Malaysia Airlines tragedies

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  1. Codegerm

    Codegerm Well-Known Member

    It is all "grasping at straws" until the plane is located. Even with knowing the planned flightpath, that's a very large area to search. I hope they locate the plane soon, if only to begin answering the questions of how and why, and to begin the healing process for family and friends of those on that flight.

    EarlyMon likes this.
  2. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Well-Known Member

    You'd think the planes themselves would have some sort of always-on GPS transmitters so the airlines that owns the planes would always know where they all are at any given moment. I want to say I'm being too simplistic, but if they had them, there'd be no mystery here... they obviously don't.
  3. palmtree5

    palmtree5 Sunny Vacation Supporter! Moderator

    Think that's what ADS-B (think that's what it's called) is supposed to be
  4. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    GPS is a navigational aid, originally for the military.

    It's not a commercial service capable of receiving information from 70,000 flights per day at US taxpayer expense.

    It transmits.

    The only receiving the satellites do is from their ground control.
    mikedt likes this.
  5. Techlord

    Techlord Well-Known Member

    With all the spy satellites in space you'd think that these type of events were a thing of the past. Sorry, no disrespect to anyone but I smell cover up. To much much time has past to still not have any answers.
  6. mikedt

    mikedt 你好 Guide

    Yeh that's it I think. Only thing is radio doesn't transmit very well underwater. The flight recorders do have radio locators on them as well as acoustic sonar location for when they're submerged, but only has a very limited range and works for about 30 days I believe.
    EarlyMon likes this.
  7. mikedt

    mikedt 你好 Guide

    It took them five days to find the remains of Air France 447, by which time most of it had sunk, and two years to fully establish what went wrong, which was pilot error.
    bjacks12 and EarlyMon like this.
  8. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator's_razor

    Then again, anything is possible - but who gains?

    Spy satellites simply aren't aimed at commercial airliners.

    Those are opposing views you have to decide for yourself.

    The truth will come out with the data recorders.
    Codegerm and mikedt like this.
  9. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Well-Known Member

    How It’s Possible to Lose an Airplane in 2014

    Although modern flight management systems use GPS for navigation, that only tells the airplane where it is–it does not tell air traffic control where the plane is.

    The mystery of flight MH370: How on earth, with all our technology, do we lose a giant plane?

    Why, then, does a plane like the MH370 keep all of its secrets locked up in a black box? Why don’t planes constantly transmit all of their black box data, so that we know their exact location, bearing, altitude, and other important factors, at all times?

    The short answer is, there’s no good reason.
  10. bjacks12

    bjacks12 Well-Known Member

    I fully expect an eventual move beyond the black box, an idea from an era with no internet. As airlines continue to increase connectivity on their planes, i would hope that they do adopt a live upload of flight data and cockpit voice recordings. It would be more than worth it, imo.
  11. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Well-Known Member

    A tragic way to learn that they're doing it wrong.
  12. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    Codegerm and Unforgiven like this.
  13. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    By the way - it's true that the black box and flight control came from an era before the internet.

    So, they simply invented a special-purpose, radio-linked network of their own.

    It has flight data transmission, data recording on the ground and in the air, interlinking from network to network - you know - like internet routers do - and all sorts of cool things.

    If you want to take that whole system BACKWARDS and base it off the internet, OK, but I hardly see the point.
  14. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Well-Known Member

  15. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    That's not deployed yet and isn't based on GPS.

    Automatic dependent surveillance-broadcast - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    However - ACARS is.

    Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Works great.

    Like the ADS-B that will replace it, it only has one problem.

    No automated messages from missing Boeing jet: sources | Reuters

    It can fail.
  16. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator


    Starting to smell like a media feeding frenzy and the output is idiotic.

    Let's take the news wire source your article used.

    Malaysia military tracked missing plane to west coast: source | Reuters

    OMGZ!! There's proof right there!

    Until you get to the later paragraph in the same news wire:

    There's a good reason that they asked China to widen the search to the seas as far northeast as Honk Kong.

    And they would not do that if they actually knew that it went southwest - the opposite direction.

    By the way, your article and the news wire said basically the same thing, let's look at your article:

    Ok, wow, there's a local newspaper quoting a named source and a general ought to know what he's talking about.

    So - one last question:

    Given that I've proven that 1) neither the Chicago Tribune nor the Washington Post can be trusted to report this accurately, and 2) given that everything else happening in the search investigations clearly show that that is simply one scenario and they're actively pursuing others, then 3) why do you believe a Malaysian newspaper you've never heard of?


    If you want to believe that the entire operational theory of air traffic is wrong and you know better based on what a reporter said, and if you want to believe that you've found evidence of a cover-up and/or terrorist activities based on a second-hand report of a Malaysian newpaper, knock yourself out.

    That's your right.

    As your pal, I'll only offer one piece of really good advice, also around since before the internet:

    Don't drink the Kool Aide. ;) :)
  17. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    Here's yet another idiotic, inflammatory report:

    Malaysia Air Crash: Why Do Airlines Keep 'Black Box' Flight Data Trapped on Planes? - Businessweek

    We have these pesky things called facts that really mess with idiotic, sensationalist reports.

    1. The data recorders took a few years to find and bring up because they were deep in the Atlantic.

    2. They found that missing plane in the middle of the Atlantic in 5 days. Not 2 years, 5 days.

    3. They were able to do that because of ACARS on that plane transmitting location and flight attitude right up until the crash.

    4. ACARS already talks to the ground and to satellites.

    Here's why we don't need a system talking to ground with flight data and backing that up with satellite uplinks:

    We already got one. :p
    Unforgiven likes this.
  18. Alien Droid

    Alien Droid Well-Known Member

    When I done a track for this yesterday with the same website it shows the track about central to the land mass and then it vanishes at this point.
    I checked several aircraft tracks several days before and they all came close to this flight path, one was almost exact. This to me at least shows the website tracking seemed to be working very close to the flight path!
    I saw a so called expert on the news say the answer to a plane vanishing from radar could mean sudden loss of altitude, so my thinking from basic guesswork did this plane either fly under radar somewhere well away from this area or did it break up over land. Has there been 100% radar track of it over water or not?
    Even though it's very unlikely I hope they turn up safe and well.
  19. Techlord

    Techlord Well-Known Member

  20. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator


    That's the million dollar question, right there.

    Reports we've been given say that all systems and backup systems to cooperate with secondary, commercial, flight tracking systems (including a type of radar that doesn't work the way people think when they hear the word radar) - all failed at once, both on the airplane and on the ground (I say "both" because they're cooperative and collaborative systems involving machinery, electronics and people).

    And reports of military tracking radar (that do work the way people think when they hear the word radar) have been confused, confusing and contradictory (two military radar sources, China and Malaysia, claiming different radar tracking for the same plane at the same time according to the press).

    In the immediate aftermath of any flight loss, there's always confusion and speculation.

    We all want to know and we all want to know right now.

    Unfortunately, wanting a thing does not make it happen. :(
    As I hope we all do my friend.
  21. dan330

    dan330 Well-Known Member

    i thought today.. people can pay for internet connections on a plane??? same as cruise ships in the ocean. they use satellite to get connected to the internet. NOT cheap but can be done.

    what is so hard to have a plane that is going over big bodies of water.. require it have internet connectivity. GPS locations sent back to it parent company (AA, Delta, etc..).

    so when the plane is lost.. at least they have very good idea were to start looking..
    fastest time to get to the wreckage.. to possibly save lives!!!!!

    i don't see this cost much to get implemented. but of course only gov certified companies can do it.. the ones that pay Politicians for help to get these contracts.
    which makes a $50 item...
    to $5000 unit and $2000 installation.. with $2000/yr maintenance .. $300/month service.
  22. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    Is there a third way for a plane to crash?

    I think accidents and on-purpose cover all the bases, yeah?

    I can dig what you're saying in the sense that almost anything is possible and everything is believable because we just have theories right now.
  23. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    You simply didn't read my previous posts.

    We already have a networked system sending location data back to the ground, all of the time, that uses a combination of ground and satellite uplinks of the data.

    It failed in this case.

    You don't need to call for that being deployed, we already have it, you don't need to figure out the costs, they're already spending it.

    I don't get it. :(

    Just because something failed does not mean it does not exist.

    It means it failed.
  24. Techlord

    Techlord Well-Known Member

    A third way would be by alien interference. Jk, All I'm saying is that, one of those scenarios are what likely happened to the plane. In flight 800, to this day there is still unanswered questions and speculation. I just feel like plane crashes should be a thing of the past. Flying in aluminum deathtraps is so 20th century. We got the technology to prevent these types of tragedies.
  25. dan330

    dan330 Well-Known Member

    i did not read every post.. skimmed .. sorry i missed your post on it.

    if there is a sys in place.. great
    if it is not reporting location for flights.. every minute.
    then there should have been an alert...

    so the sys failed
    then humans failed to notice it
    processes failed to get it corrected
    EarlyMon likes this.

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