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pesky watering holes... can they go?

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  1. Rxpert83

    Rxpert83 Dr. Feelgood Moderator

    I like 3 as well

    davoid and SUroot like this.
  2. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    For modding, having them clustered is easier, plus I think others were right, I was wrong on putting them in device threads.

    Example, we've had some things break out that ought to have gone to the PCA. Another example - we have our hands full convincing people that arguing about Apple doesn't belong in device threads.

    People come looking for support first and foremost in device threads. They should stay that way, with the obvious exceptions of pre-release threads, those belong there and can't help but get a little Lounge-y while people get anxious waiting.

    And I think there's ample evidence that they do work to get people out and about in the forums. For example, the GNex'ers hated going to the Lounge first and that really introduced them to being ok with other parts of the site.

    And we're all adults. A little off-topic here and there in device threads has always been ok - just no hijacking allowed.

    I'm for option 4, a Lounge subforum.

    Rather than a poll, I'd prefer a top-down decision from Phases.

    Question - if we do that, would we remove social groups?

    Social groups were the original watering holes, after all.

    And on that note, if we went that way, could we call the subforum Social Groups? Please. :) (And the Social Groups could move up there. Although - that could be too much profile work, not sure. :()
  3. D-U-R-X

    D-U-R-X turbo drinker Moderator

    The social groups is, I think, a little confusing... had not really been in there before today and there seem to be quite a few who post in there and have no other posts... as if they post and then, when they don't get an answer, don't come back.

    That sounds perfect, after all, it's what they are :)
    SUroot and EarlyMon like this.
  4. Xyro

    Xyro 4 8 15 16 23 42 Moderator

    I like 4.

    And I would also like to see the social group feature nuked from orbit (although we could in theory move the posts elsewhere), as it is mainly populated by spam and unseen/unanswered questions.
    SUroot likes this.
  5. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven -.. --- - / -.. .- ... .... Moderator

    I like number 4 as well. It keeps the line clear on where off topic chatter belongs. Option 3 really blurs this. As far as social groups, I don't use them. Are their even any active ones?
    SUroot likes this.
  6. SUroot

    SUroot Well-Known Member Developer

    Yes there are 4 I think now with the latest note 2 one... then there's the broader "root club" (which early has pidgeon holed elsewhere) and tablet tavern...

    Some die, some don't but they're slowly on the increase
  7. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven -.. --- - / -.. .- ... .... Moderator

    There is a Tablet Tavern social group? I know the watering hole, but not the social group.
  8. SUroot

    SUroot Well-Known Member Developer

    Sorry, I'm talking about watering holes. Misread your post.

    No idea what these social groups are.
  9. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    Complete separate subforum structure.

    Check my profile, I am a non-active member of two of them.

    Been here a while.
    SUroot likes this.
  10. SUroot

    SUroot Well-Known Member Developer

    Ah yeah I see. Thanks.

    Sometimes I feel this place is a little too over complicated and too hard to get around.
  11. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    Social groups are complicated, agree.
  12. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven -.. --- - / -.. .- ... .... Moderator

    I just checked the Boston social group I'm a member of (which I must have joined at some point) and it is a wasteland. As I said earlier, I'm all for getting rid of these altogether. I never saw the point of them, and they seem to induce what we have mentioned as a potential negative we have discussed here, being a clicque. You need to join them to participate, where at least the watering holes anyone can post in like any other thread.
  13. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    Social groups used to be very active.

    Had people used them when suggested often, they wouldn't be a wasteland and we wouldn't have watering holes. Hence my earlier suggestion to move the watering holes there, because we've always had a forum structure for the whole idea of coffee klatches.

    And anyone could join a social group. The idea that watering holes are not cliquish is something that I find odd. :D

    Have to hear from Phases if they're untouchable, because of profile linking.

    If we can consolidate them, maybe we'll have re-invented a better wheel. For now. :D :p ;)
  14. Xyro

    Xyro 4 8 15 16 23 42 Moderator

    Or if we don't ditch social groups altogether, we could at least prune them. Perhaps remove any of them that are small, inactive over a specific period of time, or ones that meet both of those requirements.
    EarlyMon likes this.
  15. treb1797

    treb1797 Well-Known Member

    I say ditch individual social groups if no one has posted in it in over a year & move what's left & the watering holes, taverns, lounges etc. to a subgroup within the lounge as discussed here. So if they are moved to a subgroup, what do you name the subgroup ? :hmmmm:
  16. Metroid Prime

    Metroid Prime Oil Can!!! Oil Can!!! VIP Member

    I don't really see harm in these Watering holes. Suppose we could remove ones over inactivity, but it makes me think what will the member think? They could think that their thread wasn't good enough and got deleted. I think perhaps social groups could be a nice touch though. :)
  17. SUroot

    SUroot Well-Known Member Developer

    People would need to be informed by the announcements
  18. Gmash

    Gmash Well-Known Member

    If they're inactive they fall down the list and don't get in the way anyway. It's the active ones that are annoying people by clogging up the lounge lol.
    The social clubs are already there, just nobody knows about them.
  19. Phases

    Phases Community Manager Administrator

    I don't know, I don't know what I'd like to do here. It just seems silly, the whole debate. Why are there even watering holes at all? I understand pre-release when there is very minimal to talk about but, I dunno.

    I can't commit to anything on this quite yet, and since there are only four in the lounge I'm not considering it super pressing, yet..
    EarlyMon likes this.
  20. palmtree5

    palmtree5 Sunny Vacation Supporter! Moderator

    If it starts to become a big issue, I'd go for moving them to a subforum in the lounge as to me, this seems like a logical choice
  21. davoid

    davoid Well-Known Member

    I think that if users of a particular device want to have a watering hole then it would be better to have them within the forum for that device, because then it allows new members and owners of that device to join in. If the watering hole is in the Lounge or a sub forum of the lounge, new members would not know of its existence, and they would therefore not be encouraged to explore outside of their device forum anyway.

    However, I'm only here because of EarlyMon's link from a new S2 users' off-topic thread recently moved to the Lounge, where the guys wanted to remain inside their "All Things Root" subforum, and he invited them here to join the discussion. Now because this was a short thread with not too many posts, I thought I'd take a look at it, and became quite interested in their plight. They seem like a nice bunch of guys who enjoy hanging out together, with a real sense of mutual appreciation which was actually touching.

    The thing is, although there is currently a "Moved" post within the original forum pointing to the new location in the Lounge, this will soon disappear and new users will not know about its ever existing. Also, a problem I see with moving off topic watering holes to the Lounge or a sub-forum of the Lounge is that the frequenters of those watering holes will no longer be reading their original device forums because they will be looking in the Lounge for the latest post to the thread. If the thread was within its original device forum, those members would also see other threads in the forum and possibly reply to them, or read some device-specific news they would not otherwise hear of. In essence, they would be less isolated from their larger community of same-device users. With sequestered or remote watering hole threads, users with device experience are being removed from the very forums in which they would be an invaluable resource to other users in need of help - particularly in the case of the "All Things Root" crew mentioned earlier.

    If all the S2 rooting veterans are off in the Lounge or Social Group chatting away, who is going to help some desperate noob who's just sent his S2 into a bootloop?

    Now one argument is that I would never have likely known their existence if the thread weren't in the Lounge, but I would probably not have read the thread if it had not been a new one. I have little inclination to try butting into some 1000-post thread frequented by people who have got to know each other and at least have their device in common, and so I don't feel those watering holes being in the Lounge is going to lessen the segregation and clique-making that is inevitable in any community.

    So, if you haven't already guessed, my choice would be option 3 ;)
  22. Liamo_210

    Liamo_210 Well-Known Member

    Maybe create a sub-forum in the lounge for the ones that are constantly being posted in. I.e s3 watering hole ,gnex, tablet tavern, etc.

    This way they wont be always at the top on the lounge thread list. I really think that they cannot be done away with though ad many users enjoy being able to chat and catch up in these threads including myself and it would be a real deterent if they were done away with.
    Rxpert83 likes this.
  23. dynomot

    dynomot Well-Known Member

    TBH I feel I've come to this discussion late and I still regard myself as a bit of a newbie, both to the world of Phandroid and Android in general. I think we need one of the four options and that option sticking to. If it takes an open poll to run for a while to make the decision, great. In the event of a "dead poll" admin and the site owner should make a decision. In my opinion that's the only way to make it democratic and fair. Democracies need rules and leaders or they're just talking shops where nothing gets acted upon.

    My preferred option would be 3 - a BS sticky thread in each devices sub forum. With a clear one post announcement in the lounge that a BS general watering hole threads are there and are just that.

    Thats my input. I realise 3 could be difficult to mod, but there you go. I've had my say.
  24. Squinty13

    Squinty13 Well-Known Member

    One 'Watering Hole' thread per device, stickied in the *edit* primary forum of each device.

    Most people don't step outside of their device forum, so it makes no sense to place a thread involving these people elsewhere.

    I could go on but it all seems a bit silly really....
  25. EarlyMon

    EarlyMon The PearlyMon Moderator

    So only rooted users get to discover the off-topic thread?
    Gmash likes this.

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