Political fund raising


  1. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    IMO the source is right of center, but it and Fox News are the only ones I've found that mentioned the foreign political contributions.

    Foreign Cash Disqualifies Romney from Presidential Bid | Veterans Today

    "No other American presidential candidate has ever left the US to garner campaign contributions from foreign citizens.

    There is a reason for this, one that Romney and his staff seem oblivious to and the mainstream media had ignored until just recently.

    Using foreign contributions in any American election is a felony. Hello Romney campaign

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  2. RazorSharp

    RazorSharp Well-Known Member

  3. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Karl and the Koch brothers contending to be the Dark Pool masters. Right now, believe Karl is ahead, base on money spent, but too early to call.

    Two Dark Money Groups Outspending All Super PACs Combined - ProPublica

    "Crossroads GPS, or Crossroads Grassroots Policy Strategies, is the brainchild of GOP strategist Karl Rove, and spent an estimated $41.7 million. Americans for Prosperity, credited with helping launch the Tea Party movement, is backed in part by billionaire brothers David and Charles Koch, and spent an estimated $18.2 million."

    "First of all, it shows how much desire there is for secrecy among huge donors who want to be able to spend money to influence this election without leaving any fingerprints," said Fred Wertheimer, who runs Democracy 21, a watchdog group. "Secondly, it shows that so far, there is an enormous advantage being played in this election by just two groups that are exercising undue influence in the elections."
  4. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    So spending lots of money is just as evil as having lots of money? Got it.
  5. saptech

    saptech Well-Known Member

    A.Nonymous, if that is true, you don't agree it is evil how they spend the money to influence the election?

    Why do you always twist around what others say?
  6. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Evil is such a subjective word, I heard a story about this mythical guy saying it's impossible for the rich to get into nirvana, so by implication, the rich are evil. The nerve of this guy questioning the divine right of the rich. Good thing the authorities removed this nut from society. Many claim this story is just a fable, so I suggest we not fret about it.

    Anyway, getting back to reality, bribery or extortion are against the law, which I guess one could call evil, but I believe the technical term is unlawful.

    Let's use common sense, when a very select group of people, that are very wealthy and well aware of the value of money and how to invest money to obtain high ROI, make hidden expenditures to select or deselect individuals to make and enforce laws are not fools. Now some of these select group's servants were caught repeatedly in illegal actions that financially benefited their business interest, just proves the need for further investments to curtail enforcement or modify the law.

    Now as this is a business decision, one needs to hire experts, which is just a business expense to insure those seeking elective office are well aware that these select individuals will spend whatever it takes to promote those candidates that support or denigrate those that do not support their business interest.

    Marketing and competitive research are effective tools to promote one's business interest and is much more effective if the competition cannot match one's expenditures, so these tools will be used extensively.
  7. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    Which mythical guy told that story? I've certainly never heard it though I'm hardly an expert on every religion or myth. Jesus was certainly not against rich people. John 3 is an account of him speaking with a man who was very rich and came to him by night lest his social status be jeapardized. Not once did he condemn this man for being wealthy. In fact, Jesus was buried in a rich man's tomb so clearly his followers didn't think they were desecrating his body by doing so. Clearly the founder of Christianity had no issues with wealth. Jews are frequently found running various banks and other financial institutions and historically have done so. Judaism would not appear to have any issues with rich people. Muhammed died penniless of course. We all know that. Islamic teaching generally teaches that all wealth belongs to Allah and we simply manage it and will be required, one day, to give account for what we have done with our wealth. It does not teach against the acquisition of wealth but rather teaches against the obsession with acquiring wealth. This teaching is not unusual in western religions. I can't speak for eastern religions views on them. I'm not particularly knowledgeable in eastern religions. Certainly the three major western religions have no problems with rich people. I'm not familiar at all with the mythical guy you speak of though I'm interested in him as exploring various religions fascinates me.

    You realize that the filthy rich fund both right wing causes and left wing causes right? Democrats have been known to have $150k a plate fundraisers just as much as Republicans do.
  8. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Well $150k is peanuts compared to one individual pledging $100m to defeat Obama.

    I guess it's which part one is selecting. There's probably better venues to discuss religious scholarship.

    Anyway let's get away from religion and discuss the business case part as previously posted.

    "Anyway, getting back to reality, bribery or extortion are against the law, which I guess one could call evil, but I believe the technical term is unlawful.

    Let's use common sense, when a very select group of people, that are very wealthy and well aware of the value of money and how to invest money to obtain high ROI, make hidden expenditures to select or deselect individuals to make and enforce laws are not fools. Now some of these select group's servants were caught repeatedly in illegal actions that financially benefited their business interest, just proves the need for further investments to curtail enforcement or modify the law.

    Now as this is a business decision, one needs to hire experts, which is just a business expense to insure those seeking elective office are well aware that these select individuals will spend whatever it takes to promote those candidates that support or denigrate those that do not support their business interest.

    Marketing and competitive research are effective tools to promote one's business interest and is much more effective if the competition cannot match one's expenditures, so these tools will be used extensively."
  9. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    I just realized you said nirvana. That's what I get for half reading late at night while trying to set up a new phone. That means it's an eastern religion, not a western one as nirvana is a term used in mainly Eastern religions. Can you at least give me the name of this teacher and a link to the story so I can explore it on my own?
  10. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    There's probably better venues to discuss religious scholarship. Do you wish to discuss the business case.
  11. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    Both sides have wealthy backers. You do realize that right? There is no business case. Wealthy people back Romney. Wealthy people back Obama. Nothing new or surprising there. The wealthy are as politically divided as the rest of America. Hardly news.

    Wasn't really wanting to discuss the religious questions, just wanted the name of the teacher and, if possible, a link to the story. I'm fascinated by people's beliefs on wealth and how that impacts how wealthy they actually become. I have a theory that people who think it's bad to be rich subconsciously make decisions that lead them away from wealth. Obviously one's views on wealth are going to be influenced by their religious beliefs (or lack thereof). So I'm curious of the name of this teacher who appears to be from some eastern religion and a link to this teaching as well if you've got it. I don't intend to discuss it here, just want to do some research on my own. I know very little about eastern religions and I am curious how one's religious views affect one's views on wealth so this is a chance to do both.
  12. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    By using the terms, "I heard a story ...", "... mythical guy ...", "... this story is just a fable ...", most would conclude this is a fable.

    As you are interested in fables, this one concerns a religion which is always evolving to reflect its creators and their various factions. It's like multiple choice with no wrong answers.

    Christian views on poverty and wealth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    "Wealth as an offense to faith

    According to Kahan, there is a strand of Christianity that views the wealthy man as "especially sinful". In this strand of Christianity, Kahan asserts, the day of judgment is viewed as a time when "the social order will be turned upside down and ... the poor will turn out to be the ones truly blessed."[5]

    David Miller suggests that this view is similar to that of the third century Manicheans who saw the spiritual world as being good and the material world as evil with the two being in irreconcilable conflict with each other.[4] Thus, this strand of Christianity exhorts Christians to renounce material and worldly pleasures in order to follow Jesus. As an example, Miller cites Jesus' injunction to his disciples to "take nothing for the journey."Mark 6:8-9"

    "Wealth as an obstacle to faith

    [FONT=&quot]A[/FONT]ccording to David Miller, Martin Luther viewed Mammon (or the desire for wealth) as "the most common idol on earth". Miller cites Jesus' encounter with the rich ruler Mark 10:17-31 {{{3}}} as an example of wealth being an obstacle to faith. According to Miller, it is not the rich man's wealth per se that is the obstacle but rather the man's reluctance to give up that wealth in order to follow Jesus. Miller cites Paul's observation in 1st Timothy that,
  13. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    I respect your lack of knowledge on business. The business case didn't mention either party or candidates.
  14. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

  15. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Which part of "I heard a story" is unclear ?

    The section "Wealth as an offense to faith" is a warning about riches.

    The main issue of the business case I presented is the very few extremely wealthy entities control government leadership, the making and enforcement of laws.

    The recent financial crisis were a result of regulations and laws were changed to gut the prevention of said crisis and/or intimidate LEO from investigating crimes because the perpetuators had too much "juice" .

    There are too many that worship the extremely wealthy that blinds them from examination of how obtained. Just because one is extremely wealthy doesn't make one divine or evil.

    The premise that the large extremes of wealth is the result of the .5% of the population being superior, smart and hard working as opposed to the inferior, stupid, and lazy 99.5% is pure propaganda.
  16. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    I've never heard this story. I'd like to read the thing. Study the context. See what else this fabled person might've said, etc....... Ugh. Apparently too much to ask.

    I agree that the premise that 99.5% of the population is lazy and stupid is wrong. The idea that all rich people is evil is equally stupid as is the idea that these people all became rich by some sort of underhanded dealings.
  17. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Just make up your own fable, it's the IN thing to do and can be quite profitable.
  18. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Anonymous Billionaires are Stealing Your Election with Attack Ads | Informed Comment

    "The ‘dark money’ PACs are outspending everyone else. Crossroads GPS, founded by Karl Rove and backed by anonymous big-money donors, has bought negative attack ads against President Obama to the tune of $52 million! The Koch brothers’ Americans for Prosperity spent $20.6 million. The political parties and the Super PACs, which have to identify the source of their funds, are making a much smaller contribution."
  19. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    These are "anonymous" billionaires yet you publish their names?
  20. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    The author of the article is referring to (c)(4) money, which is anonymous.
  21. Speed Daemon

    Speed Daemon Disabled

    No, the SuperPACs operate under 501(c)(4), which is a whole 'nuther animal. I know from experience running 501(c)(3) organizations that they must be a VERY open book. No anonymity in a 501(c)(3)!
  22. A.Nonymous

    A.Nonymous Well-Known Member

    Democrats whining about super PACs always amuses me. It's been pretty well documented that they've started super PACs of their own and had limited success. Wealthy Democrats just won't open their wallets for them. Republicans raise more money than Democrats because their donors are more willing to give.
  23. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    I stand corrected. I changed in previous post.:eek:
  24. OutofDate1980

    OutofDate1980 Well-Known Member

    Yeh, the serfs got conditioned by the false heresy of, "trust but verify". It's a blessed joy Saint Romney is conditioning the unworthy to obey the divine right of the sociopathic rich, or at least their servants, by not providing tax returns for the unworthy to determine if said Saint is [Fill-In-The-Blank].

    I beg my, [Fill-In-The-Blank], who is of full so of [Fill-In-The-Blank], due to his forgiveness of his Masters forgiveness of his hopeful servitude to the blessed Koch brothers, who's lawsuit against his Mother, would have resulted in death by stoning, by accepted [Fill-In-The-Blank] doctrine.

    Yeh, who is so anointed by the sociopathic rich, who need not provide proof of "It's been pretty well documented that [Democrats] started super PACs of their own and had limited success."

    This heresy must be punished "As noted, Super PACs were made possible by two judicial decisions. "First, in January 2010 the U.S. Supreme Court held in Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission that government may not prohibit unions and corporations from making independent expenditure for political purposes. Two months later, in Speechnow.org v. FEC, the Federal Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit held that contributions to groups that only make independent expenditures could not be limited in the size and source of contributions to the group.[7]"

    Political action committee - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Yeh, it is gospel that the sociopathic rich are divine, blessed be the Saints. Crime boss - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
  25. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Well-Known Member

    Havent Western governments been funding the Russian opposition for years? I think the bigger issue here is that Romney is surrounded by Zionists.

    LOL Koch brothers. Heres an idea. Ban corporate donations and state fund parties.
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