Help Battery life and battery management

lordofthereef · Jun 19, 2011

Talk about controversy! LOL

I can weigh in my own experiences a bit here, and I came from the iPhone 4. On a day I went without using the iphone, it would drain 10-15% max (interestingly the day I got the EVO I just set the iPhone down on the counter - we didn't cancel that line for about a week - I was still getting updates and all that since the phone number and data plan was still active and a week later it was sitting at right around 15%). On a day I go without using the EVO I get about 35% drain. Granted, the EVO is getting true push mail, updating weather, etc. With those turned off, I am still at about 25% drain. This is also with all necessary tweaks, using CM7 (which is about as stock as things get and great on battery). I would be shocked to see my EVO go more than 3 days sitting idle with radios on, as did the iPhone. FWIW I had worse reception in my house on the iPhone than I do with my EVO (2 bars on iPhone versus generally full bars on the EVO)

My experience has been great with iPhone 4 battery life. I had it for six months and only once ever wished I had a charger on me to give it more juice. With the EVO I make sure I DO have the charger on me. I have needed it at least two dozen times. I also have a tendency to plug it in when I know I will be stationary for a while "just in case". Overall I can see a person that does a lot of traveling have issues with the EVOs battery life. It certainly isn't fun to be looking for power at an airport. Some airports are fantastic, while others are just terrible. I have seen people waiting in line. In that sense, the iPhone 4 knocked the socks off my EVO hands down.

EarlyMon · Jun 19, 2011

LOTR, you make a good point beyond the one about the Evo - we've got a lot of controversy here, and it's speculation based on reviewers comments.

Maybe it'll be a dog, maybe it's be a prince - but this much is certain:

I can't imagine any of from the Evo forums known to each other saying the emperor is wearing spendid clothes if in fact this phone's power use is stark naked. We all lived thru what the Evo did and didn't do.

I say we let this whole issue lie until the phone's in our hands. Otherwise, we're just comparing history to history - and guessing about the 3vo as if we know.

It's going to take just over a week to know - the early buyers are going to augering their batteries into the ground for the first few days - we all know that one.

Let's reconvene on this next week.

evotitans · Jun 19, 2011

apinkel said:
I went back thru and re-read a few of the reviews... most of the reviewers seemed to have focused on the 4G battery life.

For those that did evaluate the 3G battery life the consensus seems to be that it will last for a full day of medium to heavy usage. Which is quite a bit better than the Evo 4G. Most reviews of the 4G said that you could get thru a whole day of light usage at best (when stock).

I'll admit I'm a bit disappointed with the battery life claims so far since I expected the Evo 3D to have class leading battery since the sensation was deemed to handle a ful day of medium to heavy usage with a smaller battery.

My minimum requirements for a smartphone is that it handle a day of medium to heavy usage so it sounds like it will meet my needs but I was hoping for more.

Side note: do any 4G phones get good battery life if the 4G radio is left running all day?

Ive yet to hear of any 4G phone with stellar battery life with the radio on.

Now before any one jumps and says Sensation...I mean a Wimax or LTE phone that has a seperate radio for 4G.

Of course there really isn't much to go by, the Epic, the Evo, thunderbolt and charge.

The thunderbolt gets atrocious battery life with LTE on...4 hours, which i have personally seen myself. Don't get me wrong the phone is a monster, but at an extreme cost of battery life.

I have not read much on the Charge, so im not sure there. The sensation gets its incredible battery life due to no need for that extra radio.

And id luv to hear what a SG2 might get with LTE or wimax radio in it.

fattank · Jun 19, 2011

chum1600 said:
I don't know about this. Thats like comparing the taste of pepsi and diet pepsi. The EVO has a gen1 snapdragon and the EVO3d is going to have a 1.2 dual core. Yes I am hoping battery life is better, but with a dual core phone, it might be the same or worse. Either way I am getting this phone.

My phone, the HTC HD2, is also equipped with the first-gen Snapdragon. Overclocked at 1.5Ghz (performance mode, no 'speed-stepping' allowed whatsoever), it lasts all day (12hrs) under heavy use (outdoor web browsing), or up to 1.5 whole days (~36hrs) under moderate/lighter use (music, texts, few calls). It is rooted and running a stock Desire HD ROM with a heavily modified kernel.

I run no task managers/killers, and typically let the phone manage itself (except for the processor, which is always locked at 1.5Ghz).

How is this possible? Well, there's some element of luck involved, but I'm also extremely attuned to my phone's behavior. I notice when the slightest choppiness is observed in UI navigation, which clues me in about phantom/zombie processes. I have CurrentWidget on my homescreen giving me a near-instantaneous battery draw rate -- it shows the standby drain after coming back to my phone, too. If any of these things are the slightest bit off, I fix them right away. I also simply turn off ALL radios (except phone/MMS-data) when not in use.

Compared against the dualcore phones in reviewers' blog videos, mine browses the web faster than most of them, and the "scrolling" is smoother, too.

Only with an Android(TM).

novox77 · Jun 19, 2011

CurrentWidget. Sounds interesting. Hadn't heard of it before. will give it a try. I'm all for more visibility into what's happening behind the scenes.

jerofld · Jun 20, 2011

CurrentWidget doesn't show current draw on my DX. /sigh I guess the processor/battery charging circuits do not report that data.

novox77 · Jun 20, 2011

hmm, I've been monitoring CurrentWidget all day. So far, today has been a low-use day for me. No morning conference call, and too busy at work to mess with the phone. So, screen off, in wifi, push from exchange in effect.

CurrentWidget's log and graph say that the phone has been drawing on average 100mA. Assuming I get the full 1500mAh from the battery, the phone should only last 15 hours. However, from this morning at 8am to now, in which 9 hours has elapsed, my battery drain has been 7% (from 86% to 79%).

This corresponds to ~11mA used by the phone during its standby. It also means that if I continue to keep the phone in this state, it lasts 5 days without a charge (which is accurate because if I shut off wifi, I can get 6 days).

Unless I'm misinterpreting the mA value?? If the battery capacity is 1500mAh, and my phone is drawing 100mA, doesn't that give me 15 hours?

hanglow · Jun 20, 2011

Emmexx said:
Well, it looks like my wish was granted. There is the black replacement for the backside, an extended battery, the camera lens looks recessed and it should still fit my hand and pockets perfect. Looks pretty sweet too.

seidioonline.com

Guess you will be rolling with the 1900 extended battery like me? I endorse their batteries despite the attitude of some individuals in this forum otherwise.

Why do people purchase the cheap Chinese knock off batteries that do not work as well as buying say 2 1900 mah extended batteries. If you are looking for lots of battery time while recording or snapping shots when not next to a charger that would be my route. When you buy cheap knock off no telling what you are getting in the battery. Like lead for example. No thanks.

ArmageddonX · Jun 20, 2011

Correct me if I'm wrong... but it looks like the "Super Extended Life Battery" backplate creates a recessed area for the cameras. Right?

cletusowns · Jun 20, 2011

hanglow said:
Guess you will be rolling with the 1900 extended battery like me? I endorse their batteries despite the attitude of some individuals in this forum otherwise.

Why do people purchase the cheap Chinese knock off batteries that do not work as well as buying say 2 1900 mah extended batteries. If you are looking for lots of battery time while recording or snapping shots when not next to a charger that would be my route. When you buy cheap knock off no telling what you are getting in the battery. Like lead for example. No thanks.

I don't mean this as an insult but why bother with this extended battery? It isn't even 10% more capacity. . . If I was going to buy a spare I would just buy a normal battery personally.

cletusowns · Jun 20, 2011

ArmageddonX said:
Correct me if I'm wrong... but it looks like the "Super Extended Life Battery" backplate creates a recessed area for the cameras. Right?

Looks like it to me as well.. also 3200mAh battery eh? That might be worth it.

ArmageddonX · Jun 20, 2011

cletusowns said:
Looks like it to me as well.. also 3200mAh battery eh? That might be worth it.

No kidding! I was already going to buy a Super-Extended Battery... if this doubles as a way to protect the camera's on the back of the phone that's a big Plus to me.

hanglow · Jun 20, 2011

cletusowns said:
I don't mean this as an insult but why bother with this extended battery? It isn't even 10% more capacity. . . If I was going to buy a spare I would just buy a normal battery personally.

Because you are basing it off of capacity and not actual usage time. Typically, a 1900 battery equates to about 2 additional hours of play time from the 1730 mah battery the EVO 3D comes with. If reviewers say they are getting about 5 hours of heavy usage then I should get about 7 hours with a 1900 mah battery. The Seidio 1750 mah battery in the EVO gets around 6 hours of playtime and the 1500 mah stock battery gets about 4 hours of playtime.

cletusowns · Jun 20, 2011

hanglow said:
Because you are basing it off of capacity and not actual usage time. Typically, a 1900 battery equates to about 2 additional hours of play time from the 1730 mah battery the EVO 3D comes with. If reviewers say they are getting about 5 hours of heavy usage then I should get about 7 hours with a 1900 mah battery. The Seidio 1750 mah battery in the EVO gets around 6 hours of playtime and the 1500 mah stock battery gets about 4 hours of playtime.

1500-> 1750 = around what 15-16%?
1730-> 1900 = 9.8%?

If a higher power phone needs more power/hr (which it seems it does) than this extended battery would be much less of a deal that the evo 4g 1500->1750 battery. Capacity is capacity (if they truly provide that capacity)
EVO 4g by your numbers
1500/4hrs=375mAh/hr
1750/6hrs=291mAh/hr

EVO 3D by your numbers:
1730/5hrs = 346 mAh/hr
1900/346mAh = 5.49 hours if your usage remains constant.
1900/7hrs=271mAh/hr

How is battery draw/hr is somehow lowered by roughly 28% by getting an extended battery? That 3200 mAh battery should last about 2 weeks so at that rate. I just have trouble believing that. Again, I am just curious if this is perhaps a function of the battery attributes or what? If you are using the phone at a high demand rate shouldn't the average draw over time remain high?

hanglow · Jun 20, 2011

I'm buying a 1900 mah battery no matter what.

Rose4uKy · Jun 20, 2011

Sorry I don't really remember I've had them for a couple weeks but I am thinking with in a week..I am thinking if there in stock you'll get them by Friday..

HuDuVuDu said:
how long did it take to receive? It looks like they are in WA. I just ordered one, and am in Northern CA. I wonder if it will be here by Friday.

hanglow · Jun 21, 2011

Am I missing something? Does this article say to turn "3G off" to save battery? Improve Your Android Phone's Battery Life | PCMag.com
Why in the heck not turn it off. Makes total sense to me. Yet he doesn't talk about the phone becoming usless as a smartphone with 3G turned off...wooooow.
Turn hardware features off. It's great that today's phones have GPS, Wi-Fi, and Bluetooth, but do you really need all three activated 24 hours per day? Android keeps location-based apps resident in the background. The constant drain on the battery will become noticeable, fast. If you have a Sprint 4G smartphone, you can turn off 4G mode separately—a good thing, since WiMAX consumes extra power but has yet to blanket the country. On AT&T and T-Mobile phones, you can even turn 3G off when you don't need speedy Internet access. If your phone has a Power Control widget, you can use it to quickly turn on/off GPS, Wi-Fi and Bluetooth.

TheHoodedClaw · Jun 21, 2011

A year or so ago, at batteryboss.org, they tested third party and OEM batteries from several suppliers. They found that those from third party suppliers were typically 80 to 85 percent of the claimed capacity.

BatteryBoss Calls Out False Capacity Claims!

I just checked it out, doesn't appear to have been updated, but the old data are still there.

Having said that, I've had reasonable experiences with Seidio extended batteries. On my Palm Pre, I bought one of their "slightly extended" batteries that claimed about 20 percent more capacity, and my perception was that it had about the same capacity as my OEM battery. I bought one of their "hockey puck" batteries that claimed double the manufacturer's life, and it extended the Pre's life further than I ever needed to test, but I restricted it to travel use (when I might have needed to spend a longer time without a charger) once I developed cracks in my Pre's USB port that made me want to use the Touchstone cordless charging as much as possible (they couldn't make that work on the bigger battery). I used the slightly increased battery most of the time till it died shortly before I got rid of the Pre in favor of my EVO 4G. I probably could have made a warranty claim, but didn't bother.

For my EVO 4G, I didn't mess with the slight increase, and just bought the big (3500?) battery almost as soon as they were available (I believe I balked at the original Seidio price, but ordered them from Amazon when they were offered at a reduced price there). If I remember correctly, there was a problem with the expanded back interfering with flash, and Seidio did redesign the back and send me a replacement when I requested it. This battery has served well, even though I've whaled the snot out of it day after day. It now has a perceptibly reduced capacity, but again that isn't surprising with heavy use.

Personally, I wouldn't mess with the slightly higher capacity batteries (except possibly if you just want a spare, but even then I'd prefer to buy OEM). But I've had good experience with the large double-capacity batteries. I recommend them for those who want a larger battery and will deal with the pregnant guppy look they impart. I may not wait for Amazon to get them and lower the price this time, depending on how annoying (or not annoying) the E3D battery life is.

hanglow · Jun 21, 2011

TheHoodedClaw said:
A year or so ago, at batteryboss.org, they tested third party and OEM batteries from several suppliers. They found that those from third party suppliers were typically 80 to 85 percent of the claimed capacity.

BatteryBoss Calls Out False Capacity Claims!

I just checked it out, doesn't appear to have been updated, but the old data are still there.

Having said that, I've had reasonable experiences with Seidio extended batteries. On my Palm Pre, I bought one of their "slightly extended" batteries that claimed about 20 percent more capacity, and my perception was that it had about the same capacity as my OEM battery. I bought one of their "hockey puck" batteries that claimed double the manufacturer's life, and it extended the Pre's life further than I ever needed to test, but I restricted it to travel use (when I might have needed to spend a longer time without a charger) once I developed cracks in my Pre's USB port that made me want to use the Touchstone cordless charging as much as possible (they couldn't make that work on the bigger battery). I used the slightly increased battery most of the time till it died shortly before I got rid of the Pre in favor of my EVO 4G. I probably could have made a warranty claim, but didn't bother.

For my EVO 4G, I didn't mess with the slight increase, and just bought the big (3500?) battery almost as soon as they were available (I believe I balked at the original Seidio price, but ordered them from Amazon when they were offered at a reduced price there). If I remember correctly, there was a problem with the expanded back interfering with flash, and Seidio did redesign the back and send me a replacement when I requested it. This battery has served well, even though I've whaled the snot out of it day after day. It now has a perceptibly reduced capacity, but again that isn't surprising with heavy use.

Personally, I wouldn't mess with the slightly higher capacity batteries (except possibly if you just want a spare, but even then I'd prefer to buy OEM). But I've had good experience with the large double-capacity batteries. I recommend them for those who want a larger battery and will deal with the pregnant guppy look they impart. I may not wait for Amazon to get them and lower the price this time, depending on how annoying (or not annoying) the E3D battery life is.

How are you going to post a link to a website that said they tested a "USED" battery from Seidio? That's not a valid test. "Seidio 1750 mah/Not new but still disappointing." Who ever did the testing needs to go work for Engadget with the remarks they made. How many of the other batteries were "used" in this testing. As a matter of fact, all batteries should be used before being tested for longevity/endurance. Not!

I hope everyone realizes that some of the batteries they tested were made in China. Its well known lots of cheap batteries sold on the internet do not meet the requirements of the company wanting to purchase the batteries so what do you think manufactures in China do? They don't throw those batteries out. In China they sell them to a buyer on the cheap. That buyer sells the battery to you very cheap. People think they are getting a deal on batteries but they aren't. This is a well known practice. I have been to China 3 times on business.

TheHoodedClaw · Jun 21, 2011

Perhaps it had an appreciable effect for the used batteries tested, depends on how far along in the life cycle the battery was. I did find their results were consistent with my experience from before I'd seen their work. Unfortunately things done on a volunteer basis as a labor of love will seldom be as rigorous as we'd like.

hanglow · Jun 21, 2011

TheHoodedClaw said:
Perhaps it had an appreciable effect for the used batteries tested, depends on how far along in the life cycle the battery was. I did find their results were consistent with my experience from before I'd seen their work. Unfortunately things done on a volunteer basis as a labor of love will seldom be as rigorous as we'd like.

What is the qualifications of the person who ran the test? Is he an engineer or a high school drop out? If someone is going to run a scientific test they need to have the proper credentials and education in order to prove they know what they are talking about in my opinion. I can take a bunch of duracell and engergizer batteries, test them, and post the results to a website. When people ask me what do I have a degree in and I say business, I will become the laughing stock of the battery world. Better yet, I stayed at a holiday inn express hotel last night.

TheHoodedClaw · Jun 21, 2011

See the last sentence of my previous post.

jerofld · Jun 21, 2011

novox77 said:
hmm, I've been monitoring CurrentWidget all day. So far, today has been a low-use day for me. No morning conference call, and too busy at work to mess with the phone. So, screen off, in wifi, push from exchange in effect.

CurrentWidget's log and graph say that the phone has been drawing on average 100mA. Assuming I get the full 1500mAh from the battery, the phone should only last 15 hours. However, from this morning at 8am to now, in which 9 hours has elapsed, my battery drain has been 7% (from 86% to 79%).

This corresponds to ~11mA used by the phone during its standby. It also means that if I continue to keep the phone in this state, it lasts 5 days without a charge (which is accurate because if I shut off wifi, I can get 6 days).

Unless I'm misinterpreting the mA value?? If the battery capacity is 1500mAh, and my phone is drawing 100mA, doesn't that give me 15 hours?

If your phone pulls 100mA for an hour, yes, your battery should die after 15 hours. So either your phone or CurrentWidget are misrepresenting your data.

NeoteriX · Jun 21, 2011

NightAngel79 said:
Lets please attempt to keep the discussion on topic, this thread is titled, 'Lets talk cases' not 'lets argue about battery life'

Thanks

I would support splitting the extended battery discussion into its own thread -- I think it's a topic worth vetting out some more, because I think there are a lot of misconceptions that ought to be vetted.

cletusowns · Jun 21, 2011

I'd like to hear from other people who bought extended batteries for their evo 4G. This will be my first smartphone so I am curious as to how effective they are at actually extending the battery life. Or is it the tweaking and radio toggling that actually provides the most benefit.

2 EVO3Ds on pre-order for my wife and myself.

Help Battery life and battery management

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