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Support How to get rid of software update

Discussion in 'Android Devices' started by Are21, May 9, 2018.

  1. Are21

    Are21 Member
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    My phone keeps wanting to force me to do a software update but I've noticed every time I've done them in the past, the phone has slowed down. Not unlike the iphone. My phone isn't rooted and I'm not even sure what that means. After a few weeks of selecting 'later', it's now having to be paused and i want the notification gone.
    Any advice would be very appreciated.
     

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  2. lunatic59

    lunatic59 Moderati ergo sum
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    The easiest way to get rid of the notification is to update your phone. :)

    Seriously, you really should apply the updates. They are going to be bug fixes and security patches which really are beneficial.

    This is true enough to be believable but also mostly perception. And, it's a temporary situation. There are a lot of things going on with system updates that can cause a phone to get busy for a while, but let it sit and do it's thing and then reboot it.

    If it's a major system update like going from 7.x to 8.x then I'd recommend backing everything up and doing a factory reset (you do back up, right?) Sure it's a pain, but it will keep your phone running smoothly.

    Okay, you still don't want to do that? Unfortunately, without root (gaining admin access to your file system) there's little that can be done to block the notifications that won't seriously mess up your phone. You'd have to disable a bunch of services that handle more than just system updates.
     
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  3. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    I came here with exactly the same question for the same device. Previous phone was an Apple one which would railroad you into applying the updates and every update would break something fundamental and make it run more slowly while doing nothing obviously useful.

    So when I got this the first thing I did was disable all the app updates and I did find out how to put it into developer mode so as to disable system updates.

    However that came too late and my experience with the phone which was great at first is now being seriously undermined by that wretched full-page dialog that pops up now and again inviting me to download the update which has to be killed.

    I might want to update the OS at some point but from what I've read Oreo has worse battery life and a number of bugs. At the moment the phone is virtually bug free so I'd prefer to keep it that way. Updates always carry risk and from what I've read you can't undo updates, once you install them you're stuck with them. Others may differ but the risk is too high for me.

    If I reset the phone completely and turn on developer mode before I allow it to connect to the internet will this stop all the notifications, or do I need to do something more "hardcore"?
     
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  4. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    I take it this is a complex thing to do...

    The thing I need to disable appears to be a system app called "Software Update".

    DISABLE and FORCE STOP are themselves disabled. So this does need something more hard-core to get the phone to behave.

    I know how to achieve such things with MS Windows, I know what MS are up to, and Windows is much more "controllable" for want of a better word when you know it well enough to undermine what Microsoft are doing. But I don't know Android well enough.

    I did see a suggestion to install something called Package Disabler (Samsung) but that doesn't exist.

    What can I do to gain basic control of the phone and turn this wretched service off?
     
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  5. mikedt

    mikedt 你好
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    I think Samsung basically made the change and locked that out following the Galaxy Note7 recall fiasco. Because apparently some holdouts were using it to try to avoid forced OTA updates that disabled or neutered Note7s(it disabled charging). There was quite a lengthy discussion here on AF about it, I know because I had a Note7. :thumbsdowndroid:

    I did read somewhere that the Package Disabler developers received a cease and desist letter from Samsung's legal department, again because of the Note7 recall.
     
    #5 mikedt, May 22, 2018
    Last edited: May 22, 2018
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  6. chanchan05

    chanchan05 The Doctor
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    The phone may or may not be actually slowing down with the updates. The thing here is, while Samsung and Google at least may not be slowing their phones down (and we can be sure because people dissects their code regularly for root exploits and for use as the base for custom ROMs), this opens them up to the issue that Apple was trying to prevent by throttling: battery output problems.
    As battery ages, it's output becomes less stable, and may become lower than what the phone is used to, or needs. This creates a slowness to the phone whenever the phone demands more power from the battery but the battery is unable to provide. So the phone hangs or stutters or just plain lags. Apple decided to avoid lag by actually decreasing the power CPU asks by throttling.
    So yes, it might artificially seem that the phone is slowing down after updates, but in reality it may have been slowing down on you for quite a while now, depending on your battery health.
    The best option is to just apply the updates, do a factory reset after then use the phone. If you're experiencing slow downs with the decreasing battery life, just have the battery replaced.
     
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  7. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    I haven't bothered registering with Samsung, I don't use any of their apps and I removed all the ones that I could. IIRC trying to use one of them throws up some dialog box about sharing data with Samsung which is rather vaguely worded and said something like 'examples of the data include..'.

    Maybe they know the answer to what happened to the "Yes, thanks for the notification. No, I don't want to install this update, don't prompt me again" button.

    I think I'll have a try at resetting the phone with it on the ground floor of our house since it can't get a data signal there and with Wi-Fi off. So deny it internet access. Then turn on developer mode. Then disable OS updates. And then see if that puts a stop to this:

    [​IMG]
    .. and the thing that really offends me and is ruining the phone, this:

    [​IMG]

    .. which pops up all by itself maybe every 10th unlock and has to be killed.
     
  8. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    The phone I had before was an Apple iPhone, and that's why I'm so reluctant to install any updates.

    iPhones are a lot of work to own. There are updates all the time which do very little except fix one or two of the bugs from the last-update-but-one. Within five minutes of restarting the phone after an update, all the new bugs are apparent and obvious. The updates just aren't tested. After all they can always issue another.. update. The users can be the testers. Apple used to be flawless. Once. Then Steve Jobs died.

    Oddly enough about a week after the expose of how Apple were slowing these down, the speed on mine suddenly jumped back to what it once was. But I'd had enough of the bugs by then.

    This S8 phone is about three months old and works very nicely. It does slow down after a while and needs a restart to restore the speed. I guess that's just poor memory management; after I've had web pages with embedded videos open it stutters slightly when scrolling around. To be fair the Apple one didn't do that.

    But with Android 7 it seems otherwise bug-free and it's nice and quick. Battery life is good. So there's nothing to gain (that I can see) and everything to lose by installing the update. Were I able to roll it back if it causes problems I would give it a try, but that's not possible.

    After all if I have issues with the phone after the update, who do I send it to for repair? EE? Samsung? The answer would seem to be "nobody". Maybe you shouldn't have installed the update.

    I don't want to install it, but I don't want the phone basically ruined by not installing it either. It all started so very well and now it's becoming a thing of hatred ;)
     
  9. mikedt

    mikedt 你好
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    FWIW ever since my Note7 was recalled, I've never wanted to buy another Samsung phone.
     
  10. Hadron

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    Why not ask other S8 owners whether they have had problems with the update? Many people have received it, so there should be enough experience to get a fair answer.
     
  11. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    I did have a flick around various sites. On forums for this phone, there's generally one thread full of people moaning that they've been missed out and haven't got the update and most of the other threads are about things that are now broken because of it :)

    Worse battery life is the common theme.
     
  12. chanchan05

    chanchan05 The Doctor
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    I've never really had trouble with the memory on my phones but that depends on use. I'm pretty knowledgeable on how to handle phones and a bit of how they work underneath.

    Treat your phone like a PC. It would need a restart every now and them. There's a setting in the phone where it can be set to restart once a week. I set it to do so at 2am Mondays, so I wouldn't even realize it did.

    A periodic visit to settings>device maintenance would also do well to clear out orphaned temp apps improperly coded apps leave behind. The phone would have to query if those can be deleted before it removes them and uses the space for the active app temp files which can cause slowing.
     
  13. lunatic59

    lunatic59 Moderati ergo sum
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    Discussion can get heated in forums about topics like this, especially if there are instances of updates causing problems (or in Apple's or Samsung's case, getting caught deliberately throttling performance). There are several things to consider.

    First, most of the noise you hear is coming from users who've had issues. The vast majority of people will apply the update and go merrily on their way without so much as a peep. In the case of your phone, there have been millions of devices shipped and it would be devastating to Samsung to have an update that caused serious problems across the whole product line (like the Note 7 battery debacle).

    In those vast numbers, everyone is going to have a different configuration, carrier and app list, so while Samsung tries their best to get updates that install smoothly for all customers, it's next to impossible. If you're one of the few who get bit, then that has to be dealt with on an individual basis.

    IMHO updates are necessary to fix bugs, plug security holes and give users new features that might not have been available at the time their phone was released. While the feature set might not be important to you, bugs and security should be.

    Of course you can chose not to install, but it's still going to nag you about it.

    Now, to prevent any problems with updates, it's always best to do the following.

    1.) Make sure your important data is backed up before you apply the update. (You should be backing up anyway, right? .... RIGHT??!! ... do it now. :) ) And turn on Google's backup for your apps and settings (*more about that later)

    2.) Fully charge your phone. A full version update can take many minutes (or longer) to complete and will use a good deal of power. Having your phone crap out in the middle of a system update can easily brick it.

    3.) Let the update run. These things take time and for version upgrades it's essentially rewriting your system. It's got a lot to do, so let it do it. 30 minutes to an hour is reasonable, but I wouldn't consider it a problem if it took longer ... after 2 hours maybe, but that's going to depend on your phone. An S8 I'd expect to take 15-20 minutes, but if you have low user space or 250 apps installed .... go for coffee ... twice.

    4.) When it's complete, clear your caches. One of the biggest problems with updates is that they leave bits of the old OS around, especially in caches that could conflict with new processes and cause lag, battery drain, heat, signal issues, etc. And make sure once you clear the caches that you restart your phone at least twice.

    5.) Best practices. Remove all accounts from your phone and then perform a factory reset. Removing accounts disables FRP (factory reset protection) so you won't have any problems with the reset. (Check with Samsung to see if they have a separate reset protection enabled for your device)

    Yeah, it's annoying but you can streamline the process if you have a custom launcher that you can backup. Nova or Apex work well. If you have checked the box in Google backup to restore your apps and settings above* it will reinstall everything for you once you've logged in with your Google credentials. Then restore your data and launcher backup and you can be back almost to where you were prior to the update with a clean efficient system.

    BTW, the biggest complaint by far for Samsung devices recently is their dropping custom notification tones from the stock messaging app. If that's the worst, then the update can't be all that bad. ;)
     
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  14. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    I asked Samsung:

    Their reply:

    I've managed to work out that by "Home" button he means the one on the left.

    It's currently sitting in "Safe Mode" with a 3 hour timer set to prompt me to restart it.
     
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  15. dt7301

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  16. chanchan05

    chanchan05 The Doctor
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    I see I actually failed to answer the notification question. LOL. However do understand that with refusing to update, you are also forgoing future security updates that protect you from malicious software.

    Now with that in mind, AFAIK the only way to clear that is to factory reset the phone, do not setup software update, then go to settings, activate developer mode, and turn off automatic checking for updates.
     
  17. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    Thanks. Samsung are absolutely useless, don't really speak English properly and don't understand their own products. If a full reset fails to fix this then I can send it to them for repair. Honestly... ;)

    Planning on doing the reset this weekend with the phone locked out from the internet until developer mode can be enabled and OS updates disabled so as to prevent the phone even detecting the updates. I just haven't had the time to spend on this.

    When I do that: I don't think there is anything on this phone which is only on this phone. It is not my main means of accessing the internet. Photos are sent to my PC via OneDrive so don't need copying from the phone.

    Apart from the "Nine" and "Malawarebytes" apps. Do I need to back those up or can I just wipe the phone and download them again from the Play Store thing without paying a second time provided I set the phone up with the same account as before?
     
  18. Hadron

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    If you have paid for an app through the Play Store you can reinstall it for free at any time as long as you use the same Google account. It doesn't even have to be the same device, and can be used on multiple devices at the same time.
     
  19. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    Thanks for all the advice.

    I can't tell you how thoroughly fecked off I am with this phone now.

    Finally I get a couple of hours to spare so set about trying to fix the phone.

    I turned it off, removed the SIM card, and ran the factory reset.

    I then worked through the setup screens turning off all the spying stuff, so disabling most things.

    I then get to the screen below which was captured with an Apple phone so it's up sideways for some reason.

    All the things above have a slider to disable them - use location, share with Google, and I turned those off.

    The thing I need to turn off doesn't have one. You cannot proceed beyond this screen.

    I thought I'd give it a try. Clicked Next, got to home screen, all reset, all good.

    Enabled Developer Mode.

    Disabled OS updates.

    I then tentatively turn on WiFi.

    Immediately it starts downloading Oreo.

    I can lock out Google, Samsung and EE on our network temporarily but that only works when it's on WiFi and if I can get a comprehensive list of IP addresses but beyond that I think it's going to have to go back to Samsung for repair at their suggestion - this is a fault, as the phone is ignoring its own settings: but before that can anyone think of anything I can try?


    [​IMG]
     
  20. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    Just to check I did everything right, I've repeated those steps.

    This time, I blocked samsung, google and ee on our network and confirmed those wouldn't resolve.

    I then turned on developer mode, disabled auto updates and this time restarted it after doing that.

    After the restart: checking that the setting had held I enabled WiFi.

    Interestingly, or not, this time it doesn't immediately try to download the software update. Instead it runs through a long list of google crap that it downloads onto the phone.

    And, when it has done most of that - then it detects the software update.

    Within the phone itself nothing from Samsung nor EE will load. Mobile data is off. It has to go through the WiFi network and that's blocking those (by domain name).

    Google still manages to resolve. As if by magic. It must download a table of IPs to get around the DNS network block.

    I think the only repair for this that I could do is install some firewall software onto the phone that's capable of defeating Samsung, EE and Google and blocks those. It would mean I could never use any Google services like search.

    So all I can think to do is send it back for repair to either Samsung or EE which is who I bought it from. Specifically to repair that developer mode > disable updates feature which has a bug and is broken.
     
  21. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    Right, I think I've cracked it through a lot of trial-and-error. I think that you have to do things in a particular sequence for this to work.

    It requires a full reset so if you have things on your phone that are only on your phone you'll need to back them up first.

    1. Turn phone off
    2. Remove SIM card
    3. Restart phone
    4. Perform factory reset
    5. Run through the setup screens and set as you prefer - but do not enable Wi-Fi. Skip that step.
    6. When the phone reboots, turn on developer mode (Settings, About Phone, then Build Number - tap that seven times until phone tells you developer mode is now on)
    7. Back out from that and tap Software Update. Turn off "Download Updates Automatically" (it seems to be important to do this and the previous step in this order)
    8. Turn phone off
    9. Reinsert SIM card and restart
    10. Turn on Wi-Fi and/or mobile data

    You should see the phone detect the update and present a modal dialog box informing you it's available. Tap "Later". (There is no "No" option).

    And, joy of joys - the nag message in Notifications no longer appears. You'll still see a "1" superimposed over the Settings icon and a box at the top of the Settings page to let you know that an update is available. Should you wish to install it later on, you can click on Settings > Software Update and there's an option to install it "manually".

    This doesn't help if you've already "upgraded" to Oreo. But it does keep the phone on Android 7 and stop it nagging you to the extent that the phone becomes an object of hate. This really ought not to be so tortuously complicated.

    I anticipate that it may prompt again at some point but it hasn't done so, so far.

    Hallelujah.
     
  22. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    Apologies. On re-reading I missed one step:

    6a (in between 6 and 7): Tap Developer Options. Set "Auto Update System" to Off.
     
  23. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    OK, sadly, to update this, this part of the phone is broken.

    I now have a new and different nag message that the update is ready to install and I can select LATER, NOW or TONIGHT.

    If I click "Later" it's back exactly the way that it was. Notification stuck in top bar and random nagging when I'm in the middle of doing something with a box that can't be forcibly closed.

    That's with "Download Updates Automatically" set to No, and with "Auto Update System" also set to No.

    The phone is basically defective and needs a software repair. Ignore the steps above, as they don't work; there is literally no way to stop the phone's software ruining the experience.

    I wonder if at some point the LATER button will disappear and lock me out of the entire device.

    I can at this point choose to install the update or send it back to EE for repair or exchange.

    Or install the update and should it break anything or reduce the battery life then have to send it back to EE for refund or replacement with something else that does work properly.

    I'd so hoped that I'd got away from all this nonsense when I moved away from Apple. These things shouldn't be so much work to own :(
     
  24. dt7301

    dt7301 Newbie
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    Ok, final word on this. I thought I'd actually call Samsung to see if they can fix it.

    Confirmed as a fault by Samsung. It cannot be repaired by me nor them, it is an operating system software bug. The phone does indeed ignore the settings. It will go ahead and download updates with "Download Updates Automatically" set to Off. Bit of an issue for people with limited data allowances.

    I have the option to install the update and should it cause any problems, return it under the consumer legislation that applies to faults or return it now to EE (it is demonstrably faulty out of the box) and choose something else now that doesn't have this fault. I'm inclined to do that as I can't be bothered with all this again in the future and I've expended enough time on it already.

    The massive irony of all of this being that at the moment with this single exception the phone is flawless and until the nagging messages I was extremely happy with it.

    A cautionary tale about Samsung mobiles perhaps.
     

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