Florida governor signs welfare drug-screen measure

[RedneckDroid]

That isnt really trusting their intention, if the first thing they got to do, is prove their intentions, now is it?

Hm true but you know good and well what I meant sir. Drug test everyone and then I will trust them. My next facebook update, either way. I think the bill is a wonderful idea and should be implemented.

 

[noah way]

True, I trust the 1.5 million people to truly need the assistance and if they want to better themselves than help them.

A compassionate and constructive position ...

If they are on drugs than give them exams of some variation, if they pull up positive everytime than send them away empty handed. I trust them to do the right thing and get clean

except that you would deny them assistance. Why not offer treatment as a condition of assistance (assuming of course that you are not violating their constitutional rights or covertly lining the pockets of private interests).

 

[RedneckDroid]

A compassionate and constructive position ...



except that you would deny them assistance. Why not offer treatment as a condition of assistance (assuming of course that you are not violating their constitutional rights or covertly lining the pockets of private interests).

Offering assistance after a positive would be ideal, if they agreed to it of course but as I said, some people wont agree and those should be left empty handed until they do. But then the crime rate might soar...so im kind of shooting myself in the foot lol.

 

[nlsme]

Hm true but you know good and well what I meant sir. Drug test everyone and then I will trust them. My next facebook update, either way. I think the bill is a wonderful idea and should be implemented.

EVERYONE? You gonna be in line for that? I cant read your mind, I am only going off of what you say. In one sentence you say you want to trust the intentions of people, then the next, you say they gotta prove themselves first. Does that Governer submit to monthly drug tests? I would be willing to bet that the percentage of drug users in a position of power isnt 0.

 

[RedneckDroid]

Haha, you're the only one that is not seeing my point here sir. I mean this, I believe in the basic good of a person. I believe that the bill was not passed to line the pockets of the Gov. but to better the welfare system. I believe that people in need of help will get off the drugs and seek treatment offered. I TRUST that people will do the right thing in general and I have been wrong many times but never faltered. A drug user is still a person and for the most part, knows right and wrong. Criminals I do not trust (And make no mistake if you pass positive on a drug test, to some degree you have broken the law) until they prove themselves. I am not saying politicains at some level are not criminals but I am saying they were not convicted and I trust in the judicial system.

But as I said, my opinion will not matter, hell the part of NC that im from they do nothing but set trash-can fires and run around in the mud barefoot!

 

[nlsme]

I havent seen anyone chime in and say they see your point. In fact, I see a lot of people posting points that counter yours. This bill does NOTHING to stop drug use, nor does it proclude those that fail the test from receiving the benefits. It does, however, guarantee a large amount of money, going to his wife.

Maybe you can answer this, should there be a drug test involved in receiving a drivers license? At least there, there is a danger to the public displayed. In fact, to get a cdl, you do have to submit to a drug test, for the very reason of public safety. Why should there not be one for any license?

 

[RedneckDroid]

I must agree with you, vehicles can be dangerous weapons. Kudos.


"This bill does NOTHING to stop drug use, nor does it proclude those that fail the test from receiving the benefits."

I think it can slow drug use if those tested positive don't recieve full benefits that they are accustomed too, or don't recieve benefits at all.

 

[nlsme]

i must agree with you, vehicles can be dangerous weapons. Kudos.


"this bill does nothing to stop drug use, nor does it proclude those that fail the test from receiving the benefits."

i think it can slow drug use if those tested positive don't recieve full benefits that they are accustomed too, or don't recieve benefits at all.

Everyone is going to have to accept that they are not going to receive the full benefits they are accustomed to. They are responsible for the $42, wether they pass or fail. And, wether they pass or fail, they WILL still get the benefits.

 

[RedneckDroid]

Meh. I like the idea still. The execution is a little off but I hope this starts a trend.

 

[RiverOfIce]

Meh. I like the idea still. The execution is a little off but I hope this starts a trend.

Starts a trend of corporate welfare in which the distribution of tax payer money requires a hand out to multi-billion dollar corporations? Now is that a good idea.

How about this. How about free medical care, including drug testing and mandatory drug class, if positive, for anyone on welfare. Make the services provided by a non profit ran facility. Heck, why don't we apply that to everyone, free medical care and drug/std testing to everyone with free consulting.

Then we will remove people off welfare, namely the multi billion dollar companies and improve the lives of the people that truly need the money.

But that will not be a hand out for the rich, nor a hand out for the poor, but a hand up to anyone that needs it, which means it will fail horribly.

Because the number 1 reason we have this law, and any law like it, so to give out money to the rich on the backs of the poor.

I just wish it would get people off welfare, help those that really need help, or even promoted a way to treat diseases. But it only hands money to the rich, while punishing the poor.

Congratz on handing millions to the rich while not doing anything to help anyone else. True conservationism.

 

[mdram]

what your missing is the job creation

many tests needed, someone has to do them, staff will be added

non profit? many of them are bigger crooks then politicians

 

[noah way]

what your missing is the job creation

many tests needed, someone has to do them, staff will be added

non profit? many of them are bigger crooks then politicians

You could hire applicants for assistance to drug test applicants for assistance.

Better yet, give a corporation that pays no taxes a no-bid contract to drug test applicants. Any cost overruns will of course be paid by the state.

 

[RiverOfIce]

non profit? many of them are bigger crooks then politicians

Because for profit companies are so upstanding. Let me google that for you.

It is of course wikipedia, so grain of salt, but you get the hint.

Late-2000s financial crisis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[RedneckDroid]

So why is it wrong to think that this could help people? I'm not looking at the financial side of this at all, all I see is someone who could be helped because when they go to do drugs they might stop and say "I can't get my help if I do this" will it stick with everyone? No. But some? Yes. If they can get anyone off drugs and back on a right path than how much exactly is that worth in your hard earned tax paying dollars?

I'm not big on financials but how much exactly is a life worth?

 

[nlsme]

So why is it wrong to think that this could help people? I'm not looking at the financial side of this at all, all I see is someone who could be helped because when they go to do drugs they might stop and say "I can't get my help if I do this" will it stick with everyone? No. But some? Yes. If they can get anyone off drugs and back on a right path than how much exactly is that worth in your hard earned tax paying dollars?

I'm not big on financials but how much exactly is a life worth?

And the ones that say. Meh, Even if I do these drugs, and fail the drug test, Ill still be able to get benefits.

 

[RedneckDroid]

I never said that was right :/

 

[nlsme]

But you said, they cant get help if they do this. But, they can. Why would they say it? Why would it stop a drug addict? It wont.

 

[noah way]

I'm not big on financials but how much exactly is a life worth?

I'm sure the value varies according to the specific individual and who you ask for their valuation.

The real question is can a life be measured in dollars and cents? And if so, who is to decide how much yours is worth?

A private health insurer sees you as a sweet asset when you are healthy and a serious liability when you are sick. They are going to make decisions about your care based on their balance sheet. That's a measure of your life's value that you might not necessarily agree with.

 

[lordofthereef]

Drug addiction is the result of bad choices, bad parenting, bad environment, lack of opportunity, etc. Nobody chooses to be a drug addict. Basing eligibility to aid on a clean drug test is cruel and does nothing to help people who need it.

I think, more often than not, it is just bad choices. So, let's say we help all drug addicts out of their rut because it is the right thing to do. After all, it was just a series of bad choices. Where do you draw the line? Rape, killing, stealing, etc. are all bad choices. So should we just have state funded rehabs for everyone that makes bad choices?

Not trying to be a jerk, I am really not. And to some extent I agree with you. We focus on punishing almost all the time and rehab almost never. But what would be a good balance here?

I completely disagree that basing eligibility on a clean drug test is cruel though. Very rarely is one actually FORCED to use drugs. It is still a choice. Even if that choice was made to "feel better about their crappy life", it is still a choice that was consciously made. As I said, use it as a basis to have these people's kids taken away from them. If they are raising kids in an environment where they are getting high, those kids are being raised with bad parenting and a bad environment (which happen to be two of the terms you used to explain why people get into drugs in the first place).

 

[lordofthereef]

And the ones that say. Meh, Even if I do these drugs, and fail the drug test, Ill still be able to get benefits.

I have still yet to see information on how easy it is to simply designate a person to receive the money for you.

 

[Sak01]

The real question is can a life be measured in dollars and cents? And if so, who is to decide how much yours is worth?

Actuaries?
Life Economic Value

 

[noah way]

Actuaries?
Life Economic Value

Leave it to lawyers, accountants and insurance reps. How much for a child, who has no earnings history? How much for a Peace Care volunteer? How much for a black or Hispanic? Or a woman? Or some combination of these ...

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal ...

 

[Dark Jedi]

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal ...

And when that was written Black Men was slaves still.

 

[nlsme]

And when that was written Black Men was slaves still.

Wow

 

[noah way]

And when that was written Black Men was slaves still.

By men who were slave owners, no less.