The "Linux questions (and other stuff)" thread

[MoodyBlues]

This is a very quick read about Linus Torvalds and his take on anti-Micro$oft feelings.

After you read it, how about sharing your thoughts? Are you on the die-hard anti-M$ side? Or do you get all warm and fuzzy thinking about all this? It shouldn't surprise anyone too much that I'm in the former group. I'm fully aware of how opinionated and passionate I am about this, but I got that way based on facts and personal experience. It'll take awhile to fully convince me that there's nothing nefarious going on in this 'new M$' world.

 

[MoodyBlues]

Hey, sudo users! Apparently there was a flaw in sudo that could let an intruder wreak all kinds of havoc on *nix systems. Of course, first the intruder would have to get in, then get a CLI, then know how to exploit this vulnerability... But it is a serious flaw that now has a fix, which we should all get.

 

[MoodyBlues]

The author of this article about Ubuntu 19.10 is very happy about two of its features: "What makes 19.10 so special to me personally? ZFS and vastly improved hardware support." He explains both in some detail.

You know...one of these days...I really ought to do some upgrading around here. My main computer, the System76 laptop, is still happily humming along on Kubuntu 14.04.

 

[lunatic59]

I really ought to do some upgrading around here.

You should.

I just installed Mint 19.2 on an old Dell laptop and the thing is humming along just fine.

 

[MoodyBlues]

You should.

I just installed Mint 19.2 on an old Dell laptop and the thing is humming along just fine.

Oh, nice! Are there any specific new features you like and find that you're using a lot?

One of these days... Yep...

 

[lunatic59]

To tell you the truth, I just keep up to date for the kernel. As long as my CLI keeps working, fancy features don't really interest me that much.

 

[MoodyBlues]

I found this pretty informative and hope you do, too: 14 Linux apps that will change how you work

The article states: "(Note: many of them are also available for macOS and Windows, so if you have to hop between operating systems, you can keep at least a semblance of consistency.)"

I think that's very good.

It also brings up the GIMP, which was bashed around these parts recently as being something to be ashamed of, and not fit to be put on a resumé. The article's take on it?:

"If you're willing to put a little effort into making the switch, you will love the free, open source GNU Image Manipulation Program (GIMP), which is just as powerful as Photoshop."

A few of the programs are completely new to me; one in particular caught my eye and piqued my interest:

"Here's one for the command-line jockeys: Xiki, a truly amazing and useful open-source enhancement for command shells (bash, zsh, etc.) that merges shell and GUI concepts and, as explained by Linux.com, "runs in a text editor, so everything is editable.” It will let you save Xiki sessions in a text editor."

What do you think, my fellow CLI lovers?

 

[GameTheory]

It also brings up the GIMP, which was bashed around these parts recently as being something to be ashamed of, and not fit to be put on a resumé. The article's take on it?:

"If you're willing to put a little effort into making the switch, you will love the free, open source GNU Image Manipulation Program (GIMP), which is just as powerful as Photoshop."

Well since I'm the one that made that statement and still stand behind it...

I'll say this: That article you linked made no actual comparison of the two products and "just as powerful as Photoshop" is just an opinion. Had he compared the two, he would see the difference favors photoshop.

Here's a comparison of the two by Harry who actually does some graphic work...
https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/can-photoshop-gimp-cant/

How do you think a professional is gonna do "print" work without CMYK color mode which GIMP does not have? Photoshop has had this since I could remember. If you'd like to see for yourself, in gimp go to "Image > Mode".

Since I use both, here are the color modes for the two...
Gimp (latest version): RGB, Grayscale, Indexed
Photoshop (old 2012 version): Bitmap, Grayscale, Duotone, Indexed, RGB, CMYK, Lab, Multichannel

Now I haven't upgraded Photoshop from my old 2012 version, but I here the latest is leagues ahead.

 

[MoodyBlues]

That article you linked made no actual comparison of the two products and "just as powerful as Photoshop" is just an opinion. Had he compared the two, he would see the difference favors photoshop.

You left out the facts he stated, not opinion:

"GIMP provides sophisticated color management, the ability to read and write all common graphics file formats, customization through scripting and support for input devices such as pressure and tilt sensitive tablets and USB and MIDI controllers. You can also load and save files using FTP, HTTP, SMB, and SFTP/SSH directly from GIMP. One of the most mature FOSS projects out there, GIMP is outstanding."

I can't argue any of the other points you made, as I've never touched PS, only seen it on my daughter's [Mac] computers.

 

[GameTheory]

You left out the facts he stated, not opinion:

"GIMP provides sophisticated color management, the ability to read and write all common graphics file formats, customization through scripting and support for input devices such as pressure and tilt sensitive tablets and USB and MIDI controllers. You can also load and save files using FTP, HTTP, SMB, and SFTP/SSH directly from GIMP. One of the most mature FOSS projects out there, GIMP is outstanding."

I can't argue any of the other points you made, as I've never touched PS, only seen it on my daughter's [Mac] computers.

I didn't leave out facts, but simply touched on the opinion you highlighted in blue letters.

The question that is always avoided by gimp die-hards...
How does one think a professional is gonna do "print" work in gimp without CMYK color mode which GIMP does not have???

How could one say gimp is "just as powerful as Photoshop" without CMYK color mode?

 

[GameTheory]

The question that is always avoided by gimp die-hards...
How does one think a professional is gonna do "print" work in gimp without CMYK color mode which GIMP does not have???

How could one say gimp is "just as powerful as Photoshop" without CMYK color mode?

I'll add this for gimp users...
Imagemagick comes pre-installed on *buntu distros.
Just run this for your image from the command-line to get CMYK.

convert input.jpg -colorspace cmyk -compress LZW output.tif

Note: You shouldn't have to do workarounds like this in "professional software".

 

[MoodyBlues]

How does one think a professional is gonna do "print" work in gimp without CMYK color mode which GIMP does not have???

What qualifies as 'print' as you mean it? I'm curious because I've been on CafePress since 2001, and sold hundreds of thousands of products with my designs 'printed' on them, and all I've ever used is GIMP. As I recall, CP -requires- that all images be in RGB format, specifically stating not to upload CMYK. The products range from shirts to bumper stickers, and everything in between. (I haven't worked on my shops since before I got sick, but I'm very sure about the RGB thing.) So what is that? I call it printing. So does CP.

As for ImageMagick, I've used it for decades. My photography products require 14 different files from each image. Here's a snippet from an interactive shell script I wrote in 2012; it did the grunt work for me:

# This is for images from the Nikon D5100, 4928x3264
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 739x490 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_15.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 1232x816 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_25.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 1478x979 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_30.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 1971x1306 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_40.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 2464x1632 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_50.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 3696x2448 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_75.jpg
 cp -v $INPUTFILE "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_100.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 6160x4080 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_125.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 7392x4896 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_150.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 8624x5712 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_175.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 9856x6528 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_200.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 12320x8160 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_250.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 14784x9792 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_300.jpg
 convert $INPUTFILE -resize 17248x11424 -verbose "$OUTPUTFILE"_input_350.jpg

As noted, I've never needed CMYK, but it's good to know IM can easily do the conversion. Thanks for posting its command.

 

[GameTheory]

What qualifies as 'print' as you mean it?

Cafepress probably processes the images and converts them to CMYK since they're not gonna expect all their customers to be graphic designers or to buy professional tools for their images. This is probably done automated. Also, a poster for example is printed while a t-shirt is heat pressed, so poster would require cmyk while t-shirt is fine with rgb. Hence, why they probably ask not to upload cmyk so they can apply depending on product.

CMYK is what commercial printers use. This would cover magazines, posters, books, business cards, flyers, and way too much to list.

Here's a quote from the previous link I posted...
"There are two dominant color modes that professional photographers and designers use: RGB and CMYK. RGB comes from the red, green, and blue pixels that are used both to capture images with cameras and to portray them on a digital screen. CMYK comes from the cyan, magenta, yellow, and black inks used by commercial printers."

Here's a quote from the following link...
https://www.printingforless.com/color.html
"About RGB-CMYK
Scanners, digital cameras and computer monitors use red, green and blue (RGB) light to display color.
Commercial printing presses print with cyan, magenta, yellow and black (CMYK) ink, called process printing, instead of RGB light, and therefore produce a different range of color."

edit:
This has also been a gimp deal breaker for me:
https://www.gimpusers.com/forums/gimp-user/20482-is-there-anything-like-ps-actions-for-gimp

 

[lunatic59]

Sorry Moody, but @GameTheory is right.

Commercial printing at it's most basic is CMYK color models, but high end press like art reproductions or Annual Reports for companies like ... um ... Google use much more complicated color models ... up to 8 or even 10 colors to achieve some remarkable effects. Photoshop can handle that, GIMP cannot. And, simple conversion via a single color map just doesn't account for enough variables in screen, press, gain, gamut etc. to make it a viable workaround.

For RGB work like web and video, GIMP does have a full palette of tools but for print work it's the Adobe juggernaut all the way.

 

[MoodyBlues]

For RGB work like web and video, GIMP does have a full palette of tools but for print work it's the Adobe juggernaut all the way.

I've used the GIMP, exclusively, for all my CafePress [and Zazzle] 'print' designs, starting in 2001.

CP and Z both require RGB images. They both claim to 'print' the images on products. They've stressed that they do not--and will not, even if you beg them [because you screwed up]--modify your images. CP, specifically, says that its design interface is truly WYSIWYG. That baffled me 18 years ago, but since every one of my designs printed with the rich, vibrant colors I had seen on my monitor, I gave up questioning it.

Sorry Moody, but @GameTheory is right.

I've been fully cognizant of CMYK vs RGB for decades--but I know what kind of files both places require, and that they say they don't modify them. GT said "while t-shirt is fine with rgb"--which means 'printing' [in my context] is possible with RGB images.

I'm not saying he's wrong about anything, just explaining what I know as fact regarding how I create my images. I've never touched PS, so if it's the de facto standard for print work...???

CP and Z probably do process them--and don't consider that modifying them. I don't know. *shrug*

 

[lunatic59]

Okay ... here we go ...

RGB is a transmissive and additive color model while CMYK is reflective and 'subtractive'. What this means is for RGB you take varying amounts of colored light and add them together to create colors based on the ammount of Red, Green, or Blue light you add. Depending on the number of bits in the signal controlling the light source you can have 24, 64, 256, etc. variation in intensity. The most common is 32 bit color where there are 24 bits (one byte per color) plus 8 bits for an alpha channel to determine transparency. The give you 256 options per channel. An RGB value of 0, 0, 0 would be black since there is no light being transmitted. An RGB value of 255, 255, 255 would be white since all colors are on at 100%. The eye gets the full visible spectrum.

Now a reflective color model like CMYK requires a light source which can change the color the eye sees based on it's own color temperature. The ink that is put down absorbs certain colors of light and reflects others. Cyan ink, for example reflects blue, but absorbs everything else. To simplify things (and be somewhat incorrect in the process ) the black channel is for contrast and detail. Theoretically you should be able to achieve black by mixing equal amounts of cyan, yellow and magenta ink, but because of the pigments and binders, it never gets to 100% so black is necessary.

In any case, when you see a color image on an opaque surface, it is most likely printed in CMYK. There are other models used for printing but far and away CMYK is the most prevalent. One thing you can be certain of, though, is it will NEVER be RGB.

What's going on here is that technology is getting better into making images consistent in different mediums. A truly WYSIWYG interface is simply making those visual adjustments to remove those colors that are not available to both color models. There are colors that RGB can display that CMYK cannot reproduce, and vice versa. WYSIWYG doesn't allow those colors to be used so the translation tables to go from one to the other can be relatively accurate. You do indeed get your RGB images printed accurately, but they are printed in CMYK.

What you also have is a limited palette. While this is usually okay for a majority of work, professionals, especially those closer to pre-press production, need control over the CMYK channels and GIMP can't do that.

I've used both GIMP and Photoshop since the mid '90s. Both have come a long way and are both very powerful. Depending on your need GIMP certainly can be a good alternative to PS, but @GameTheory 's point was specifically about commercial printing. I have to agree.

 

[MoodyBlues]

Here's an interesting article: Linux Beat IBM, Will Open-Source Software Beat Waymo And Tesla?

 

[lunatic59]

Here's an interesting article: Linux Beat IBM, Will Open-Source Software Beat Waymo And Tesla?

Interesting read, although anybody who follows Linux would already know most of that. I do think the leap from general open source desktop OS to vehicle OS is a bit of a stretch, though.

 

[MoodyBlues]

As I continue plodding along, doing LONG-overdue housecleaning on my network, I occasionally find myself laughing out loud. I hope these have the same effect on you!

Oops! Left this one out:

 

[palmtree5]

For those of you Linux devotees who also use OpenSSL, there is a vulnerability in newer versions. Yes, I see the irony of posting a security advisory from Microsoft in a Linux thread, but that's how I heard about it. (The greater irony perhaps is that it doesn't affect *Windows* versions of OpenSSL...)

https://portal.msrc.microsoft.com/en-us/security-guidance/advisory/ADV200004

did you link the right thing? That led me to something about autodesk

 

[MoodyBlues]

I bailed on this article after a paragraph or two, but in case anyone is interested: systemd will change how your home directory works

PS I intend to finish reading it...someday...

 

[lunatic59]

They had me chuckling at "For example, you could use a USB drive to move it between your work and home machines, or any other systemd-homed computer." Now there's a disaster in search of a backup, if I've ever seen one.

 

[MoodyBlues]

^ Ha ha ha! No kidding.

 

[MoodyBlues]

I'm going to keep my big mouth shut, and let this article speak for itself:

Microsoft admits it was wrong about Linux and open source

 

[Dngrsone]

I am looking forward to playing with KDE Neon in Windows 10, if I can get it to work...

Might not be for a while, though--my current work/play situation is kinda leaning toward the work side of the equation.