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Will the next Windows be Linux?

Discussion in 'Computers' started by Crashdamage, Apr 2, 2016.

  1. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    Will the next Windows be Linux?

    Let's take a look at the situation MS is in. WinPhone is dead. MS made their big play for WinPhone to become relevant with the Nokia deal and failed completely.

    So now they have a dead mobile OS, and old, 2nd rate OS still using a silly drive lettering system, that ridiculos registry, the now old NTFS file system, and lots of legacy code they'd like to dump. They're beating a dead horse with the old NT code. MS has to realize that the longer they keep using NT code the harder it will be to get rid of it.

    MS said Win10 will be the last numbered version. Could that be because they want a new naming systen to differentiate an entirely different OS? Añd could that OS be Linux? I think it could be. Things are very different at MS since Ballmer left the building.

    MS can see that Linux is a highly capable, secure system adaptable for almost anything
    .
    Little snippets of Linux have been spotted in Win10 And the Unbuntu command line has been added to Windows 10. MS even.already sells Linux,
    http://m.theregister.co.uk/2015/09/...linux_repeat_microsoft_has_developed_its_own_

    MS might join the Linux landslide rather than blow their cash reserves trying,to build barricades against it. They've.changed the base OS before, from 95-98'to NT snd can do it again. They have to. The old NT nust go,

    Could it be that MS intends to rely on the Windows name and a very good VM for legacy software, to maintain their desktop market share? Who could challenge them? The challenge for MS is to make a distro so good it's worth pàying fcou
     

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    #1 Crashdamage, Apr 2, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2016
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  2. rootabaga

    rootabaga Extreme Android User
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    I'm writing this on a Nokia Lumia 920 running Windows 8 (10 hasn't been released for it). In all honesty it's been a terrific device, and the OS has been excellent. I think the biggest hurdle it had was all the negativity associated with the windows brand.

    Outside of phones, M$'s big push is Azure, their cloud. Theoretically I could see a shell running some variation of Linux for basic functionality and tying to a cloud UI for apps and features, at least if speeds pick up a bit.

    I hope things are going well for you, Crash. Have a good weekend, we're still pulling for you.
     
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  3. LV426

    LV426 I say we take off and nuke this place from orbit
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    Hi Crash, nice to see you here.
    All good points, and I for one would be delighted if this happened.

    I can certainly believe that the MS developers are massively fed up with supporting such old legacy code. If there's one thing I've learned about software, it's that it almost always gets to a point where the code needs to be scrapped and re-designed. You just can't make old code do something radically different, and expect it to be tidy and maintainable.

    Linux is good, Ubuntu in particular is very professional, but even I have to admit that there are areas where it's let down. In my experience, support for some graphics chipsets historically isn't that good, particularly Nvidia, where proprietary drivers were tricky to get working.

    So maybe MS putting their weight behind Linux would be the catalyst to create a really outstanding, fully supported and smooth O/S, with all the wrinkles ironed out. I would pay for that. MS certainly has the resources to make that work, supporting all hardware variants.
    Over the years Linux has proved itself to be adaptable, with its modular kernel design. In fact the whole system lends itself to being upgraded, and by an open source community. Imagine what could be achieved with the power and resource of a big company like MS.
     
    #3 LV426, Apr 2, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2016
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  4. AZgl1500

    AZgl1500 Extreme Android User
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    I was in Best Buy yesterday, and one of the sales folks helping us had a Nokia phone....
    I noticed that it was quite snappy and asked him how he liked it....
    He said he preferred it over the other smartphone offerings....

    but, then, he thinks a MS Surface is a "great tablet" ??

    we were there trying to find a video adapter for a 2nd generation Surface to HDMI.... he got it for us, and we are happy.... the Surface belongs to my friend who I help with computer stuff.
     
  5. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Extreme Android User
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    Over the years, Windows has become too entrenched in business. Whether those users like it or not, they've made it work and there's no way they can risk abandoning it. Same reason Apple never had a chance of taking over.
     
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  6. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    But with a really good, well integrated VM for compatibility they won't care as long as their stuff runs OK and the box says MS Windows,

    MS already partnered with Canonical, put the Linux command line in Win10 and gave their developers Linux tools.

    Why?
    Q
     
    #6 Crashdamage, Apr 2, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2016
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  7. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Extreme Android User
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    Well, if those business installs can somehow 'migrate' to Linux under the guise of an ordinary Windows upgrade, I suppose it's possible... but it's not possible.
     
  8. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    Not possible? Why not? The biggest problem I see is weaning users off the old drive letter system,
     
  9. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Extreme Android User
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    I don't think this issue is up to us...

    Linux adoption

    Reasons for adoption

    Reasons to change from other operating systems to Linux include better system stability, better malware protection, low or no cost, that most distributions come complete with application software and hardware drivers, simplified updates for all installed software, free software licencing, availability of application repositories and access to the source code.​

    Barriers to adoption

    The greatest barrier to Linux desktop adoption is probably that few desktop PCs come with it from the factory. A.Y. Siu asserted in 2006 that most people use Windows simply because most PCs come with Windows pre-installed; they didn't choose it. Linux has much lower market penetration because in most cases users have to install it themselves, a task that is beyond the capabilities of many PC users: "Most users won’t even use Windows restore CDs, let alone install Windows from scratch. Why would they install an unfamiliar operating system on their computers?​
     
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  10. xyourxhighnessx

    xyourxhighnessx Android Enthusiast
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    This is so true jef.

    Windows is dominant by default. For typical cpu users they see only two options. Apple or microsoft/windows.
     
  11. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    Because they won't even realize it's Linux. The box will say MS Windows, tno doubt with usual proclamation that it's the greatest Windows ever. Linux might not be mentioned àt àll.

    I fully realize it will take a LOT of work to màke.a hybrid upgrade OS that can make the changeover a.reasonàbly smooth transition, But MS doesn't have to write a whole new OS.

    What else could MS be up to?
     
    #11 Crashdamage, Apr 2, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2016
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  12. xyourxhighnessx

    xyourxhighnessx Android Enthusiast
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    I think more cpus need to ship with linux.

    One of the biggest advantages with linux is its openness. I think everyone benefits when "everyone" has a voice. If u know what i mea.
     
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  13. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Extreme Android User
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    A once-unthinkable alliance shows Microsoft is ready to play ball

    You needn't give a fig about that tool, called the Bourne Again Shell, or Bash. You should care, though, that Microsoft is bringing Bash to Windows because it demonstrates how profoundly Microsoft has changed -- for the better . In short, Microsoft is showing its old feisty spirit now that it's an underdog again. And that could bring innovation that benefits us all.

    Microsoft in the 1990s built a robust business selling Windows, which still powers the vast majority of personal computers, and its Office suite of productivity apps. Then came the era of Internet access and smartphones, which gave Google and Apple the opportunity to show how complacent Microsoft had become.​
     
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  14. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    MS can port Office, Outlook, etc to Linux. Note that MS Visual C++ can now write Linux. Gradually, others are will follow and eventually mothball NF.

    Ballmer's taken his Monkey Dànce to the karaoke bars and Gàtes is so busy saving lives he doesn't care as long as the money keeps rolling in,
     
    #14 Crashdamage, Apr 3, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2016
  15. RazzMaTazz

    RazzMaTazz Android Expert
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    Linux is open-source. Open-source is free. Red Hat Linux makes $2B, mostly from services that anyone can provide. Microsoft makes $93B mostly from proprietary products. There's no way that Microsoft (or Apple) is going to base its core products on open-source. No way. The stock price would go in the tank.

    Adding a Bash shell to Windows empowers developers who need to use Linux tools. Several years ago, Apple wisely added a Bash shell to their proprietary (not Linux-based) Mac OSX, and consequently, such developers have been mostly buying Macs, instead of Windows-PCs. And I'm not talking about a few Linux geeks here or there. Entire engineering departments and big/medium/small software/IT-related companies buy Macs instead of PCs. And then if you're the IT manager for those companies, you might just go ahead and encourage (or mandate) the rest of the sales & marketing people to get Macs also so you only have to support one kind of OS. Microsoft was losing a lot of business by not supporting Bash. Problem solved.
     
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  16. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    I get what you're saying, but how much longer can MS supporf the old, klutzy NT code?

    If they make the break to Linux they still have the Windows name and would be selling a proprietary upgrade. And they still have all their other proprietary products to sell.
     
  17. mikedt

    mikedt 你好
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    Well actually Apple did a heck of a lot more than that. Sixteen years ago they changed the whole of Mac OS to be a UNIX based OS, not just a Bash shell. Steve Jobs coming back to Apple bringing NeXTSTEP with him, that's what happened. That's why it's called "OS X", to emphasis the UNIX base, and the difference from "classic" Mac OS. However what goes on with the OS X GUI is completely proprietary of course, but it is X11, X Windows compatible.

    And here's the Apple open source for the Mach kernel, Darwin. BSD, etc. Which OS X and iOS does use.
    https://www.opensource.apple.com/
    ...and FYI
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_(operating_system)
     
    #17 mikedt, Apr 4, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2016
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  18. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    MS doesn't have to release everything as Open Sourrce. Using the open BSD has not resulted in a free, downloadable version of OS-X. A Linux based Windows won't with Windows, either. You won't be able to download a runable Windiws for free.

    MS may be preparing to do something much like Apple did long ago.
     
    #18 Crashdamage, Apr 4, 2016
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  19. svim

    svim Android Expert
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    I have to agree with RazzMaTazz on this. Microsoft can see there's a lot of application development going on that's done through a Bash shell so folding one into Win10 is just a way to keep developers from leaving Windows. This isn't Microsoft conceding anything to Open Source, it's just a move that's just a part of its documented history of vendor lock-in.
     
  20. RazzMaTazz

    RazzMaTazz Android Expert
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    "Will the next Windows be Linux?" No. Not in the sense of a Windows-looking Linux distribution like Ubuntu, Fedora, Mint, et al.

    "Will MS adopt a Linux kernel and bury it in proprietary code?" It's possible. But that would be a massive effort (like the NT revamp) so I won't hold my breath. As an end-user I don't sense any UNIX/BSD kernel advantage in the Mac OS over Windows.

    I wouldn't read much into the addition of Bash to Windows.
     
  21. svim

    svim Android Expert
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    It's very doubtful Microsoft will be moving away from its NT backbone any time soon. It's one thing to look at MS changing over to a Linux kernel from a consumer's point of view but from a business viewpoint that just isn't logical. Microsoft's dominance in corporate IT is still very, very strong and while Linux may be the top dog in big iron servers, in typical web servers, in SAAS (Software ss a Service), and its on the verge of taking over IoT (Internet of Things), all the big money is still tied into corporate contracts. The consumer market is huge but it's still dwarfed by corporate money. Online services and mobile devices are rapidly growing and steadily eating into MS's long-time cash cows, Windows and MS Office, but it's not like Microsoft is struggling to make money. Despite Microsoft's failure to get into the mobile market the fact is big business just can't change it's IT foundation in a timely fashion. It's one thing for a household with maybe a dozen at most devices to make a change, it's another thing when it's a matter of changing over hundreds of thousands of devices along with the infrastructure their networked into. Lots of companies are run off of Windows Servers, locked into Microsoft's proprietary Exchange, along with countless amounts of data tied into Microsoft's SQL databases. (... and don't ever forget these technologies are by design not openly compatible with similar, competing technologies.) For any company looking into migrating its IT to Open Source solutions as a long term way to save money and run more efficiently, there are dozens that will continue to retain their commitments to Microsoft and its NT-based systems. It's a complicated, expensive process that will rarely occur without problems. Change will eventually happen, it's just not going happen for several years. Even an entire nation like S. Korea, a leader in Asian tech, had spent decades crippling itself by basing its networking infrastructure on the IE and ActiveX. It was only last year, 2015, that there was real progress in upgrading past such outdated technology.
     
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  22. jefboyardee

    jefboyardee Extreme Android User
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    Microsoft working with Linux.

    Oil mixing with Water.
     
  23. krokus

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    One concern I have: Will increased popularity increase the malware risk?
     
  24. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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    Maybe it's more it's more than giving developers Linux tools to keep pace with competitor's, but to get them used to Linux before the changeover is made.
     
  25. Crashdamage

    Crashdamage Android Expert
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