Be VERY CAREFUL with over the phone contract re-ups!

OcalaFlGuy · Mar 29, 2011

Preface; In my 6 years with VZN I have never had an issue where I thought they were trying to do me. Until now.

I had this post earlier of the killer deal I got them to agree to last Friday for a 2 year commit from me. http://androidforums.com/verizon/303397-wheelin-dealin-data-plan.html

When I get the on-line Commitment Letter over the weekend, it's not what we had agreed on.

(THANK GOD! I had the lady Friday sent me a live email recapping what we'd agreed to. If it weren't for that I think I'd be SOL. IT IS ALSO AGAINST VZN POLICY FOR HER TO HAVE EVEN SENT IT.)

30 min on the phone with them yesterday and they are going to listen to the call tape and call me back. How unfortunate it was to have to tell THEM that *I* was recording this call with them. That is something I might have to do with ATnT or Sprint, I don't expect to have to protect myself like that with VZN. (Sure never have before)

Another 30 min today and there is still an issue. Their system will only allow them to give me a promotion (price break on text) for one year. We'd agreed to two years last Fri. (the full period of my re-up Duh)

So, they end up (at least saying they will) credit my account for the money amount of all they had promised me in price breaks that couldn't
be input to their system (they said).

$400.

(Quick recap; I was to get a $10/month drop in unlimited data.
a $40 one time free months service credit (my basic plan amount) and 2 years of 500 free text a month, $10/mth. One year of the free text IS input to their
system. They (say they) will credit me the full amount of all those differences.)

I recorded both yesterday's call and today's and told them so.

It is so disappointing in this respect for it to appear that VZN has jumped into the mud hole with ATnT and Sprint on customer fairness.

Bruce in Ocala, FL

najaboy · Mar 29, 2011

I'd be very careful about recording phone calls, since Florida is a two party state. Recording a conversation without their express consent is a first degree misdemeanor for a first offense not for illegal purposes or commercial gain. Subsequent to the first offense, it becomes a third degree felony.

OcalaFlGuy · Mar 29, 2011

najaboy said:
I'd be very careful about recording phone calls, since Florida is a two party state. Recording a conversation without their express consent is a first degree misdemeanor for a first offense not for illegal purposes or commercial gain. Subsequent to the first offense, it becomes a third degree felony.

I told her I was recording the call.

Also, I am pretty sure that by Verizon saying, "this line may be monitored and recorded" they technically also give YOU the right to record. <They are giving the ok to being recorded by recording you and them themselves.>

But, you are correct.

I just covered those bases too when I called them...

[And by the way, I used my Sansa Fuze to record the call with the mighty DX on speaker. Cool thing there is the phonecall is then in a .wav file that can be pulled right off the Sansa and emailed if needed. :cool:

]

Bruce in Ocala, FL

Tempusfugit · Mar 29, 2011

At least verizon agreed to listen to a call...

Sprint kept telling me "we only use recorded calls for QA purposes." Telling them this is exactly one of the quality assurance purposes you are talking about didn't help.

Oh, and "the system only allows us to do 'x' " is a lie used by every phone company. Sprint actually told me they could only take off 25 dollars in charges... LOL

byteware · Mar 30, 2011

najaboy said:
I'd be very careful about recording phone calls, since Florida is a two party state. Recording a conversation without their express consent is a first degree misdemeanor for a first offense not for illegal purposes or commercial gain. Subsequent to the first offense, it becomes a third degree felony.

There is this nice little message at the beginning of the phone call.

This call may be recorded for customer service quality assurance...

In my humble non-lawyer opinion... that makes it clear that the call can be recorded (by either party).

Edited to add: Bah you beat me to it.

drdoom · Mar 30, 2011

I tried to cash in on a promotion in January where I could get unlimited data on all lines for $10/month. They told me I was completely eligible for it and proceeded to activate it. Next month, my bill was $40 higher than normal rather than being $10 lower because of the promotion. It took me 7 long calls to Verizon to get them to remove the charge because of their error. I should have been recording the calls with Google Voice because one guy told me he didn't care and to stop calling about the problem. I threatened to cancel and he just hung up. It won't be a threat the next time they try to pull crap like this on me. I never did get the promotion; they claimed the lady who originally signed me up for it "misunderstood" me and that I wasn't able to receive this promotion.

najaboy · Mar 30, 2011

byteware said:
There is this nice little message at the beginning of the phone call.

This call may be recorded for customer service quality assurance...

In my humble non-lawyer opinion... that makes it clear that the call can be recorded (by either party).

Edited to add: Bah you beat me to it.

Legally. no. I'll have to dig up the proscribing case law, but in FL, any party that's recording must provide disclosure, regardless if the other party is recording for their own purposes.

byteware · Mar 30, 2011

najaboy said:
Legally. no. I'll have to dig up the proscribing case law, but in FL, any party that's recording must provide disclosure, regardless if the other party is recording for their own purposes.

Even if the other party says it's ok for you to record the conversation?

OcalaFlGuy · Mar 30, 2011

There certainly is no option with the Verizon message to allow you to say, "no, please don't record this call".

I don't think the other party has to GIVE PERMISSION for you to tape, they just have to be Notified that you ARE taping the call. (They of course, have the option to hang up if they don't want to be recorded.)

There are a couple apps for call recording, but the Sansa Fuze just worked too well. Especially it making each recorded conversation a serperate .wav file. (Which I did for grins pull off the Sansa, copy to my laptop and play just to be sure I could.) While it was technically an edit, the Sansa even let me pause the recording while I was on hold and resume when they came back on the line. It could come in handy being able to attach the .wav file to an email (to VZN?) and send via email the recorded phone conversation.

1000 poxes on you VZN for making your customers feel they have to resort to protecting themselves from being hosed over by VZN.

Bruce in Ocala, FL

byteware · Mar 30, 2011

OcalaFlGuy said:
There certainly is no option with the Verizon message to allow you to say, "no, please don't record this call".

True, but they don't inform you that they are either. They simply inform you that they it MAY be recorded.

And that doesn't say that it MAY be recorded by Verizon. It simply says that it MAY be recorded, so if that disclaimer is legal, then it's legal for both parties since it's so vague.

skilaufen · Mar 30, 2011

While refraining from entering the legal discussion I just have one thought...

Legal or illegal, I would seriously doubt Verizon would have a customer arrested for illegally recording the conversation with their Customer Rep. I can only imagine the PR fallout of doing that would be of great concern to them.

....But then again who knows now-a-days.

butthead007 · Mar 30, 2011

OcalaFlGuy said:
Preface; In my 6 years with VZN I have never had an issue where I thought they were trying to do me. Until now.

I had this post earlier of the killer deal I got them to agree to last Friday for a 2 year commit from me. http://androidforums.com/verizon/303397-wheelin-dealin-data-plan.html

When I get the on-line Commitment Letter over the weekend, it's not what we had agreed on.

(THANK GOD! I had the lady Friday sent me a live email recapping what we'd agreed to. If it weren't for that I think I'd be SOL. IT IS ALSO AGAINST VZN POLICY FOR HER TO HAVE EVEN SENT IT.)

30 min on the phone with them yesterday and they are going to listen to the call tape and call me back. How unfortunate it was to have to tell THEM that *I* was recording this call with them. That is something I might have to do with ATnT or Sprint, I don't expect to have to protect myself like that with VZN. (Sure never have before)

Another 30 min today and there is still an issue. Their system will only allow them to give me a promotion (price break on text) for one year. We'd agreed to two years last Fri. (the full period of my re-up Duh)

So, they end up (at least saying they will) credit my account for the money amount of all they had promised me in price breaks that couldn't
be input to their system (they said).

$400.

(Quick recap; I was to get a $10/month drop in unlimited data.
a $40 one time free months service credit (my basic plan amount) and 2 years of 500 free text a month, $10/mth. One year of the free text IS input to their
system. They (say they) will credit me the full amount of all those differences.)

I recorded both yesterday's call and today's and told them so.

It is so disappointing in this respect for it to appear that VZN has jumped into the mud hole with ATnT and Sprint on customer fairness.

Bruce in Ocala, FL

If you're getting a special deal through elite ninja "wheeling and dealing" skills, then I suggest you get everything in writing before you post on the internet. There are no special deals or price matching, so if you can get them to commit in writing or remark the account, then you are good to go. You also may be talking to an outsource rep who is not exactly up to speed on current policies so tread lightly.

As far as any calls you get regarding upgrading/renewing, etc, if I really have to tell you that you need to be attentive and listen to everything that is said to you, then you really have no argument.

Be a smart consumer. Listen to everything that is said to you. For the love of god, do not take the stance that everyone else does and call in and demand promos you did not receive. While customer care should be providing you with the best information, there are outsource reps and people who are uninformed who you may be dealing with.

Some of these problems are your own doing. Verizon does not price match their plans or "wheel and deal" as you put it, so I think your expectations going into it are not based in reality.

Too many consumers adopt the attitude of "uh ha, yep, sure, whatever" while agreeing to things and only when they have a cogent moment 5 months down the road do they realize what they agreed to. And we get blessed with posts like this.

Just be sure you are informing the reps you are speaking to you are also recording so the judge doesn't have to inform you that all your years of reading consumerist.com were wasted.

OcalaFlGuy · Mar 31, 2011

butthead007 said:
If you're getting a special deal through elite ninja "wheeling and dealing" skills, then I suggest you get everything in writing before you post on the internet. There are no special deals or price matching, so if you can get them to commit in writing or remark the account, then you are good to go. You also may be talking to an outsource rep who is not exactly up to speed on current policies so tread lightly.

As far as any calls you get regarding upgrading/renewing, etc, if I really have to tell you that you need to be attentive and listen to everything that is said to you, then you really have no argument.

Be a smart consumer. Listen to everything that is said to you. For the love of god, do not take the stance that everyone else does and call in and demand promos you did not receive. While customer care should be providing you with the best information, there are outsource reps and people who are uninformed who you may be dealing with.

Some of these problems are your own doing. Verizon does not price match their plans or "wheel and deal" as you put it, so I think your expectations going into it are not based in reality.

Too many consumers adopt the attitude of "uh ha, yep, sure, whatever" while agreeing to things and only when they have a cogent moment 5 months down the road do they realize what they agreed to. And we get blessed with posts like this.

Just be sure you are informing the reps you are speaking to you are also recording so the judge doesn't have to inform you that all your years of reading consumerist.com were wasted.

I'm not sure what other than just sending a smarmy post, you were trying to accomplish with your post and I certainly don't appreciate your attitude displayed.

Maybe YOU don't feel as you put it "blessed" by my OP but I can tell you *I sure wish I'd have known* (and remember I am a 6 year customer of VZN so this ISN'T my first dance with them) that VZN has IMO, taken on such anti-customer tactics prior to my re-up call to them last Friday.

RE; you ending admonition to announce you're recording, perhaps your reading skills had you MISS the FOUR other times *I'd already said* I told them the call was being recorded. Thanks so much for your help there. :rolleyes:

Some of these problems are my own doing because VZN doesn't not wheel or deal? You must apparently be very ignorant of how VZN does business.
I assure you the $400 credit they made to my account is Very Real. Once again, perhaps you need to recompute your advice there...

You also stress "get it in writing". Just how to you expect to enforce that edict of yours when Verizons policy IS NOT to put the deal negotiations in writing at all outside of the automated Confirmation Letter which in my case was wrong on most every point? You are going to be up the creek when they refuse to send you any verifying email (like they tried to do with me) and you haven't taken any measures to record the call. But that's OK, you know better than try to wheel and deal with them to begin with I guess. :rolleyes:

It also was not an outsourced VZN person I was talking to as her email has the VZN office in Acworth, Ga. contact info on it.

Furthermore, though I've read the Consumerist.com a few times, it's far from the years of reading it you note.

In closing, congratulations on your post that was incorrect or not applicable on virtually every single point you meagerly attempted to make.

[removed by Mod]

Bruce in Ocala, FL

Slug · Mar 31, 2011

Hi there!

Just a friendly reminder.... please keep your responses civil and insult-free. Remember the mantra - "attack the message, not the messenger".

Be *VERY CAREFUL* with over the phone contract re-ups!

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Be VERY CAREFUL with over the phone contract re-ups!