Verizon Not Allowing Retail Purchased Phones to Retain Unlimited?

[Rachel A]

Personally I would not refund jack. If he did not do hid home work, tough on him. You did not lie to him. You put out information that was put out by various Verizon pr reps over this issue. That said, Verizon can't mandate that you must buy from them, in order to use their network.

I agree except we're not talking about what they will allow on the network, but what the terms and conditions of the contract will be considering they want you off the unlimited plan. That's my only point here.

 

[UncleMike]

The question is is there anything right with it? It flows as though it's been trimmed and edited or even just made up. He doesn't clarify that he already has a phone on unlimited and would like to keep that plan.



Have the buyer refer to paragraph 7 of this page:

Share Everything

Have the buyer start a new chat session with a CSR and have him ask this question:

"Hi, I am a current Verizon customer. I have a smartphone with unlimited data. I would like to upgrade my phone and keep my current unlimited data plan *as is* without changing it or extending my contract. I understand that if I purchase a Samsung Galaxy S3 through retail or other third party without using my subsidized upgrade that I may activate the new phone on my account without making any plan changes or extending my contract."

And have them send you the unedited transcript.

I disagree with the bolded part above, and believe any mention of the word "upgrade" will be problematic. What the buyer really wants to do is activate a different phone on that line.

 

[Rachel A]

Agreed. The word upgrade to VZW may be like a red rag to a bull

 

[TzuDohNihm]

Corporate store employees say there is no scenario in which they would not activate a SGIII under an existing plan if it was brought in purchased at retail. I asked them if moving from a 3G phone to a 4G would be a problem and they said no.

Then after I leave I get this email:

Here is the full text of the chat I had with Verizon Wireless about using a SG3 to continue my unlimited data plan. Since I would have to enter into a new contract (which does not offer unlimited data) I would no longer have access to unlimited data even with a pre-purchased phone. I am currently using a Samsung Galaxy S II phone with the Nationwide 450 plan. I'm eligible for upgrade in September with the contract expiring in January.

Please hold for a Verizon Wireless sales representative to assist you with your order. Thank you for your patience.

You are now chatting with 'Jonqueshia'

You: what prepaid plans do you have for the Galaxy S III?

Jonqueshia: We currently have no prepaid plans for that device.

You: can i use that phone without a contract after july 11?

Jonqueshia: No it requires a contract.

You: can i use a verizon gs3 phone bought elsewhere with my current VZ contract?

Jonqueshia: What is your current plan?

You: 450 min peak, unlimited data

Jonqueshia: We currently no longer have that plan.

So many things are wrong with this. Again, Verizon never had a Galaxy S2 variant and Google only offered me one New York Craigslist ad talking about flashing a Sprint SG2 onto Verizon pre-paid.

But then the guy goes and says he has a contract with renewal in September and ending in January.

My feeling at this point is as follows:

1) If he has a contract there is no reason he cannot activate the phone and am not feeling inclined to cancel the transaction

2) If this guy is savvy enough to have gotten a Sprint Galaxy S2 flashed to Verizon pre-paid then I am not inclined to cancel the transaction because he should have been knowledgeable enough to find out PRIOR TO PURCHASING whether or not a SGIII could be activated on a pre-paid line.

 

[Rachel A]

So I called VZW and asked them if there was any differentiation between activating a phone purchased elsewhere or VZW and they said no. To confirm it still further I asked if the only differentiator was buying it subsidized or not and she said yes.

I know that eBay invariably sides with the buyer on disputes but I'd personally ask the buyer to confirm and prove that they have a preexisting active plan with Verizon that included unlimited data.

I think the problem here is that you made that statement in your description which the buyer is now trying to exploit. Chances are if you'd said nothing you'd be OK. That said, I get why you did say what you did.

If I were Judge Judy here I would side with you myself..

I'm also a little confused - does the buyer have a prepaid plan or a contract? As far as I know they're mutually exclusive. I thought prepaid was month to month and therefore VZW would have the right to change the plan at any time or am I missing something here?

 

[Aokusman]

Yeah you should not have proclaimed so boldly that he could use it and keep his unlimited plan. I also think the buyer is not very wise and is being sold BS by the reps. I rremember a delta airlines counter person tried to charge me for my second checked luggage, even though delta allowed military personal check 2 free bags. She sis it wasn't their policy till i showed her the print out from delta.com. Op why don't u call Verizon yourself and inquire. Also take all the money out of your papal account before they freeze it.

 

[dirkbonn]

With all the headaches this may be causing you, your other option is to refund his money minus any costs you have incurred and resell it on ebay. I'm not saying that this is what you should do but it is an option.

Best of luck to you whatever you decide to do.

 

[TzuDohNihm]

Update. Basically this guy is asking the wrong set of questions to ignorant VZW CSR's.

I am using the Samsung Fascinate, which is a Galaxy S phone. My mistake on the number designation. I can understand your confusion on that part.
The text of the chat is the actual chat (copied and pasted) in which I was asking if I could use the SG3 with a prepaid plan when my plan expires. The answer was no.

I then asked if I could use the SG3 with my current contract so as to continue my unlimited data plan.

The Verizon representative went on to say (again, verbatim copy and paste):

You: You don't have nationwide talk 450 anymore?

Jonqueshia: So it would be unavailable to use with that phone.

That's pretty clear to me. I will forward our emails to PayPal and request a refund since the sale was advertised with false assurance of services.

I sent the following as a response.

Thank you for clarification on the phone and your contract circumstances. Your chat with the VZW CSR is incorrect from both her side and the way you worded your questions/requests.

First, I have the same plan as you in the Nationwide 450 minutes with unlimited text and unlimited data. Because I was going to be purchasing a full priced Incredible 4G I investigated the changes to my account quite extensively.

Second, you will be allowed to activate the GSIII on your current plan with no problem and keep your unlimited data, you do not need to make any changes to or even bring up the type of monthly plan you have when you activate the phone. You will simply go to your local VZW store with the phone and ask them to activate it and deactivate your Fascinate.

Third, requesting information about pre-paid plans is incorrect from your end of the conversation. When your plan ends in January you do not need to change it or make any modifications to it. It will simply continue as is on a month to month basis. I can assure you this is the case because my upgrade was in December 2011 and my contract actually ended in April of 2012 and I had made no changes to my plan prior to June 26th when I pre-ordered the SIII.

Per all of the above none of the statements made in my listing were "false assurances of services".

If you speak to another CSR or, better still, go to a VZW store(corporate is best because "Authorized Reseller" stores have their own set of rules) and tell them you wish to activate a GSIII when it arrives they will tell you that this is well within the realms of possibility. Once again, in January when your contract ends you will not need to make any changes to it as it will continue on as is.

I am leaning on this being less that this guy is clueless but that he actually has second thoughts about spending $650 on a phone and if he continues with this ludicrous attempt to get a refund through Paypal I hope they realize he is full of shit.

*EDIT* To Aokusman, for some reason the money is still pending which is odd because my Paypal and Ebay accounts are as old as the hills.

To dirkbonn, Yeah but at this point I am getting pissed because I think he's just being a shyster and trying to back out of a legitimate auction. So I'll most likely see it to it's bitter end because I am an asshole like that.

 

[FragDroidX]

I do believe that while Verizon will allow phones purchased at full retail to remain on unlimited data it has to be like plan to like plan. 3G plans and 4G plans are considered as separate plans. So regardless of whether the phone was bought at full retail going from a 3G plan to a 4G plan constitutes a change in the plan and a loss of unlimited data. I am guessing this person is having buyers remorse and now wants his money back. In my opinion you should fulfill your end of the bargain and send him his purchased product and be done with the deal.

 

[sorka]

I disagree with the bolded part above, and believe any mention of the word "upgrade" will be problematic. What the buyer really wants to do is activate a different phone on that line.

Agreed. That would be better wording.

 

[UncleMike]

...Yeah but at this point I am getting pissed because I think he's just being a shyster and trying to back out of a legitimate auction. So I'll most likely see it to it's bitter end because I am an asshole like that.

It's been a long time since I sold anything on eBay, but from what I remember the seller was required to have device on hand. A transaction like yours would not have been permitted.

I would love to see you stick it to this guy, as I believe he's trying to wiggle his way out of the deal. But in the end you'll probably save yourself a lot of grief if you just refund the purchase price, and cancel the transaction on eBay (you'll get your final value fee refunded), and relist the item without the claim of the buyer being able to maintain their current plan. By the time you do all this you could have the device in hand, ship it ASAP after the sale, and be done with it.

 

[TzuDohNihm]

I do believe that while Verizon will allow phones purchased at full retail to remain on unlimited data it has to be like plan to like plan. 3G plans and 4G plans are considered as separate plans. So regardless of whether the phone was bought at full retail going from a 3G plan to a 4G plan constitutes a change in the plan and a loss of unlimited data. I am guessing this person is having buyers remorse and now wants his money back. In my opinion you should fulfill your end of the bargain and send him his purchased product and be done with the deal.

Check one of my posts above from today. I specifically brought up a change from 3G to 4G at the corporate store and the employees I was speaking with said that would not matter for purposes of keeping unlimited.

At this point when the phone arrives I will ship it as promised and be done with it unless Paypal and Ebay want to be idiots about it.

 

[sorka]

I do believe that while Verizon will allow phones purchased at full retail to remain on unlimited data it has to be like plan to like plan. 3G plans and 4G plans are considered as separate plans. So regardless of whether the phone was bought at full retail going from a 3G plan to a 4G plan constitutes a change in the plan and a loss of unlimited data. I am guessing this person is having buyers remorse and now wants his money back. In my opinion you should fulfill your end of the bargain and send him his purchased product and be done with the deal.

There is no difference in the unlimited data plan for 3g or 4g phones. You may switch back and forth between 3g and 4g phones all you like without changing your current plan. The only issue is that on Verizon with 4g phones, your sim card turns into a pumpkin at midnight if you don't switch back for then.

 

[TzuDohNihm]

It's been a long time since I sold anything on eBay, but from what I remember the seller was required to have device on hand. A transaction like yours would not have been permitted.

I would love to see you stick it to this guy, as I believe he's trying to wiggle his way out of the deal. But in the end you'll probably save yourself a lot of grief if you just refund the purchase price, and cancel the transaction on eBay (you'll get your final value fee refunded), and relist the item without the claim of the buyer being able to maintain their current plan. By the time you do all this you could have the device in hand, ship it ASAP after the sale, and be done with it.

There are an abundance of pre-ordered phones constantly on Ebay and I actually sold a PS3 I prior to having physical possession of it several years ago when they released. Made enough off that sale to pay for the Wii I bought a few months later.

As long as the ad states the nature of the transaction I believe Ebay has not had a problem with this type of listing for quite some time.

As far as grief, I got plenty of time on my hands for grief. And worse comes to worse I sell the GSIII some time down the road. Actually, worst case scenario is I have to keep the damn thing vs. the Incredible 4G.

 

[Aokusman]

Once a hot device is announced people will start listing them on eBay based on the fact that they will have it on launch day. And, as usual there are morons that will bid on this.

 

[Caesars]

I would offer to activate for them, just get the info and do it online.

Edit: The guy is clearly trying to back out, screw him lol.

 

[NeutralNovice]

Just FYI, eBay really really SUCKS.

As much as I hope you win this situation between you and your buyer, all the buyer will have to do is claim that "item received is not as described."

I think eBay sides with the buyer 99% of the time. Even if your listing stated "No Returns Accepted" it means practically nothing unfortunately.

Here is a way I think the buyer will be forced to pay and cannot complain:

Since the buyer has already contacted you without even receiving the item yet for a refund, there is absolutely no way that the buyer can claim the "item received is not as described." If you report the fact that he's contacted you for a refund already, any attempt to return the item after he has received it can be looked at suspiciously. For example, he might open the item (even though it is already sealed) and intentionally damage it saying that the damage happened before he even got to it. That's where things get crazy with eBay because it's essentially your word versus his and eBay almost always sides with the buyer.

Here, however, is my advice to you to save you a lot of trouble:

Just give the idiot his refund.

Why?

1. You haven't sent out the item yet. Since I am assuming that you selected "No Returns Accepted" if a buyer opens a case against you and wins, you will have to refund all of his money back AND pay for return shipping, which in the end will cost you more.
2. If the item is listed as completely brand new and sealed, I'm sure you're going to send it that way as you should. He can easily intentionally damage the phone after receipt and send you pictures, which you will have no proof to challenge otherwise. Ebay in that case will still most likely side with the buyer.
3. By just giving the refund, you will make it substantially easier for yourself; no need to argue, settle a case, have a nervous breakdown, whatever LOL, once the refund is given, it is done and you can just block that buyer from ever purchasing from you again. Sure, if you try to sell it again, you probably can't sell it for as much as you did but you WILL be able to sell it; heck, I'd buy it from you LOL!

I know I know... I'd want to fight back based out of principle to show the other person that they are wrong, but I've found that with eBay, one REALLY has to be picky with their battles. Unfortunate, but true.

 

[Aokusman]

Don't refund him jack, thats,letting liars win. Some guy tried that with me. I didn't budge and he gave up. My auctions have a 15% restocking fee to discourage this.

 

[UncleMike]

Once a hot device is announced people will start listing them on eBay based on the fact that they will have it on launch day. And, as usual there are morons that will bid on this.

And if you wait until you have it in hand, all the buyers willing to pay high prices will have bought already - from people who listed ahead of time.

 

[NeutralNovice]

Don't refund him jack, thats,letting liars win. Some guy tried that with me. I didn't budge and he gave up. My auctions have a 15% restocking fee to discourage this.

I am assuming then that your listings accept returns. If I am correct, his listing does not accept returns AND he doesn't have a restocking fee requirement in his listing.

The reason why I suggested for him to just give a refund is because there are too many things a buyer can say to have eBay side with them. And even if this user DID have a restocking fee, if the buyer miraculously finds an issue with the sealed phone (read: intentional damage), ebay would see that the seller be responsible for the damaged "new goods."

Too many things can go wrong with this particular situation and, to me at least, is a waste of time and energy to resolve. eBay's buyer and seller policies are why I hate it so much---they pretty much do ZERO to protect the seller from idiot buyers. Remember, in their eyes, by the time your item sells, they already have your money.

 

[Aokusman]

And if you wait until you have it in hand, all the buyers willing to pay high prices will have bought already - from people who listed ahead of time.

Exactly.

 

[TzuDohNihm]

So far since I sent him that last reply I have not heard back from him or gotten any emails from Paypal or Ebay concerning refunds.

I have the time and money to wait the guy out so, while I appreciate the advice, I'll most likely wait him out. Maybe take a video of me checking the device out as much as possible removing it from my shipping packaging.

 

[jamor]

I think NeutralNovice is right. You haven't even shipped it yet.

You're going to send someone a phone that they don't want and you're going to freak out when he successfully lists your phone as "item not as described" (could do whatever he wants) and you have no choice but to accept the return and offer the refund.

Sucks the guy is a lying bad buyer but if he's stubborn enough or really needs that $650 back, he will win.

People close stores because ebay always sides with buyer.

Losing battle.

 

[Aokusman]

I think NeutralNovice is right. You haven't even shipped it yet.

You're going to send someone a phone that they don't want and you're going to freak out when he successfully lists your phone as "item not as described" (could do whatever he wants) and you have no choice but to accept the return and offer the refund.

Sucks the guy is a lying bad buyer but if he's stubborn enough or really needs that $650 back, he will win.

People close stores because ebay always sides with buyer.

Losing battle.

Maybe not. If The buyer uses eBay a lot, and even sells too, he may not want to lie. If he is like me, and has over 200 feedbacks, all positive, he may not want to ruin that. Just don't ship the phone till the money hits you're account. Then withdraw it.

 

[NeutralNovice]

Maybe not. If The buyer uses eBay a lot, and even sells too, he may not want to lie. If he is like me, and has over 200 feedbacks, all positive, he may not want to ruin that. Just don't ship the phone till the money hits you're account. Then withdraw it.

Buyers don't have to worry about getting negative feedback since you can't leave negative feedback for them. Yet another way eBay gives all the powers to the buyer and screws over the seller.