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General [RELEASED] The 4.3 inch "Thunderbolt" aka "Mecha" aka "Incredible HD" from HTC...beyond coming soon!

Discussion in 'Android Devices' started by crimton, Oct 31, 2010.

  1. mb01

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    I'm guessing youre one of those people that believe ram is what speeds up a device and makes it run better LOL. Try playing dungeon defenders on your phone and then tell me if its plenty fast enough. Of course TB has a faster processor. Hell the droid x and 2 have a faster processor except they were released MONTHS AGO. HTC just upgraded technology that's already dead, and for some reason youre trying to defend it. I definitely would not want to own this phone with this kind of iPhonish fanbase.
     

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  2. gobluejd

    gobluejd GOBLUE!
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    This should help a little. I just posted a good article explaining.

    http://androidforums.com/htc-thunde...speculation-dual-core-single.html#post2104481

    Continue discussion THERE.
     
  3. BzB

    BzB Android Enthusiast
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    lol. look guy, you can like whatever you like. i was saying the TB processor is faster than the incredible processor, and the inc processor is already fast enough for all that i ask it to do. plus i do value the udpated version of sense and i don't prefer moto's sw or their locked bootloaders.

    is it a problem if not everyone wants the same phone as you? u mad?
     
  4. gobluejd

    gobluejd GOBLUE!
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    I think if you have read this thread, this is said over and over. We get it.

    If you choose to keep posting in this thread, please come up with some original content to provide.

    Debate why it is better and read the article I posted in the thread I posted a few posts up.

    Thanks.
     
  5. ChiTownJim

    ChiTownJim Android Expert
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    I know dual core laptops big advantage other then speed was slightly better battery life. Don't know why it wouldn't be the same on a phone.

    Speed is no issue to me , I have never said to myself "man I wish my Incredible wasn't laggy and slow" or "man I wish my incredible was faster"
    and this phone will be faster then the Incredible with a more efficient and battery saving processor with a better GPU . I was a little disapointed but I am all in on this device. I will check out other devices if they are released the same month such as the Moto and LG phones they showed but I really want to be able to customize my phone and the Moto takes taht away.
     
  6. Bearly

    Bearly Android Expert
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    Jim,

    Are you saying you're all in on the Thunderbolt? If so, why? What makes it better than your Incredible, besides the LTE,larger screen, and front facing camera (which I do not personally consider necessary features) ?

    I'm pissed that HTC considers the Thunderbolt as something we should be in awe of. The Moto ATRIX looks amazing, though (yes, I know it's AT&T).
     
  7. ChiTownJim

    ChiTownJim Android Expert
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    Pretty much. the biggest thing is I need a larger screen , I love typing on the EVO and the Fascinate the Incredible I just have too big of thumbs and hands or I just suck at typing lol ... But after using a 4 and 4.3 screen 3.7 just isn't enough realestate for me.

    Motorola was putting out some amazing products but the fact of locked boot loaders etc.. is a big turn off for me. And I've tried out Moto (Droid, Droid X) and Samasung (Fascinate , Epic and Moment) android devices and have been very disapointed the Three HTC Android phones I've used have been amazing Eris, Incredible and EVO

    I know it's not a huge upgrade but it's enough for me to do a 1yr contract and pick up a new phone as a Christmas Gift to me at the end of the year

    I don't plan on buying the phone on release date probably 2-4 weeks after and then I will check out any phones that come out over the next month . If the Moto or LG phones blow me away I'll get them
     
  8. fatpomp

    fatpomp Android Enthusiast
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    No its not the same. The Evo has the LCD TFT screen and the Thunderbolt will have the SLCD screen.
     
  9. ECFfighter7232

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    As many others, im in a debate over the Bionic and the TB.... Both phones have flaws in my opinion...
    TB - Pros: Looks sexier IMO, actually looks better built (granted this is just from pictures but the bionic looks... idk.. plasticy), non locked bootloader (or so we think, no one knows really yet), 1gb ram, kickstand with a nice big speaker under it.
    Cons: single core as apposed to the dual of the bionic, no hdmi port (I've gotten used to having it on my X), smaller battery (I know it has a newer/more efficient processor but still...)

    Bionic - Pros: tegra 2, nice big battery, oh, and tegra 2 (did I mention that before? lol)
    Cons: looks kinda cheaply made IMO from pictures (which is surprising to me coming from moto), its from moto so chances are the bootloader will be locked up like ft knox again, 512mb ram, looks kinda fat to me.
    Moto-Blur/Ninja-Blur and Sense UI arent really a big issue to me honestly. I use launcher pro plus anyway and currently have apex on my X which gets rid of enough of the blur for my liking.
    Both will be able to be rooted im sure, moto wont get custom kernals again im sure, and the htc most likely will be able to.
    Before CES started I said I wanted to see a dual core, 4g, 1gb ram phone with a front facing camera running 2.3... well 2.3 is not on either, one is duel core but doesnt have 1 gb, the other has the one gb but isnt duel core... cant win em all I guess... now i've just got to pick which phone will be better for ME for the following year.
    whats best for one person isnt always best for someone else, right now im leaning toward the TB though
    I will say this though.... the Xoom will be mine!
     
  10. jfoey22

    jfoey22 Android Enthusiast
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    Well said. I tend to agree w/ most of them. I have a question. Can you give me benefits of the HDMI port? The one thing I can think of is the obvious one. Streaming Media from the phone to a TV. I am not a DLNA expert but can't you pretty much do the same thing if you have a DLNA TV? The TB will support DLNA correct? The only exception to this would be live online content. You couldn't stream live video on the phone and then pass that onto the TV with DLNA could you?
     
  11. MIAtrix

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    I asked this question before, but it probably got lost as it was posted right around the Verizon press conference. Could someone elaborate the differences between Blur and HTC Sense? I have a friend with the D2, and from her opinion and reading everything else on various message boards I've figured that Blur=Bad and Sense=Good. But what exactly makes them as such from your experiences? (I haven't had any Android phones myself yet so I'd really like to know)

    My coworker told me that Blur basically came with a bunch of preloaded crap that she never used, although she was eventually able to root it and delete most of the unwanted stuff. But basically that's the extent of my knowledge on Blur. But yeah, all of my friends/coworkers who have Motorolas (D1, X, D2) were either okay with the phones or weren't too impressed overall. Meanwhile, all my friends/coworkers with HTC phones (G1, G2, myTouch 4G, Dinc, Evo) all love their phones. So I definitely don't want to rule out getting a DTB just because it doesn't have a dual-core processor.

    Right now, the Motorola's processor and possibly the docking station that the Atrix has (if it comes to the Bionic as well) intrigue me. But other than that, I'd probably be happy with everything the DTB appears to offer so far.
     
  12. ECFfighter7232

    ECFfighter7232 Android Expert
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    yeah I've got DLNA on my X and dont use it, mainly because I dont have anything thats DLNA compatible so I've never touched it.
    I use my HDMI port often because I take a fair amount of videos (Im a volunteer firefighter and usually record out responses) and its nice to play that back on a tv screen. Also works really well for pictures.
    But again, thats just ME. I would probiably guess that 85%+ of X users, dont ever use the HDMI port. out of the 4 other people I know personally who have X's, none of them have ever used it.
     
  13. jfoey22

    jfoey22 Android Enthusiast
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    I don't want to steer this topic down the wrong path but anybody understand DLNA well? Like, can you from the phone stream online content and then through DLNA stream it to a TV. A perfect example would be the NFL mobile app. Can I stream an NFL game to the phone and then through DLNA put that on my DLNA approved TV?

    If so, then no HDMI output wouldn't be an issue for me and right now that is a big sticking point w/ this phone.
     
  14. vzwuser76

    vzwuser76 Android Expert
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    Actually, RAM does speed up a device and makes it run better. Case in point, my dad's pc. It's an older Compaq with a sempron 2GHz cpu & 256 mB of RAM. It was slow as hell. He had to wait around 10 minutes after pressing the power button to open anything. Solitaire took 30 seconds to load, web browser took around a minute. The specs showed it had 4 memory slots with a total capacity of 4GB. I recently installed 2GB (2 sticks) of RAM and it's a night and day difference. Now don't tell me "That's a PC, this is a smartphone." They are both computing devices and as such operate on the same principals. Think of the cpu as the motor and the RAM as the fuel. With more RAM, or fuel, you can run longer before running out of memory. With better RAM (like going from DDR to DDR2 or 3) you increase speed, just like adding a higher octane fuel. There's a reason why faster cpus require better memory. If you don't believe what I have said is sound, try removing half of the RAM from your computer and see how it runs.

    As far as the dual core = better battery life, that has to do with electronics theory, specifically energy loss due to heat dissipation and efficiency (resistance). Saying having one core running at 700 MHz is worse than two cores each doing 350 MHz will result in better battery life is valid only if each core of the dual core is more efficient than that of the single core. If not it will lose energy in the form of heat dissipation.

    Another issue is how much does each type use at idle. If a single core uses x amount of power on idle, the amount of power a dual core will be greater than a single at idle, because you have two 1GHz cores instead of one, again unless each core is more efficient than that of the single core. So you may very well be using more power on idle with a dual core but less with heavy use compared to a single core.

    An analogy is you have a 30 ton load to transport. Two semis will have less of a load on each than if a single semi tried to haul it, but now you are fueling two devices. The only way this is a better scenario is if the two semis get a better average mpg (ie power consumption) than a single semi. Granted, mechanically the two semis will lessen the the strain to haul the total load than if it were hauled by a single semi (which is analagous to heat over time breaking down the material in the chips causing a mechanical/parts failure).

    Another would be you have one bulb hooked up to a power source. If you add a second in parallel, each light is dimmer and it puts more of a load (draws more current) on the power source. Now you're using more power than originaly but possibly getting more light than with a single bulb. If you switch to bulbs that are more efficient, you can get the same amount of light while drawing less power. But that's the kicker, in the dual core each device must be more efficient than the single core they are replacing. The PC industry ran into this when they switched to dual core. Some manufacturers where taking two existing single cores and putting them together. It had more processing power, but drew more power and generated more heat.

    There are certain laws which cannot be overcome. Energy cannot be created or destroyed, only converted, in this case into heat. If you can lessen the amount of resistance the energy must travel through to accomplish it's task, you get higher output with the same or less power consumtion. It's basic electronics.

    So basically what it boils down to is, is each core of the Tegra 2 more efficient than a single core snapdragon, hummingbird, or OMAP? If so then power consumtion and heat dissipation will be reduced for a comparable task. If not then it will still the have higher processing power threshold, but will have the same or worse power consumption and heat dissipation for a comparable task.
     
    irish, crimton and MIAtrix like this.
  15. jfoey22

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  16. Bearly

    Bearly Android Expert
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    There is no way that Apple would allow Verizon to announce the iPhone on its network before Apple announces it at a major, regular Apple event (Feb or June).

    It's likely not device related but moreso related to the network (LTE, pricing models, etc.)
     
  17. jfoey22

    jfoey22 Android Enthusiast
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    Hey That would be A-Ok with me. I would love to see some LTE pricing.
     
  18. mb01

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    I'm sorry, you used a lot of smartsy words but your analogies and information is terrible. RAM simply allows for opening multiple programs at once and allowing background processes to run. Android runs barely any background processes, and multitasking is handled flawlessly by the OS by shutting off extra apps and programs when necessary. Android multitasking is not "true" desktop multitasking where you can physically have mutliple programs open and running while using them simultaneously. Android hardly touches on the 512MB of RAM it currently has, the addition of dual core CPUs will make programs open faster, better rendering of animations on-screen etc. The only way RAM would make an affect right now is if it was an upgraded FORM of RAM (DDR1 to DDR2).
    Your story about 2 semis hauling something is in no way relevant or related to how CPUs operate when put into a dual-core scenario. Your analogy is relevant to multiprocessor setups, where more than 1 processor is physically utilized. Dual-cores operate in a completely different manner than multiprocessors. Read it up, I don't feel like typing stories.
    As far as battery life and your "heat dissipation/lost energy" theories, these phones get hot because the processors are constantly handling heavy loads trying to do eveything by themselves, constantly running at high clock speeds. High clock speeds means more juice pulled from the battery to sustain the speeds. Dual cores SHARE the load by splitting the tasks up (when multithreading software is implemented properly) and executing accordingly. This means lower clock speeds for the processor in it's entirety, which then equals less heat dissipation, and in turn less power used to perform each task. A single core 1Ghz running a task at 700 Mhz does not equal a dual core 1Ghz running same task at 350Mhz per core.
     
  19. WormDoes

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    After sleeping on it I'm going to get the TB. Who am I kidding? Every android I've owned has been an HTC and they've been great! I think the early reports that the TB still flies with the Qualcomm and the 32gb SD was a HUGE factor for me. I've been looking to purchase a 32gb to get rid of my iPod and now I can get a new device and the card??? SOLD!

    What I haven't heard anyone mention, which surprised me because I believe it's a pretty big issue, is the location of the micro USB in relation to the kick stand. When the phone is resting with the kick stand out the USB slot is facing down and seems like it'd be impossible to charge and watch a movie or whatever. Is no one else worried about this? Also, I know it will be purely speculation, but do you think that if this does comes out in MArch it would ship with GingerBread?

    Maybe this VZW presser is to announce the LTE pricing and to reveal the REAL HTC device that we all want :p
     
  20. shipwrestler12

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    I could see apple doing that I mean they wanted to steal some of the steam from the CES and what better way to do that than release their iphone on verizon a month or two before android lte phones. It would be a smart move so many people would buy this if they have an upgrade now rather then wait months for an LTE device. Even if it was 3g it would be a big seller then release their iphone 4g in the summer
     
  21. crimton

    crimton Android Expert
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  22. vzwuser76

    vzwuser76 Android Expert
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    I concede that apparently I wasn't understanding how Android works. But going by what you said then Android doesn't really do true multitasking. It's basically running one program, then when you go to open another, it either pauses or shuts down the previous program to put all it's energy into the current task. But wouldn't it have to store a cache of the paused program and wouldn't that be where the RAM comes in?

    As far as the dual core/ dual processor, you are correct. I was thinking of the first dual core PCs where they were putting two single cores on a chip rather than two cores optimized to work together.

    But as far as the heat dissipation/lost energy theories, it's not a theory, it is the first Law of Thermodynamics. I believe we can agree that a microprocessor is a collection of logic circuits. A logic circuit in it's basic form is an electronically controlled switch, requiring a certain condition before it switches on/off. The more they switch on/off the more power is used and heat is built up. The hotter it gets, the more resistance is built and the less efficient it is, requiring more power. If this goes unchecked it will lead to thermal break down. It does apply to single/dual cores, but the extent depends on how efficiently each works.

    One thing I remember about dual cores is they will only work better if the OS has been optimized for them. From what I have been hearing Android previous to Honeycomb has not. Motorola kinda confirmed this at CES when they said that had software on their 4G phones to take advantage of the multiple cores. That kinda goes back to what I said a few days ago about buying the first model. In this case they have the hardware ready , but the software is a patch. The OS wasn't written from the beginning with dual core in mind and probably won't be until 2.4 or 2.5. In this case I would rather let them get any major bugs out first and then jump on it.

    I am currently happy with my Incredible's performance. The TB will offer improvements speed wise (45nm vs. 65nm) plus the other features that have been mentioned earlier. One that has not is it has noise cancelling mics. As I use the phone part quite a bit this is something I see as a plus.
     
  23. cdavis

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    I don't understand why this is such a huge deal to everyone. Yeah it isn't the same technology that was announced for Moto., but it fits right in with HTC and what everyone had previously known. The fact is the Thunderbolt will be the top seller on VZW until the Droid Bionic is launched, it has the fastest processor of any phone on the network, much improved battery life from the Evo and the Incredible and it will be the only high end android phone with LTE capability until the Droid Bionic making it the best phone out there until such time. Then right around the end of Q2 when the Bionic is launched, HTC will release or announce their upcoming superphone whether it be dual core, triple core, or whatever and it will be the highest phone out there for the remainder of the year. Why should HTC announce their superphone plans now and give the other manufacturers time to adjust their devices to outperform it when it launches just after mid-year as HTC stated was the time period they were aiming to launch their multi-core line. In my opinion they have a very well thought out business strategy here; launch the first VZW LTE phone with great specs and a free 32gb SD card and ride out the huge profit for having the best phone out from now until the middle of the year, then just as everyone is launching the device they hope to make their year HTC will come out with their superphone that blows them all away with newer hardware and newer software with the high build quality they are loved for. Then by doing this they will ride out the remainder of the year with the profits off of their superphone having had the most up to date phone out for the carrier for the majority of the year.
     
  24. crimton

    crimton Android Expert
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  25. Bearly

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    How do you figure that the battery life is "much improved" ? We don't know that yet, so we should stick to historical evidence (poor battery life).

    Also, whoever posted the link to the WSJ article, come on. We all know analysts and the media have been WRONG way more times than they have been right. I don't trust those guys anymore. They can all go to hell :)
     

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