Steve Jobs Claims Eris Has Antenna Problem Too **LIVE**

[hallstevenson]

I think he is also correct that the Eris has a weak spot, however we never notice it because:
1. The antenna is located in a spot that actually makes sense to how you hold your phone.
2. Verizon has a much better network than AT&T and doesn't drop calls like they do.

Okay, this is for ANYONE to answer:

How many of us HAD to get special covers for our phones in order to stop calls from being dropped ??

 

[djclark]

Lets keep down the mis information. You're leaving out the rest of what he said.

"On Friday morning, during the iPhone 4 press conference, one person in the audience noted that he couldn't get the "death grip" to work with his BlackBerry Bold 9700. The reason, answered Apple CEO Steve Jobs, was the fact that the signal was strong on the Apple Campus.

 

[djclark]

You don't HAVE to get a cover for the iphone 4 either. This whole thing has been blown way out of proportion.

Okay, this is for ANYONE to answer:
How many of us HAD to get special covers for our phones in order to stop calls from being dropped ??

 

[thetingster]

I've noticed that on my Eris I usually have 2-3 bars and sometimes 1 bar. But when I'm on a call it jumps to 4 bars all the time. I wonder if it's a power management thing. Never a dropped call and I just think that Verizon's network is way more reliable than the one apple jumped in bed with along with a that stupid fad of a phone.

 

[SyDTRaKKeD]

I've noticed that on my Eris I usually have 2-3 bars and sometimes 1 bar. But when I'm on a call it jumps to 4 bars all the time. I wonder if it's a power management thing. Never a dropped call and I just think that Verizon's network is way more reliable than the one apple jumped in bed with along with a that stupid fad of a phone.

it does that because when not in a call or sending a text message it is showing your 3g signal...

when in a call or sending a text message you are not using 3g... it will show the "1x" signal which is stronger

 

[thetingster]

it does that because when not in a call or sending a text message it is showing your 3g signal...

when in a call or sending a text message you are not using 3g... it will show the "1x" signal which is stronger

Well cool I didn't know that, thanks.

 

[BeachBumDeac]

HTC says only they've received complaints from .016% of customers, as opposed to 0.55% for the iPhone4

HTC: Droid Eris complaints nothing compared to iPhone 4 - Pocket-lint

HTC Joins Nokia, Blackberry In Firing Back At Apple | Cult of Mac

 

[Veeshnoof]

Where's the most practical place to put an antennae. The top of the device, or the bottom? Hmmm!

 

[Demache]

Where's the most practical place to put an antennae. The top of the device, or the bottom? Hmmm!

The bottom can work, if done properly. But the top is always the best.

 

[nomarsgirl]

Why would he compare the brand new, state of the art iphone 4 to the Eris anyway? Wouldn't you expect the iphone to perform better than an entry level android that isn't even in production anymore?

 

[byteware]

Sort of. All phones will have signal attenuation when you hold them in your hand. However, most of the time phones are designed with this in mind and the effects are minimal. People have been able to cause signal loss on several devices, including a few of us with the Eris. In Apple's case, it's because they chose to make the device pretty with the antenna on the outside, so it's more noticeable. No other phone may have the problem this severely, but it's erroneous to say that no other phone has issues with signal attenuation when held.

Most cell phones have signal attenuation when you cover it with your hand due to the signal having to go through flesh and bone to get there.

That's not the big problem with the iPhone 4. The big problem with the iPhone 4, is that when you touch it and bridge the two antennas, the phone is operating at a slightly different frequency.

 

[doogald]

Where's the most practical place to put an antennae. The top of the device, or the bottom? Hmmm!

Spencer Webb of AntennaSys, Inc. has had the best collection of blog posts about the iPhone 4 antenna from an antenna engineer's point of view. In one of his first posts about the antenna issue, he wrote:

The FCC puts strict limits on the amount of energy from a handheld device that may be absorbed by the body. We call this Specific Absorbtion Rate, or SAR. In the olden days, when I walked ten miles to school in three feet of snow, uphill in both directions, cell phones had pull-up antennas. This allowed the designer to use a half-wave antenna variant, and put the point of maximum radiation somewhat away from the user's cranium. Of course, most people did not think it was necessary and kept the antenna stowed. Motorola's flip phone acutally had a second helical antenna that was switched into place when this was the case. But, more importantly, SAR rules were not yet in effect.

Flip phones became yesterday's style, and phones were becoming more monolithic. Some phones, like the early Treo, kept the antenna in the traditional location at the top of the phone, near one edge, but reduced it to a short stub. Whips became stubs, stubs became bumps, and finally antennas were embedded into the rectangular volume of the phone. The trouble was SAR; if you left the antenna at the top, the user was now pressing it into their head, insuring lots of tissue heating. Enter the bottom-located cellphone antenna.

Just about every cell phone in current production has the antenna located at the bottom. This insures that the radiating portion of the antenna is furthest from the head. Apple was not the first to locate the antenna on the bottom, and certainly won't be the last. The problem is that humans have their hands below their ears, so the most natural position for the hand is covering the antenna. This can't be a good design decision, can it? How can we be stuck with this conundrum? It's the FCC's fault.

You see, when the FCC tests are run, the head is required to be in the vicinity of the phone. But, the hand is not!! And the FCC's tests are not the only tests that must be passed by a candidate product. AT&T has their own requirements for devices put on their network, and antenna efficiency is one of them. I know because I have designed quad-band GSM antennas for the AT&T network. The AT&T test similarly does not require the hand to be on the phone.

The blog is here.

 

[doogald]

HTC says only they've received complaints from .016% of customers, as opposed to 0.55% for the iPhone4

HTC: Droid Eris complaints nothing compared to iPhone 4 - Pocket-lint

HTC Joins Nokia, Blackberry In Firing Back At Apple | Cult of Mac

I'm willing to bet that HTC has received a lot more complaints about the silent audio bug than Apple has, though!

 

[psu9495]

I found it really funny how they removed the weather widget from the screen and just had a few dull icons on it. I guess they didn't want people to know that Android phones have widgets!

I noticed the same thing when I first saw the video. I'm sure they had some consultant tell them what layout would be the most aesthetically DIS-pleasing. No widgets, two uneven vertical columns of icons in the center. Plain background. We obviously know what the stock layout is, so they certainly made an effort to change it to what was shown. It's ironic, though, that you can modify your layout to that degree, but can't with the iPhone.

 

[Demache]

I'm willing to bet that HTC has received a lot more complaints about the silent audio bug than Apple has, though!

Very true. But signal loss from everyday usage (like Apple claims) is not a problem.

 

[adammsu]

So even if his claim that our Eris have this problem too was true (although I think it's bogus for the most part), then would using a case on our phones fix the so-called problem as well?

well, this is certainly not all, but here is what i heard from a REAL apple/att fanboy (i summarize)

part of the problem is that the antennas are external and can be touched directly by the skin. one of the bands represents the wifi antenna, and the other is the cell antenna. When the two are bridged in the "death grip" or by connecting them in the lower left-hand side, they can "short" or be rendered ineffective. Skin isn't "that" conductive, so u have to be pressing hard on it, not likely to be accidental. Thus, a case would eliminate THAT PART of the issue. Since the eris antenna does not connect to the outside in the same fashion, you still get some signal blockage, but not the same "short" that occurs on the iphone.

like i said, i havent read the proof myself, but when my irritatingly "fanboy" friend told me that, i am inclined to believe him. And it makes logical sense that they are trying to eliminate person-phone electrical conductivity with a case, otherwise a case would be pointless.

 

[byteware]

part of the problem is that the antennas are external and can be touched directly by the skin. one of the bands represents the wifi antenna, and the other is the cell antenna. When the two are bridged in the "death grip" or by connecting them in the lower left-hand side, they can "short" or be rendered ineffective.

This is partially true. What happens is that they are bridged, and function as ONE antenna. The length of an antenna is proportional to the frequency it is to use. If you change the antenna length, this makes the antenna less effective for the specific frequency it was originally made for.

Skin isn't "that" conductive, so u have to be pressing hard on it, not likely to be accidental.

This part is BS. Skin doesn't become any MORE conductive by pressing hard. Now, I will admit that oil/sweaty hands make the problem even worse, but the problem clearly exists with simple ordinary contact.

Thus, a case would eliminate THAT PART of the issue. Since the eris antenna does not connect to the outside in the same fashion, you still get some signal blockage, but not the same "short" that occurs on the iphone.

This is true. Without the actual contact to "bridge" the two antennas, you would not have the level of problem you are having with the iPhone 4.

 

[jasonh]

This is true. Without the actual contact to "bridge" the two antennas, you would not have the level of problem you are having with the iPhone 4.

Consumer Reports recommends using duct tape so you don't bridge the two.

Seems to me, the first company to market an iPhone4 accessory which is basically a clear piece of thin vinyl to cover that idea (and charge out the butt for it) stands to make a bit of money.

 

[adammsu]

This part is BS. Skin doesn't become any MORE conductive by pressing hard. Now, I will admit that oil/sweaty hands make the problem even worse, but the problem clearly exists with simple ordinary contact.
4.

ok, bad wording choice. i'm more referring to the concept that we all learn in grade school. take two wires and a battery and light. lightly touch the contacts, and the light will flicker. press them hard between your fingers, much brighter light.

same idea here, incidental contact between the antennas probably wont do much, due either to duration (1/2 second change i doubt would even register on the "bars" due to smoothing algorithms) or minimal conductivity.

My guess is this is why "few" users have complained, because the average user won't cause the condition with average use, or simply hasnt noticed it.

Either way, i still think its silly it made it this far. If they are smart enough to make the techno that they do, someone probably said bridging those antennas would be bad (and apparently there are reports that this did happen, though i am not going to go find them ATM)

 

[byteware]

My guess is this is why "few" users have complained, because the average user won't cause the condition with average use, or simply hasnt noticed it.

Few users have complained because Apple changed the bar display formula for the iPhone 4. The iPhone 4 reads 5 FULL BARS until you are at half strength.

My opinion is that they made this change specifically to MASK the problem with the antenna.

They also removed the program that you can use to check signal strength directly (all other iPhones have this program).

Either way, i still think its silly it made it this far. If they are smart enough to make the techno that they do, someone probably said bridging those antennas would be bad (and apparently there are reports that this did happen, though i am not going to go find them ATM)

Some of the changes that they made prior to release (removal of the signal debugging program, and changing the bar display formula) indicate that they knew exactly what the problem was, and took steps to prevent an uproar instead of fixing the problem.

 

[adammsu]

My opinion is that they made this change specifically to MASK the problem with the antenna.

absolutely. they knew how much it would cost to make a physical change to the device, this is much easier. Although bad signal > "searching for service" like some videos i saw portrayed, so its a weak mask at best.

Some of the changes that they made prior to release (removal of the signal debugging program, and changing the bar display formula) indicate that they knew exactly what the problem was, and took steps to prevent an uproar instead of fixing the problem.

yep

 

[meatwad]

1. We all know that At&t's coverage sucks anyway.
2. We also know that most Iphone users are nothing more than Apple fanboys.
3. I really think my eris is better than the Iphone in lots of areas. I.e. I can pretty much do anything on my eris that my friends at work do on their pricey Iphone. (I paid thirty for my eris).

 

[byteware]

absolutely. they knew how much it would cost to make a physical change to the device, this is much easier. Although bad signal > "searching for service" like some videos i saw portrayed, so its a weak mask at best.

The sad thing is, a clear polymer coating over the antenna would have solved the problem completely with only a minor hit to the Fung Shui of the device. Steve Jobs preferred to try to hide the problem than take a minor hit to the Fung Shui of the device.

 

[xx_bishop_xx]

Any word on the feng shui?

 

[byteware]

Any word on the feng shui?

The word I was actually looking for was "aesthetics", but I couldn't spell it right at the time. Oh well, if you can't spell one word right, go misspell a different one just for kicks I guess.