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Lets talk About Donald Trump :)

Discussion in 'Politics and Current Affairs' started by Evo 5oh, Apr 13, 2011.

  1. Evo 5oh

    Evo 5oh Android Enthusiast
    Thread Starter

    I seen a lot of threads videos and stuff

    YouTube - CNN Official Interview: Will Donald Trump run for president in 2012?

    Now tell me about this guy what do you really think? Will you vote if he runs for president? why and why not.....

    I can finally vote and now I want to have facts and opinions... It seems in my eyes that he knows what he doing and what he's talking about... give me some knowledge....

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  2. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

    The hair dude?
    Isnt he a birther?

    Don't listen to your parents dude
  3. Evo 5oh

    Evo 5oh Android Enthusiast
    Thread Starter

    they dont care about politics lol im the only one that does....they dont even vote...

    I just want the US economy to be better....and is true what hes saying about china
  4. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

  5. Evo 5oh

    Evo 5oh Android Enthusiast
    Thread Starter

    Shadow your making me not vote for anybody lol Im confused now....i just want America to be #1....Im from Puerto Rico and im pretty sure all the Puerto ricans on this forum want the same thing ;) we like to represent... :p
  6. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

    America has been no. 1 for a century
    China will suprass it, but that's only fair 4 times as many people live there
    The EU is decades away from being competition
    India is all but a joke

    There is no shame in not voting
    But there is in not caring about your peoples future
  7. lordofthereef

    lordofthereef Android Expert

    I personally don't think he will run for President. I see it as an easy way to give himself more publicity.
  8. Dark Jedi

    Dark Jedi Guest

    Any president can only do as much as congress allows him or her to do. So dont see Trump catering to the top few percent.
  9. cipher6

    cipher6 Android Enthusiast

    shadowninty is just jealous :> and upset the US doesn't follow Europe's cradle to grave nanny state.

    Higher taxes will hurt the economy, but truly turning the economy around isn't as easy as switching a tax switch, like Regan did in the 80's.

    To get the budget under control, we have to make some serious changes. Currently, defense, social security and Medicare are 85+ percent of the budget. As the more and more baby boomers retire, and start collecting SS and Medicare those numbers are expected to explode. Something has to be done.

    Obama and democrats want to give more and more away.. I think in his speech yesterday he said the GOP plan (which cut entitlements) was going to take opportunity away from Americans... they see welfare as opportunity. We have a thread on welfare touching on some of these topics. They see it as, these people are just not smart or good enough to not be poor, so the government handouts are all the opportunity or "hope" they have.

    They want to raise taxes, which hurts job creation and economic recovery, to give more "opportunity" away to those people that are just aren't capable of supporting their selves, and must rely on a benevolent government to take care of them.

    The entitlement system in our country is going to bankrupt us, raising taxes, making it harder to higher new employees and expand businesses, to fund it will only drag the economy down further, making more people poor, which increases entitlement spending, that you then have to raise taxes again to fund... its a terrible cycle that causes everything to go down the tubes.

    Paul Ryan's budget plan takes some concrete steps, many recommended by the dept commission Obama set up, but ignored their findings. It turns Medicaid into a voucher program, that can be used to buy private insurance. Obama wants to fix Medicaid by cutting costs... for example, saying Medicaid will only pay X amount for a certain thing... there is a reason many doctors don't take Medicaid patients anymore, because they pay too low. He also wants a panel of 15 unelected people, appointed by the president, to find "waste and abuse." Its getting very close to the UK's NHI, that says who can and can't have procedures. Right now, in an effort to save money, their making people wait months, in pain, for hip and knee replacements. Thats not the kind of system America needs.

    Republicans want to expand the economy, you do that by fixing the budget, which requires entitlement cuts, and not raising taxes. But it also requires, and not many are talking about this, is bringing in the talented people around the world. Our immigration policy favors families, not the educated, like Canada or Australia.

    Here is some further reading:

    Why the Republicans can't find a candidate
    By Spengler
    Asia Times Online :: Asian news and current affairs

    The Presidential Divider
    Obama's toxic speech and even worse plan for deficits and debt.
    Review & Outlook: The Presidential Divider - WSJ.com
    Member243850 likes this.
  10. Evo 5oh

    Evo 5oh Android Enthusiast
    Thread Starter

    Ok I see where you going but as shadow said the republicans want to cut back on education and green energy....First what the hell? education? people are becoming more stupid because of technology we cant do that....and green energy thats the new thing now...we have to depend on it because one day there is not going to be oil and then? what we going to do...
  11. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

  12. cipher6

    cipher6 Android Enthusiast

    Member243850 and Evo 5oh like this.
  13. Evo 5oh

    Evo 5oh Android Enthusiast
    Thread Starter

    I love a post with a lot of information. LOL i try reading the whole thing when i come back im going to make my time look at these....
  14. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

    was education spending increased 25%? Many industrialising countries are rapidly surpassing the US, and states are cutting budgets

    Can you Explain 70%?? of course its partially a "bailout" to ghe big three - other countries do the same
    Remember what Bush did?

    Reagan's economic bubble was built on BORROWED MONEY -.-

    the plan is to give back healthcare to the states (IMO that would be good)... but that is a federal cut and state increase


    but what about your previous tax cuts... if you need to hire staff you will (otherwise your company is in trouble) if you pay 10% tax you aren't gonna hire a dancing troupe to spend the excess... you'll hoarde it [generalistion]

    the waiting times isnt a big deal - if you need urgent care you'll get it - if not depending on the conditions you'll have to wait a few days
    You can switch doctor in UK to

    Its a socialised system - big deal

    Anyway it doesnt matter much which of the three systems you choose, as long as its a single system model, heavily regulated by the state
  15. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert

  16. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert

    I am not so sure about Donald Trump. I doubt he will run, however. He is more qualified than Obama. Clearly, he understands business and I think he loves this country.

    As for president, I'll need to hear more from the man.

    It is quite easy to discount him; the Donald is well known and most people likely do not think of him as 'presidental material.' If we can get past "the Donald's" persona and give him a chance to seruiously talk about the country as a legitimate cantidate, perhaps yes, I'll Vote Donald.
  17. cipher6

    cipher6 Android Enthusiast

    compared to what?

    supassing us in what?

    Like I said, we have one of the most expensive education system in the world, with the lowest paid teachers. Administrative costs eat up too much. This isn't really addressed in Ryan's budget.

    What is addressed, is decreasing Pell grants to pre stimulus levels. It seems, the more Pell grant money thats out there, the more higher education charges.

    Then, eliminating duplication of job-training education, make them work, and track how well they do so you know what works and what doesn't.

    Focus more on career training than sending everyone to a four year college for a liberal arts degree with Pell grants. Target spending to the people who need it most. Help the poor get an education they can use to get a job and get themselves out of poverty and become self sufficient... not just pump money blindly into any and every program, then claim the other side "hates kids" if they try to make it help more people and target it to those that need it.


    yeah I can explain 70%, its a ratio, expressing a number as a factor of 100. What 70% are you talking about?

    Somehow related to the auto bailout? Or bank bailouts?

    If GM when out of business, I'm sure there would be some enterprising investors waiting to fill that market void... why didn't Ford need a bail out?

    The bank bailouts are a little different, I can accept some of that. If we were on the door step of a liquidity crisis, bank bailouts might have stopped it. But I think with the auto companies, it went too far... and REALLY too far with the 800 billion stimulus.


    Can you elaborate, or do you only think in catch phrases and talking points?

    Did you bother to read anything? Do you know what "block grant" means?


    What "previous tax cuts?" This is part of the problem. Bush lowered ALL tax brackets when in office, but to get it passed, had to agree to make it temporary (10 years I think it was). When the time was up, taxes were set to automatically raise back to pre bush levels, in the middle of a huge economic recession. The top bracket before was 39.6%, Bush lowered it to 35% (Lowest bracket 15% was lowered to 10%). In 2010 they were set to jump back to 39.6%. Obama called extending the brackets that had been in place for 10 years a tax cut, Republicans called letting the top rate go back up to 39.6% a tax hike.

    Lets say you own a restaurant, it's an LLC (Limited Liability Company)
    Now, Lets say you did $250,000 last year in profit. You have that much sitting in your companies bank account. You, of course will want to have some in there for unforeseen issues. Oven explodes and you need a new one, someone slips in the bathroom and sues you etc... If your taxed at 39.6% you owe the government, $99,000 and now have 151,000 left for rainy days. At 35% thats $87,500 you owe, and are left with $162,500 . A difference of $11,500. That 11,500 could have hired a couple new full time waiters... waiters make ~2.50, plus tips.

    This is a general example, but you get the idea. Raising taxes takes money out of the economy, meaning less money business have to hire and expand.

    When they talk about raising taxes on the "rich" making over $200,000, their talking not about fat cat millionaires, but small business owners, who make up the majority of that group.

    Not what I read on this side of the pond.

    A 9-month wait for arthritis treatment: Delay can mean a lifetime of agony for victims | Mail Online

    BBC NEWS | Health | NHS waiting time 'underestimated'

    Guide to waiting times
    If I had an issue, and had to wait 18 weeks for treatment, I would be pissed...

    Cancer sufferers refused life-extending drugs despite Government pledge - Telegraph

    Patients forced to live in agony after NHS refuses to pay for painkilling injections - Telegraph

    Stafford Hospital caused ‘unimaginable suffering’ - Times Online
  18. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

    pre stimulus


    physics, maths, chemistry etc

    70% of clean energy funding

    I don't like the bailouts, but the collapse of even one wouldve had awful effects... but the government should have been keeping an eye on them in the first place


    Reagan's boom was based on hige GOVERNMENT BORROWINGS and the increasment of prrsonal debt


    I presumed the idea of the block grant was to eventually shoulder more burden to the states.. hence the big savings...


    and money from these taxs goes towards hiring incentives....


    these waits do happen.. however the government is always trying to reduce them

    people in the British Isles like to moan - Irelands health service is hated - but Britons. hsve huge pride in the NHS

    again they are paying 40% what ye pay


    and I bet mostly are fixed - insurers wouldnt bother in the US


    UK = Democracy

    About 10-15% of UK people have provate health insurance too.. so yes

    Socialism isnt bad or scary

    The Cold War is over
  19. cipher6

    cipher6 Android Enthusiast

    I don't know what the % of Pell grant increase was. Do you?


    I agree, which is why we need to get our education system working better. Pumping money into it, obviously isn't working... So I don't think more money will magically fix the problem. K-12 public education, I think the major problem is too much money eaten by administrative costs.

    What is 70% of clean energy funding? What are you talking about? Its hard to debate one line sentences that don't elaborate on what your talking about.

    Thats straight false, do you actually think the government bailed out every bank in trouble? No they didn't. Do you remember Lehman Brothers, 4th largest in US? It went bankrupt, government didn't bail them out, and the world didn't implode.

    But, like I said, I can kinda accept stabilizing the banking system. But why auto companies? And why 800 billion (Iraq and Afganastan so far cost us 1 trillion) for a "stimulus" that had virtually no effect on the economy?


    Not really, its so states can choose the best way to spend that money, instead of a one size fits all federal system.


    No it doesn't, it goes to pay for the growing entitlement programs no democrat wants to cut funds from... and even if it did, do you know how silly that sounds? Take money from companies, decreasing their ability to create jobs, so you can give it back to give them incentive to create jobs? Really how does that make any sense at all?


    My max wait to see a doctor... a few days. Why do you think the government is the solution to everything?

    How much of your pay check do you get to keep every week?


    I don't know what your talking about again.

    Nether is the free market bad or scary... why not use what works when it works and forget about these silly labels. IF the UK likes its systems, and wants to keep them great for them. They should do what suits them. But why do so many Europeans get upset the US doesn't want to have a system just like theirs?
    Member243850 likes this.
  20. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

  21. cipher6

    cipher6 Android Enthusiast

    Its close to racism, the way people talk about the evil scary America.

    Don't care about those of lesser economic value? Any one, citizen non-citizen, rich, poor, ANYONE, can walk into an emergency room with a problem, and BY LAW has to be treated.

    And why is it automatically assumed the government is the only entity that can or should help the less fortunate? In the US we have way more private charity than the UK. If you need assistance, the government isn't the end all be all source of that assistance.

    You have centralized controls, that means a small group of government bureaucrats dictates who gets what treatment... I agree, its a bit hyperbolic to call it a "death-panel," but thats what politicians do, exaggerate. The point their getting at though, is all decisions about treatment are made by a small group.

    And the UK might be able to pull off centralized management, with only ~61 million population, and make their people happy... But that becomes more and more difficult with a population of 300 million. What works for UK doesn't work for everyone... what works for America doesn't work for everyone.
  22. davlid

    davlid Lurker

    Here in Scotland we don't go much for Trump since he tried to evict five people from their homes to build yet another blasted golf course. You can read more at:

    Tripping Up Trump | Tripping Up Trump

    Do feel free to keep him tied up in the US of A where he can do much less damage...

    David L
  23. Potvin63

    Potvin63 Member

    Cipher, I have read most of your posts on this topic and appreciate the positive points you have made regarding Paul Ryan's plan because I give him credit for being specific about Medicare and Medicaid because Obama sure wasn't clear.

    However, Ryan wants to further cut income and business taxes and thinks 3 million jobs will be created and unemployment reduced to 4% by 2015 without saying how. You can't just further cut taxes and expect that will create jobs.

    Without the quote, you mentioned that the economy was better during Reagan's presidency than the years before and after he left office. During several years he actually raised taxes. The deficit commission made bold proposals and that included both spending cuts and tax increases.

    I know tax increases are never popular but so far tax cuts in the last ten years haven't resulted in jobs being created in this country. Our entitlements are unsustainable and as more and more people retire those of us years away from retirement have to be concerned if there will be anything left for us.

    Regarding Donald Trump, I am a registered Independent but I lean democratic generally. However, I can't vote for someone who has had to file for bankruptcy protection a handful of times for his real estate and casino operations. He does have a great understanding of business and he certainly can use a lot of his own money to wage a campaign but generally wealthy business people do not fare well in general elections. Plus there is a lot going on internationally as well so whoever wins in 2012 will have a lot on their plate from the get go.

    With the country so fractured, neither party has a plan with enough support to go anywhere and in one month there will be an even bigger fight over raising the debt ceiling. I just want to see effective leadership from someone, I don't care which party it is.
  24. ElasticNinja

    ElasticNinja Android Expert

    explain the medical death issue... and America is not evil
    Charities are great - they often help with low level family issues ... but they cannot replsce the state welfare wise
    beuracrats are the medical staff ss far as I know (I don't know much about that), treatment is based onon need not ability to pay
    IMO healthcare should be managed at a state level - with federal regulations to ensure interchangeability and cross border cover
    The fact is that the US's current system (not a system) does not work sadly
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