California Prop 19, Legalize Marijuana? Vote Yes, or Vote No?

mcatdtDROID · Oct 20, 2010

tommy_ed said:
WOW when the hell did I say legalize it for minors?

well, using your argument of "legalize it since we do it anyways" argument, 13 y.o.'s everywhere can argue the same thing for smokiing, drinking, driving....

you fail at understanding how complex a society you exist in is... you've proven to me in other threads you don't understand econonics, please don't vote. KTHXBIE

JQwerty91 · Oct 20, 2010

mike1 said:
well some of you obviously have never smoked before and are just going by stereotypes but for the most part when you are high you can focus if you want to its just thats its more fun not too haha you could basically do anything that a normal everyday non high person can do except you will have more fun. i find that when i smoke i am more focused on some things than when i am not

Fun? That depends on the amount of marijuana a person smokes. If it's at a low dose like a dimes worth then that person's serotonin increases (which is what all users should be aiming for). However a lot of people without the proper knowledge smokes it heavily and that's where the effects worsen itself and causes depression; If continued the depression becomes severe.

mcatdtDROID · Oct 20, 2010

mcatdtDROID said:
I say no for the simple reason that it enrages potheads.... boo hoo, you can't smoke, let me tell you how much sleep I lose over that...

....

gallandof · Oct 20, 2010

granted I dont live in California, but I feel that it should be legalized.

to the arguments of people driving high or operating machinery high, odds are they do the same thing currently so nothing there would change.

only negative I could think would stem from this is a false economy boost, sure the economy will boost for a year or two but after a while I dont think marijuana will be as profitable.

Also it would help control usage by minors. Say they place a law that makes it a jailable offense to posess marijuana not produced by govt. this would help (to an extent) cut down on black market purchase. and since the only way to obtain it legally would be through a authorized seller, an underage person would have to resort to finding someone who is old enough(granted this will happen, its how I buy my alcohol) it will be alot harder then walking up to 75% of their highschool classmates.

meh i think they should legalize shrooms

more fun

mike1 · Oct 20, 2010

JQwerty91 said:
Fun? That depends on the amount of marijuana a person smokes. If it's at a low dose like a dimes worth then that person's serotonin increases (which is what all users should be aiming for). However a lot of people without the proper knowledge smokes it heavily and that's where the effects worsen itself and causes depression; If continued the depression becomes severe.

actually its used to treat depression and it has definitly helped mine so i dont know where you are getting that....probably from one of those websites that start all the stereotypes about smokers and how bad it is for you there is no proof of anyone having any long term problems people with depression in California and other states that have legalized it for medical purposes give people with depression marijuana to help cope with it it is also given to some cancer patients to help with they treatments

JQwerty91 · Oct 20, 2010

mike1 said:
actually its used to treat depression and it has definitly helped mine so i dont know where you are getting that....probably from one of those websites that start all the stereotypes about smokers and how bad it is for you there is no proof of anyone having any long term problems people with depression in California and other states that have legalized it for medical purposes give people with depression marijuana to help cope with it it is also given to some cancer patients to help with they treatments

Did you read between the line? I said at small doses that where it increases Serotonin and thats the number of doses they treat their patients. At high doses that's where the affects are adversed.

mike1 · Oct 20, 2010

you also said that at high doses causes depression which is completly false also please tell me which of these affects are adversed with high doses

mcatdtDROID · Oct 20, 2010

mcatdtDROID said:
....

.......

JQwerty91 · Oct 20, 2010

mike1 said:
you also said that at high doses causes depression which is completly false also please tell me which of these affects are adversed with high doses

The concept is the same as drinking alcohol. At low concentrations alcohol is good for your liver. But if you abuse it and drink excessively you will damage your liver, brain, and many vital organs. This law applies the same for Marijuana, at small doses like alcohol it is good for you because it increases serotonin levels and improves depression. Delta-9-THC the active component in marijuana mimics chemicals in the brain, those chemicals are the ones responsible for regulating serotonin levels by attaching themselves to your brain receptors (cannaboid). But if you abuse marijuana and take it at large doses, the affects are reversed. At excessive amounts of marijuana induced those receptors are suppressed to a point where little Delta-9-THC are released which causes depression and at further excessive use worsens it. Also note that there are also 65 other chemicals induced into your body besides D9THC that targets other parts in your brain.

My sources:
Health Class
the WHO
Princeton Medical
And a former pot user

LickTheEnvelope · Oct 20, 2010

^^^ Moderation is the key to soooo much in life.

Even viruses and disease exposure is fantastic for your body in low levels to help your immune system fight-back properly.

mcatdtDROID · Oct 20, 2010

mcatdtDROID said:
I say no for the simple reason that it enrages potheads.... boo hoo, you can't smoke, let me tell you how much sleep I lose over that...

......

tommy_ed · Oct 21, 2010

JQwerty91 said:
Fun? That depends on the amount of marijuana a person smokes. If it's at a low dose like a dimes worth then that person's serotonin increases (which is what all users should be aiming for). However a lot of people without the proper knowledge smokes it heavily and that's where the effects worsen itself and causes depression; If continued the depression becomes severe.

many doctors disagree with you... marijuana causes a euphoric effect, the opposite of depression. The closest thing to depression it causes is paranoia.

mcatdtDROID said:
well, using your argument of "legalize it since we do it anyways" argument, 13 y.o.'s everywhere can argue the same thing for smokiing, drinking, driving....

you fail at understanding how complex a society you exist in is... you've proven to me in other threads you don't understand econonics, please don't vote. KTHXBIE

No, 13 y.o.s couldn't argue that, because they are not 18. And we don't stand to make any money off of drinking or smoking and driving so that doesn't fall under my argument. You fail to read what I am typing. As a poster above mentioned, if it was legalized, it would actually be EASIER to control usage by minors. That's why alcohol is harder to get for minors.

Where have I shown you I don't understand economics? Because I don't install task killers on peoples phones? I still have YET to see someone come in here specifically for a task killer problem. And now I see you're trolling?

mcatdtDROID · Oct 21, 2010

response reported, tommyed....

tommy_ed · Oct 21, 2010

mcatdtDROID said:
response reported, tommyed....

reported for what? lol sounds like you've run out of semantics again...

Palmetto Fellow · Oct 21, 2010

I never really thought they would legalize MJ.

I can see them perhaps legalizing THC...which would of course be administrered via extracting it from the plant, and making a pill out of it.

Burning the plant to extract the THC is where almost ALL of the danger lies. Burning plants usually means releasing carcinogens. Cooking with MJ would be healthier...and of course, making a pill out of it would probably be even more healthy.

jamor · Oct 21, 2010

mcatdtDROID said:
I say no for the simple reason that it enrages potheads.... boo hoo, you can't smoke, let me tell you how much sleep I lose over that...

It doesn't enrage just "potheads" but it enrages people that enjoy occasional tokes.

Just like not all people that drink are alcoholics, not all people that smoke weed are "pot heads".

You must be fair in your arguments.

Nonetheless, people can still smoke. It's very easy to get.

Please, let's try and get through this discussion without (to everyone) insulting each other and stereotyping people that smoke because the same can be done for drinking/alcoholism and that's not the point of the discussion.

tommy_ed · Oct 21, 2010

Palmetto Fellow said:
Burning the plant to extract the THC is where almost ALL of the danger lies. Burning plants usually means releasing carcinogens. Cooking with MJ would be healthier...and of course, making a pill out of it would probably be even more healthy.

agreed! home cooked foods would probably be the safest way to go. If they made a pill I'm sure it would be packed with plenty of filler chemicals :rolleyes:

dark4181 · Oct 21, 2010

Palmetto Fellow said:
I never really thought they would legalize MJ.

I can see them perhaps legalizing THC...which would of course be administrered via extracting it from the plant, and making a pill out of it.

Burning the plant to extract the THC is where almost ALL of the danger lies. Burning plants usually means releasing carcinogens. Cooking with MJ would be healthier...and of course, making a pill out of it would probably be even more healthy.

They already do make THC pills. They aren't even half as effective as consumption of the actual plant. That's why I mentioned vaporization earlier. Much safer than burning.

Synthetic Solution

[FONT=book antiqua, times new roman, times]The problem with this synthetic strategy was most quickly evident to patients. Marinol isn't marijuana. The synthetic solution failed because Marinol is only marginally effective.

The difference between marijuana and THC was apparent from the outset. Cancer patients quickly discovered smoking marijuana is far more effective than swallowing oral THC pills.(45) During the DEA hearings before Judge Young, one researcher, Norman Zinberg, M.D., testified that during his 1974 research nearly half the patients quit his legal, THC-based study in order to obtain illegal, but more effective, marijuana.(46)

Zinberg's observations were amplified in an internal National Cancer Institute (NCI) memo from mid-1978. Synthetic THC is described as "erratic," "unpredictable," and finally dismissed as "unfit" for human use. Marijuana cigarettes, by contrast, are described as "reliable" and "highly predictable." After reviewing the available evidence the cancer specialists at NCI concluded, "All in all the [marijuana] cigarette may be the best means of delivering the drug."(47)

After reviewing the available evidence DEA Judge Francis L. Young concluded Marinol is not an adequate substitute for marijuana.(48) [/FONT]

mcatdtDROID · Oct 21, 2010

tommy_ed said:
reported for what? lol sounds like you've run out of semantics again...

I figured it was the thing to do.... :rolleyes:

jamor said:
It doesn't enrage just "potheads" but it enrages people that enjoy occasional tokes.

Just like not all people that drink are alcoholics, not all people that smoke weed are "pot heads".

You must be fair in your arguments.

Nonetheless, people can still smoke. It's very easy to get.

Please, let's try and get through this discussion without (to everyone) insulting each other and stereotyping people that smoke because the same can be done for drinking/alcoholism and that's not the point of the discussion.

I don't care that it enrages recreationalists... I also realize most would never classify themselves as a pothead because the stigma is like admitting you're an alcoholic, or have a gambling addiction.

And I don't have to be fair with my arguments. I am simply taking the Conflict Perspective to it. I'm the one with the power.... you have to convince ME (and others who take my point of view) that I should vote YES instead of NO. So I don't have to convince any of yall of anything, or be "fair" in my argument. If people vote no to legalizing because green is their least favorite color.... then you still have to change their vote.

Bob Maxey · Oct 21, 2010

Palmetto Fellow said:
I never really thought they would legalize MJ.

I can see them perhaps legalizing THC...which would of course be administrered via extracting it from the plant, and making a pill out of it.

Burning the plant to extract the THC is where almost ALL of the danger lies. Burning plants usually means releasing carcinogens. Cooking with MJ would be healthier...and of course, making a pill out of it would probably be even more healthy.

Well, you are getting there.

Seems to me I read somewhere that a state that wants to legalize pot would do so only if the strength could be controlled. Utah once had (still do?) a law that regulated the percentage of alcohol in beer.

What happened is many people went to Wyoming to buy stronger beer. Some say that could happen with MJ. The state controlled version is not very strong, so a black market develops.

I am not sure Californians that use the stuff would be happy with a state controlled monopoly and I am not so sure they want a pill.

Bob Maxey

jamor · Oct 21, 2010

Bob Maxey said:
Well, you are getting there.

Alcohol % is hardly regulated either so not really getting there.

See Everclear - available and legal. Or any other hard liquor for that matter. Not exactly a small amount of alcohol.

Josh2 · Oct 21, 2010

stop19.com

Bob Maxey · Oct 21, 2010

jamor said:
Alcohol % is hardly regulated either so not really getting there.

See Everclear - available and legal. Or any other hard liquor for that matter. Not exactly a small amount of alcohol.

Under Utah law, any beer sold in grocery stores or from bar taps cannot exceed 3.2 percent alcohol by weight. So yes, Sport, it is regulated in Utah.

We do sell Everclear, by the way. And we sell the hard stuff and wine.

Please read, I was specifically talking about a Utah law that governs the allowable percentage of alcohol in beer.

Bob Maxey

Vinsanity93 · Oct 21, 2010

I think it's just going to end up like Prohibition, because weed is illegal criminals would make a fortune growing and selling it. I mean look how much money we waste looking for growers, traffickers, and dealers. Imagine if it was legalized and taxed we would probably be out of this recession and there would be less crime.

And look at cigarettes, seriously the only way to use it is by smoking it and it's well known to have poisons in it, yet it is still legal even if it is known to kill and cause cancer.

Now look at weed, you can smoke it, eat it, and vaporize it. Can you vaporize or eat cigarettes? Maybe, but why would you? And in all my life I have never known weed to kill anybody or cause cancer (unless you smoke it).

jamor · Oct 21, 2010

Bob Maxey said:
Under Utah law, any beer sold in grocery stores or from bar taps cannot exceed 3.2 percent alcohol by weight.

We do sell Everclear, by the way. And we sell the hard stuff and wine.

Exactly, so it's hardly regulated. You can still get Everclear, one of the strongest amounts of alcohol available.

Thank you for verifying my post.

California Prop 19, Legalize Marijuana? Vote Yes, or Vote No?

California Prop 19, Legalize Marijuana? Yes or No?

Yes

No

Maybe in the future, once the proposition is rewritten to close loopholes and insure safety.

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