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EVO camera blind test

Discussion in 'Android Devices' started by reemas, Jun 21, 2010.

?

Which video was better?

  1. Left

    3 vote(s)
    1.6%
  2. Right

    180 vote(s)
    98.4%
  1. reemas

    reemas Well-Known Member
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    I am no fanboy of HTC nor Apple. Seriously. I just hate being tricked.

    iPhone 3GS on the right.
    EVO on the left.

    i highly recommend you watch ONLY the right side of the video. and then ONLY the left side of the video. the motion blur is horrible on the EVO.

    if anyone wants more comparisons, it'll take me a bit but i'll try to get them out. as far as the lighting, there was ample light in the room. at least for the "3 MP" iPhone. i'm telling you guys, HTC compresses the crap out of the video. 8MP or 500MP, it's really what you voted on that matters, not how big the stupid MP number is.
     

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  2. reemas

    reemas Well-Known Member
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    why would I or anyone do this? i am not a apple employee or HTC CEO. i just want my dollars to count.
     
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  3. Bnice

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    well i've seen better quality on youtube so this don't mean a thing.not knocking you just saying some folks take good pictures or video with their phone some don't.
     
  4. Dreamliner

    Dreamliner Android Enthusiast
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    More proof of HTC's "quality"
     
  5. RiverOfIce

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    The other issue is that 3 mp camera needs only to power 3megapixels, then light up the resolution needed for the picture.

    A 8 megapixel camera will have to power the 8 megapixels, and light up the need resolution.

    Which means, no matter how you downgrade the resolution of the video it is still going to have 8 megapixel of noise, which is going to suffer in lower light. There is no way around this, the more megapixel you power, the more heat, the more noise, the higher the iso you have to go. Just the way the senor works.

    The 3 megapixel is using 1/2 to 1/4 the power of the 8 megapixel, which means that you can really up the power and keep the noise down when compared to 8 megapixel.

    This is why the films like avatar, star wars ( the latest ones), and even lord of the rings where shot with 1.67 to 2 megapixel camera (kind of complicated). 1920x1080 is all you need for highest definition.

    So your "offical" test is kind of invalid because you are using difference sensors. But it is only a phone. If you want good video, get a good camera.
     
  6. mrspeedmaster

    mrspeedmaster Android Expert
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    Last year, I bought 6 different video cameras. I've seen how different sensor react to motion and how they compare to each other. What you are seeing is bad motion jello-effect. Mostly due to the sensor design.

    The EVO sensor is made by Omnivision. If you notice, the fps drops real quick when the lighting condition gets darker. I've seem 10fps videos from the EVO. That tells me, it is a cheap sensor.

    The ideal camera will be 720p/30fps in all lighting conditions. iPhone 4 may deliver on that.
     
  7. reemas

    reemas Well-Known Member
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    Invalid or not, just look at the video and vote with your eyes. I don't think anyone cares about sensor jargon. Period. There is a reason HTC is advertising the 8MP camera. They know people want "more" megapixels regardless of quality.

    And I have a good camera, but I also have other nice things.

    The point is not what I have, but how HTC's 2010 Camera compares to the competitions 2008 camera.
     
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  8. Raadius

    Raadius Member
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    Thanks for the video. It's really a shame that such a great piece of hardware tech as the Evo is equipped with a cheap camera sensor.
     
  9. dr g

    dr g Android Enthusiast
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    It's not the lighting conditions at issue, it's the camera metering. The sensor has nothing to do with it, it's the settings the camera chooses to shoot the scene. Clearly the camera on the right boosts ISO to a greater degree to get a shorter shutter speed.

    That's photography 101.
     
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  10. NeoteriX

    NeoteriX Android Expert
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    Nice comparison work. I may have to fire up the Pre and compare that one as well once I get it back from warranty work.

    Perhaps it may not be a sensor issue as much as it is an encoding one. It might be possible that there is a software-based improvement to be made. I for one know that the Pre and iPhone record at a much higher sound sampling frq. and bitrate and there is room for software improvement on that side of things.
     
  11. jonathan76888

    jonathan76888 Well-Known Member
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  12. AJ_EVO

    AJ_EVO Android Enthusiast
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    how about a video in 720p vs iPhone? Why dumb down to a resolution the iPhone supports?
     
  13. IPvFletch

    IPvFletch Android Enthusiast
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    reemas please go outside in sunlight and take a video with the cameras on the ground and some objects moving (you or balls or a dog or whatever). For indoor, can you set it on a table or use a tripod?

    I agree with your points, we voted on what we preferred plain and simple. There's a lot of variables with moving the camera/phone around so the tripod/tabletop should resolve that variable.
     
  14. IPvFletch

    IPvFletch Android Enthusiast
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    Sadly, YouTube isn't set to show that one in 720p - DOH! :D
     
  15. NeoteriX

    NeoteriX Android Expert
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    Because a blurry image and low framerates aren't going to look any better at a higher resolution ;)
     
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  16. jonathan76888

    jonathan76888 Well-Known Member
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    even so , it looks better, BAd test, go all out or dont do shyt sereously!!
     
  17. NeoteriX

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    In this current implementation of video recording, changing the resolution to 720p does not improve the frame rate of the recording which is the main issue being demonstrated/criticized here: low frame rates with challenging levels of indoor lighting.

    In fact, if anything, the frame rates would get worse as you go from a lower to higher resolution.

    Increasing the resolution would be irrelevant. Similarly, recording/shooting photos in daylight is not challenging to most sensors/video implementations, so suggestions to shoot video outside are irrelevant for this test as well--both cameras will do it well. That's like testing a BMW and Hyundai to see how well they can drive through a school zone; every car goes 5 mph just fine.
     
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  18. jonathan76888

    jonathan76888 Well-Known Member
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    they do find at 5mph but can both do good at 100mph
     
  19. wrchad23

    wrchad23 Well-Known Member
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    I'm not surprised. I'll tell you first hand that in most practical situations for sending pics to friends my Black Berry Tour with a 3.2megapixel camera took far better pictures then the EVO. Outside in the daylight the EVO takes amazing pictures but for practical pictures, like taking a picture of something close and sending to a friend as "hey did you see this" or something the Tour owns the EVO. I bet the 5mp on the iPhone tears the EVO to pieces.
     
  20. zamardii12

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    The iPhone one looks better... Heck, I have a Evo and I can accept that. Why are people being so defensive as if someone is attacking their religion or something? The Evo excels in a lot of other ways over the iPhone but I do think they just wanted to be able to write 8mp and 720p on paper so it looks good and sells. The 720 video doesn't look as good as it should and neither do the pictures... it all has to do with the sensor. I can guarantee all of you that the new iPhone 4's camera may only be a 5mp but it's going to take some really good pictures.

    I love the Evo a lot, and the camera takes good enough video and pictures for a cell phone and that's good enough for me. I'm not going to nit-pick. If I want to take good pictures, i'll get a good CAMERA out.

    Note: I'd really like to know what 3 blind people clicked on "left" in the poll. lmao
     
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  21. reemas

    reemas Well-Known Member
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    This, exactly.

    I was hoping I didn't have to explain it to some guy brought this up. Thought we all knew 720p would look WORSE in terms of frame rates. The only thing 720p does it make the resolution larger.

    Also guys, the bitrates were as follows:
    (I didn't choose these settings, the phone/camera did automatically...)

    iPhone 3Gs: 3700kbps
    EVO: 970kbps

    Framerates were:
    iPhone: 23 frames/sec
    EVO: 9 frames/sec

    All this info is DIRECT from the files off the phones. (Audio wasn't included but the EVO really, really compresses the audio.)
     
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  22. Aldo Junior Ao2

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    Capture2.PNG

    YouTube - Boom

    I have the lights off with the Tv paused. This is what 9 frames per second looks like buddy. So When you made that video you had the lights off like me with only some parts of the tv screen to light you up. Shoot i even dirty the lens just to get it that low. Come on guy you were caught. Be honest 9 frames per second?????? You must have a lemon then.
     
  23. mrspeedmaster

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    If he post the original source video, will you retract your comments? The files can easily be viewed and the meta-data can be extracted in an app like VLC.

    I've seen it go down to 10fps when the metering goes crazy.
    He is not the first either:

    http://androidforums.com/htc-evo-4g/92774-mediainfo-output-evos-hd-video-capture.html

    The camera goes down from 16-10fps in low light. This is a fact.
     
  24. Aldo Junior Ao2

    Aldo Junior Ao2 Android Enthusiast
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    Ok 10fps when there is very low light like i just proved with almost no light. Meaning no outdoor sunlight influence correct. But there is plenty of light Not enough for it to go to 9 frames per second. I stand with the words i wrote or then there is no such thing as free speech correct. If he or she wants to prove it. Prove it. I would love to study the original file and see why it dropped to 9 frames per second. I have been working on making the resolution higher and also maybe i can stop it from dropping that low and make a zip file for people to flash. Root of course needed to flash ZIP. But i have never gotten that low unless i tried. Once i receive the original i'll run a test to see the actual frames per second as the video is playing.
     
  25. SporkLover

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    Brush up on your Digital Camera language folks. The Digital sensor in the EVO is a newer generation of sensor than whats in the Iphone 3GS, and it's manufactured by the same company, same technology, same production processes..... the words cheap is a poor way to describe the sensor.

    More Mega Pixel does not equal better quality. Generically, you getter better quality from larger pixels (pixel pitch) and larger camera sensors. In reality there are many specs to the camera sensor that really dictate the "quality". I'll try to keep it as simple as possible.

    The Iphone 3GS has a 1/4 camera sensor, the Evo a 1/3.2 camera sensor (slightly larger). The Iphone's sensor is divided into 3.1M pixels providing a 1.75 pixel pitch (Large), the Evo's sensor is divided into 8M providing a 1.4 pixel pitch (small). What this means is that although the Evo has a larger sensor and more pixels, those pixels are less "sensitive" because they have less area to capture light. This correlates directly to why low light conditions would lag in the Evo. The Iphone has larger pixels, better capable at capturing more light per pixel. In good lighting the Evo should have superior pics. Since this same sensor is responsible for video, the same applies to video capture for each phone.

    Now that was speaking from a purely hardware specs comparison of each sensor. The design of the sensors give the manufacturers of the phone a great deal of freedom over the operations of the sensors (metering, etc etc etc).... so the other part of that equations is going to be the software written to control the camera sensors.

    If I were to describe the sensor in the Evo, I would call it a marketing trick that plays into the consumers line of logic that more MP = better pictures. The engineering behind it produces 8MP, but it hampers sensitivity of the sensor, which can introduce the blurring you guys see. This is very reminiscent of the Intel vs AMD clock speed wars, where AMD proved with the Athlon line of processors that you can compute more data with lower clock speeds.

    Just to set up some of the fragile egos for the Iphone 4 release..... it will have the same size sensor as the Evo, with 5MP, giving it 1.75 pixel pitch..... theoretically producing better pics! It will also be better at taking wide angle photos due to the packaging and the lense.
     
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