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So a ups

Discussion in 'Computers' started by Shotgun84, Nov 3, 2017.

  1. Shotgun84

    Shotgun84 Android Expert
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    Whatever he said.
    Cambridgeshire, England
    So my power's gone out a couple of times in the last year for 2 to 3 hours. It always happened at the worst time when my phone was running low on juice, so was kinda sat like a lemon waiting for it to come back on. I've had a bit of warning this time that they're doing work on my power lines so the electric will be off for 8 hours for one evening next week, so bought myself a ups. I'm not expecting it to power my TV or anything, I just want it to power my router so I can watch things on my tab. It's still charging so haven't been able to test it out but am I right in thinking amps makes more difference to power consumption than watts? Never been able to find the capacity of the batteries online but I think it's a 7-9ah. The box says it'll run an entry desktop, 22"monitor and modem which is 40 watts for 80 minutes. I'm guessing 2 of those run at 1 amp each. I've done my maths on my router and it's 46 watts. So will my router run the ups down in less then 80 minutes even though it's only 0.2 amps?
     

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  2. The_Chief

    The_Chief Accept no imitations!
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    Well, amps are simply a measurement of the current flow - the wattage is the actual power rating. I try to never exceed 70% of my UPS' power capacity... of course, the lower the amps, the less power the equipment draws. Ohm's Law, baby...
     
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  3. rootabaga

    rootabaga Android Expert
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    46 Watts? That’s a LOT of power for a router.
     
  4. TRS-80

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    Not really. 420mA x 110V = 46 watts.

    OP, one thing to remember, the deeper you discharge a battery, the more you are shortening it's life. Even with so-called "deep cycle" batteries that are made for that application (as UPS batteries are). See if you can find some discharge specs, especially duty cycle count or whatever.

    No phone with a hotspot? If you had something like that, you could run everything off one of those battery packs like from ANKER. Just another thought / option.
     
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  5. rootabaga

    rootabaga Android Expert
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    Well, I'm assuming he's using a regular home type/end user router, most of those use a 12V adapter with an amp adapter at most, so 12W (my Netgear uses 6W). The enterprise ones we use are 120VAC with more robust power supplies, but that didn't sound like what he's dealing with.

    Since this sounds important to the OP, the best thing to do is invest a bit of money in a current tester and find out what the router is actually drawing. They are cheap enough, this one is quite popular and under $20: https://www.amazon.com/P3-P4400-Electricity-Usage-Monitor/dp/B00009MDBU

    That's really the crux of the whole thing. Playing with math is one thing, actually KNOWING what the device draws in use is what counts, especially when you don't really sound all that sure about the calculations.

    Once the actual load is known, then the final calculation can be made. If the router is actually drawing near 46W, for example, something in the 1,000VA rating will be needed to supply power for about 90 minutes. Eaton has some useful tools on their site for the calculation.

    BTW, OP, having a 7A or 9A battery in a UPS really doesn't tell you much. I've got one under my desk that is a 375VA with a 12V9A battery, but I've got one down the hall that has four of those batteries and is rated only 750VA. That's the "max" current draw, but obviously the circuitry in the UPS is what determines all of that. So read the label and find the VA rating for it. That's what matters, not what batteries are in it.

    Good luck.
     
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  6. lunatic59

    lunatic59 Moderati ergo sum
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    @Shotgun84 didn't your UPS come with a monitoring app for your PC? I think most of them do offer some free application that will let you run a calibration cycle to determine load capacity/time to discharge. Just plug your router only into the outlet that provides battery backup and your PC into the surge-only outlet and there's a UPC cord so the app can gracefully shut the PC down if there is a prolonged power outage.
     
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  7. rootabaga

    rootabaga Android Expert
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    At least the way I'm reading it, s/he's not trying to power a PC. All s/he wants to do is power his/her router and then surf on a tablet.



    If it came with monitoring software and a USB interface cable then s/he may be able to take your suggestion, at least assuming s/he has a PC with the proper OS to work with the software. ;)
     
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  8. svim

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    That's what I was reading into it also. And yeah, that 46W does seem a bit excessive. Just to add the mix of other comments, I have an Arris modem and Netgear router, and together they use about 13W.

    +1 for Kill A Watt. Picked one up a few years ago and still use it frequently. Obsessively like to check not just how much power my computer stuff uses but the refrigerator, floor fan, rice cooker, oven, TV, etc., etc.
     
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  9. lunatic59

    lunatic59 Moderati ergo sum
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    Which is why I told him to plug into the surge-only outlet. It doesn't draw from the battery. I am assuming he's picked up a consumer grade UPS which will have both a surge-only side and a battery powered side. The PC could easily be plugged into the wall, too. The connection between the PC and UPS for the monitoring application is handled by the USB cable and only reads the load on the battery, not what is connected to it.

    Remember too that in addition to the external load on the battery is the internal circuitry of the UPS itself, so even if the math works out to 4 hours, he might only see 2. That's why I suggested using the calibration utility for a more accurate idea of time on battery.
     
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  10. rootabaga

    rootabaga Android Expert
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    ^^^ Yep, I saw that. But I wasn't sure he had a PC, and maybe I'm just jaded, but that software interface stuff never worked really well for me. Maybe it's improved over the years. I just tend to overpower everything I need on a UPS so I don't have to worry too much about it. ;)

    On a far more hilarious note, I was looking at the killawat link I posted and noted that while the device is inexpensive, if you want "expert installation" it will set you back a few simoleons... :D :D Hey, you know, I'll do it for half that!

    killawatt.JPG
     
  11. lunatic59

    lunatic59 Moderati ergo sum
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    I'll do it for $1,200.00 ;)
     
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  12. Shotgun84

    Shotgun84 Android Expert
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    Whatever he said.
    Cambridgeshire, England
    Thanks for the replies. All's good. It ran my router for 5 hours and I think I had a little left to charge my phone or tab so it's more than enough for my needs. Haven't had a power cut since I've had it except the planned outage though. I guess it's better to have it and not need it than not have it and do need it though :)
     
  13. rootabaga

    rootabaga Android Expert
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    Exactly the reason we buy insurance anyway...good it works for your purposes.
     
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  14. TRS-80

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    I only buy insurance because it's required by law! So much for our much vaunted "free market!"

    I finally picked up a Kill A Watt myself recently! I had always wanted one, for years now. They are a lot cheaper now then they used to be!
     
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  15. psionandy

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    A little off topic.. but insurance is essentially the buying and selling of risk. The ultimate expression of the free market.
     
  16. TRS-80

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    I think you may have missed the part where I said "required by law" which compels you, ultimately, through the use of force, thereby completely eliminating the "free" part of "free market!"
     
  17. psionandy

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    /Off topic start

    You missed out the bit where you said YOU ONLY BUY IT because its required by law... and then made a comment about your "much vaunted free market"....

    Thus implying that insurance is by its very nature is against the free market.

    If that wasn't what you meant by your choice of words.. then i'm sorry for the confusion they caused...


    /Off topic end


    now back onto the subject of UPS and routers... :D
     
  18. Astr4y4L

    Astr4y4L Android Enthusiast
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    well For about $60 USD I put together a Power supply kit running my PC, a T.V, Charging A phone, and cooking on a hot plate...

    ( For taking my Stuff With Me Camping --- i know laugh if you want but I gotta be connected)

    I used an Approx. $30 Jump-Start box ( for jump starting a car )

    and a 200 Watt Dc to Ac inverter (used to run Power-tools from the Battery of a work truck )
    a back pack ,
    a powerstrip
    and a short extension cord (to plug it in to charge it with out pulling it all out the back-pack )

    basically I took the Big black wire from the inverter and clipped the big black clamp from the jump-box on it , with a little electric tape to cover it
    and the red wire to the red clamp and tape it.
    turn the jump box to START
    and the inverter comes right on...

    it powered the T.V, a Desktop P.c& Monitor , A hotplate or coffee pot and had a usb port right there to power my android with native wifi hotspot :)

    while this is a Home brewed solution it did seem to work great, For Hours at a time (3-4) depending on how much coffee or food i heated...

    jumpbox.jpeg


    [​IMG]


    but yeah It worked out great, and would be my recommendation as opposed to the U.P.S because it's portable by design.
    Great for trips !!!

    L.O.L

    :)
    Astr4y4L
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  19. Shotgun84

    Shotgun84 Android Expert
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    Whatever he said.
    Cambridgeshire, England
    Honestly I did consider putting something together with a car battery and then I thought my landlord might get the hump when I burn his flat down :D
     
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  20. Astr4y4L

    Astr4y4L Android Enthusiast
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    yeah a carbattery might be a little much.
    but this way it was all contained and the whole thing didn't produce very much heat really.
    I carried it on my back , LOL!
     
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  21. bcrichster

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    Don't. Car battery? Fine. Inverter? Not needed if just charging phone batteries, wastes the pwr to convert back to DC. Just hook up a USB car charger and go from there. Trust me, I'm an electrician..
     
    #21 bcrichster, Dec 22, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2017
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  22. Astr4y4L

    Astr4y4L Android Enthusiast
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    That would be best ...

    If your only running D.C appliances/devices off of it.
    but like I said I wanted a Tower pc desktop and a T.V and A Hotplate and a Coffee maker.
    and I didn't want to go find D.C appliances when I already have A.C ones !! LMFAO!
    I'm and electrician too, along with many other duties as plant engineer!!!
    Last big project in electricity...
    I used a Big GE step-down transformer , rewired the windings to function EXACTLY BACKWARDS and now we get 480 Delta wave form from the 220 with the Y wave form !!!
    Frikkin Frankinstined it!!!

    but absolutely if your running ONLY dc appliances just grab the car battery HAHAHAHAHAH

    besides from the sound of it he wanted his whole wifi network run off of it not just an android.

    of course those are mostly DC also.

    but yep...

    Astr4y4L
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    #22 Astr4y4L, Dec 23, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2017
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  23. bcrichster

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    480?! Oh ma Gawd!! Lmfao!! Holy crap, nice job Mang. That's some shit right there, Props! Last time I seen something as cool as what you did on that 480 was a case of 2 single phase generators and small rack of capacitors putting out 3phase 480. I'm still trying to wrpa my head around that one, Lol..
     
    #23 bcrichster, Dec 23, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2017
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  24. Astr4y4L

    Astr4y4L Android Enthusiast
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    Hmmmm.
    Theres an idea too...

    But we had an issue where my plant manager ( the guy in charge)
    Bought a bunch of new motors.
    We burned the first one up when we stuck
    L1 L2 and L3
    To to the 220 Y

    So after quite a bit of investigation.
    We determined we had 480
    Motors and wired it wrong too.
    Lol that costed about $1800 to fix.

    So we talk to the power company...
    220 Y was the best we can get from the lines comeing into our plant ( according to them )
    So ya see we had to improvise.

    Its pretty Kool. Makes my hair stand up just standing close to it when those coils energize.
    Oh and if you get a grounded steel cable too close it looks like a continious lightning bolt !!!
    Its live!!!

    Astr4y4L
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  25. bcrichster

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    There's usually a metal tag on motors stating the voltages & amperage.. I assume he didn't check the tags before installation? Lmao
     
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