Tiered Data coming soon...


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  1. bmwrin1990

    bmwrin1990 Member This Topic's Starter

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  2. kenn

    kenn Well-Known Member

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    If they take it away, I'll be done with Verizon and back to Sprint. Period.
     
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  3. JustinHEMI

    JustinHEMI Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Verizon can kiss my butt.
     
  4. bmwrin1990

    bmwrin1990 Member This Topic's Starter

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    well i would agree, but at&t is already tiered and sprint is talking about it (depending on if people abuse it)
    and im sure as hell not going with tmobile...so not many options if it happens, which according to the post is very likely
     
  5. Joan006

    Joan006 Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking, if you use Wi_fi as much as possible, something we might not be doing now, wouldn't that cut down on data usage?
    I've had my X for awhile now and last month i decided to use WiFi as much as I could remember to, and I managed to keep my data usage under 500 MB. Priviously, it was around 700, but I also had just reveived my DX and was on it ALOT and didn't know about the WiFi stuff.
    I don't stream movies or anything, just alot of FB/twitter updates and normal usage pretty much.
     
  6. Joan006

    Joan006 Well-Known Member

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    I just copied this off AT&T's website...it would work out to be cheaper for us who use under 2GB then what we're paying now! MAYBE, Verizon will use a plan similar to this!!!!

    DataPro 2 GB for Smartphone

    SUMMARY

    Includes:
    2 GB of data
    Unlimited AT&T Wi-Fi Basic usage!
    Designed for Smartphone users who primarily:

    Stream music from music services such as AT&T Music
    Watch videos on YouTube
    Download apps and files
    Surf the web
    Send and receive personal email
    Visit social networking sites
    Use search engines
    Reference Wikipedia and other reference sites
    Shop and pay bills online
    Get maps and directions
    Is it the right amount of data for you?
    Try the AT&T Data Usage Calculator tool to estimate how much data you use every month.

    How do I use AT&T Wi-Fi Basic?
    Most Smartphones have Wi-Fi built in! You can connect quickly and seamlessly to your home wireless network or to more than 20,000 AT&T Wi-Fi Hot Spots in the U.S at no additional charge. Find an AT&T Hot Spot near you. A Wi-Fi enabled device required. Other restrictions apply. See AT&T Wi-Fi for additional services details and locations.

    What if I go over 2 GB?
    DataPro 2 GB for Smartphone includes 2 GB of data for use in the U.S. If 2 GB is exceeded, an additional 1 GB is automatically provided at a rate of $10 for each additional 1 GB. All data allowances, including overages, must be used in the billing period in which the allowance is provided. For more details on Data Plans, go to Data Plans with Wi-Fi - DataPlus & DataPro Plan - Wireless from AT&T.


    Other Monthly Charges Plan Terms Online Pricing
    Returns Policy & Early Termination Fee Additional Messaging & Data Charges
    Shipping Information
    Monthly Price $25.00
     
  7. binary visions

    binary visions Well-Known Member

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    I think the knee-jerk reaction to this is funny.

    OMG IF THEY DO THIS I'M GOING TO <INSERT OTHER CARRIER>.

    Of course they're going to do tiered data. Every major carrier is going to do tiered data. Sprint will have the luxury of taking longer to do it because they're a smaller carrier, but eventually it'll come to them, too (besides, who wants to trade coverage for unlimited data? Your data is useless if you can't get a signal).

    In a surprisingly short amount of time, you will see "minutes" and "sms" packages go away entirely - everything will be VOIP, and you will buy a data package that suits your needs. There will probably be a voice data package and a bulk data package because the voice traffic will get higher priority over the network but it's still going to be tiered data.

    This isn't a surprise. This isn't an attack on consumers. This isn't an affront to the industry. You are consuming a service and you will have to pay for how much of the service you consume. Shocking, I know.

    Next thing you know, the electrical companies are going to start charging based on how much electricity you consume...
     
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  8. phobic

    phobic Well-Known Member

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    Finally someone else that knows this will soon be the standard. No one should really be surprised by this and it's only a matter of time before the other carriers follow.
     
  9. binary visions

    binary visions Well-Known Member

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    Yep, and I can't really see why people get mad about it. It's a measured, service with a finite amount available. The more you consume, the more it costs the provider and the less is available for those around you. So why shouldn't you be charged more if you consume a lot of data?
     
  10. SFWB

    SFWB Well-Known Member

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    I use wifi as much as possible and haven't gone over 1 GB...

    But, I will enjoy being grandfathered with my unlimited plan.
     
  11. bigbadwulff

    bigbadwulff Well-Known Member

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    You can thank those that are rooted and use tons of data for this. Sorry but that is the way it is. A few ruin things for the rest of us. Happens all the time in all aspects of society.
    Just like cable pirates.
     
  12. SFWB

    SFWB Well-Known Member

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    How does rooting use tons of data?

    I assuming you mean those who rooted so that they can tether and go nuts?
     
  13. igotgame

    igotgame Well-Known Member

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    I am still grandfathered in with my Alltel plan and my 26% discount from where I work.

    There is no way in hell I will ever change from Verizon or change my plan...my grandfathered plan absolutely crushes anything Verizon can offer with unlimited data included obviously.
     
  14. chammer

    chammer Active Member

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    People get mad because technology, and the world around us is constantly evolving and *advancing*. Starting from the top of the top, unlimited, and taking steps to go backwards in an attempt to thwart what you yourselves have started instead of improving the network is a load of garbage. Any sane person would agree.

    More and more services are being offered which utilize data, and more and more people are growing accustomed to having their social networking, web, YouTube, etc at their finger tips. Obviously this all uses data, and lots of it in some cases.

    While it's true that most users will never use more than XXXmb, and could even save money, thats really not even remotely close to the bloody point. The point is these companies are offering us more and more services (or the ability to use said services) via our data connection, getting us addicted and not caring about what and when we use said data, and then will take it away. Leaving us, the users, to constantly be worried and constantly be monitoring our connections.

    No, sorry. This is BS any way you slice it and to defend their move in this direction is even more BS. I get unlimited internet at home. I also work in IT, so yes, I know how finite a resource bandwidth *can* be. However, with network upgrades comes increased capacity. The capacity to handle what you, as a company, promised would be available. Now you're going back on your promise (and even perhaps the responsibility of having to spend money to further upgrade your network) by telling the customer, "Oh...too bad. This is how it is now."

    No, sorry, this is BS plain and simple. Unfortunately, whats an even bigger load of BS...is the fact that as people who use this service have absolutely no control over Verizon (or any other companies) decision to do this. Sadly, they (all of them) can and do get away with bloody murder and yet people still support them.

    Amazing.

    (...and no, I myself personally don't use a lot of data. When I had my BlackBerry it was common to have only 30-40mb in a whole month. I've been using more with my Android device simply because it's brand new. Once I have things setup I will probably see no more than 100-200mb at most, but again...that's not the point.)
     
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  15. dawnierae

    dawnierae Well-Known Member

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    I haven't read anything about being grandfathered in indefinitely (until you change the feature). I can imagine they may grandfather you in until you renew your contract (when you upgrade your phone), but not that they would do it indefinitely.
     
  16. deathratlehead

    deathratlehead Well-Known Member

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    Cool story bro.
     
  17. binary visions

    binary visions Well-Known Member

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    Wrong. Unlimited data is allowed now because the numbers worked out that they had lots of capacity but not a lot of high volume users. Now that there are a lot of high volume users, they have to provide some mechanism by which their network becomes scalable again.

    Gosh, I see. So they're responsible for your data usage. Who is "they" by the way? Is Verizon the one coding the software on your smartphone? Is Verizon the one who set your app's polling intervals at 5 minutes? Is Verizon the one who wrote the YouTube app? Is Verizon the one who is holding the phone downloading videos all day?

    See, I believe that there's personal responsibility to be had. You don't have to rabidly check your usage. There are lots and lots of tools to monitor data usage and "any sane person" will very rapidly develop an internal baseline, just like you know when you decide to turn your air conditioning down to 65, your electricity bill will increase.

    If you work in IT, you'll know that wireless data is orders of magnitude more expensive than data transmitted over wires.

    This is so absurd I don't even know where to start. Nobody promised you anything. You bought a service and they are supplying you the service. They didn't say that in 10 years the service would be the same. Gas prices used to be cheaper, and nobody promised me that would remain constant. Prices fluctuate and infrastructures adapt to meet needs. The entire world's economy runs on this fact. As resources become saturated, the cost to acquire them goes up.

    I feel like I'm on another planet here. This is incredibly simple:

    - Up until now, mobile data usage has been very low, which has allowed carriers to offer an unlimited amount of a fixed resource, because they had a reasonable expectation that "unlimited" would not exceed their capacity.

    - Now that smartphones are saturating the market, data usage has gone up exponentially. Unlimited plans are no longer feasible for the prices they are offered.

    Get mad about it if you want. It's wasted energy. This is an eminently reasonable thing for all the wireless carriers to do.
     
  18. Martimus

    Martimus One bite at a time... Moderator

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    In my opinion what is happening here has been planned and thought out by the carriers for a long time. This is not a surprise to them and it shouldn't be a surprise to us either. Where it'll likely impact us is that our current unlimited plans will expire the next time we update our contracts. My guess is that nobody will be "grandfathered" indefinitely.

    As wireless data technology improves it does create certain challenges for the carriers, namely how to handle larger amounts of data at the cell site. Currently most cell towers are connected to the Internet using T1 circuits. At 1.544 Mbps each, this usually means that there are multiple T1's supporting each cell tower. Most current network routers can't support all that many simultaneous T1's so the carriers get creative and use DS3 multiplexors to de-mux the T1's into fractional T3 circuits. This solves one problem for them but adds yet another device (and more complexity) to the mix.

    At the Telco I work for, we are pursuing a program of extending fiber optic cable to cell sites. Why? Because fiber can drive significantly more data than copper T1's and, over time, the fiber circuits can be expanded as technology allows. The challenge with this program is that digging up roads, highways, and private property all over our region to bury fiber is very expensive and time consuming. Some municipal governments won't even let us proceed quickly because construction on roadways impedes traffic or requires additional maintenance that the city can't always afford to do. The flip side to this upgrade, however, is that fiber optic circuits tends to also still be expensive to operate. Why? Because the hardware manufacturers still charge a lot of money for their highest capacity and/or longest range fiber optic modules (and the routers that will support them).

    Performance improvements will continue to happen at cell sites. I think that's a given. But they are currently constrained by technology and cost. And carriers don't typically absorb all these costs by themselves. They pass them along to us. So unless all Smartphone users can all agree to pay more each month for data I suspect tiered pricing is a reality in our respective futures...
     
  19. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if the new tiered plan would count OS upgrade data towards usage. Even when I was on wifi yesterday, the OTA update still came over the air and although I'm not charged for the data, it does show up in the data usage in my account as a 63MB download.
     
  20. chammer

    chammer Active Member

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    So by your logic, our cable and DSL providers should have gone to tiered data instead of actually having half a clue and scaled their networks for all our Hulu and YouTube usage today which eats up gigs and gigs of data. Right?

    I believe I understand your base logic, but to be honest, it doesn't make any sense. With technology as things evolve, expand, and get better, things get upgraded. This includes networks. If you have over sold your capacity you increase said capacity. You don't rip off customers by imposing artificial limits and keeping all the profits for your self. It's really basic supply and demand. They supply, we demand; We demand, they supply. In this case what we are demanding is currently what they supply, but they wish to change that where they are now demanding from us what they will supply. That's not how a free economy is supposed to work.


    They are the major corporations who believe they can get away with constantly screwing over the customer. Verizon ARE the ones coding the software, actually. Who do you think customizes the firmware with apps like Blockbuster and the like. Sure, it's probably actually coded by the likes of Motorola, but it's based on specifications given by Verizon on what they want on their product, and how they want it done.

    I'm not saying there's not personal responsibility, and personally speaking I have it. Can I, as a rooted user, obtain free tethering and stream gigs of data from Verizons network over my phone to my laptop? Sure. Do I? No. I don't see the benefit myself. If I can't do something on my phone, then I wait until I get home and do it there.

    I'm well aware there are apps/tools/widgets/etc to monitor data usage. Point remains, we shouldn't have to. They sold us something, and are going back on their end of the bargain.

    I work in IT with wired connections. Wireless is not my area of expertise. What it costs to transmit data wireless is something I cannot comment on, nor will I. However, generally speaking what I've stated holds true in any field. If you cannot supply what your customers demand, then you upgrade until you can meet said supply. Digital media companies are the only ones these days who think they are some how above this, and try every way possible to nickle and dime their customers to screw them over. What surprises me more than that, is the fact the sheeple let them get away with it because they "need" it. *Sigh*

    Our company is constantly upgrading and expanding so that we can meet the growing needs of our bandwidth demands, and the loads it puts on our servers. Again, by your logic that companies should not be compelled into expanding and upgrading I guess we should have just told our users, "Sorry, but you can now only visit this site 10 times a day instead of as much as you'd like." Right?


    Actually, you're so very wrong. They ARE promising a service. What do you think the contract is for? They agreed to supply me with unlimited data, and I agreed to pay them for said unlimited data. What is so hard about that to figure out? Your gas analogy holds no water in the technology industry. Oil prices rise and fall, data is a static resource. While its finite in the capacity fibre, copper, servers, etc can handle, capacity can always be increased. The same cannot be said of oil as there's no way to make any more. Likewise, data doesn't cost $0.10 this week, and $0.15 the next.

    Now that smart phones are saturating the market is no reason to pull unlimited data. It simply means its time to use all that money that your millions of customers are paying you and using it to continuing to build out your infrastructure. We have so much fibre in this country thats dark it's sad. Everyone (within reason) could have fibre to the home with 100mbit or more speeds and still not come close to saturating the bandwidth we have if we turned it on. However, they get away with this because they sell us 1/10/20/50mbit connections for $X/month. Connections which come complete with unlimited data transfer.

    Even scaling the price up doesn't make sense. I'm still paying around the same amount monthly for my cable connection that I did 10 years ago, but its an order of magnatudes faster than it was back then. All while retaining unlimited transfer. It's because of infrastructure upgrades that allows this.

    To sit back and defend the mobile industry for some how being above this basic law of supply and demand is insulting at best. I'm glad you're happy with how things are going, but I'd not be surprised to find that you're in the minority. I do, however, believe that it doesn't help my side of the fence when people are constantly rooting and tethering their devices so that they may download torrents, and other bandwidth intensive things 24/7. They are the ones that have truly spoiled this for everyone else, and I don't think we'd be here discussing this otherwise.

    Anyways, this is how I feel, and this is how you feel. I'm not attacking you, and I apologize if it comes off that way. Everyone has the right to voice their opinion, and I am merely doing so. Even though I disagree with your opinion, I do respect it.

    At any rate I'm done with this topic. I generally refrain from commenting on issues such as this because usually no matter how or what you say, it usually either sounds like a flamewar or turns into one. I guess this was the straw that broke the camels back, and I had to say something. :(
     
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  21. JustinHEMI

    JustinHEMI Well-Known Member

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    Chammer I am with you. It is customers that just lay down for these corporations that allow this to happen. What surprises me though, is that not only do they lay down, they then defend the behavior. Way to go Verizon! Another area about to happen is pay for play for pc online gaming. I wont be doing that either, but enough will that the company will get away with it. Sad.
     
  22. binary visions

    binary visions Well-Known Member

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    It's not "laying down."

    You guys really have no idea how supply and demand works.

    Oh well.
     
  23. JustinHEMI

    JustinHEMI Well-Known Member

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    LOL yeah, we do. That is the point. Some people, you for example, are willing to pay more for less. Others, me for example, are not. However, because of the other subset of people, everyone will be forced into it, or forced out of it. I will be forced out because I wont pay more for less.
     
  24. Anemone

    Anemone Active Member

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  25. dylo22

    dylo22 Well-Known Member

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    Dude, radio spectrum is finite. There are only so many frequencies available for carriers to use. You make it sound like they can just create bandwidth out of thin air. Carriers can manage what they have by improving on the technology they use for data transfer, but in the end they still have to work with in the boundaries of the radio spectrum they are alloted.
     
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