People stealing your paid apps?

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  1. Ljooba

    Ljooba Member

    First i don't see that any of you judge ppl who UPLOAD all that on net,criminals are ppl who download judging by all your post's.
    Second,like i wrote i did not steal anything,if someone upload files 2 net and i download that i don't see my self like thief and i don't shame my self.
    Like i wrote i admit i download and still can look at ppl's eyes.
    I know 4 ethics but i dont like judging me without knowing me think of me like i criminal and telling me to ashamed my self!!!

  2. mikedt

    mikedt 你好 Guide

    Perhaps you should come and live in China, you'll probably feel right at home here. :rolleyes:
  3. OfTheDamned

    OfTheDamned The Friendly Undead VIP Member

    I don't and don't agree with anyone who does.

    We have a problem with anyone who takes something that does not belong to them without compensation. The people who upload the files are just as bad as the people to download the files and in most cases they are worse.

    Stealing is taking something that does not belong to you. It doesn't matter if it is a piece of gum, a car, an app, a song, a movie or your neighbors lawnmower. Just because some guy is standing on the street corner offering you stolen goods doesn't mean your hands are clean. There are laws in most countries for accepting stolen property for a reason, it isn't right. Taking something without compensation is theft.

    As far as judging you, we can only do so based on your actions and what you have described here. Based on those things you actually should be ashamed. While you aren't stealing millions of dollars in diamonds, you are taking money away from other members of the Android community. You are taking money away from people that develop these apps and games. The only thing your actions accomplish in the end is to drive more people away from wanting to develop for Android because they know it is harder to get compensated for their hard work. You are taking things from people who, in some cases, are just like you. They are out of work and the apps they develop pay their bills. Wouldn't you be a little upset if people started taking the food off your table?

    As someone else said, I certainly wouldn't work for free and I doubt you would either. Why do you think it is fair to force others to do so by stealing their goods or services because you don't want to pay for them?
    Roze, lunatic59 and Slug like this.
  4. scythefwd

    scythefwd Well-Known Member

    I paid 1 cent for my phone. I find it amazing that people actually spend more than 20 bux on a phone. Also, it isn't stealing, it's copyright infringment. Two different sets of laws.

    On the other had, OP, have you tried deleting the apk file after install? You cant copy the file off if it no longer exists. Have it part of a first run of the program.. if this apk exists.. rm it.
  5. OfTheDamned

    OfTheDamned The Friendly Undead VIP Member

    The cost of a phone is different for everyone and depends on the priorities of the person looking to purchase it. I use my phone for just about everything and when locked into a contract for two years here in the US, I prefer to have the best available at the time of purchase.

    I wasn't really talking legal definition. The legal issue can be argued by someone else because it doesn't matter. We are talking about someone's hard work being taken without compensation or permission. Regardless of how the legal system looks at it, the developer still feels the same. I've yet to meet anyone that has had their software pirated that says, "Well it is only copyright infringement so it doesn't really matter." To a developer, song writer, musician or independent film maker taking their product without paying for it is taking money out of their pocket. Regardless of what a bunch of lawyers are willing to argue, that is theft just as it would be if they took something from their home.

    In the end, the real difference to most people isn't splitting hairs, it's dividing a rabbit in half.
  6. AngryHatter

    AngryHatter Well-Known Member

    If I have to lay out thousands to have people play on my album, recording time in a studio etc and you copy the cd without paying, I am out money and you have indeed stolen from me.

    As to Google and international borders, it is the fault of the nations and not the companies, Amazon and Google would love to sell apps and ebooks to anyone anywhere, but licensing agreements must be in place before that happens.
    And some countries with their lax application of IP laws are not licensing friendly.
    So steal my cd and now you are preventing people from using GooglePlay as well.
    OfTheDamned likes this.
  7. scythefwd

    scythefwd Well-Known Member

    You're right. The difference, between theft and copyright infringment is splitting a rabbit in half. Legally, it's even worse. You get huge fines, soft time for infringment.. theft will land you in jail for much longer. We can quibble about symantics, but in the end... there is a right and wrong. Both are wrong morally...

    Angry, you assume that just because I got the pirated cd that I would have actually ponied up money for it. That would be false. I haven't bought, or downloaded music in close to a decade. I haven't pirated any either. I'm actually against pirating. You take it to court and call it theft.. and any lawyer worth his salt will get it dismissed. Copyright infringment doesn't infer that you aren't losing money out of it.. but it's a civil case, between the copyright holder and the infringer. Theft is a criminal case between the state, aka district attourny or his representative, and a defendant.

    but I'm right :p
    OfTheDamned likes this.
  8. AngryHatter

    AngryHatter Well-Known Member

    Splitting hairs... Philadelphia Lawyer...:)
    Civil or criminal - it is wrong.
    OfTheDamned likes this.
  9. scythefwd

    scythefwd Well-Known Member

  10. Cryssie

    Cryssie Well-Known Member

    I know I am playing the devil's advocate here but I want to address some issues because some of the responses scare me.

    1. The act of piracy is overblown into huge and evil proportions imo. Maybe it is something American, I don't know...
    Let us be realistic: If you look for real life examples, it is something we have all done. We have all taped songs of the radio, recorded music video's of MTV, shared newspapers with neighbours, copied cd's from friends, copied sheetmusic from the library, installed software on our computers our neighbours bought, shared magazines, et cetera ad infinitum. All these things are inherently no different then downloading a song, movie or app on the internet. You copy a piece of intellectual property for personal use from somebody else who purchased it.
    Now: the first option is generally considered to be okay but when you do it online you are suddenly a dirty low-life pirate with no values, robbing people of their income.
    The main difference here is of course scale. Sharing a cd with your neighbour and little sister is different then putting it online where thousands of people can download it with a single mouse-click and it is logical that the money-making people get nervous at the thought of so much people possibly getting their product for free.
    But let's be clear: it is not the act that is the problem but the medium.

    2. Ask yourself this and be honest:
    Is your disgust of pirates based upon your own judgement of the ethics of the act or is it based upon the media industry flashing "downloading is stealing!!!" at you every chance they get?

    3. the logic that piracy is stealing is deeply flawed. It assumes that every download equals a lost sale and if some one had not downloaded the product, they would have purchased it. This assumption is used by the anti-piracy lobby to convince you of the huge fictional monetary loss they suffer.

    4. This age is one of globalization, fast spreading of news and a very slow and very outdated system of licensing. If you create a source of entertainment, spread it to half of the world and say to the other half: "You cannot have it!" you will have soaring piracy on your hands. People who cannot get it through legal means, will resort to downloading. The age where the unlicensed countries lived in blissful ignorance is officially over.
    The best way to counter this is to make it quickly and widely available.
    You can argue that people just have to get over it: but these differences can not be explained away. "You cannot have it or buy it because you are not from the right country!" People stopped accepting this excuse and frankly: I do not blame them.

    Let's be clear: I am not pro-piracy, I am a semi-professional musician struggling with the question on how to generate a steady income in today's world. I frequently buy cd's, I recently spend a lot of money on apps, my bedroom is piled full of books right to the ceiling, I buy magazines, go to concerts and the cinema. I will not blame anyone for downloading a cd on the internet but I will if they do not buy it if they enjoy it. I requires no debate that creators of content should be rewarded for their work.
    But a debate of this ilk could benefit from some nuance because the issue is imo not as clearcut as "pirates are evil people!" There are often more issues to take into consideration: like pricing, availability and methods of payment. Also, it signals what people want in their entertainment. Before we resort to legal actions, we should take a long hard look at the reasons why piracy soars so high and address those issues.
    In the case of Google Play: are the apps in the store truly accessible to all Android users? I believe not
    Because currently; we are putting ourselves on a very dangerous slippery slope in this regard. People are being almost criminalized for getting a glimpse of entertainment they have not paid a set price for and I think this is incredibly scary. We are heading towards a world where free sharing of information will belong in the past.

    I realize this is not very useful to the OP, forgive me.
    Deepfried likes this.
  11. deltaforce

    deltaforce Well-Known Member

    I see your problem and I wonder how folks can install pirated stuff on Android (I am new to Android). Why the measures taken by iOS are not implemented in Android but the real reason of me getting into Android ecosystem is, I am fed up with Apple and its dictatorial attitude towards the users (and developers where it asks for 30% cut) and many more issues.

    Now coming down to piracy, as a developer, sure it sucks but look at the bright side, many of those who pirated your software will most likely buy your app eventually. I used to download truckload of stuff but eventually I got fed up. A more than decade ago, I started on pirated windows, pirated office, pirated music but later on, I bought everything. I tried many freewares before buying MS office, I didn't like them because I was so used to it (and I didn't want to change), so finally I bought office 2007. With music, I downloaded truckloads (in pre-spotify era when I had a little options to try music online, we are not talking about western music here) then whichever I liked, I bought CDs and ripped them. So don't be so upset.

    And especially in the US, this piracy issue is overblown, music industry and film industry considers it as a lost sale but the fact is, very little good quality stuff is made anyways so why blame the consumers. They still want to stick to old business models which won't work/last in today's world. Haven't been to a movie in past 5 years but I watch all the movies on cable, may be a little late but who cares?

    I am not pro-piracy and Bill Gates has publicly acknowledged that piracy has increased MS share in the market, so if there are loads of links (and downloads) to your apps, may be your app IS popular.
    I think, Western world should learn a thing from the (Asian) Indians, very small profit margin and a BIG sale equals more profit and in Western world, the model is, more profit and small sale equals big profit, whoever comes across this model, sue them, idiots...
  12. Hrethgir

    Hrethgir Well-Known Member

    Deepfried likes this.
  13. newtzgames

    newtzgames Member

    I just released my first game to Google Play this past Friday, and before I released it I thought long and hard about going through the whole process of including Google's licensing service. In the end, I decided it's not worth it.

    I came to the conclusion that if it's a good app, it will sell well. Will some people pirate it? Probably, but they would even if I did try to use the licensing services. I'd probably just end up introducing issues into the app for the people who actually paid for it, and I don't want to hinder their experience because they're the ones I care about.
    Seanette likes this.
  14. RyanB

    RyanB Guest

    I'm pretty sure that actually does happen, and I think it's a great idea.
  15. Seanette

    Seanette Well-Known Member

    Uh, yeah, ask Sony how well their adventure in malware worked out. :p

    As pointed out, a developer who did that would risk causing problems for actual customers, and as I mentioned, a developer who gets a reputation for spreading malware isn't likely to have customers for long, since trust would be a major problem. Also, I see no ethical justification for property damage that isn't for preservation of safety (e.g., breaking windows to get into a house in which there's a fire or an in-progress crime, or a fire department breaking windows on a car parked illegally obstructing a hydrant they need access to so they can get a hose to the hydrant).
    lunatic59 and mikedt like this.
  16. mikedt

    mikedt 你好 Guide

  17. rouge6

    rouge6 Active Member

    you guys sorta need to understand something though... alot of the droid pirates are linux enthusiast. Linux = free ...and "ubuntu" is a great community. Largely places, droid is slightly based on ubuntu gnome. I realize theirs HUNDREDS on linux distros.. I have a few favorites myself, but some how or another.. the linux geek continually thinks in terms like the following statement; "Lets stick it to google, linux is our community and it's a free helping environment" so when you think about it in those aspects.... It's kinda sad. Both developers and fans get the shaft. I applause all you dev. out there, you guys are doing great work. It's not you vs. pirate.. it's pirates/fans of linux vs google... trying to keep google from being a tyrant like microsoft. Therefore, It doesn't seem like the pirates realize what they are really doing in the end.

    then theirs ppl like me.. I can't install google play store and I can't install market at all. I've tried and tried. Then blackmart installed... im sorry, if I could install market and pay for the apps, i'd be more than happy to, but im in a rock and a hard place and it kinda makes it hard to sleep at night knowing I can't pay for a whole lotta some of what i've downloaded.
  18. jerofld

    jerofld Fixing stuff is not easy VIP Member

    Is GetJar not an option for you, either?
  19. rouge6

    rouge6 Active Member

    nope..... unfortunately... nothing works... and I really don't want to root the device until next year when warranty runs out.
  20. rouge6

    rouge6 Active Member

    Creative Zen Touch 2 - android 2.2.1 Froyo cortex 800 mhz 256mb memory 8 gig internal 8 gig installed on sd ext2 formatted(linux format) - most of you guys say fat32 is preferred, not really the case.. my device has never froze and I think it's in part because of the ext2.

    the device is very locked out in ways... right now my biggest concern is the bluetooth i've posted a thread in this directory. With a hacked bluetooth driver for it I might be able to make a google market for the device that would work, might be premature... but it's a start for us creative android users who don't want to be pirates. Plz guys help me there and then i'll help the community.
  21. aysiu

    aysiu Well-Known Member

    As far as I can tell, this is a very small but vocal minority of Linux users, and I know tons of pirates who are Windows and Mac users. I've been using Ubuntu since 2005, and I do not advocate at all pirating apps. In fact, piracy of software is in many ways antithetical to the free software movement. The more people pirate proprietary software, the more they become dependent on it.
  22. rouge6

    rouge6 Active Member

    you have a point and that's a linux debate you just brought up. Lets not go there...

    in my case, I have no option but to pirate... If I could pay, I would... theirs a few apps I wish had a donate button that didn't like to googleplay, i'd actually give more for them.
  23. jordy2254

    jordy2254 New Member

    i dont beleve in pirating games because it is near enough the same as walking into a shop nicking a game from ther cuz you cant afford it
    also i am a new dev my slf and have nott uploaded apps you think of it if you dont by a dev game and only one person does if he uploads to the internet as a pirite copy efectivly that game may never be brouht again/very few by's

    majorly off topic: hi all i started the forums today for some help on my app and got no respons its for adding joysticks

    ps sorry if sounds like i am droning it on but piracy annoys me in game case's
  24. rouge6

    rouge6 Active Member

    ... ur not droning I agree but I have no choice
  25. mikedt

    mikedt 你好 Guide

    "Free software is a matter of liberty, not price. To understand the concept, you should think of free as in free speech, not as in free beer."
    OfTheDamned, Roze and scythefwd like this.

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