Lawsuit vs Verizon and the N1

[Ayrow]

So, like many people, I am patiently waiting for the N1 to come to Verizon.
Now I am having second thoughts because of this lawsuit.

I am scared it will cripple and/or slow down the progression/development of Android on the N1.

What do you guys think? I know it will be months or even years before it gets to court, but do you thing that there is any reason to be concerned?

I'm curious as to what everyone thinks.

 

[srey]

Unless there is an injunction, HTC, Google, and Verizon won't be stopping anything. That is my opinion, and it does hinge on whether or not Google goes to bat with HTC, but I think it is valid.

 

[Foo (AZ)]

I don't think it will be an issue. No yet anyway and it wouldn't keep me from buying an N1 again. Besides, if they do issue an injunction it won't keep the mod community from continuing their development.

 

[SnotF]

are you talking about apple's suit against HTC's multitouch intergration? your thread title is really vague... i have no idea what you're talking about.

if it is that suit, i wouldn't worry about it. multitouch has been integrated into so many phones at this point that the idea isn't to get htc to yank the interface, merely to cost them resources, publicity, and time during this important time when apple is starting to be threatened by the onslaught of android phones and blackberry phones, and on the horizon is a new winmo as well. and when was the last time you saw a new iphone? and there's nothing on the immediate horizon either. apple could release their code, but half of the attraction to apple is the brand, not the code.

 

[ttaylor0024]

Yet another reason to say.... F*CK APPLE!

 

[QrafTee]

are you talking about apple's suit against HTC's multitouch intergration? your thread title is really vague... i have no idea what you're talking about.

if it is that suit, i wouldn't worry about it. multitouch has been integrated into so many phones at this point that the idea isn't to get htc to yank the interface, merely to cost them resources, publicity, and time during this important time when apple is starting to be threatened by the onslaught of android phones and blackberry phones, and on the horizon is a new winmo as well. and when was the last time you saw a new iphone? and there's nothing on the immediate horizon either. apple could release their code, but half of the attraction to apple is the brand, not the code.

One of the patents is "lowering voltage to conserve power" and "sliding a button on a touch screen to unlock a device."

I never knew there was a patent on lowering voltage, I always thought PC builders had that because we OC and UC CPUs and GPUs.

 

[Foo (AZ)]

Yeah, some of the patents sound ridiculous to me too. I was listening to a podcast the other day and they thought Apple was going after HTC because they're relatively small and without an intellectual property portfolio in which to countersue. Easier to pick on HTC and possibly create a precedent in the courts. That way it would be easier to take on the bigger guys and force licensing royalties.

I also had a thought recently about what if Apple wins and puts a stop to competition? They will most likely want to license the features, but what if to even a limited extent? Is it plausible to have manufacturers like HTC and Motorola build the hardware and we load the software from the open source community? Most of these patents are software based, so if we get the software from a source that does not profit from the release, does that not get us around the rights issue?

 

[QrafTee]

Google should come to HTC's rescue which will further their coalition.

 

[Fatal Exception]

One of the patents is "lowering voltage to conserve power" and "sliding a button on a touch screen to unlock a device."

I never knew there was a patent on lowering voltage, I always thought PC builders had that because we OC and UC CPUs and GPUs.

It wont hold up in court, it's too ambigious.

 

[tluv00]

If anything this lawsuit will create some patent reform.

Some people think that if the injunction is filed and upheld HTC could send an OTA to cripple the functions in question. Others speculate that it will delay updates, releases etc. Impossible to tell what will happen but most likely nothing will happen anytime soon. The us court system is slow as hell so don't expect to hear anything until Q3 or 4 if then (IMO).

 

[SnotF]

Google will most likely lend resources to htc's defence. I don't see this suit having any merit and I'm sure apple knows it. Its asimple ploy, as stated above.

 

[vonfeldt7]

Usually anyone that goes to court against Apple loses... big time.

Hopefully that won't be the case in this situation. I'm banking on the fact that (A) Some of the patents are extremely vague, and that (B) Google will hopefully help HTC out.

 

[MartinS]

Google have already said they will support HTC.

 

[trailmixx]

Do any of you remember the Lotus 123 vs Borland lawsuit in the early 90's? The Supreme Court sided with Lotus and allowed them to enforce the copyright on the "look and feel" of their interface. Due to that precedent, I expect Apple to win exclusive rights to multi-touch because it's such an integral part of the "look and feel" of Iphone.

 

[Outatime]

Google have already said they will support HTC.

...and that's huge. HTC doesn't have the capital to go against Apple... Google does.

 

[cyberbob25]

This is a good blog posted by a former CEO of Sun:

http://jonathanischwartz.wordpress.com/2010/03/09/good-artists-copy-great-artists-steal

 

[sergey]

It takes yrs. before these things get settled and even if htc were to settle out of court, I would imagine even that would take time. So as long as the n1 is released on verizon, I think we'll be ok. Even if the next android update disables multitouch, etc. There are plenty of roms that can fix that.

The conservate play would be to get a droid- a good phone, if all this makes you queasy about htc.

 

[gerryk]

Of course it's also important to realise that such ridiculous patents are only enforceable in the US. Thankfully, the rest of the world is sensible and doesn't allow such things as 'ideas' to be patented.

 

[Foo (AZ)]

Of course it's also important to realise that such ridiculous patents are only enforceable in the US. Thankfully, the rest of the world is sensible and doesn't allow such things as 'ideas' to be patented.

Well, that's what a patent is, a protection of an idea. But I'm sure you're talking about ideas painted with a broad brush. I don't see how anyone could get a patent that gives them exclusive right to 'interacting with a screen by touching it'. Too broad. Interacting with a screen using multiple points and manipulating with such touching is a bit different, but I still don't think it should stand up in court. It's used in many other products and has been for years.

If anything, it will be licensed to HTC and gang and we'll all move forward. Or, android will have easy tie ins for others to make the mods after the sale. Either way, I don't think this will disrupt android too much.

 

[AnotherFatalEpic]

of course it's also important to realise that such ridiculous patents are only enforceable in the us. Thankfully, the rest of the world is sensible and doesn't allow such things as 'ideas' to be patented.

Fail.

I suppose we shouldn't allow ridiculous things like "writings" and "names" to be copyrighted and trademarked.

---
I'm sorry you had a good point and I understood what you meant. Excuse me.

 

[gerryk]

Well, that's what a patent is, a protection of an idea.

No, a patent is designed to protect mechanisms and designs. Before there was any such thing as software, pretty much everything that was 'designed' was done so through a series of engineering, prototype, tooling and manufacture, or, in the case of med-tech and chemical engineering, design, manufacture and certification. All of this costed huge amounts of money before you saw a penny back in sales.

Software is different, and ideas, such as 'look and fee' even more so. Software can be designed and created without spending a penny, and an idea is just that, an idea. In the US patents are granted with no actual due diligence, and it remains up to the courts to determine the validity of a claim... usually granted to the one with the deeper pockets.

Also, the thing about software and interface design is that despite there being many ways to skin a cat, they all involve a cat. Put another way, solutions to similar problems will tend to converge, given a similar toolset. Put 20 engineers in separate rooms and have them all solve the same problem and I can guarantee you that the solutions they arrive at will be similar for the most part.

 

[AnotherFatalEpic]

Touche.

 

[Foo (AZ)]

gerryk, we're not far off in our positions and I agree there are serious problems with the patent process. When I talk about ideas I mean ideas that are based on a specific design, not something generic and wildly open to interpretation.

Even software designs that are seemingly simple can be very expensive. Put 5 engineers in a room for two weeks @ $30 an hour each and the cost will add up. Software is NOT cheap by any means.

You bring up many good points about how software has changing the way we look at patents. I don't believe the patent process was meant to be use in such an abstract way. I'm sure patent law is big business, where lawyers are doing their best to get their client's patents approved using the most abstract of language as possible. It's like camping on an idea waiting for trespassers to come along. The practice is bogus and I have a feeling we'll see this hammered out in the higher courts.

 

[Foo (AZ)]

Read this last night and I thought you all might find it interesting.

Apple's HTC patent lawsuit is a bluff
Apple's HTC patent lawsuit is a bluff | Betanews

 

[Ayrow]

Read this last night and I thought you all might find it interesting.

Apple's HTC patent lawsuit is a bluff
Apple's HTC patent lawsuit is a bluff | Betanews

Great article. Thanks for posting.