Root **Official** Droid X encrypted bootloader and efuse thread

[Piiman]

About what? That the bootloader might be encrypted? Or that if it is, it'll be more or less impossible to crack?

All this "We have absolutely no guarantee that we won't be stuck on 2.2 from after the next update, because we won't be able to upgrade to new Android versions manually when they arrive - when Motorola decides the Milestone's reached EndOfLife status (any day now...), we're screwed. No 2.3 or 3.0 for us, while even G1 and Magic users will be getting the newest updates...

 

[vudu]

Yes, agreed. And on my part, I have leaned more towards keeping my Evo primarily because of the ability for custom roms. I'll play with the X when it comes out and see whether the rest of the package outweighs no custom roms (until i hear otherwise) and no front camera. Let's see what the devs can do with the kernel source released recently for the Evo in the next couple weeks.

In a roundabout way, that's part of what I was trying to say. Working on the Executive side of my Consulting firm, I know 1st hand that Motorola could care less about those of us curious about our technology or what Android is all about, it's about volume and putting up big sales numbers which allows for the creation of the next phone we'll all rush out to get.

I'm a bit older than most here and seeing the progression of technology over the years and how it's becoming more and more locked down, I've grown to be quite cynical about these things and occasionally I get on my soapbox hence my previous post. Bottom line, if the Droid X sells in large numbers which it more than likely will, our issue is a non-issue. That's why I said the only thing that would get their attention would be a boycott or some major publicity BEFORE the device launches, neither of which is going to happen.

I think we agree......

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

 

[Brendanmurphy]

Although the Milestone has the encrypted bootloader developers have been working hard. We have a working version of sense, we can overclock, we have root and wifi tether. The milestone does not have alot of support and most of it is in Germany. The encryption can be bypassed. The milestone modders have been working hard on a Kexec module that will bypass the normal bootloader and allow us to flash custom kernels and roms. I assume that the Droid X will be able to do the same thing and probably alot faster as it will have alot of support. But i really hope they release a gsm version of this device then there will be even more support worldwide

 

[tcallahan]

Hey guys,

Im new to droid and am curious... if the droid x does end up being able to be rooted.. they would potentially be able to put sense on it??

 

[garland]

Anything is possible.

 

[tcallahan]

Anything is possible.

is that a yes??

im so lost. I dont know if i want the X without being able to open it up and overclock it etc......

 

[droidSPARX]

is that a yes??

im so lost. I dont know if i want the X without being able to open it up and overclock it etc......

no one really knows yet. the phone is not out. even when the phone comes out. looking for a crack is not gonna happen right away.

 

[bemymonkey]

All this "We have absolutely no guarantee that we won't be stuck on 2.2 from after the next update, because we won't be able to upgrade to new Android versions manually when they arrive - when Motorola decides the Milestone's reached EndOfLife status (any day now...), we're screwed. No 2.3 or 3.0 for us, while even G1 and Magic users will be getting the newest updates...

 

[sjones765]

Although the Milestone has the encrypted bootloader developers have been working hard. We have a working version of sense, we can overclock, we have root and wifi tether. The milestone does not have alot of support and most of it is in Germany. The encryption can be bypassed. The milestone modders have been working hard on a Kexec module that will bypass the normal bootloader and allow us to flash custom kernels and roms. I assume that the Droid X will be able to do the same thing and probably alot faster as it will have alot of support. But i really hope they release a gsm version of this device then there will be even more support worldwide

I agree with you.
Problem is..seems people will ignore anything to get their point across. The fact of the matter is, hopefully this can be done to dx. Seems like it will. If it doesn't.. who keeps a phone 3-4 years now anyway? Especially with LTE coming at the end of the year. Reality is most of us will be switching within the next 2 years for much faster phones anyway.

The DI is an awesome phone. If you need reassurance that you can have an unlocked bootloader buy that.

 

[JAS_21]

I don't think I'm going to buy this phone on release day. I'll probably hang back to see if it gets rooted and if flashing roms is a possibility. I have an Eris now and I jumped on the leak bandwagon before the phone was rooted. Even with the new root method for the Eris, I have been unable to achieve root. The new method doesn't work for everyone.

The DroidX is an awesome phone regardless, but if I buy it I will most likely have to pay full retail price. In my mind, if I'm going to pay 5 or 6 hundred for a phone I damn sure should be able to use it as I see fit.

So what it comes down to is if it can be hacked/ rooted, I will probably jump on it. If not, I'll wait to see if the Droid 2 is encrypted.

 

[blink]

Look at Android phones that are two or three years old - are manufacturers still releasing updates (with the exception of updates that were promised nearly immediately after the devices release and then took years to actually be released ) for those?

Not to be a troll, lol, but Android phones haven't even been out 2 years yet. The first Android device was the HTC Dream (T-Mobile G1) and it came out on October 22, 2008

 

[bemymonkey]

And look how outdated those are already - now imagine you couldn't update them to 2.1/2.2 and think about how much more incredibly outdated they would be then

Support has stopped long before even two years have passed...

 

[sanjeeva7]

I don't recall seeing this asked yet...how long did it take for the Milestone bootloader encryption to be hacked?

 

[Piiman]

How is stating a very real possibility an assumption? Have you looked at the software/update support on Android handsets lately? Obviously the version numbers I mentioned were picked arbitrarily, and I'm hoping we'll see support for 2.3 and even 3.0 on the Milestone, but sooner or later, support WILL be dropped - it's just not economical for Motorola to continue releasing software updates long after no more devices are being sold...

Look at Android phones that are two or three years old - are manufacturers still releasing updates (with the exception of updates that were promised nearly immediately after the devices release and then took years to actually be released ) for those? Nope, but the handsets themselves are still pretty usable, and thanks to projects like CyanogenMod, it's still possible to run a modern version of Android on them.

Sooner or later, Motorola will drop support for the Milestone, and sooner or later they'll drop support for the Droid X. When that happens, these devices will age and become outdated much faster than their unencrypted counterparts, simply because they can no longer be upgraded...

Of course, there's still a chance that the Droid X bootloader won't be encrypted - I'm just saying that if it is, it makes the phone a much less attractive device.

Read your first sentence if you can't if you can't understand that your assuming a lot I can' help.

And really if you're claiming someday the phone will be outdated well DUH. But claiming it will die long before just becasue the bootloader is encrypted is silly and based on ....?? What is it based on?. Why is it silly? Because IMO people like us will have moved on to the latest and greatest long before that happens. (and you know its true LOL) And those not in the know won't care as long as it still makes calls.

This phone will be dead in your, and my, eyes long before Moto kills it off.

I hope it's not encrypted and we have loads of ROMs to load but it's not going to kill the phone, or you, if it is. It's not a game changer in IMO but it might be to others. Unfortunately the "others" are a very small group and don't really have enough clot to change Moto's policies.

So if it's all locked up you just need to decide if that is something you want or don't want and make your buying decision based on that..

No need for gloom and doom scenarios based on your imagination

 

[ckochinsky125]

Read your first sentence if you can't if you can't understand that your assuming a lot I can' help.

And really if you're claiming someday the phone will be outdated well DUH. But claiming it will die long before just becasue the bootloader is encrypted is silly and based on ....?? What is it based on?. Why is it silly? Because IMO people like us will have moved on to the latest and greatest long before that happens. (and you know its true LOL) And those not in the know won't care as long as it still makes calls.

This phone will be dead in your, and my, eyes long before Moto kills it off.

I hope it's not encrypted and we have loads of ROMs to load but it's not going to kill the phone, or you, if it is. It's not a game changer in IMO but it might be to others. Unfortunately the "others" are a very small group and don't really have enough clot to change Moto's policies.

So if it's all locked up you just need to decide if that is something you want or don't want and make your buying decision based on that..

No need for gloom and doom scenarios based on your imagination

I agree it isnt really that big of a deal to me if it is or isnt im not big into root and all that i know some people are though. As much as I go through phones i highly doubt i will have it long enough for it to reach its EOL

 

[jreed2560]

I don't recall seeing this asked yet...how long did it take for the Milestone bootloader encryption to be hacked?

thats what is scaring everybody about this phone, It hasn't been hacked yet. Its been rooted so you can use apps that require root access, but you cannot flash customer roms to it yet

 

[Wolfedude88]

thats what is scaring everybody about this phone, It hasn't been hacked yet. Its been rooted so you can use apps that require root access, but you cannot flash customer roms to it yet

So could I use the screen shot app that requires root and one of the other wireless tethering apps?

 

[bemymonkey]

I don't recall seeing this asked yet...how long did it take for the Milestone bootloader encryption to be hacked?

It hasn't been hacked at all, nor has a workaround been found so far.

Read your first sentence if you can't if you can't understand that your assuming a lot I can' help.

You do realize the the word "if", as I have used it, typically denotes that the sentence fragment following it is a) a possibility, or b) a hypothetical scenario. In this case, it is both. Maybe I should explain the post...:

If the Bootloader is signed, you're probably all SOL when it comes to custom ROMs. Kexec isn't working on the Milestone (see and-developers), and the bootloader is so heavily encrypted that even a sizable server farm would need years to crack it.

Now, would you be so kind as to point out the assumption here? Or were you talking about the second part of the post?

We have absolutely no guarantee that we won't be stuck on 2.2 from after the next update, because we won't be able to upgrade to new Android versions manually when they arrive - when Motorola decides the Milestone's reached EndOfLife status (any day now...), we're screwed. No 2.3 or 3.0 for us, while even G1 and Magic users will be getting the newest updates...

Once again, just in case you didn't notice, this is a purely hypothetical scenario. However, one should point out that we've seen it before - Samsung, HTC, Archos... I'm sure there are others too. The difference here is that it wasn't such a big fuss, because none of those devices had encrypted bootloaders.

And now, back to your last post:

And really if you're claiming someday the phone will be outdated well DUH. But claiming it will die long before just becasue the bootloader is encrypted is silly and based on ....?? What is it based on?. Why is it silly? Because IMO people like us will have moved on to the latest and greatest long before that happens. (and you know its true LOL) And those not in the know won't care as long as it still makes calls.

This phone will be dead in your, and my, eyes long before Moto kills it off.

How do you know how long Motorola is planning on supporting the Milestone, or the Droid X? Aren't you the one who is assuming that everyone who cares will have moved on to their next device by the time the software updates are stopped (One should note that this scenario is dependent on two variables you have absolutely no control over, and also probably don't have any info about: Motorola's support length and how long people will keep their phones)?

I don't know about you, but if I buy a 500€ piece of equipment, I don't want it to become outdated in terms of software a year later... hardware becoming outdated is a fact of life, but why would you buy a piece of hardware that is, in a world of user-upgradeable Android handsets, completely locked down?

I know I won't be buying another phone before my two years are up if I keep getting the newest version of Android, or at least all the features my hardware will support... I'm not only an Android power user because I find it fun, but also because I want to get the most out of my hard-earned cash. And what I learned the hard way is: Don't buy devices with locked bootloaders!

I hope it's not encrypted and we have loads of ROMs to load but it's not going to kill the phone, or you, if it is. It's not a game changer in IMO but it might be to others. Unfortunately the "others" are a very small group and don't really have enough clot to change Moto's policies.

So if it's all locked up you just need to decide if that is something you want or don't want and make your buying decision based on that..

No need for gloom and doom scenarios based on your imagination

If people are going to make an informed buying decision, they need to be informed about the possible consequences of that decision... which is precisely what I'm doing: Warning people that a locked bootloader might lead to an obsolete device with catastrophic resale value far more quickly than an unlocked bootloader.

Once again, let me make it clear that I'm not assuming that it will happen, but merely stating that it could happen.

So could I use the screen shot app that requires root and one of the other wireless tethering apps?

Yes. Drocap and Wireless Tether for Root Users both work fine on a rooted Milestone.

 

[arcturussage]

This might not be the places for it but it's sort of related. I'm new to android and the DX will be my first android phone. I've seen a few posts explaining what rooting does and allows you to do, but what about the Custom ROMS?

What are some custom roms that you would only be able to add if the phone isn't locked or encrypted? Why are the custom roms instead of being in the App store or something?

 

[lanteau]

I emailed a bunch of those reviewers posted in that thread about the DX having an encrypted bootloader. Andrew at Boy Genius Report emailed me back:

Hi Logan--

So I'm sort of an "Android amateur" if you will. While I know my way around the platform, moding, rooting, etc. is totally foreign to me. Is there any way to verify that the DX has an encrypted boot loader? Is there anyway to examine/sample it via the command line? If you can provide some instruction, and I can verify that it is in fact encrypted, I have no problem writing up a small piece about it.

Best--
Andrew

What should I email him back? It seems like we have no actual proof the bootloader is encrypted, but we have almost EVERY reason to believe it is. Is there anyway he would be able to tell with a test device? Should I tell him we just have to wait until the devs get it when its released? If Boy Genius Report wrote a piece on this, that would kind of be a big deal. Agreed?

 

[bemymonkey]

This might not be the places for it but it's sort of related. I'm new to android and the DX will be my first android phone. I've seen a few posts explaining what rooting does and allows you to do, but what about the Custom ROMS?

Think of it this way:

Root on a phone with a signed bootloader is like having a PC with an unbreakable password on the BIOS and all boot options locked down. You've got Windows installed, and you've got the administrator password for Windows itself, and can install any Windows program you want, but you can't throw Linux or any other OS on there, because Windows is the only thing that the manufacturer will allow on the hardware.

What are some custom roms that you would only be able to add if the phone isn't locked or encrypted? Why are the custom roms instead of being in the App store or something?

Custom ROMs are complete OS's that could have been customized (by the people who made them) in pretty much any way. They can use a custom kernel, provide versions of the operating system that haven't been officially released on that hardware, include custom apps... and many more features.

Custom kernels and unauthorized OS upgrades are the big loss here, because most of the other stuff is possible with regular root already, just like on the Milestone.

 

[jthacker]

I emailed a bunch of those reviewers posted in that thread about the DX having an encrypted bootloader. Andrew at Boy Genius Report emailed me back:



What should I email him back? It seems like we have no actual proof the bootloader is encrypted, but we have almost EVERY reason to believe it is. Is there anyway he would be able to tell with a test device? Should I tell him we just have to wait until the devs get it when its released? If Boy Genius Report wrote a piece on this, that would kind of be a big deal. Agreed?

Nice work...glad to know BGR is listening to the "vocal minority." Like you, my knowledge of the actual bootloader/root process is limited (new to android), but I'm definitely still concerned about the consequences of an encrypted bootloader. Someone linked to this forum a while back when asking about where devs might hang out, and it looks like there might be some info on there that might help your or Andrew:

Droid X Android Development - xda-developers

Specifically this thread: How to Get into Bootloader! - xda-developers


Sorry I don't have much info...but maybe that link will help figure it out.

 

[jthacker]

Think of it this way:

Root on a phone with a signed bootloader is like having a PC with an unbreakable password on the BIOS and all boot options locked down. You've got Windows installed, and you've got the administrator password for Windows itself, and can install any Windows program you want, but you can't throw Linux or any other OS on there, because Windows is the only thing that the manufacturer will allow on the hardware.

And don't forget --> not being able to upgrade to XP, Vista, Windows 7, etc. until Microsoft gets around to sending you the update...if they've not already determined your device is past it's prime.

 

[Syco54645]

Nice work...glad to know BGR is listening to the "vocal minority." Like you, my knowledge of the actual bootloader/root process is limited (new to android), but I'm definitely still concerned about the consequences of an encrypted bootloader. Someone linked to this forum a while back when asking about where devs might hang out, and it looks like there might be some info on there that might help your or Andrew:

Droid X Android Development - xda-developers

Specifically this thread: How to Get into Bootloader! - xda-developers


Sorry I don't have much info...but maybe that link will help figure it out.

I posted before on XDA about what29 owning a DX and was willing to work with them to figure it out. They did nothing AFAIK... I feel like we should know this by now...

 

[Piiman]

I agree it isnt really that big of a deal to me if it is or isnt im not big into root and all that i know some people are though. As much as I go through phones i highly doubt i will have it long enough for it to reach its EOL

That's the irony of his scenario. The people that are concerned about that sort of thing are the first to move on to the next "latest and greatest" (Hell my Dinc is going to last 28 days. I've already planned its EOL .)

There is no way I'm keeping a phone more than two years and I'm sure this phone will be supported for 2 years.