Root [CDMA] Newbie root question- sense and 3d?

[shadders139]

Hi guys, I've never rooted my htc hero, but am thinking it would be best to root as soon as possible when I get the Evo 3d so that I don't have to worry about backing things up!

My questions are: since we would lose the beautiful sense 3.0 by rooting, are there going to be any ROMS available that have sense 3.0?

Since the 3d hasn't even been released- is it going to take a few months before there are fully functional ROMS?

Basically what i'm asking is, is there a way to root without losing any nice features like sense and functionality? or does there always have to be sacrifices?

Thank you for your time and patience with my newbie questions, and I am sorry if this has already been asked

 

[lpjzfan2005]

Just rooting your phone doesn't get rid of sense! I know plenty of people that run stock rooted just because they love sense.
So in other words, no sacrifices if you dont want to man!!

 

[thelonewizard]

My understanding is that rooting, by itself, won't cause you to lose anything. This will just allow you to get rid of the bloatware sprint loves to cram down our throats. however, I think what you're saying is that you want to root, and then later install a custom kernel/ROM. Even though we might assume that the EVO 3D will come with an unlocked bootloader ala HTC's new policy, it will still be at least a week or two after the phone is released before we can expect a test ROM from the dev community. Therefore, ROOT it as soon as you can, install titanium backup from the market, and then you won't have to worry about that part anymore. Once a cutom ROM arrives that you want to try, backup your phone, and try it. There's lots of tutorials here on the forums, and more to come once the phone drops. I, too, am interested in loading a custom ROM on it.

 

[shadders139]

Just rooting your phone doesn't get rid of sense! I know plenty of people that run stock rooted just because they love sense.

oh I see, I always thought rooting automatically got rid of all additions to vanilla android, such as sense

My understanding is that rooting, by itself, won't cause you to lose anything. This will just allow you to get rid of the bloatware sprint loves to cram down our throats.

so you can, in fact, root the phone to gain full access, and still run the stock ROM with sense? would this still give you the full advantages of rooting? i.e. being able to run apps that require rooting, or overclocking the phone- or does that require custom ROMs/ kernels.

because i would love to stay on the stock ROM, and also have all the advantages that rooting brings

 

[lpjzfan2005]

You can still do all of that with rooting and having a kernel that plays nice with the stock rom! For example, to flash a custom rom you have to be stock rooted first and apply a custom recovery, followed by the rom. Seeing as root is the first step in that you can just leave it that way if you please!! Gotta love having choices

 

[lpjzfan2005]

Hi guys, I've never rooted my htc hero,

P.S. how did you live with your hero that long?? I have a motorola backflip at the moment and it would be broken in half if i was still running stock 2.1 on it right now. I know sense is alot better than motoblur, but still with the old hardware in our phones 2.1 was a lagfest for any phone that wasn't AOSP as far as i know

 

[shadders139]

that's great to hear, i'll be sure to take the plunge and try my hand at rooting when I get the evo 3d then hopefully without doing any damage to the phone! am pretty excited to hear that i'll be able to keep sense 3.0 and still tinker with the phone!

P.S. how did you live with your hero that long?? I have a motorola backflip at the moment and it would be broken in half if i was still running stock 2.1 on it right now. I know sense is alot better than motoblur, but still with the old hardware in our phones 2.1 was a lagfest for any phone that wasn't AOSP as far as i know

well the hero was my first android phone, and I only got it a year ago. but yeah the lag is pretty unbearable, i just never got round to rooting because i didn't want to lose sense and was scared to root without knowing much about it! the evo 3d can't come round soon enough- looking forward to moving on from what's essentially ancient hardware by now!

 

[thelonewizard]

oh I see, I always thought rooting automatically got rid of all additions to vanilla android, such as sense



so you can, in fact, root the phone to gain full access, and still run the stock ROM with sense? would this still give you the full advantages of rooting? i.e. being able to run apps that require rooting, or overclocking the phone- or does that require custom ROMs/ kernels.

because i would love to stay on the stock ROM, and also have all the advantages that rooting brings

Now that I'm a little iffy on. I'm not entirely sure, but I think you'd be able to overclock it without a custom ROM, but I'm not 100% on that. and Glad I could help you. I tried rooting my Samsung Intercept, failed miserably, and now I'm waiting for a phone I know I can root.

 

[CanDMan]

I never rooted my Hero either. Didn't want to void the warranty and I knew when I bought it that it would have first gen issues. I liked the phone even though there were multiple problems. The way I see it, it'll be nice to have a more capable device once my contract is up later this year.

 

[novox77]

Here's how it works:

root adds something called su (SuperUser). That user has admin (root) privs on the phone.

So when you add su to the ROM, you've effectively customized the stock ROM, since it's no longer the way it was from HTC. But we don't call that a custom ROM though technically it is. We call it a rooted stock ROM for clarity.

For people who have no interest in custom ROMs (which may have modifications to the kernel and/or operating system), the rooted stock ROM is the perfect choice.

When an OTA update comes from HTC, the devs take that update, break it open and add su, and the rooted stock ROM is created. This process very fast and straightforward. Typically the rooted stock ROM is out on the same day as the OTA.

Here's the kicker: if you're rooted already, just flash this rooted OTA image, and you're automatically updated while preserving your rooted status. But if you're not rooted, you have no means to flash this ROM, so you have to first apply the root exploit (the actual process of breaking into your phone and adding su).

So, if you do things right, you root your phone once, and once only. Then, you just flash rooted stock OTA updates to keep your phone up to date with the rest of the non-rooted phones.

Or you can go totally custom and not worry about OTAs. Lots of freedom once you root. The only sacrifices you are making are:

1) giving up the option to accept HTC' over-the-air (OTA) updates
[you can do it, but it might totally F up your phone]

2) void your warranty.
[but even here, you can unroot, and your warranty is valid again]

 

[shadders139]

Here's how it works:

root adds something called su (SuperUser). That user has admin (root) privs on the phone.

So when you add su to the ROM, you've effectively customized the stock ROM, since it's no longer the way it was from HTC. But we don't call that a custom ROM though technically it is. We call it a rooted stock ROM for clarity.

For people who have no interest in custom ROMs (which may have modifications to the kernel and/or operating system), the rooted stock ROM is the perfect choice.

When an OTA update comes from HTC, the devs take that update, break it open and add su, and the rooted stock ROM is created. This process very fast and straightforward. Typically the rooted stock ROM is out on the same day as the OTA.

Here's the kicker: if you're rooted already, just flash this rooted OTA image, and you're automatically updated while preserving your rooted status. But if you're not rooted, you have no means to flash this ROM, so you have to first apply the root exploit (the actual process of breaking into your phone and adding su).

So, if you do things right, you root your phone once, and once only. Then, you just flash rooted stock OTA updates to keep your phone up to date with the rest of the non-rooted phones.

Or you can go totally custom and not worry about OTAs. Lots of freedom once you root. The only sacrifices you are making are:

1) giving up the option to accept HTC' over-the-air (OTA) updates
[you can do it, but it might totally F up your phone]

2) void your warranty.
[but even here, you can unroot, and your warranty is valid again]

thank you very much novox77 and all the other users in this thread for your explanations

where would you typically go to keep up with and acquire new updates? the xda developers forum?

 

[novox77]

where would you typically go to keep up with and acquire new updates? the xda developers forum?

Just come right here The mods will be busy merging duplicate threads pointing to it, so you won't miss anything!

 

[shadders139]

Just come right here The mods will be busy merging duplicate threads pointing to it, so you won't miss anything!

that's a relief because i've always found these forums to be very friendly and helpful. i can see myself coming on here a lot more frequently once i have an evo 3d of my own!

 

[Vanquished]

Now that I'm a little iffy on. I'm not entirely sure, but I think you'd be able to overclock it without a custom ROM, but I'm not 100% on that. and Glad I could help you. I tried rooting my Samsung Intercept, failed miserably, and now I'm waiting for a phone I know I can root.

Over-clocking depends on the kernel, if I'm not mistaken. If the stock kernel allows for higher speeds, then you can over-clock it, if not you need to flash a different kernel.

 

[thelonewizard]

Over-clocking depends on the kernel, if I'm not mistaken. If the stock kernel allows for higher speeds, then you can over-clock it, if not you need to flash a different kernel.

Thanks. I wasn't sure, as I hadn't rooted or modded my phone. I tried and bricked it, then unbricked it. Samsung POS.... Anyway, hoping the Evo 3D will allow for it on rooted stock.

 

[Vanquished]

Thanks. I wasn't sure, as I hadn't rooted or modded my phone. I tried and bricked it, then unbricked it. Samsung POS.... Anyway, hoping the Evo 3D will allow for it on rooted stock.

I believe it was made to work at 1.5, but HTC has under clocked it. There was an article earlier about a Korean company with basically the same device but clocking the MS8660 at 1.5, so it's possible.

If it does clock to 1.5 using the stock ROM/kernel that wold be awesome, but some have been saying you'll most likely have to flash a new kernel.

 

[Android 17]

I believe it was made to work at 1.5, but HTC has under clocked it. There was an article earlier about a Korean company with basically the same device but clocking the MS8660 at 1.5, so it's possible.

If it does clock to 1.5 using the stock ROM/kernel that wold be awesome, but some have been saying you'll most likely have to flash a new kernel.

The G2, which runs an older processor, has been overlocked up to 2.0 MHz, although it's likely not stable, I'm betting the EVO3D will easily be overlocked to 1.5 and above and be relatively stable.

And for the OP, a lot of developers also make Sense-based roms. I feel like sticking with stock, is usually, for the most part, not the best choice.

I'm sure some devs will make better optimized, leaner roms running Sense 3.0 that will essentially feel like stock but have additional improvements.

 

[thelonewizard]

The G2, which runs an older processor, has been overlocked up to 2.0 MHz, although it's likely not stable, I'm betting the EVO3D will easily be overlocked to 1.5 and above and be relatively stable.

And for the OP, a lot of developers also make Sense-based roms. I feel like sticking with stock, is usually, for the most part, not the best choice.

I'm sure some devs will make better optimized, leaner roms running Sense 3.0 that will essentially feel like stock but have additional improvements.

They overclocked the Thunderbolt's CPU up to 2GHz within a week of it launching, and it was said to be fairly stable. Could we see a stable 2.5GHz on Qualcomm's chip here in the EVO 3D?

And to Vanquished: Yeah, Qualcomm made this to run at 1.5, but HTC did underclock it, and that one Korean company, Pantech I believe, made a phone using the same chipset to run at it's usual 1.5. I believe there will be a lot of overclocking done on this phone, and I will be taking part in it.

 

[Vanquished]

I'm pessimistic about how fast it can be overclocked to and run without crashing because of my EVO. I haven't had any problems running it at 1154 but as soon as I clock it to 1192 it usually hard resets on its own and I have to reinstall everything.

If It's stable at 2ghz, that would be awesome. I'd be happy with over 1.5 though.

 

[Android 17]

I can overclock to 1190 on my EVO with no problems. With the better battery management the EVO3D seems to have, and custom, undervolted kernels, I wouldn't be surprised if we get good battery life even with overclocking.

I understand some people don't like to overclock because of battery issues, but I personally think that I'd rather get the fastest, most lag-free experience at all times, so the improved experience while using the device warrants the slight battery hit.

 

[novox77]

Just remember that every CPU is different, and just because SOMEONE is able to OC to some level doesn't mean you will be able to. On my Evo, if I try to OC even just a little bit, I will get reboots here and there.

Manufacturers release a chip with a certain clock speed conservatively. They don't want to clock it right at the point where it might not be stable, because there may be use cases they forgot to test which would trigger the reboot/shutdown. So they clock it lower to a point where they feel the chip would be reliable in 100% of possible use cases.

That means to some degree, every chip is OC'able (except MY Evo lol). Seems like the E3D's chip is more flexible than normal, and sure, it's going to be exploited. But unless the manufacturer is absolutely certain that 1.2ghz was too low and it's safe to raise the clock speed, they'll likely keep it where it is. It's competitive at 1.2ghz. Why risk a bad customer experience across the entire user base?

And then there's battery life. Keeping it at 1.2ghz could change people's perceptions that Android (or HTC) has crappy battery life.

 

[lafester]

The first gen snapdragon isn't very overclock - friendly. Newer cores are much easier to oc. Take the nook color for example... overclocked to 1.2 ghz from 800mhz stock. I don't keep up on all the phones but from what I have seen almost doubling stock speed is becoming reality. I would not be surprised at all if the 3d was oc'd to over 2 ghz. (assuming we get full root)

 

[novox77]

perhaps because it's harder to peg both CPUs where it might trigger an overheat reboot/shutdown?

 

[lafester]

perhaps. it will be fun trying in any case

 

[Deleted User]

I am very very new to the android world, so naturally i am new to the rooting world.

I do not have my E3D yet, but when i get it i will want to do the following; Throttle back the processing power to conserve battery when the phone is in standby, remove bloatware, & unlock tethering.

Will i need to get a custom rom for these or will i be able to keep my stock rom and not have to sacrifice things like the 3D, 4G, ect. ect.

thanks in advance