3dEvo: Pre-release miscellany

EarlyMon said:

One last time - Sense is more than a launcher it includes the app suite.

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One last time, I know this. I've had Sense, and purposefully removed the bloat, and never looked back. It's all window dressing on the same chica mang!

You argument derives from a marriage of convenience, I get it, and I'm not knocking it, just thought the install size was very large. More so, I agree with you. Sense can be more *convenient* in a variety of ways. I simply don't find it meaningful in many practical ways that justify the load is all.

EarlyMon said:

Your position that Sense is just bloating without adding much functionality does not include allowing any of us to inventory what is new in Sense.

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Quantify away Grand Poobah (I feel a fit of deja vu coming along)! But it's mostly eye candy and not much else. The added functionality to justify the bloat relative to the competition is very minor. It is first and foremost, a launcher, w/ a crap-ton of window decor widgets, a dialer in a skin w/ T9 and an integrated Facebook/Twitter contacts manager (I consider this distracting a nuisance, and the polling a battery hog).

If I remember correctly, you enjoy the messaging widget? Is that the one were you flick through messages via the home screen? Cute . LP has a similar widget. And the calendar was it? It can be easily replaced w/ both a functionally superior (way more features, and autonomous widget) and more aesthetically pleasing glass aero-esque alternative.

One cool thing I like about Sense: the weather animations, that's it, but it takes up too much real estate for my tastes.

EarlyMon said:

What's new in HTC Watch? The whole thing. Bloat or valuable for many? How much code did it take?

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That app expletives fragmentation. Who's going to want to subscribe to yet another, separate streaming video service that only works on their HTC handsets; rather than the homogenous Netflix on thieir TV/Puter/Phone, etc? Nevermind Amazon's increasing VoD services, uVerse, Vcast, Hulu (coming soon). They all overlap somewhat. Who needs another myopic (by design) alternative when there are alternatives that already do that, and more?

If your argument is some (i.e. many, same difference) find it worthy in and of itself, well... one can say the same about fart apps.

EarlyMon said:

This phone comes with Sense. Please stop beating this horse to death. You've owned a Hero with Sense, it didn't work out for you. We got it.

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Correction: I OWN a Hero, but without Sense. But I was merely pointing out how large it seems, especially relative to the additional features it provides... it was news to my ears is all.

I had a Hero. It is a poor ambassador for Sense because the hardware just isn't up for it. It made me hate sense.

However Sense on the HTC Flyer looks and runs great and is miles ahead of Touchwiz, Motoblur and even pure android in someways in terms of presentation and information delivery.

Just because you like Sense better doesn't make it better. Its personal preference.

But, I like Sense 3.0 just a little bit more than TouchWiz 4.0 just because of the lock screen being great on Sense and bad on TW (but I will be using a lock screen replacement). I like the Widget settings, music player, launcher, and app drawer (even though it does look iphone-ish its just a faster, more accurate and more customizable way than vertically scrolling hoping you stop it on the right section) on TW4.

2strokenut said:

LOL LTE is not replacing anything. LTE AND Wimax will be used in the future, in fact LTE advanced and Wimax2 will be the future. WiMax is not going anywhere.

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Hmmm... If I start with LOL, will it add credence to my point?

Sure, Wimax will exist in some form, but that's not the point. Technologies constantly evolve but that doesn't mean that antiquated technologies are not still used.

Clearwire is at its low point, is on shaky grounds (seen that nose dive of a stock lately?), yet seeks significant investment to continue roll out.

Maybe Sprint will buy them out completely when they know what they really want, but what will you say when LTE starts taking the majority market share of WiMax on the very same network, never mind the far larger ATT/T-Mo & Verizon subscriber base w/ exclusive LTE plans. We simpletons call that 'replace'. WiMax was the 1st out the gate as a stop loss, but will be a day late and a dollar short, as current market conditions already indicate.

Note, I am indifferent to these technologies, and am a happy Sprint customer.

2strokenut said:

Like I said above educate yourself first.
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I think I have done a reasonable amount of research. Sprint is beginning a 2.5 billion network upgrade, which includes a a LTE network build via 15 year partnership with LightSquared valued at 20 billion. At the same time, Sprint - with its 53% share in Clearwiire -- has consistently and deliberately stifled Clearwire (perhaps to their own economic ends, but it does the technology as a whole no good). Meanwhile, three out of four of the major US carriers have chosen LTE, never mind which is beginning the shape the global advantage.

Early and Novox thx for explaining things to people. My brain starts to hurt because its why why why. I thought AOL hit the .com bubble like other startup .com companies and this caused their demise.

I've had my AOL account since 1998. I have saved mail in their from 2007. And I have old mail and sent mail in there from 2009. AOL gives you lots of storage space. I love my AOL email account.

And Novox I saw how you were ranting in the battery thread about radio usage and battery life. I try to explain that and all I hear is why have a smartphone with 3G always off. Haven't run this test in awhile but leaving 3G on will drain your battery around 2%-3% every hour opposed to 1% an hour leaving WiFi on.

hakujin said:

Hmmm... If I start with LOL, will it add credence to my point?

Sure, Wimax will exist in some form, but that's not the point. Technologies constantly evolve but that doesn't mean that antiquated technologies are not still used.

Clearwire is at its low point, is on shaky grounds (seen that nose dive of a stock lately?), yet seeks significant investment to continue roll out.

Maybe Sprint will buy them out completely when they know what they really want, but what will you say when LTE starts taking the majority market share of WiMax on the very same network, never mind the far larger ATT/T-Mo & Verizon subscriber base w/ exclusive LTE plans. We simpletons call that 'replace'. WiMax was the 1st out the gate as a stop loss, but will be a day late and a dollar short, as current market conditions already indicate.

Note, I am indifferent to these technologies, and am a happy Sprint customer.



I think I have done a reasonable amount of research. Sprint is beginning a 2.5 billion network upgrade, which includes a a LTE network build via 15 year partnership with LightSquared valued at 20 billion. At the same time, Sprint - with its 53% share in Clearwiire -- has consistently and deliberately stifled Clearwire (perhaps to their own economic ends, but it does the technology as a whole no good). Meanwhile, three out of four of the major US carriers have chosen LTE, never mind which is beginning the shape the global advantage.

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Like I said, educate yourself first. You are parroting what every know nothing in the media says about LTE vs Wimax. Its easy to see. I like to LOL. Are you saying Wimax is somehow antiquated?


Sprint has not finalized anything with LTE, its all talk right now. LTE and Wimax will both be needed. Clearwire is handicapped by local laws in the build-out of Wimax, just give it some time. Just wait till iDen is gone and sprint frees up that 800mhz spectrum. If you think Verizon and ATT choosing LTE means a global advantage then I don't think you understand what Wimax is going to be.

You see me trolling....you hating. But thanks for the trip down memory line, good times those were.

On a more important side note, glad to see some good reviews today. 6 more days.

Why are we even arguing over Wi-Max vs LTE? Even if it were to start the upgrade process today, the E3D would be relevant to the time where most people could upgrade, anyways. This is something to be concerned about in 6 months to a year from now, if upgrading. Not now when all LTE is to Sprint is a bunch of plans and documents in a boardroom.

Halfbaked said:

Early and Novox thx for explaining things to people. My brain starts to hurt because its why why why. I thought AOL hit the .com bubble like other startup .com companies and this caused their demise.

I've had my AOL account since 1998. I have saved mail in their from 2007. And I have old mail and sent mail in there from 2009. AOL gives you lots of storage space. I love my AOL email account.

And Novox I saw how you were ranting in the battery thread about radio usage and battery life. I try to explain that and all I hear is why have a smartphone with 3G always off. Haven't run this test in awhile but leaving 3G on will drain your battery around 2%-3% every hour opposed to 1% an hour leaving WiFi on.

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If it helps, I definitely remember getting all those damn AOL CDs in the mail. We never used them for Internet service, though. I was kind of a late bloomer in that regard. I think I started using the web in 2000.

As far as 3G/Wifi, your absolutely right that it saves power, but it automatically turns of 3G when wifi has a known connection, so it's not really necessary to keep 3G off all the time (as long as you're by wifi). You could definitely leave it off and save power, but then you'll only be getting phone calls and text messages, no emails, internet browsing, app store, etc. I'm sure you understand that, I just want to make sure someone reading through the thread will understand better how it works.

EarlyMon said:

I like Infosync reviews, I find them rather accurate. I'm concerned that they're saying voice quality is now relating to signal strength - that's not the CDMA way, and those guys are good enough to know that.

I'll be watching that with interest when I get mine.

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He said he was roaming. So, unless I misunderstand how the system works, roaming means that it's going through someone else's system. I wouldn't expect the same voice quality from any phone when roaming.

However, I didn't like how the guy didn't try call quality again when in a Sprint area to see if it was due to roaming or not. Overall, I think he did a really good job with the review. He hit the high points and the low points and put it in a presentation where the buyer can decide for themselves if the phone is good for them. Which is what reviews should be.

AOL is out? Seriously? Crap...I suppose now you'll tell me I have to go trade in my pleated jeans and get those fancy boot-cuts now.

Whoops...my wife just told me from the other room those are out too...she just yelled something about "skinny" jeans.

Don't you young punks wear those? They'll never hold an Evo 3D. Screw it...I'm going back to Slater style. They may be stone-washed but I can hold a smartphone AND a small laptop in those bad boys...

(Ahhh, being old....)

2strokenut said:

Like I said, educate yourself first. You are parroting what every know nothing in the media says about LTE vs Wimax. Its easy to see. I like to LOL. Are you saying Wimax is somehow antiquated?

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Educate? I see. Pot meet kettle. Your response is an argument from ignorance. 'Educated' people call that a fallacy.

I am saying exactly what I originally said: LTE will replace Wimax on Sprint, eventually. But you know... I'll kick it up a notch and say 'sooner than later'. I guess you deny this but that doesn't mean anything really.

2strokenut said:

If you think Verizon and ATT choosing LTE means a global advantage then I don't think you understand what Wimax is going to be.

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I'm saying there are far more global commitments (all over the map, but can you say biggest potential global = 'China'?), projected 7x the subscribers by 2016, and nary a source that speculates Wimax will pose a serious threat, let alone defeat LTE.

Then, let's not undervalue consumer hyperbole. That also has a toll, because you can't sell nearly as much of a product that is believed as inferior to its competitor. If you'd kindly look around the tubes and not come to the conclusion that the talk is largely fire & brimstone w/ WiMax technology, well... you aren't looking. This will be a stigma hard removed, particularly when the biggest U.S. mobile telecom backer of the tech (which btw is small compared to competition) is transitioning to incorporate LTE (not if, but how soon) into their network and basically threw Clearwire under a bus, probably causing a mass exodus for its shareholders who can't be too pleased right now. I don't think they'll support two competing technologies (though they could practically speaking as w/ the proper infrastructure, it's merely a flavor of ice cream) indefinitely, do you?

jerofld said:

Even if it were to start the upgrade process today, the E3D would be relevant to the time where most people could upgrade, anyways. This is something to be concerned about in 6 months to a year from now, if upgrading. Not now when all LTE is to Sprint is a bunch of plans and documents in a boardroom.

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I agree 98%. Never stated otherwise. Re-read my initial post on LTE, than the subsequent blase, faux-authoritative responses that ensued, and you are arrive here at this spot now.

The other 2% is LTE as merely an idea in a board room.That is baloney & ignores 2nd from last post completely. LTE is far more than that for Sprint. Unless maybe you feel the partnership w/ Lightsquared will perhaps serve Sprint as a mobile food truck startup. I mean... c'mon. Let's not pander to Sprint's not at all secret HUGE plans and commitment. Let's analogize... do you need a presentational statement or are the bombs dropping overhead enough indication to know a country is at war?

Anyway, this conversation is going nowhere; I'm sure my efforts will be negated and then scoffed at, and sorry, but I have better things to do this weekend than argue with 2strokenut over some glib reply to me ... about something I couldn't care less about proving to you.

More so, 55" 3D LED LCD-TV sale at Frys, Ramen House, and West Coast Bay weather works extremely well right now, not online talking about some that neither make me happy nor a rich man.

Enjoy your weekend gentlemen!

Well I wasn't trying to argue about LTE. Just noted that it is better i most practical ways to Wi-Max. Lots of my friends have Evo (I live in a popular sprint area) and uniformly most of them can't use wi-max indoors. 3g in my area is not so bad (actually pretty good for 3g) but what's the point of wi-max if you cant' use it.
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Anyways I think spring knows this and I think that is why they are likely to move to LTE. Pity they didn't do it in the first place (I'm presuming perhaps incorrectly they will use a lower frequency with LTE).

jerofld said:

Why are we even arguing over Wi-Max vs LTE? Even if it were to start the upgrade process today, the E3D would be relevant to the time where most people could upgrade, anyways. This is something to be concerned about in 6 months to a year from now, if upgrading. Not now when all LTE is to Sprint is a bunch of plans and documents in a boardroom.

Click to expand...

2strokenut said:

Like I said, educate yourself first. You are parroting what every know nothing in the media says about LTE vs Wimax. Its easy to see. I like to LOL. Are you saying Wimax is somehow antiquated?


Sprint has not finalized anything with LTE, its all talk right now. LTE and Wimax will both be needed. Clearwire is handicapped by local laws in the build-out of Wimax, just give it some time. Just wait till iDen is gone and sprint frees up that 800mhz spectrum. If you think Verizon and ATT choosing LTE means a global advantage then I don't think you understand what Wimax is going to be.

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I agree with your assumption that WiMax and LTE will both be needed but it isn't all just talk with Lightsquared, if you read the bloomberg article they have actually put pen to paper, inked the deal. Of course it is pending FCC approval and some tweaks to stop interference with GPS. As far as Clearwire goes all rumors point to it getting ready to be sold. And Sprint reduced it's voting share to 49.8% or so to prepare for the future so they can say "We aren't sure why they went under, we had no voting power so we don't owe those debts". This is all just in case but it is clear that Sprint is going LTE, crystal in fact. What isn't clear, ironically, is Clear's fate in all of this. Ok now can we get back to our regularly schedule program.

you2 said:

Well I wasn't trying to argue about LTE. Just noted that it is better i most practical ways to Wi-Max. Lots of my friends have Evo (I live in a popular sprint area) and uniformly most of them can't use wi-max indoors. 3g in my area is not so bad (actually pretty good for 3g) but what's the point of wi-max if you cant' use it.
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Anyways I think spring knows this and I think that is why they are likely to move to LTE. Pity they didn't do it in the first place (I'm presuming perhaps incorrectly they will use a lower frequency with LTE).

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Building penetration depends on frequency regardless of the tech, WiMax or LTE. So I think what you are saying is Verizon's LTE is better in most practical ways to Sprint's WiMax.

jerofld said:

He said he was roaming. So, unless I misunderstand how the system works, roaming means that it's going through someone else's system. I wouldn't expect the same voice quality from any phone when roaming.

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Pretty sure when I've been roaming, I've been on Verizon towers. In any case, I've suffered no voice quality issues when doing so on my Evo, Moment or others.

I suppose it's possible tho.

hakujin said:

One last time, I know this. I've had Sense, and purposefully removed the bloat, and never looked back. It's all window dressing on the same chica mang!

You argument derives from a marriage of convenience, I get it, and I'm not knocking it, just thought the install size was very large. More so, I agree with you. Sense can be more *convenient* in a variety of ways. I simply don't find it meaningful in many practical ways that justify the load is all.

If your argument is some (i.e. many, same difference) find it worthy in and of itself, well... one can say the same about fart apps.



Correction: I OWN a Hero, but without Sense. But I was merely pointing out how large it seems, especially relative to the additional features it provides... it was news to my ears is all.

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I cut out the invective as I'm tired of repeating that I don't use the Sense messaging widget (or app), I mod the calendar thread for this site, and I've been down the path you're on.

I'm not aware that any of us know how many new features Sense brings. Perhaps I'm alone in this.

I find comparing any of the maker UI + goodies to fart apps rather grating but - for anyone new to this discussion or Android, maybe anyone comparing these three phones, it's good to know that if they have questions on this sort of thing, folks like you can guide them to alternative choices.

Now - I've been more than fair, tried to word things diplomatically.

Move on. This is not the thread to continue this.

sikclown said:

Building penetration depends on frequency regardless of the tech, WiMax or LTE. So I think what you are saying is Verizon's LTE is better in most practical ways to Sprint's WiMax.

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There is nothing wrong with Wimax, but there is a lot wrong with Clear. If Sprint's Wimax infrastructure was provided by a more organized and better funded organization our opinion of Wimax would be very different.

RichboyJhae said:

Do you guys feel we should pursue HTC to give the E3D 1080p support for 2D recording? I really think our phone should have this feature.

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I don't think we should have to pursue HTC to give us that. Sure, it'd be nice for them to give us everything we ask for, but I don't see it happening. What we SHOULD do, is pursue our lovely devs to come up with a fix for it. They did that with the EVO 4G and the 30fps cap.

thelonewizard said:

I don't think we should have to pursue HTC to give us that. Sure, it'd be nice for them to give us everything we ask for, but I don't see it happening. What we SHOULD do, is pursue our lovely devs to come up with a fix for it. They did that with the EVO 4G and the 30fps cap.

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It's not a matter of us expecting them to give us everything we ask for. It's a matter of them giving us what they promised.

They advertised 1080p 2D recording all over the place. In fact, when most of us placed out preorder, it was listed in the official specs on Sprint's website.

This isn't the same thing as us asking for them to include a bunch of stuff we think the phone should have. It's a matter of us asking them to include the things they promised the phone would have when we agreed to buy it.

When I had an 89 Honda Accord SE-I my tech taught me to hold the remote to my talking alarm under my chin if I was far from my car and trying to activate the alarm. Your head can act as an antenna. Some people may have to hold their 3VO underneath their chin for good reception. Can you hear me now?

BlackDynamite said:

It's not a matter of us expecting them to give us everything we ask for. It's a matter of them giving us what they promised.

They advertised 1080p 2D recording all over the place. In fact, when most of us placed out preorder, it was listed in the official specs on Sprint's website.

This isn't the same thing as us asking for them to include a bunch of stuff we think the phone should have. It's a matter of us asking them to include the things they promised the phone would have when we agreed to buy it.

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Exactly. Couldn't have been said any better.

Halfbaked said:

When I had an 89 Honda Accord SE-I my tech taught me to hold the remote to my talking alarm under my chin if I was far from my car and trying to activate the alarm. Your head can act as an antenna.

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Your chest-neck-chin was acting as a weak, distorted, but sufficiently-effective, parabolic reflector. Satellite dishes and ground transmit antennas are parabolic reflectors - we do that because that shape kinda concentrates the signal reflection into a general area instead of all-over, and increases power in that direction.

If anyone's head is acting an antenna, seek help or wear tin foil.

Some people may have to hold their 3VO underneath their chin for good reception. Can you hear me now?

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No, I'm on Sprint, and please don't speculate on how that will impact battery life, either.

I'm moving to northern California and I decided to pick my residence based on the Sprint coverage map because I know Yuba City, CA will receive 4G before any other place closer to where I work. But the coverage around where I work looks bad. Then again it could be due to the nature of the facilities. My buddy is on AT&T and he may not get any iPhone loving in nothern Cali.

Moved review to review sticky thread.