• After 15+ years, we've made a big change: Android Forums is now Early Bird Club. Learn more here.

Root **Official** Droid X encrypted bootloader and efuse thread

Have you guys seen the new unrevoked tool to turn off security on the evo and incredible? Basically you permanently turn it into a developer phone and can flash any rom at will. It turns off the bootloader checking below the radio.

Yeah, unfortunately from what I read at XDA they said it is a vulnerability only on the HTC phones, so it doesn't really apply to us....atleast not yet :( ....but atleast it gives people the idea to start looking for it.
 
Upvote 0
Yeah, unfortunately from what I read at XDA they said it is a vulnerability only on the HTC phones, so it doesn't really apply to us....atleast not yet :( ....but atleast it gives people the idea to start looking for it.

I wasn't even aware that the Evo and Incredible had encrypted bootloaders? They were locked yes, but everything is locked out of the box...
 
Upvote 0
the NAND memory was protected though.

BTW, what is meant by NAND memory in regards to a phone? Is it just a reference to the internal NAND (as opposed to NOR) flash memory? In the case of "Protected" NAND memories does that mean that beyond the normal su permissions necessary to mount read/write from within the system, there is also a deeper level of read only outside the system (like if I'm in recovery)?
 
Upvote 0
So I vote that this thread be un-stickied. Since we have root and a workable recovery method, I doubt this thread has much relevance any more.

I partially agree, and partially disagree. Let me explain.

Currently, we have root, and we can load a version of 2.2. Unfortunately, the version of 2.2 we can load is one that was released onto a developer phone way back in April: needless to say, it has countless bugs, is not optimized much at all and really doesn't present a who lot of incentive to make the switch.

From what I understand, we are now stuck waiting for the official release which will obviously bring us an optimized kernel, a less buggy version, etc etc. Unfortunately, even when we do have the official 2.2 release, we will still be restricted to the kernel that it comes with b/c it is the only Moto-signed version we will have (since the boot loader is still encrypted, we can only use Moto signed kernels).

The good news is this: I assume that once we do get an official 2.2 release, we will start seeing support from BB, CM and other big ROM names (but this is just my very uninformed opinion...). I haven't had any experience w/ custom ROMs myself, so if those guys typically thrive on using custom kernels, then maybe I'm wrong about seeing support.

The bad news is, this: when it comes time to release the next OS after 2.2, we will almost certainly be stuck waiting for the official release (remember that we got the early 2.2 from a pre-release developer/tester phone). Unless we're lucky enough to get access to a dev phone loaded with Gingerbread (or its successor), we will not see a TRUE early release of Gingerbread on the DX (I say TRUE b/c without the proper kernel, it really won't be Gingerbread). This also has dire implications for anyone hoping to use the DX for the full two years of their contract (or longer): there is a possibility that Gingerbread and/or later releases will take an EXTREMELY long time to reach the DX. Heck, there's even a chance that those version won't make it to the DX at all (depending on when Moto/Verizon/Google/whoever decides to discontinue support). Don't forget, 4G and a myriad of new more powerful phones are coming, so who knows when the DX will be sidelined for good.


There are some scenarios in which my doom-and-gloom scenarios don't apply:

1) We crack the boot loader encryption. Probability of this occurring: 0. This isn't up for debate, it's a fact: if you don't believe me head over to AllDroid for a few in-depth, and quite conclusive discussions of it. Even if someone was dillusional enough to WANT to try cracking it, said individual almost certainly wouldn't have the know-how to even try. Those who do have the know-how are the same folks who understand that the encryption is FAR FAR to great to brute-force (yes, even with a global farm of computers).

2) We find an alternative way to load kernels without the stock boot loader. Probability of this occurring: not good. I do have a hightened respect and confidence in our hackers, but this is where the Moto Milestone guys got stuck. I'd like to think that we have a more intellegent, crafty and skilled group of hackers working on the DX, but that is really just a pipe-dream. A LOT of geniuses have been hacking away at the Milestone for quite some time now, and I'm not dillusional or conceited enough to claim that our DX guys are far better and brighter.

I know someone is going to say "well look how much faster we've achieved ______", so let me address that right now: much of what we've achieved is due in large part to the hackers utilizing their knowledge of what the Milestone guys have been doing. I'm not taking any credit away from them (they're AWESOME), I just am pointing out that the aforementioned argument is not a valid one.

3) We get a leak from an EXTREMELY high level Motorola engineer that allows us to access the boot loader. Probability of this occcurring: very close to 0. Someone at this level is not going to jeopardize their reputation or career to please a bunch of hackers. That is unless we can get the Leverage crew to run a brilliant scam on said engineer, have the Soprano's beat it out of him/her or get Sheldon Cooper to just remotely steal it or reinvent the technology for us! (tv references ftw, lulz).

Summary: this thread is still somewhat relevant b/c the signed boot loader is still relevant. The eFuse protection: not so much.

Disclaimer: I could be wrong. If I am please correct me (politely) and provide the correct information. If you don't know for sure that something I've said is incorrect, or you don't have the correct answer, please don't just post to contradict me b/c you're disgruntled about what I've said.
 
Upvote 0
Hi kwest!

You've got a pretty good grasp on the situation. The device has been rooted and you have a custom recovery you can use, but no true custom ROMs are possible without bootloader access. Custom ROMs like those avaipable for devices with open (or at least non encrypted) bpotloaders typically include a lot of kernel tweaks and changes that would be difficult to implement outside of the kernel.

This isn't necessarily horrible, if you're satisfied with the features of the kernel you currently have access to.

However, it seriously limits the future-proofness of the device. On a device with an unblocked bootloader, you don't need to worry about never geting updates because the manufacturer is too concerned with newer phones selling well than keeping old ones up to date. Take a look at phones like the G1 or Magic... they're already on 2.2 while the Droid x and milestone are still on 2.1. I don't think this will be any different when Android 3.0 or 4.0 come along.

The only chance of changing that is by cracking the bootloader (which will probably just result in Motorola making it harder to crack on the next model), or by getting Motorola to change its ways. If you've already bought a Droid X or Droid, you're going to have the exact opposite effect on Moto :(
 
Upvote 0
Yes, the thread still seems relevant to some degree.

Also, it was just a few weeks ago when we weren't even sure we'd ever get root! So we've come a long way already, even though it may seem unlikely to get true custom ROMs on the X.

I have a quick question that I may as well ask while I'm here.... I'm running the leaked version of 2.2 and have kept root. I also have the Bootstrap Recovery installed.

When the "official" 2.2 is released, I'm assuming I won't be able to upgrade to it until an update.zip is released for it like the leaked version, right? I mean, yes, I understand I can sbf back to 2.1 and then upgrade, but I don't want to do that. I want to upgrade to the "official" 2.2 without having to wipe. I don't mind waiting a while, but I'm just hoping that will be possible?
 
Upvote 0
Also, it was just a few weeks ago when we weren't even sure we'd ever get root! So we've come a long way already, even though it may seem unlikely to get true custom ROMs on the X.

Why were you unsure about root? Every other Android phone has been rooted with at least rudimentary access to the root file system... it's only the encrypted bootoader that Motorola's started using that's causing problems :(
 
Upvote 0
I didn't mean to imply that the basis of this thread is pointless now. Just that it the information contained in this thread is woefully out of date and inaccurate. Perhaps it would be best to retire this thread and start a new one that builds from where we are today with a recovery method and root. A "Post Recovery Method" discussion thread so to speak....
 
Upvote 0
I didn't mean to imply that the basis of this thread is pointless now. Just that it the information contained in this thread is woefully out of date and inaccurate. Perhaps it would be best to retire this thread and start a new one that builds from where we are today with a recovery method and root. A "Post Recovery Method" discussion thread so to speak....

Once again: The recovery has nothing to do with the (encrypted) bootloader. What you're talking about is a completely different topic...

And how is the information out of date? The bootloader's still encrypted, isn't ist? :p
 
Upvote 0
Well, if I recall correctly (I'm not going to reread the 12 previous pages), most of the conversation has revolved around these main points: are we going to be able to root, and will the bootloader be cracked so we can run recovery and custom ROMs.

The only question that hasn't been answered is running custom ROMs. That is what I mean when I say there is a lot of old out of date information in this thread.

I certainly don't mind reading any "unread" posts that pop up. But it would be brutal for a new person to have to read those 12 pages - expecially when taking into light my statement above. Really long threads like that are counter productive IMHO because the contain so much information that has changed by the time you get to the end of the thread.

It's not like anyone is calling for this thread to be deleted. The information would still be available to anyone that looks for it. A new thread could actually stimulate conversation too.

I could really care less to be honest. I'm certainly not trying to stur up trouble. If the Admins feel that this thread contains enough previously posted information to remain sticky - rather than replace it with a new thread that would start out with today's baseline (root and recovery), then I'm fine with that decision.
 
Upvote 0
Because I only tend to read the "unread" posts, I had failed to see that KWest12 has been doing a great job at maintaining the first post and keeping it update with relevant progress. That alone makes me more comfortable with keeping this thread stuck.

Great job KWest12!

PS - it also shows how far we have come. Originally when this thread was started, no one knew for sure if the device even had an excrypted bootloader. Then we found out it did, and even had the efuse scare (ie sneezing wrong is going to brick you phone). Finally we have arrived where we are today, with root, a workable sbf file, and a custom backup/recovery method - all in less than 60 days!
 
Upvote 0

BEST TECH IN 2023

We've been tracking upcoming products and ranking the best tech since 2007. Thanks for trusting our opinion: we get rewarded through affiliate links that earn us a commission and we invite you to learn more about us.

Smartphones