i can determine if my theory is correct, it will have to stay closed.

Maybe i should explain my self to avoid 100 posts asking what the hell do i mean.

Okay, I encountered the very same issue that fell on the recently closed Incredible thread and that issue is that moderators cannot see the thread. Thereby we cannot moderate it.
In that Incredible thread problem, we could not see any page except the last one. Only Admins and Guides could, but the owner and us mods could not.

A week or so ago, the same thing happened to the EVo thread to me on page 133 or was it 136, can't remember now, but rest assured that it did happen. But this time it was the reverse. at that time the last page was 136, and i could not see it, a total blank page. Anything before and thereafter i could.

Some say that the database could be corrupt and yes that would be true if the EVO thread was 5000 pages long like the Incredible one, but the EVo is 1 third the size. I think its a bug. A bug that occurs every so often when a thread is repeatedly has it posts, merged, deleted moved etc. now don't take this as fact, its only my theory and opinion. But anyway, after Saturdays-Sundays fiasco, i had to go in and clean it up. i finally finished at 1:30 in the morning (3 hours past my bed time) and then I noticed i could not see page 169, the last page in the thread. So here we are.

Now I'm thinking that since that last page has 44 posts in it and its 50 posts per page, if i post another 7 posts, it will push it onto another page and thus we mods can see the thread again and moderate it. but if it doesn't work, then rest assured that there is no way in hell I am going to re-open that thread if it cannot be moderated by staff, since as we can purely see, letting you guys self moderate is not working out.

So there you have it, the reason why the EVO thread is not re-opened yet.
i will try again in a few minutes and see.

But if i can open it up again, be aware that we will not tolerate any crap in that thread. That thread is too important and to heavily watch by outside sources for it to be destroyed by a few vindictive egotistical troll jerks from another forums.

Which reminds me, ajac09 has been banned, and once I re-read the thread at a more leisurely pace instead of rushing like I did last night, i will issue infractions to those that contributed to its closing. After tomorrow Tuesday, there will be other staff members keeping tabs on this sections and will not hesitate to do whats necessary to keep it in line.

TS out

You don't get nearly enough credit for the amount of work you put into keeping our favorite thread clean. Here's hoping that the reopening of the thread will also bring a new appreciation for (and fear of the wrath of) the mods (mainly TS) and Bill.

Many thanks to TS and Bill for their efforts.

 

[WRSmith2PhD]

TS, Bill, and Slug: Thank you for all of your work. I primarily lurk to learn about the phone but I also watch for other reasons -- my research area actually revolves around how online communities form, evolve, and function (in a simplistic nutshell). None of what has been written would EVER be used; it's just interesting to observe . . . but you have to admit, the dynamics of the group and individual members was pretty spectacular!

Now back to our regular programming -- EVO!

 

[RiverOfIce]

I would like to say a few things. People are going to get pissy and mad about this. So feel free to pm. It is ok, you are not going to hurt my feelings, I promise. But keep it civil in this thread.

1.) On the internet, anyone can be anything. I could be a dentist in Denver, a Truck driver from Tulsa, or a wireless engineer from Walcott (which is also a really good song). Because someone says something, does not mean they are.

2.) SP and Jackson, so far have not posted anything that can not be found by googling. I am sorry but this is true. The first time I saw jacksons post, back in the sprint forums. I thought, oh my god, he is actually re-posting old info. BUT that does not mean he does not have inside information, the first post may actually have came from him to. But from the point no-one questioned what he was saying. I knew what the meeting was about on April 12th and I knew he was flat out wrong. From there it is clear that he is going with what ever is popular on the internet.

3.) You should have the right to disagree with someone. You should have the right to post you disagree with someone. You should have the right to post they are a fraud, liar, and a idiot. But you only have the right to do it once, with proof. Jackson, sp, ajac, and other crossed this line yesterday. They went to personal attacks. They all did. This behavior has to stop. In my opinion, they all need a temp ban for their behavior.

4.) To the rest of you. I guarantee you. No body here knows the game play for the release of the EVO. There is no messiah and he does not visit this forum. If I posted what others have posted as true in this forum, I would be fired. I signed an Non Disclosure Agreement. I can not only be fired for tell you who I work for, I can also be sued. That is for only WHO, not what I actually do. If I was posting officially from the companies then it would be different, but I am not. In the real world, a leak like Jackson would have to be crushed. The only information comes from the top down. If jackson was right, why did he not post about may 12th, until after it was already on the internet? Once again, jackson could be anyone. From Hasse to a 9 year old.

5.) Since there is no official information about Evo, anything that is said needs to be taken as any information will create conflict, because that is what it is going to led to. Honest conflict resolution on anything involves many parts, they include. 1.) Listening 2.) Understanding 3.) Reacting 4.) Responding 5.) Listening 6.) Understanding... Everyone involved in the conflict last night cared more about being right in the public eyes, then listening, understand... Another reason for a few day of banlanida (did not get it right)?

6.) Before the thread can be reopen, we all need to decide where we can disagree with anyone. If no one is going to be able to disagree with anyone, why don't the people that must be right and unchallenged start their own thread. The thanks system egged people on last night, only allowing the positive with out the negative, will always create a false sense of self worth. Creating mob mind.

7.) Quit following people. Once again, everything that has been said, has been said before. Everything. So far, nothing new.

I am sorry if you want to believe I am wrong, but I am not.

Take a look for yourself.
Android:HTC SUPERSONIC...info

Then you use google. Type in anything you want to check up on, and search about 2 weeks before. Use the search options, date range.

Once again. I am not saying that Jackson, sp and others my not have real connections. But they do not have the right to abuse people with their popularity. Which is what happened in that thread. And it needs to stop.

 

[TheRiot]

You don't get nearly enough credit for the amount of work you put into keeping our favorite thread clean. Here's hoping that the reopening of the thread will also bring a new appreciation for (and fear of the wrath of) the mods (mainly TS) and Bill.

Many thanks to TS and Bill for their efforts.

+1

I lurked for quite awhile before I registered, and I've only posted twice, but this forum has been a fountain of information for me. I'm so pumped to get my first Android phone, and can't wait for it to be the EVO...and that excitement has come from this forum.

I agree wholeheartedly with BeLikMike23...you guys don't get nearly enough credit for the work that goes into this thread. Bill, thank you so much for putting together and continuing to update the info on the EVO. Many, many thanks to you and TS for all of your hard work. Thanks for letting me be a part of your community!

 

[Max Power]

Greetings all!

Although I anticipate learning much by following these forums to benefit my eventual purchase of the Evo (and abandonment of my jailbroken iPhone 3G), I registered today to comment specifically on this issue. Hopefully a "newbie's" perspective will be of some use at all.

As a new member, and probably as many new members, I find such superthreads and the master Evo thread discussed here, which have a robust history, intimidating to begin to wade into. Many will be disinclined to invest the time necessary to read through a thread of such magnitude, despite the potential wealth of information contained therein. With the commercial release of the Evo, and the flood of new activity to come, you might find that relying on a master thread encourages redundant questions, due to the reluctance of new members to enter the thread, and unfamiliarity with the search feature. An alternative strategy might be to sticky post FAQs and basic information, and from there rely on threads which ask specific questions on an as needed basis.

Cheers.

 

[drexappeal]

okay people, this is the deal, i am trying to determine a problem in the EVO thread and until i can determine if my theory is correct, it will have to stay closed.

Maybe i should explain my self to avoid 100 posts asking what the hell do i mean.

Okay, I encountered the very same issue that fell on the recently closed Incredible thread and that issue is that moderators cannot see the thread. Thereby we cannot moderate it.
In that Incredible thread problem, we could not see any page except the last one. Only Admins and Guides could, but the owner and us mods could not.

A week or so ago, the same thing happened to the EVo thread to me on page 133 or was it 136, can't remember now, but rest assured that it did happen. But this time it was the reverse. at that time the last page was 136, and i could not see it, a total blank page. Anything before and thereafter i could.

Some say that the database could be corrupt and yes that would be true if the EVO thread was 5000 pages long like the Incredible one, but the EVo is 1 third the size. I think its a bug. A bug that occurs every so often when a thread is repeatedly has it posts, merged, deleted moved etc. now don't take this as fact, its only my theory and opinion. But anyway, after Saturdays-Sundays fiasco, i had to go in and clean it up. i finally finished at 1:30 in the morning (3 hours past my bed time) and then I noticed i could not see page 169, the last page in the thread. So here we are.

Now I'm thinking that since that last page has 44 posts in it and its 50 posts per page, if i post another 7 posts, it will push it onto another page and thus we mods can see the thread again and moderate it. but if it doesn't work, then rest assured that there is no way in hell I am going to re-open that thread if it cannot be moderated by staff, since as we can purely see, letting you guys self moderate is not working out.

So there you have it, the reason why the EVO thread is not re-opened yet.
i will try again in a few minutes and see.

But if i can open it up again, be aware that we will not tolerate any crap in that thread. That thread is too important and to heavily watch by outside sources for it to be destroyed by a few vindictive egotistical troll jerks from another forums.

Which reminds me, ajac09 has been banned, and once I re-read the thread at a more leisurely pace instead of rushing like I did last night, i will issue infractions to those that contributed to its closing. After tomorrow Tuesday, there will be other staff members keeping tabs on this sections and will not hesitate to do whats necessary to keep it in line.

TS out

Now that is how to be a darn good moderator right there! Couldn't have approached it any better myself. From one mod to another, I applaud you!

 

[toothpick]

I would like to say a few things. People are going to get pissy and mad about this. So feel free to pm. It is ok, you are not going to hurt my feelings, I promise. But keep it civil in this thread.

1.) On the internet, anyone can be anything. I could be a dentist in Denver, a Truck driver from Tulsa, or a wireless engineer from Walcott (which is also a really good song). Because someone says something, does not mean they are.

2.) SP and Jackson, so far have not posted anything that can not be found by googling. I am sorry but this is true. The first time I saw jacksons post, back in the sprint forums. I thought, oh my god, he is actually re-posting old info. BUT that does not mean he does not have inside information, the first post may actually have came from him to. But from the point no-one questioned what he was saying. I knew what the meeting was about on April 12th and I knew he was flat out wrong. From there it is clear that he is going with what ever is popular on the internet.

3.) You should have the right to disagree with someone. You should have the right to post you disagree with someone. You should have the right to post they are a fraud, liar, and a idiot. But you only have the right to do it once, with proof. Jackson, sp, ajac, and other crossed this line yesterday. They went to personal attacks. They all did. This behavior has to stop. In my opinion, they all need a temp ban for their behavior.

4.) To the rest of you. I guarantee you. No body here knows the game play for the release of the EVO. There is no messiah and he does not visit this forum. If I posted what others have posted as true in this forum, I would be fired. I signed an Non Disclosure Agreement. I can not only be fired for tell you who I work for, I can also be sued. That is for only WHO, not what I actually do. If I was posting officially from the companies then it would be different, but I am not. In the real world, a leak like Jackson would have to be crushed. The only information comes from the top down. If jackson was right, why did he not post about may 12th, until after it was already on the internet? Once again, jackson could be anyone. From Hasse to a 9 year old.

5.) Since there is no official information about Evo, anything that is said needs to be taken as any information will create conflict, because that is what it is going to led to. Honest conflict resolution on anything involves many parts, they include. 1.) Listening 2.) Understanding 3.) Reacting 4.) Responding 5.) Listening 6.) Understanding... Everyone involved in the conflict last night cared more about being right in the public eyes, then listening, understand... Another reason for a few day of banlanida (did not get it right)?

6.) Before the thread can be reopen, we all need to decide where we can disagree with anyone. If no one is going to be able to disagree with anyone, why don't the people that must be right and unchallenged start their own thread. The thanks system egged people on last night, only allowing the positive with out the negative, will always create a false sense of self worth. Creating mob mind.

7.) Quit following people. Once again, everything that has been said, has been said before. Everything. So far, nothing new.

I am sorry if you want to believe I am wrong, but I am not.

Take a look for yourself.
Android:HTC SUPERSONIC...info

Then you use google. Type in anything you want to check up on, and search about 2 weeks before. Use the search options, date range.

Once again. I am not saying that Jackson, sp and others my not have real connections. But they do not have the right to abuse people with their popularity. Which is what happened in that thread. And it needs to stop.

The man is right I have read this forum for a long time and I guess it is time for me to post,I think you all need to just calm down and talk about app's or something I know I have never used an android before,So you might want to talk the time to help people out and not fight with them.
Also I would love to learn about some app's please!!!

Thanks for your time.

 

[Onemyk]

3.) You should have the right to disagree with someone. You should have the right to post you disagree with someone. You should have the right to post they are a fraud, liar, and a idiot. But you only have the right to do it once, with proof. Jackson, sp, ajac, and other crossed this line yesterday. They went to personal attacks. They all did. This behavior has to stop. In my opinion, they all need a temp ban for their behavior.

I have been quiet on this forum but have been on it since the end of March-- I have enjoyed many of the things on the forum and am upset of where it has gone.

Riverofice, i agree with everything you posted except your #3 -- You have the right to disagree with anyone on the forum but to go out and use names such as liar, fraud, etc. is plain childish. I don't know how old most of you guys are but I am a grown ass man and the squabbling that happened toward the end of the forum was simply childish at best. If people don't like what jackson has to say, then fine, say you disagree, state why and move on or have a simple DEBATE like grown-ups. Jackson, ajac and some others couldn't handle people disagreeing with them and in the end they ruined it for all of us.

BILLMED - DON'T YOU DARE APOLOGIZE FOR BRINGING UP MAY 22 - YOU DID NOTHING WRONG -- It was you opinion and that is that, if someone can't handle an opinion then they should leave!! You posted your belief and debated it like an adult don't apologize because some people are too immature to understand what a debate consists of.

I hope we can continue a productive thread in the future!!

 

[Bek]

3.) You should have the right to disagree with someone. You should have the right to post you disagree with someone. You should have the right to post they are a fraud, liar, and a idiot.

But you only have the right to do it once, with proof.

Jackson, sp, ajac, and other crossed this line yesterday. They went to personal attacks. They all did. This behavior has to stop. In my opinion, they all need a temp ban for their behavior.

Was there ever really proof of anything, from either camp?

The only way either side will be validated, is by WAITING until the official drop happens. Then and ONLY THEN will anyone's chatter be confirmed. But there seems to be be a lack of patience amongst some...

 

[andiron]

Yea thanks a lot TS and yea your right Norril.
Things will get back to normal.

Or back to abnormal! LOL Minus the hate!

 

[Android 17]

A typical internet argument:

Person #1: Opinion/speculation about a subject.

Person #2: Differing opinion/speculation about subject.

Person #1: Reaffirms opinions as fact.

Person #2: Bashes opinions of the first, and reaffirms his own opinions as fact.

Person #1 and #2 bicker while mostly everyone else takes sides.

Repeat.

 

[Android 17]

There's no problem with posting your own speculations, ideas, or beliefs about what you want, it's when you become so entrenched in it that you begin to see it as either fact or truth that it becomes a problem.

There was nothing wrong with Bill believing the date for the release would be the 22nd, however, when he started to firmly state over and over that it would be the date, and not that it might be the date, that's the problem.

Unless anyone here is named Dan Hesse or happens to be a top executive working for HTC or Sprint, any and everything you've said is opinionated and as such, not fact until verified by a trusted source.

 

[passivesf]

I just want to give props to all the apple employees that made this happen ... Job well done...can't deny it

 

[RiverOfIce]

Riverofice, i agree with everything you posted except your #3 -- You have the right to disagree with anyone on the forum but to go out and use names such as liar, fraud, etc. is plain childish.

I will say no. You have the right to call someone a fraud, liar, and idiot, if you have proof they are.

But neither side had any proof. When some was brought up, the phone number, that is when it got out of hand.

But you can not let a bully, push you are around. At some point you will need to stand up and, with proof, shoot him/her down.

 

[Onemyk]

I will say no. You have the right to call someone a fraud, liar, and idiot, if you have proof they are.

But neither side had any proof. When some was brought up, the phone number, that is when it got out of hand.

But you can not let a bully, push you are around. At some point you will need to stand up and, with proof, shoot him/her down.

I'd agree if anyone could ever have stone cold proof, but when you are in a forum with nothing but speculations, rumors, and hearsay - you can never have stone cold proof until the whatever the topic is - is officially announced by SPRINT until then I believe we all have to respect people's opinions or their so called facts. Jackson said he had an inside man and so on and so forth - but unless I see a notarized letter from Dan Hesse to Jackson giving him the inside scoop - it's just a rumor.

I guess what I'm saying is that RESPECT should be given to everyone on the forum even if you disagree with where they are coming from. If you think they are a fraud, there is no way you will ever be able to prove it - just ignore their posts or debate with them maturely. If the latter starts getting childish with their posts, then walk away, be the bigger man (or lady).

 

[BeLikMike23]

So right now there is a disagreement in the thread titled "Can we behave if the Official thread unlocks?". At this point I can't really say I'm surprised. We should all just look at what happened yesterday as a lesson of what not to do (if you need to confront somebody for whatever reason, just PM them!!) and not mention it anymore. Just keep it in the back of your mind and know that it shouldn't be done.

Now hopefully this disagreement about what is right or wrong as far as proving someone is a liar or whatever is over, because it really doesn't make much difference. All personal arguments should be done in private, hence the aforementioned use of Private Messaging.

 

[Trident]

FYI- http://androidforums.com/htc-evo-4g/54768-official-evo-rumors-speculation-thread.html

 

[Norril]

Thanks Trident!

Well, my idea of a "lets all agree we can behave" thread did not really seem to work, lol. Lots of good input and still some steam getting blown off. I for one promise to keep every post civil and take anything combative to a PM or Moderator as appropriate.

Thanks all for keeping me company and sharing your thoughts! See you back inside the biggie Evolicious thread

 

[Trident]

Thanks Trident!

Well, my idea of a "lets all agree we can behave" thread did not really seem to work, lol. Lots of good input and still some steam getting blown off. I for one promise to keep every post civil and take anything combative to a PM or Moderator as appropriate.

Thanks all for keeping me company and sharing your thoughts! See you back inside the biggie Evolicious thread

And on that note, I'm going to close this thread since the "Official thread" has reopened.

Behave yourselves...