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To tether or not to tether

Discussion in 'Politics and Current Affairs' started by cougar214, May 17, 2011.

  1. cougar214

    cougar214 Android Expert
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    The way I see it is unlimited data is unlimited data. Look, you got this phone with tethering capability and you pay for unlimited data on your phone service. What's the problem?

    The problem is Verizon want's to charge you extra for tethering because, well, because they just want to make more money. That's it. It's all about the money. Tethering is NOT illegal. I do not understand people taking this "it's stealing" stance.

    Why is it stealing? Because Verizon now says it is because we refuse to pay for it? Gimme a break. If Verizon and other providers didn't start calling it "stealing" because they couldn't/cant get you to pay for it, would you be calling it stealing? of course not.

    there is a word for people that fall right in line where the big companies want you. Sheeple. If I personally want to tether than i'm gonna tether. You want to call me a thief than knock yourself out. I pay my bill, you don't.
     

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  2. sonofaresiii

    sonofaresiii Android Enthusiast
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    Okay, but see, stealing is a definable term, and within its definitions, tethering without paying is stealing, which is illegal. It's not a question of is it stealing/illegal or not-- it is. It's a question of is it fair to steal or not. Certainly there can be moral gray areas within the realm of stealing-- very few people think Robin Hood should have been locked up.

    You can even make the argument that it SHOULDN'T be stealing/illegal, because you're paying for unlimited data and should be able to use that data however you want. I wouldn't agree with you, but I would entertain your argument. But as it stands, tethering is, literally and by definition, stealing, which is illegal.

    But then, technically, so is making back-ups of your cds. I had a friend who legally purchased every album he ever owned, but since he didn't want to scratch them, he'd make back-ups onto blank cds and keep the originals in a box in his closet. That's illegal. Should it be? Fscking of course it shouldn't be. But it is nonetheless.

    edit: just to drive my point home and because I'm bored, here are other things that are inarguably illegal:

    Frankfort, Kentucky, makes it against the law to shoot off a policeman's tie. Horses are forbidden to eat fire hydrants in Marshalltown, Iowa.
    Idaho state law makes it illegal for a man to give his sweetheart a box of candy weighing less than fifty pounds.
    In Denver it is unlawful to lend your vacuum cleaner to your next-door neighbor.
    In Devon, Connecticut, it is unlawful to walk backwards after sunset.
    In Greene, New York, it is illegal to eat peanuts and walk backwards on the sidewalks when a concert is on.
    In Lexington, Kentucky, it's illegal to carry an ice cream cone in your pocket.
    In Memphis, Tennessee, it is illegal for a woman to drive a car unless there is a man either running or walking in front of it waving a red flag to warn approaching motorists and pedestrians.
    In Ohio, if you ignore an orator on Decoration day to such an extent as to publicly play croquet or pitch horseshoes within one mile of the speaker's stand, you can be fined $25.00.
    In Pocatello, Idaho, a law passed in 1912 provided that "The carrying of concealed weapons is forbidden, unless same are exhibited to public view."
    In Seattle, Washington, it is illegal to carry a concealed weapon that is over six feet in length.
    In Tennessee, it is illegal to shoot any game other than whales from a moving automobile.
    In Tulsa, Oklahoma, it is against the law to open a soda bottle without the supervision of a licensed engineer.
    It is against the law for a monster to enter the corporate limits of Urbana, Illinois.
    It is illegal to drive more than two thousand sheep down Hollywood Boulevard at one time.
    It is illegal to say "Oh, Boy" in Jonesboro, Georgia.
    It is Texas law that when two trains meet each other at a railroad crossing, each shall come to a full stop, and neither shall proceed until the other has gone.
    It's illegal in Wilbur, Washington, to ride an ugly horse.
    Kansas state law requires pedestrians crossing the highways at night to wear tail lights.
    Kirkland, Illinois, law forbids bees to fly over the village or through any of its streets.
    Minors in Kansas City, Missouri, are not allowed to purchase cap pistols; they may buy shotguns freely, however.
    New Hampshire law forbids you to tap your feet, nod your head, or in any way keep time to the music in a tavern, restaurant, or cafe.
    Texas law forbids anyone to have a pair of pliers in his possession.
    The Arkansas legislature passed a law that states that the Arkansas River can rise no higher than to the Main Street bridge in Little Rock.
    The City of Palo Alto, in its official description of parking lot standards, specifies the grade of wheelchair access ramps in terms of centimeters of rise per foot of run. A compromise...
    The penalty for laughing in a courtroom is six months in jail; if it were not for this penalty, the jury would never hear the evidence.
    -- H. L. Mencken
    The state law of Pennsylvania prohibits singing in the bathtub.
    There is a Massachusetts law requiring all dogs to have their hind legs tied during the month of April.
    Virginia law forbids bathtubs in the house; tubs must be kept in the yard.
    It is illegal to take more than 2 baths a month within Boston confines.
    Two people cannot kiss in front of a church.
    All Public Displays of Affection (PDAs) are forbidden on Sunday.
    Pedestrians always have the right of way.
    Anyone may let their sheep and cows graze in the public gardens/commons at any time except Sundays
    In Calgary there is a by-law that is still on the books that requires businesses within the city to provide rails for tying up horses.
    There is/was a law on the books in Washington state that stated that a motorcar driven at night must be preceded by something like 100 yards by a man carrying a lantern.....
    Stupid laws: In the England it is illegal to sell most goods on a Sunday, (this law is mostly ignored), it is however legal to sell a carrot. It is also legal to sell it at any price and to give free gifts with it, such as anything else one might want to buy on a sunday!
    Pennsylvania:
    In certain sections of Pennsylvania many years ago, the Farmer's Anti-Automobile society set up some "rules of the road." In effect, they said:
    1. "Automobiles travelling on country roads at night must send up a rocket every mile, then wait ten minutes for the road to clear."
    2. "If a driver sees a team of horses, he is to pull to one side of the road and cover his machine with a blanket or dust cover that has been painted to blend into the scenery."
    3. "In the event that a horse refuses to pass a car on the road, the owner must take his car apart and conceal the parts in the bushes."
    Utah:
    It is against the law to fish from horseback.
    Ohio:
    In Bexley, Ordinance number 223, of 09/09/19 prohibits the installation and usage of slot machines in outhouses.
    Indiana:
    Back in 1924, a monkey was convicted in South Bend of the crime of smoking a cigarette and sentenced to pay a 25 dollar fine and the trial costs.
    Kansas:
    No one may catch fish with his bare hands in Kansas.
    California:
    In 1930, the City Council of Ontario passed an ordinance forbidding roosters to crow within the city limits.
    Kentucky:
    A Kentucky statute says:
    "No female shall appear in a bathing suit on any highway within this state unless she is escorted by at least two officers or unless she be armed with a club." Later, an amendment proposed: "The provisions of this statute shall not apply to any female weighing less than sixty pounds nor exceeding 200 pounds; nor shall it apply to female horses."
    Oklahoma:
    Harthahorne City Ordinance, Section 363, states that it shall be unlawful to put any hypnotized person in a display window.
    These excerpts are from the book "Loony Laws" by Robert Pelton (Walker; $8.95) Enjoy!
    In Ottumwa, Iowa, "It is unlawful for any male person, within the corporate limits of the (city), to wink at any female person with whom he is unaquainted."
    In Los Angeles, you cannot bathe two babies in the same tub at the same time.
    In Zion, Ill., it is illegal for anyone to give lighted cigars to dogs, cats, and other domesticated animals kept as pets.
    In Carmel, N.Y., a man can't go outside while wearing a jacket and pants that do not match.
    In Clawson, Mich., there is a law that makes it LEGAL for a farmer to sleep with his pigs, cows, horses, goats, and chickens.
    In Gary, Ind., persons are prohibited from attending a movie house or other theater and from riding a public streetcar within four hours of eating garlic.
    In Miami, it's illegal for men to be seen publicly in any kind of strapless gown.
    In St. Louis, it's illegal to sit on the curb of any city street and drink beer from a bucket.
    In Hartford, Conn., you aren't allowed to cross a street while walking on your hands.
    In Michigan, a woman isn't allowed to cut her own hair without her husband's permission.
    In Baltimore, it's illegal to throw bales of hay from a second-story window within the city limits. It's also illegal to take a lion to the movies.
    In Oxford, Ohio, it's illegal for a woman to strip off her clothing while standing in front of a man's picture.
    In Nicholas County, W. Va., no member of the clergy is allowed to tell jokes or humorous stories from the pulpit during a church service.
    In California, animals are banned from mating publicly within 1,500 feet of a tavern, school, or place of worship.
    In Pennsylvania, "any motorist driving along a country road at night must stop every mile and send up a rocket signal, wait 10 minutes for the road to be cleared of livestock, and continue."
    In Carrizozo, N.M., it's forbidden for a female to appear unshaven in public (includes legs and face).
    In Los Angeles, a man is legally entitled to beat his wife with a leather belt or strap, but the belt can't be wider than 2 inches, unless he has his wife's consent to beat her with a wider strap.
    In Kentucky, "No female shall appear in a bathing suit on any highway within this state unless she be escorted by at least two officers or unless she be armed with a club"
    An amendment to the above legislation: "The provisions of this statuate shall not apply to females weighing less than 90 pounds nor exceeding 200 pounds, nor shall it apply to female horses."
     
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  3. cougar214

    cougar214 Android Expert
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    Yup. You were REALLY REALLY bored......lmfao.
     
  4. sonofaresiii

    sonofaresiii Android Enthusiast
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    My favorite is the one that says women can't drive unless a man runs ahead of the car with flags to warn everyone.
     
  5. Bugly

    Bugly Android Expert
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    Male
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    and that, kids, is how babies are made...
     
  6. cougar214

    cougar214 Android Expert
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    WARNING! WARNING!.....female driver approaching!......Sometimes I think they should make that a federal law......hehe.
     
  7. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    The plan is for your phone not your phone and your PC/Mac. You signed a contract which likely says no to tethering, so if they get mad and charge you or cancel you, it is their right to do so.

    Bob
     
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  8. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    Where we get into trouble is when we justify our reasons for doing what we do because we do not see the harm. We might have the best of intentions, but many people do not and their copies of LPs and CD's often find their way to the net. And some people do this because they honestly believe it is legal.

    I can rapidly disseminate the entire Beatles, Stones, and Metallica libraries in zip files by the thousands if I wanted to do so. Once it is in digital format, "manufacturing" copies is effortless.

    So laws are written to prevent all sorts of things because for every person that does what your friend does, more will simply post their music.

    By the way, the last time I looked, you can make copies of your records and CDs as long as you do not distribute the files. It has been legal since December, 2005 or 2006. Or it has always been illegal, depending on the web site you visit. It has always been legal to make backups of software, and I am not sure if the laws have changed.

    I still have lots of old backups on Floppy Disks. I have DOS 1.4 or some version. Posting it to the web does not hurt Microsoft's bottom line because it is no longer required. But it would be illegal to do.

    The web is filled with tools to copy music to disks or portable music players. Nero comes to mind. And it is not considered illegal. In fact, most MP3 players, CD Drives, laptops, and desktops come with ability to burn a CD. It is not illegal, it is encouraged.

    There are many stories that claim it is illegal. This is a position taken by the RIAA. When you read the articles, quite often, the complaint is not making copies of the CD/LP but sharing the music, which amounts to distributing perhaps tens of thousands of copies of some artist's music. This is unquestionably illegal and unquestionably stealing.

    When I bought my Laptop, it came with loads of tools specifically for burning CDs. I'll take my chances and eventually copy my entire collection to my HDD.
     
  9. Dark Jedi

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    People who justify using tethering for free are just looking for a cheaper internet connection. Price the speeds of 4g to the same speed of cable internet.

    In the end I see them getting rid of tethering as its just going to be one big headache for the cell company. People will always try to get something for nothing and try to justify it anyway to make them selves feel they are doing nothing wrong.
     
  10. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    If tethering becomes a big issue, guess what . . everyone will pay for it. Either increased monthly bills or a cap on bandwidth.
     
  11. Dark Jedi

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    You pay for unlimited data. So you can use all the data you want just as long as its on your phone. Tethering capability is just that it can do it but it isnt activated on your phone. So beings I have the blockbuster app I should be able to use it for free beings they put it on my phone ?




    Tethering is a service offered just like their Internet sticks are. They are evolving to have tethering to replace the data sticks for internet capable devices.
     
  12. Dark Jedi

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    I totally agree as all companies will pass the buck on the consumers rather than take the hit themselves. Its people like the OP that ruins it for everyone.
     
  13. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    I see it this way and it is really, really easy to understand: people should simply read the contract they sign and if it says no tethering, then the case is settled. If they tether, they are violating their contract. If people do not like it, then they should find a better deal.

    It is really no more complicated than that, despite the convoluted excuses they often use to justify their actions.
     
  14. Dark Jedi

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    Oh I know they use its not illegal as I am breaking no criminal laws. But illegal is also defined as not allowed in the rules. Verizons ToS are rules but people like the OP wont see it as it would show him and others with this thought pattern would have to admit they are wrong.
     
  15. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    I think people like the OP do not see it as a problem and they tend to define "Unlimited Data" as being unlimited in a way that allows them to tether. They are not necessarily bad people, just not aware of the law. Then again, there is that "ignorance of the law . . . ."

    It might not be a matter of criminal law as much as it is a matter of contract law. Then again, I am not so sure. If it is considered theft, it becomes a bit more than a civil law matter although the likelihood of arrest is slight to zero.

    That said, imagine how a few arrests would give people a little to think about. Then the repercussions become very real. And no, I am not suggesting we arrest those that tether.

    But I could be wrong. Bob is not a lawyer.
     
  16. Dark Jedi

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    I just think the most that will happen is they terminate their contract for breach of contract. Sort of like Xbox bans live accounts for modified systems or pirated games and they will ban the xbox itself. Verizon wont waste the money for a lawyer and trial over a matter they can solve by terminating the service to the person.
     
  17. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    I agree. the chance of an arrest is very low. They might sue those that provide software. They might not, probably wont, but sometimes a nice fat suit wakes people up.

    Look at the extent the RIAA goes to in court.
     
  18. cougar214

    cougar214 Android Expert
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    Hey guys, just for the record, i'm not the OP. This was moved because it didn't hold on topic of another post. And to make another point, I don't tether. I don't have a reason to. I use my WiFi at home or where ever they have WiFi while i'm out. Same goes for my wifes laptop. But should the need arise for me to do so, I'm going to. if that means I get a bill then so be it. Like I said, I pay my bill, you don't.

    The only point I was making is unlimited data means, or should mean, UNLIMITED. At the end of the day VZW and other carriers WILL either cancel people service for violated their newly written contracts(convenient for them), raise the prices of their unlimited data plans to make up for lost revenue because of tethering, or they will do a combination of the two.
     
  19. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    The term Unlimited is unfortunate because it does not mean unlimited as in, every customer can use vast amounts of bandwidth, absolutely unlimited downloads of huge files, and the like. As far as I can tell, all (or most) plans have some sort of cap and a rule against tethering.

    Regardless, if you sign a contract, that is that. Read it with care and ask questions and do not be bitter or mad because you do not know what you signed.

    I think it is fair for providers to cancel contracts when the terms of those contracts have been violated. This is basic and should be simple for people to understand. I have never approached my limits because my phone is not an entertainment tool and I do not need the web 24/7.
     
  20. tfek70

    tfek70 Well-Known Member
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    You mention LP's and Floppy Disks. What are these?
     
  21. Bob Maxey

    Bob Maxey Android Expert
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    LP = Long Play (record). They are large disks of plastic with a single grove on one side and a single groove on the other side; a label on either side, and a little hole in the center and you have Gustav Mahler, the Stones, and Snoop Dog's grandfather in glorious quadraphonic sound from a rotating platform, moving parts, and small sliver of gem material.

    Or a metal pin in the case of Edison's players.

    Odd that the big ones have a tiny hole and the 45s (smaller ones) have a big hole except for 78s which had a small hole and Edison cylinders that had a big hole longitudinally. And piano rolls that have lots of holes and slots, but made from dead trees by Elves in a hollow recording studio. Music from air and suction, like magic.

    Thank God things have improved and 8-tracks are finally here. Ask your Grandfather about tape.

    Floppy disks are things my grandfather once told me about. Really not all too floppy except for the 5.50/10.0 inch versions.

    Guess I need to 'splain wire recorders and Edison cylinders, right?:D

    :pBob:p
     
  22. RiverOfIce

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    In exile
    Repost 10 chars
     
  23. Thefoodman52

    Thefoodman52 Android Expert
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    Is tethering illegal? Because our carriers are greedy, they can claim it to be so without paying extra to use your data in a different way. I however, find it to be completely fine. I'm using my paid for data in a different way, that's all.
     
  24. Dark Jedi

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    Its unlimited data on your cell phone. Not unlimited data to be used anyway you see fit. When you got your android phone did they not tell you that you have to have the data plan with it? So right there that tells you the data is suppose to be used for your cell phone and not to tether your laptop.
     
  25. Dark Jedi

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