bootloader question

[Enrodreher]

im going to sound like a total noob but i want to go ahead and ask what does having a locked bootloader mean? what exactly does that mean for us the consumers. i dont even know what bootloader means, can someone explain i know it has to do with moto blur and i hear so many bad things about it, whats so bad about motoblur? the only motorola phone i ve had is the razor.

thank you in advance

 

[sanchez1980us]

im going to sound like a total noob but i want to go ahead and ask what does having a locked bootloader mean? what exactly does that mean for us the consumers. i dont even know what bootloader means, can someone explain i know it has to do with moto blur and i hear so many bad things about it, whats so bad about motoblur? the only motorola phone i ve had is the razor.

thank you in advance

I would also like to know this?

 

[stoli412]

im going to sound like a total noob but i want to go ahead and ask what does having a locked bootloader mean? what exactly does that mean for us the consumers. i dont even know what bootloader means, can someone explain i know it has to do with moto blur and i hear so many bad things about it, whats so bad about motoblur? the only motorola phone i ve had is the razor.

thank you in advance

The bootloader is the partition on the phone that contains the kernel and loads the rest of the OS. Now there are 2 things here: a locked bootloader and an encrypted bootloader. Most phones ship with a locked bootloader, and various hacks are usually found to unlock it so that custom ROMs can be created and loaded.

The big stink about Motorola phones is that their phones are not only locked, but also encrypted with a 1024-bit key. This makes it nearly impossible to decrypt and unlock the bootloader, which leaves full custom ROMs out of the question. You can still do a lot, but you can't replace things like the kernel, which makes it hard to add a lot of the goodies that custom ROMs usually have.

Note that this has nothing to do with rooting. Rooting a phone usually happens within a matter of days of release, sometimes even before it's released. Rooting your phone basically gives you full access to the ROM that's already on it. You can add/remove software (including carrier bloatware), enable features that have been stripped out by the carrier (like wifi hotspot), etc.

 

[vinay427]

The bootloader is the partition on the phone that contains the kernel and loads the rest of the OS. Now there are 2 things here: a locked bootloader and an encrypted bootloader. Most phones ship with a locked bootloader, and various hacks are usually found to unlock it so that custom ROMs can be created and loaded.

The big stink about Motorola phones is that their phones are not only locked, but also encrypted with a 1024-bit key. This makes it nearly impossible to decrypt and unlock the bootloader, which leaves full custom ROMs out of the question. You can still do a lot, but you can't replace things like the kernel, which makes it hard to add a lot of the goodies that custom ROMs usually have.

Note that this has nothing to do with rooting. Rooting a phone usually happens within a matter of days of release, sometimes even before it's released. Rooting your phone basically gives you full access to the ROM that's already on it. You can add/remove software (including carrier bloatware), enable features that have been stripped out by the carrier (like wifi hotspot), etc.

Can you also use hardware hacks such as over clocking on a device with an encrypted bootloader that is rooted?

 

[s.m.knipe]

Can you also use hardware hacks such as over clocking on a device with an encrypted bootloader that is rooted?

No, under/over clocking requires a custom kernel, which would be blocked. Excepting the app "SetCPU" in the market, but it would have to be written to accommodate the Atrix's dual cores. The dual cores with 1gig of ram should be more than enough, why the interest in overclocking, if i may ask?

 

[vinay427]

No, under/over clocking requires a custom kernel, which would be blocked. Excepting the app "SetCPU" in the market, but it would have to be written to accommodate the Atrix's dual cores. The dual cores with 1gig of ram should be more than enough, why the interest in overclocking, if i may ask?

I was just wondering, because this phone (as any) is bound to get laggy and not be able to hold up more resource intensive apps. I've heard (never owned an Android device before) that overclocking can be a simple solution to this. But I wouldn't need or use an overclock until that ever happened, so it's not really an immediate issue for me.

Also, the Droid X has an encrypted bootloader if I'm not mistaken, and there is a overclocking app available for it. (link)

Does that mean that there could be a possibility of an eventual overclock available for the Atrix?

 

[s.m.knipe]

I was just wondering, because this phone (as any) is bound to get laggy and not be able to hold up more resource intensive apps. I've heard (never owned an Android device before) that overclocking can be a simple solution to this. But I wouldn't need or use an overclock until that ever happened, so it's not really an immediate issue for me.

Also, the Droid X has an encrypted bootloader if I'm not mistaken, and there is a overclocking app available for it. (link)

Does that mean that there could be a possibility of an eventual overclock available for the Atrix?

I think there will be eventually, like i said it is up to the app developers to find and write the code to work with dual cores. I really don't see it as a problem anytime soon with this device though...

 

[andrew53517]

The reason for the lag is lack of hardware acceleration. Honeycomb has this, once we get ROMs that have hardware acceleration ported over, you will never notice those lags anymore.

 

[lsutigers03]

The reason for the lag is lack of hardware acceleration. Honeycomb has this, once we get ROMs that have hardware acceleration ported over, you will never notice those lags anymore.

If there's a locked bootloader like Moto usually does then those roms won't exist Unless Moto updates the Atrix to Honeycomb.

 

[AndreaCristiano]

If there's a locked bootloader like Moto usually does then those roms won't exist Unless Moto updates the Atrix to Honeycomb.

Yes and there is the reason im avoiding this phone like the plague

 

[xBoXeRx]

Hi, I am new and just registered right now. Hi to all. I have never owned a Motorola smart phone and I'm look at buying the Droid Bionic. Not sure if this is a good buy according to standards here. So far what I've seen is impressive My question's are will the Droid Bionic be harder to unlock when it comes to boot loader? What to expect from that phone for rooting? Will it be on the Honey Comb Network?

 

[s.m.knipe]

Hi, I am new and just registered right now. Hi to all. I have never owned a Motorola smart phone and I'm look at buying the Droid Bionic. Not sure if this is a good buy according to standards here. So far what I've seen is impressive My question's are will the Droid Bionic be harder to unlock when it comes to boot loader? What to expect from that phone for rooting? Will it be on the Honey Comb Network?

Welcome then, to both Android and Androidforums. The Droid Bionic should have its own forum (click "android phones" at the top or bottom of the page and scoll down and you should see it) which would probably be more relevant to your interests. As the Bionic (nor the Atrix, for that matter) is not out yet and so any info at this point is just speculation. Based off of Motorola's previous statements we can safely assume that the bootloader will be locked, but Moto has also said that they are looking for some way of accommodating developers, so that might mean some sort of key to unlock it (we don't know). Rooting and the bootloader are seperate things, root access gives you administrator priveleges, which is needed to access the bootloader. The bootloader is the partition that contains the system image and allows one to change the rom file (system image) and this is known as flashing roms. You can have root without needing access to the bootloader, but can't access the bootloader without root. Lastly, there is no such thing as" Honey Comb Network" as Honey Comb is the latest (and tablet only) version of Android.

 

[xBoXeRx]

Welcome then, to both Android and Androidforums. The Droid Bionic should have its own forum (click "android phones" at the top or bottom of the page and scoll down and you should see it) which would probably be more relevant to your interests. As the Bionic (nor the Atrix, for that matter) is not out yet and so any info at this point is just speculation. Based off of Motorola's previous statements we can safely assume that the bootloader will be locked, but Moto has also said that they are looking for some way of accommodating developers, so that might mean some sort of key to unlock it (we don't know). Rooting and the bootloader are seperate things, root access gives you administrator priveleges, which is needed to access the bootloader. The bootloader is the partition that contains the system image and allows one to change the rom file (system image) and this is known as flashing roms. You can have root without needing access to the bootloader, but can't access the bootloader without root. Lastly, there is no such thing as" Honey Comb Network" as Honey Comb is the latest (and tablet only) version of Android.

Hey, Thanks for the response and for the welcome. I will look into the Bionic forums for more info in the future. I hope they do make it accessible some how otherwise I will be looking into something else possibly the Tegra2. As for Honey Comb I will do a little more research on that.

 

[s.m.knipe]

Hey, Thanks for the response and for the welcome. I will look into the Bionic forums for more info in the future. I hope they do make it accessible some how otherwise I will be looking into something else possibly the Tegra2. As for Honey Comb I will do a little more research on that.

No worries, I didn't mean to sound/come across as impatient or short or anything, I was just typing that from my phone and was trying to be as concise as possible. So far all of the manufacturers' attempts to lock the bootloaders have been cracked eventually, so I am not too worried about it being a permanent situation. A bigger deal has been made about it than it really will be (someone will get to work on it right away at XDA-developers forums or somewhere, and if like the Droid X in under a month we will have it cracked, if like the Desire z/HD's rootkit it should take just about a month- maybe less now that we have the methods and examples of those two attempts).

 

[Willy Willy]

So what is the point of rooting, bootloading?
So rooting just means getting "admin" power?

 

[lsutigers03]

So what is the point of rooting, bootloading?
So rooting just means getting "admin" power?

Yes you get admin permissions when you root. Some useful apps in the Market require that the phone be rooted. Also you can enable sideloading if you are away from your computer and can't use the sideload wonder machine. Once roms are created you'll need to be rooted if you want to use them.

 

[Willy Willy]

What is a Rom and kernel?
I am fine with a stock device... Yea I would like the bloatware gone but all I want is a wifi tether

 

[s.m.knipe]

So what is the point of rooting, bootloading?
So rooting just means getting "admin" power?

Having "root" or admin privileges allows access to the system files for customizations, make use of certain apps in the market, make use of some features like wireless tethering (which isn't really blocked on the phones, the user just ins't given access rights to it and an app isn't there by default to make use of it; having root access and downloading an app to use it, such as "wireless tether" in the market, can enable that functionality) and full app and settings backups with apps like "titanium backup" in the market. Root access grants the user something called "super-user" permissions in Linux (Android is a variant of Linux) which simply means you have permission to utilize EVERYTHING in the system (if you know how to ask the system properly for it- such as what the apps do). You will need root access and super-user permissions to gain access to the bootloader and flash the custom system files made by yourself or someone else (custom roms).

 

[Willy Willy]

But what is a rom and kernel

 

[s.m.knipe]

But what is a rom and kernel

In very basic terms a ROM is basically the Operating System (called a ROM because it is stored in Read Only Memory). There are two types, official (from google and the manufacturers) and "custom" roms (from individuals who take the Android Open Source Project- AOSP- files [Android is open source, so the manufacturers have to post most of their rom files within a reasonable amount of time for accountability reasons, the parts they can withhold are the parts they wrote themselves without the help of Google/Java such as device-specific drivers, etc.] and "make them better" by adding the things they think are cool and taking out the things they don't like). The Kernel is sort of like the BIOS on many Windoze machines, as it is what allows the software and firmware (the ROM and apps) to play nicely with the hardware and communicate between firmware and hardware, as well as utilize or disable aspects of the hardware.

 

[xBoXeRx]

In very basic terms a ROM is basically the Operating System (called a ROM because it is stored in Read Only Memory). There are two types, official (from google and the manufacturers) and "custom" roms (from individuals who take the Android Open Source Project- AOSP- files [Android is open source, so the manufacturers have to post most of their rom files within a reasonable amount of time for accountability reasons, the parts they can withhold are the parts they wrote themselves without the help of Google/Java such as device-specific drivers, etc.] and "make them better" by adding the things they think are cool and taking out the things they don't like). The Kernel is sort of like the BIOS on many Windoze machines, as it is what allows the software and firmware (the ROM and apps) to play nicely with the hardware and communicate between firmware and hardware, as well as utilize or disable aspects of the hardware.

That was a good explanation of what Roms and Kernels are. It helped me understand it better. My question with the Roms, is, when you Root>get admin>unlock it. Whats the process after this the create your own custom ROM? Is there some place to get custom Roms or do i just create it myself? Thanks In Advance

 

[s.m.knipe]

That was a good explanation of what Roms and Kernels are. It helped me understand it better. My question with the Roms, is, when you Root>get admin>unlock it. Whats the process after this the create your own custom ROM? Is there some place to get custom Roms or do i just create it myself? Thanks In Advance

The magical land of enchantment for all things root and rom can be found at

Android Forums & Windows Phone Discussion @ xda-developers

It is where nearly all of the developer community hangs out...

 

[xBoXeRx]

The magical land of enchantment for all things root and rom can be found at

Android Forums & Windows Phone Discussion @ xda-developers

It is where nearly all of the developer community hangs out...

Gonna go check it out! ill get back to you.