Windows 10, Yay or Nay?

[AZgl1500]

the shame of it is, I am a die hard Windows user, IT support tech, now 5 years retired..... Was programming stuff in binary code in 6502 language when MSDOS 1.0 came along..... Apple wanted over $500 for a memory expansion board for my Apple II.... and that pissed me off..... that was twice as much as I could buy a whole damn x286 PC for......
I had 3 Apple IIs, 2 Apple IIGSs, and 1 Mac512 in my office......
I called up the newspaper and advertised the whole lock, stock, and barrel in one chunk for $3,000..... all or none...
and I got it....

then I bought an x286 and have not looked back since.

Win7 is on my Desktop and will never be upgraded, having already experienced Win8.1.2.10 and all of them stink to high heaven.....

I started looking for something to make my Brand New laptop "usable" without having to resort to "thinking Tablet".... I hated that with a passion.

So, against my better judgement, I allowed a friend?? push me into Linux.... he didn't care what color it was, just get on Linux....
so, I looked at a bunch of LiveCDs and Linux Mint 17.3 with Cinnamon desktop appealed to me. It allowed me, a Windows user, instant access to the laptop to go anywhere on the internet with ease.

The desktop is familiar, Firefox is identical to what is on Win7, the same Addons work even...

I had a bit of trouble accepting Linux though, until, slowly, but surely I found little applets that would let me do things useful.
Make text file and store it somewhere.
Download pictures and store them somewhere.

I am now going on the 5th or 6th week of using that laptop from my recliner and doing what I usually do.... and it is getting easier, and most important........... not a damn thing has crashed on it yet....

I am still having a LOT of trouble making gnuCash work.... can't seem to get it to login to a bank account.

.

I have an Apple G4 Powerbook I would sell, anyone want it?
still plugged in to keep the battery alive.

 

[Father Guido]

I haven't used Paragon myself but they have been around a long time and have a good reputation. The $20 Professional version adds:

"Unique business tool to get Linux and Windows cooperating
Create/format partition wizards
Read/Write support for LVM (Logical Volume Management)".

The latter is losing importance as PCs move away from LVM to UEFI. The free version would probably do fine but personally I would pop $20 just to show support.

I finally booted my primary desktop into win7 and this does what I need to rid the NTFS issue. Gonna spring for the pro as suggested. Another step in the right direction. Thanks a ton

 

[jefboyardee]

In my Linux immersion, I tried to let Mint convince me to ditch Windows. It almost did, but there's those little Windows things, like six billion little apps for anything and everything, that held me back. And now that Windows 10 is not the panacea I was expecting, and I'm stuck at Windows 7, I may have to try the Linux immersion again.

 

[bcrichster]

In my Linux immersion, I tried to let Mint convince me to ditch Windows. It almost did, but there's those little Windows things, like six billion little apps for anything and everything, that held me back. And now that Windows 10 is not the panacea I was expecting, and I'm stuck at Windows 7, I may have to try the Linux immersion again.

I just said "Screw It" and dualboot with Linux Mint Cinnamon as my "go to" Primary OS and Win7 as a minimal OS for when I rarely need to use an app that doesn't have a Linux Equivalent.. Like the LG Flashtool

 

[jefboyardee]

I used to have up to ten Linux partitions, but never saw the point. So I went to just Win7 on hd and Mint on flash. But now I have those two and two more hd partitions of Win10, one as a Win7 upgrade, the other as clean install. And just like my my Linux days, I don't see the point of Win10 either. But I suppose that could all be because my PC is ten years old, born as an XP monster.

 

[AZgl1500]

In my Linux immersion, I tried to let Mint convince me to ditch Windows. It almost did, but there's those little Windows things, like six billion little apps for anything and everything, that held me back. And now that Windows 10 is not the panacea I was expecting, and I'm stuck at Windows 7, I may have to try the Linux immersion again.

for now, I am keeping them separate.
Win7 Pro on the big Desktop with 24 inch monitor.
Linux Mint on the laptop for a fast little surfer on the go, or when I'm idling in my recliner.

Like others have said, there are just too many Win7 applets laying around, that are impossible to duplicate in Linux.
I can't give up Windows..... so I keep it on top of my Office Desk ( in my home ), and the laptop by the recliner. ( goes in the motorcycle when that leaves the house. )

 

[Father Guido]

I just said "Screw It" and dualboot with Linux Mint Cinnamon as my "go to" Primary OS and Win7 as a minimal OS for when I rarely need to use an app that doesn't have a Linux Equivalent.. Like the LG Flashtool

Exactly my plan, although it will need to be a bit more gradual for me. As others mentioned there are so many *little* things you get accustomed to from Windows that are hard to duplicate. One in particular is the handy "HashCheck Shell Extension," that I can simply right-click on a file to create/verify integrity (very important when flashing firmware, etc.). There are other little things, but given time I should be able to find an equivalent. We've already sort of hijacked this thread ( I apologize), so if anyone knows of another place to do a quick search for Linux equivalents of such things I would be grateful for a link or 2.

 

[Deleted User]

My Dad just bought a new computer, with Win10 installed. What surprised me was that he didn't get an installation disc. Any time I bought a computer in the past, I always received installation media. I mean what happens if you have a catastrophic HDD failure, and need to reinstall the O/S?
The shop told him that they could make a system backup memory stick for £35, and they said it wasn't easy to create it. That sounds like a load of BS, why would Microsoft make the process of creating a system repair disc/memory stick difficult? From past experience, Windows system repair discs were fairly easy to create.

But I just found it surprising that there was absolutely no installation media supplied with the computer. Is this normal now?

 

[Xyro]

My Dad just bought a new computer, with Win10 installed. What surprised me was that he didn't get an installation disc. Any time I bought a computer in the past, I always received installation media. I mean what happens if you have a catastrophic HDD failure, and need to reinstall the O/S?
The shop told him that they could make a system backup memory stick for £35, and they said it wasn't easy to create it. That sounds like a load of BS, why would Microsoft make the process of creating a system repair disc/memory stick difficult? From past experience, Windows system repair discs were fairly easy to create.

But I just found it surprising that there was absolutely no installation media supplied with the computer. Is this normal now?

I think it depends on manufacturer, but no, most of the laptops I've purchased or set up for family in the last 5+ years haven't come with CDs. However they come with hidden recovery partitions that, if you boot into them rather than your usual C:/ drive, can restore a factory image of the PC. There will probably also be some kind of manufacturer utility to make a USB stick that does the same thing. Worst comes to worst you can also legitimately download Windows 7-10 and make your own bootable DVD or USB stick nowadays, which can be used to access recovery tools or reinstall the OS. (Although you have to make sure you keep a record of your windows licence key if you take that approach).

Some shops (PC World in the UK, certainly) will charge you some money to make you that same USB stick, and I really doubt that they're difficult to set up if you're relatively tech-oriented like ourselves. You have to remember that, (a) most of their customers probably aren't so tech-savvy, and (b) the PCs you buy in those shops are usually sold at near-cost prices, with the shop's profit coming with the extras (the £35 recovery USB stick, PC 'set up' fee, Microsoft office, antivirus subscriptions, warranties, etc). So they'll happily exaggerate or straight out lie about how difficult it would be to do those things yourself.

 

[Dngrsone]

Like @Xyro says, most vendors stopped including installation media quite some time ago.

Creating a bootable recover/restore USB drive is pretty easy, and as I recall, any USB drive will work as long as it has the capacity (16GB, I think).

 

[AZgl1500]

My Dad just bought a new computer, with Win10 installed. What surprised me was that he didn't get an installation disc. Any time I bought a computer in the past, I always received installation media. I mean what happens if you have a catastrophic HDD failure, and need to reinstall the O/S?.......
But I just found it surprising that there was absolutely no installation media supplied with the computer. Is this normal now?

Nearly all of the manufacturers have abandoned providing backup media, and have so for over 5 years. It is far easier to just provide a Recovery process and let you make your own Restore Media. You have the option of putting it on DVD, or a Flash stick.

also, you can install Macrium Reflect (free) and just do a full HDD image, that will restore things to exactly the way the system was "at the time" the image was made. To use the Recovery process, you need to purchase a license though...

I am a convert to Linux for some things. bought a new laptop with Win8.x => Win10 and used it for 3 months to see if I could be happy with it. As an IT support tech using Win7 Pro on my office desktop, Win10 was a total cluster mucked up mess, and I formatted the hard drive and installed Linux Mint 17.3 Rosa/Cinnamon. I am very pleased with the results.

If MicroSlop office 2003 AND Quicken Checkbook could run Natively in Linux, I would probably kiss Windows goodbye... but, I have a huge amount of applets that I run in Win7 and I have found that even with Wine, they won't run under Linux... so, I will just move from one keyboard to the other keyboard and use what is "best for right now"...

I tried to install Office 2003 under Wine, but it failed on the only attempt that I made... That particular install of Linux went horrible from the 1st minute I tried it.... because of Secure Boot issues.... those have since been resolved.... and maybe, I will try to install Wine again, but I see no pressing need for it now....

I want to keep Linux 'clean' and Windows "over there" away from my laptop.

I tried to make gnuCash work to replace Quicken Checkbook, but so far, that has been another total failure. Why not make it easy like Quicken did? All Quicken wants is the Routing Number and your Account number.... job done.... it asks if the bank it found with that routing number is the one you mean, but other than that, it is done... and off to the races.

gnuCash is a PITA in the way it sets up Accounts instead of Categories....
also, if your bank, ie, my Credit Union, is not in the database they provide, you are totally screwed.... I have no clue as to what all of the things the Wizard is looking for, There is NO documentation anywhere on how to make that Wizard work..... I spent two days looking for a description of the Wizard account setup.... did not find anything. The "manual" for gnuCash is a joke....

there is nothing intuitive about gnuCash for a checkbook. I am not running a business, I just want to poll my bank and have my checkbook register updated. end of story.

 

[bcrichster]

Like @Xyro says, most vendors stopped including installation media quite some time ago.

Creating a bootable recover/restore USB drive is pretty easy, and as I recall, any USB drive will work as long as it has the capacity (16GB, I think).

I'm thinking a 32Gb would be a safer bet. I installed Win7 premium on my laptop and then after all drivers were installed, tried making a backup disk/DVD and got an impending file size of 25Gb!! That shut me down quick like. I'm SURE Win10 is even bigger as well..

 

[Dngrsone]

I'm thinking a 32Gb would be a safer bet. I installed Win7 premium on my laptop and then after all drivers were installed, tried making a backup disk/DVD and got an impending file size of 25Gb!! That shut me down quick like. I'm SURE Win10 is even bigger as well..

You may be right... I did this some eight months ago, and all I remember is going to the store to buy a cheap drive specifically for this purpose.

 

[AZgl1500]

I'm thinking a 32Gb would be a safer bet. I installed Win7 premium on my laptop and then after all drivers were installed, tried making a backup disk/DVD and got an impending file size of 25Gb!! That shut me down quick like. I'm SURE Win10 is even bigger as well..

You are quite correct, if you expect to make backup of Win10 or Win7 after your applications are installed, you need a full minimum of 64 gB.... I prefer to use nothing less than a 512 gB HDD set aside solely for that one PC... yes, I buy a separate HDD for each PC and it is dedicated to multiple Image Backups for that one PC.... I mark them with a big heavy Black Felt tip... I keep a minimum of 3 images, preferably 5 and then I delete the oldest one... except, for keeping an Original Install of the PC, and an Original Install with all Security Updates.... then the 3 month images start after that.... yes, I use a Calendar Reminder to tell me it is time to make a New Image of a PC.

I use a USB adapter dock for that purpose. It has its' own power supply so the HDD does not pull any power from the PC under going an image.

 

[Dngrsone]

You are quite correct, if you expect to make backup of Win10 or Win7 after your applications are installed, you need a full minimum of 64 gB.... I prefer to use nothing less than a 512 gB HDD set aside solely for that one PC... yes, I buy a separate HDD for each PC and it is dedicated to multiple Image Backups for that one PC.... I mark them with a big heavy Black Felt tip... I keep a minimum of 3 images, preferably 5 and then I delete the oldest one... except, for keeping an Original Install of the PC, and an Original Install with all Security Updates.... then the 3 month images start after that.... yes, I use a Calendar Reminder to tell me it is time to make a New Image of a PC.

I use a USB adapter dock for that purpose. It has its' own power supply so the HDD does not pull any power from the PC under going an image.

Wow... That's a lot of money.

I have six laptops operating in castle dngrs.

 

[AZgl1500]

Wow... That's a lot of money.

I have six laptops operating in castle dngrs.

well, just get one 1 TB HDD and make some folders for each of your laptops....
those have come way down in price lately.

 

[Dngrsone]

Actually, I have a 2TB NAS which holds backups of all the family music, ebooks, and photos, as well as periodic backups.

I have a separate binder for physical restore/recovery media (DVD, USB drives).

 

[AZgl1500]

sounds good to me.

 

[Crashdamage]

Nearly all of the manufacturers have abandoned providing backup media, and have so for over 5 years. It is far easier to just provide a Recovery process and let you make your own Restore Media. You have the option of putting it on DVD, or a Flash stick.

I don't worry about Recovery images. I treat Windows and Linux about the same. I keep OS installation media on a USB stick and just do occasional backups to cloud storage of key user files such as Firefox, Thunderbird and a few others to avoid losing bookmarks and other data and a lot of setup. Reinstalling from scratch goes pretty quick.

Some user data is cross-platform friendly between Linux and Windows. GnuCash data, Firefox and Thunderbird profiles and some others can be copied directly from one OS to another.

If MicroSlop office 2003 AND Quicken Checkbook could run Natively in Linux, I would probably kiss Windows goodbye... but, I have a huge amount of applets that I run in Win7 and I have found that even with Wine, they won't run under Linux... so, I will just move from one keyboard to the other keyboard and use what is "best for right now"...

I tried to make gnuCash work to replace Quicken Checkbook, but so far, that has been another total failure. Why not make it easy like Quicken did? All Quicken wants is the Routing Number and your Account number.... job done.... it asks if the bank it found with that routing number is the one you mean, but other than that, it is done... and off to the races.

gnuCash is a PITA in the way it sets up Accounts instead of Categories....
also, if your bank, ie, my Credit Union, is not in the database they provide, you are totally screwed.... I have no clue as to what all of the things the Wizard is looking for, There is NO documentation anywhere on how to make that Wizard work..... I spent two days looking for a description of the Wizard account setup.... did not find anything. The "manual" for gnuCash is a joke....

there is nothing intuitive about gnuCash for a checkbook. I am not running a business, I just want to poll my bank and have my checkbook register updated. end of story.

I have an opposite take. love GnuCash. I hated Quicken. All Quicken wants is your money, over and over. GnuCash is free and true double-entry accounting whereas Quicken is actually fundamentally broken in regard to accounting rules. I've used GnuCash for 15 years to track several accounts including my business and my wife's business. Really nice software and being totally cross-platform compatible is a. HUGE advantage. I consider GnuCash indispensable.

I've never needed the manual so I can't say if it's good or bad. It was easy to figure out GnuCash just by poking around. If a Quicken user just thinks of Accounts = Categories it simplifies the changeover. There's a GnuCash user mailing list that's supposed to be good help but I've never needed it. I can't comment on communication with banks. I've always made account entries manually.

Regarding Office and Wine, I haven't done it but apparently a lot of people have. I just use Libre Office. Works well for me and again is cross-platform friendly. I'm BIG on cross-platform software.

 

[AZgl1500]

Okay, how do you get gnuCash to connect to your bank if it is not in the very meager list of banks that gnuCash already knows about?

the Wizard is broken IMO, no explanation of how to use it.

when I click on 'create new user', it all collapses, and disappears..... ie, gnuCash just exits out and is gone.

 

[Crashdamage]

Well, like I said I don't connect to banks. I do entries manually once or twice a week. It only takes a few minutes to catch up the accounts.

I can't comment on the Wizard. Never use it.

Can't comment on creating a new user either. Never done it.

I can say GnuCash has been an easy to use, stable, cross-platform solution for some fairly complicated bookkeeping for 15 years.

 

[mikedt]

I have to give my vote for GNUcash over Quicken. Simply because Quicken only does US currency, I need Renminbi ("people's money").

 

[AZgl1500]

I never update Quicken unless it refuses to work, and that has only happened once, when the whole US banking system changed how they do online interconnects.

if gnuCash will not log into a bank, and download my info, it is a useless POS for me.

I refuse to do manual entry, I used to do that with Spreadsheets decades ago, until Quicken was invented.
when that happened, I never again, downloaded CSV files and imported them into a spreadsheet.

a manual only checkbook program is for the birds, get real....

 

[argedion]

You have to really trust a Corporation with your info if your willing to put your bank account in their hands. I do not trust any Government or Corporation that much. I don't even trust the bank. They are all out to screw you in the end. Just remember Business exist to take your money.

 

[Father Guido]

I think it depends on manufacturer, but no, most of the laptops I've purchased or set up for family in the last 5+ years haven't come with CDs. However they come with hidden recovery partitions that, if you boot into them rather than your usual C:/ drive, can restore a factory image of the PC. There will probably also be some kind of manufacturer utility to make a USB stick that does the same thing. Worst comes to worst you can also legitimately download Windows 7-10 and make your own bootable DVD or USB stick nowadays, which can be used to access recovery tools or reinstall the OS. (Although you have to make sure you keep a record of your windows licence key if you take that approach).

Some shops (PC World in the UK, certainly) will charge you some money to make you that same USB stick, and I really doubt that they're difficult to set up if you're relatively tech-oriented like ourselves. You have to remember that, (a) most of their customers probably aren't so tech-savvy, and (b) the PCs you buy in those shops are usually sold at near-cost prices, with the shop's profit coming with the extras (the £35 recovery USB stick, PC 'set up' fee, Microsoft office, antivirus subscriptions, warranties, etc). So they'll happily exaggerate or straight out lie about how difficult it would be to do those things yourself.

Shameful all the crapware that comes pre-installed. Once activated, I normally just retrieve the key and do a clean install from an ISO. Unsure if you even need a key for Win10 anymore.