WIMAX 4G Repeater / Amp?

mraroid said:

RF Expert....

Will this booster work with the HTC EVO 4G WinMax? Can you post additional details? Perhaps the frequency range that needs a boost? Any other info you can share?

Thanks

mraroid

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No, he is doing a modem modification.

I can see why some people are having problems.

Repeaters work on the RF signal, and its doesnt matter one bit what that signal is carrying. They receive the signal, amplify it, and re-transmit it. What DOES matter is the frequency they operate on. Sprint/Clear WiMax is in the 2.5-2.6GHz band, whereas 3G and cell phones operate at 700-900MHz and 1800-1900MHz. There are LOTS of repeaters on the market for the two cell phone bands. The problem is that Sprint/Clear have used a frequency well outside those bands. It'll take a while for manufacturers to ramp up.

T-Mobile is using their old 3G network and calling it 4G, so you can use a cell phone repeater for them.

Verizon (and AT&T) bought some spectrum for 4G that used to be used for broadcast TV n the USA, so an old "TV" repeater will work for them. (But not enough. As soon as they get some 4G customers, they will run out of capacity.)

Clear built the 4G network both Sprint and Clear use, under a deal where Clear customers fall back to Sprint's 3G network. It's in a band that was reserved for religious/educational use and 'owned' by the Catholic Church. It'll take a little while to build it out, but they got gobs of spectrum, which is why they can offer unlimited service versus the others who all have a cap on their 4G usage.

So, dont look for a "WiMax" repeater, because "WiMax" is used at all sorts of frequencies, depending on who you are and what part of the world you live in. You need an RF repeater that operates in the 2.5GHx-2.6GHz band.

Repeaters are definitely the solution to this problem. I know there are no Wimax repeaters on the market yet but this company seems like they will have one soon. They are already the first ones on the market with Verizon and AT&T 4G repeaters.

WirelessCoverageSolutions.com

I already bought one of the Verizon boosters for my Pantech 4G LTE USB Modem UML290 and it works great. Boosted my 4G in my house from 1 bar to full 4 bars.

But what kind of speed tests results did you find?

Repeaters will create a strong signal indoors, but unless you have decent WiMax reception outside, you will not experience much benefit. Great for getting around penetration issues but not very good for increasing speed if you have a weak signal to begin with.

At least that is what I gathered from:
http://www.rfwel.com/forums/content...extending-wimax-coverage-beyond-cell-boundary

I just called Wilson and they said they have no repeaters for the Sprint 4G network, but they're developing them. I have an Evo, and since there is no antenna port, I guess I'm SOL until a repeater product comes out.

There are now a few commercially available repeaters on the market.

But a strong warning, running an unlicensed repeater is a felony. If you get got, it will be a very stiff fine and possible jail time.

RF Expert said:

The boosters will not work that you refer to. I have developed a excellent external antenna system for the Houston Texas Clear area.

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I am in desparate need of a solution to sucking wimax from the Clear tower that is just under 8 miles away. I live in the boonies so the only thing between me & the tower are trees & rice fields. If you know a way to suck wimax from a distance (line of site), I am foaming at the mouth.

Bought this today. I guess I'll have to wait patiently to see if this picks up wifi signals inside of 50Km with my 39ft truckers antenna. I'll keep you updated. RF Expert, I'm still interested in a wimax solution.
http://www.ubnt.com/downloads/b2hp_datasheet.pdf

xtramyle said:

Bought this today. I guess I'll have to wait patiently to see if this picks up wifi signals inside of 50Km with my 39ft truckers antenna. I'll keep you updated. RF Expert,I'm still interested in a wimax solution.
http://www.ubnt.com/downloads/b2hp_datasheet.pdf

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Sorry it is really late, but how are you going to use that?

The average wifi router can not reach more then 500 feet, 1 mile max. Which means your 50 kilometer signal booster is really no more effective then a good radio antenna, 500 feet to 1 mile max. You would need to added the booster to both the sender and the receiver to get something over 50km.

To be honest, with out looking up the laws or knowing where you are from, it is a 40mhz booster in the 2.4ghz range, on the 802 standard, which means it is illegal in the usa, 20 mhz is maximum for usa, assuming you are in the usa.

Make sure you check the laws before you use it, there is some very big fines if you get caught.

Hi RiverOfIce

Thank you for your kind response & cautionary info. Yes I live in the US - a few miles past "the last mile".
It is hard to sit on the sidelines and watch the rest of the world go by at breakneck broadband speeds. Of course, I want to work within the law. At this time I am practically willing to petition my congressman with the help of my neighbors & do whatever it takes to bring serious broadband to my local community (Liverpool, TX)

I first read about this bullet at this site(the manufacturers):
About Us | Ubiquiti Networks, Inc.
Contact Us | Ubiquiti Networks, Inc.

The bullet sounded legit & although I was looking for a wimax solution, it sounded quite interesting, pretty much too good to be true.
Bullet M | Ubiquiti Networks, Inc.
Bullet | Ubiquiti Networks, Inc.

The bullet was actually delivered today (super fast shipping). However, I am in Austin, TX 200 miles away & will continue to hold my breathe for a few more days till I return home.
There is even a forum: Ubiquiti Networks Forum

As long as there is a legal way to use this bullet, I will test it out and will update this forum as soon as I get my hands on that bullet. By the way, the distance I need to cover is under 12 miles. I am hoping to at least use this bullet as part of a repeater setup with a SKU9DB30INTRUCKER antenna and Linksys WRT54G Wireless Router.

By the way, I am sure glad that you haven.t quit this forum. I'll probably need to "pick your brains" at some point.

Thanks again for the "heads up"

RF Expert said:

The boosters will not work that you refer to. I have developed a excellent external antenna system for the Houston Texas Clear area.

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I live in an area that has three clear/sprint towers within 1.5 miles that support wimax. I was thinking that I could put an omnidirectional 2.4 to 2.6 Ghz (if such thing exists) antenna on the roof to to obtain the optimal wimax signal. It is *my* understanding, mostly from the posts of RiverOfIce, that wimax is a mesh network, so the more towers, the better the signal. Note: R.O.I. is not to blame if my understanding is incorrect.

I would be interested in your external antenna system. Don't know if there is a wimax router that supports an external antenna, but implied by your post there is something that works.

P.S.: Use to do some business travel in TX, mostly Austin & DFW area. Have a good friend living in the Houston area.

OutofDate1980 said:

I live in an area that has three clear/sprint towers within 1.5 miles that support wimax. I was thinking that I could put an omnidirectional 2.4 to 2.6 Ghz (if such thing exists) antenna on the roof to to obtain the optimal wimax signal. It is *my* understanding, mostly from the posts of RiverOfIce, that wimax is a mesh network, so the more towers, the better the signal. Note: R.O.I. is not to blame if my understanding is incorrect.

I would be interested in your external antenna system. Don't know if there is a wimax router that supports an external antenna, but implied by your post there is something that works.

P.S.: Use to do some business travel in TX, mostly Austin & DFW area. Have a good friend living in the Houston area.

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You are 100% correct, but you the wimax towers must be told to use that tower, which is done carrier side. So it would not really work. Since this is licensed spectrum, do not expect much in the way fo diy help.

RiverOfIce said:

You are 100% correct, but you the wimax towers must be told to use that tower, which is done carrier side. So it would not really work. Since this is licensed spectrum, do not expect much in the way fo diy help.

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OK, I'm confused. I'd be paying WiMax Clear/Sprint for it's signal on it's licensed spectrum. If I had an external omnidirectional antenna, Sprint/Clear tower selection:

1. Whichever Clear/Sprint tower had the best signal to the device this antenna is attached at start up would be selected by Clear/Sprint to be used ?

2. Clear/Sprint splits the signal between these three towers, to lessen any potential congestion on a particular tower ?

3. Clear/Sprint assigns a device to a particular tower in an assigned geographic area and there is no algorithm to hand off all or some of signal to another available tower due to congestion, tower failure, etc. ?

Edit: Doing a bit more reading. Instead of using one omnidirectional antenna, use three directional antennas, each pointed to a different Sprint/Clear tower make any difference ?

Delete

OutofDate1980 said:

OK, I'm confused. I'd be paying WiMax Clear/Sprint for it's signal on it's licensed spectrum. If I had an external omnidirectional antenna, Sprint/Clear tower selection:

1. Whichever Clear/Sprint tower had the best signal to the device this antenna is attached at start up would be selected by Clear/Sprint to be used ?

2. Clear/Sprint splits the signal between these three towers, to lessen any potential congestion on a particular tower ?

3. Clear/Sprint assigns a device to a particular tower in an assigned geographic area and there is no algorithm to hand off all or some of signal to another available tower due to congestion, tower failure, etc. ?

Edit: Doing a bit more reading. Instead of using one omnidirectional antenna, use three directional antennas, each pointed to a different Sprint/Clear tower make any difference ?

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Three directional antennas? Interesting! Wouldn't an omnidirectional antenna be easier to work with? SKU9DB30INTRUCKER is omnidirectional and supports Frequency Range 700 MHz - 2500 MHz. Maximum Signal - Welcome!

There is an antenna connector inside the Series M Clear modem - getting to it voids your warranty. 4G WiMax Data Devices & Accessories

While in Austin, TX, I called Clear tech support and got a very knowledgeable young man in Manila. He did indeed remotely reset my Clear modem to receive its signal from a different tower from the one I was using. Without doing anything else, I went from 3 bars to 4 bars.

No final word on my Bullet M5HP project. Still at it.

I am using a Winegard portable foldup Dish antenna with the LNB removed and a piece of eighth inch plywood mounted using the two LNB screw holes. Attached to the plywood with rubber bands is my Clear Rover Puck. Sliding the puck back or forth I can adjust the focal point.
Aim the antenna at the tower, tweak the direction and you will definitely get a signal increase. I would be interested in what others results might be.

japowers, you can do the same thing with a phone, turn the screen towards the tower, it will decrease signal, turn phone away it will increase.

The problem with your setup is simple. It will only increase the signal by a few dbm.

Outdated, it would increase your signal strength slighting, but it would not use your tower as a hub.

RiverOfIce said:

... Outdated, it would increase your signal strength slighting, but it would not use your tower as a hub.

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xtramyle said:

... He did indeed remotely reset my Clear modem to receive its signal from a different tower from the one I was using. ...

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From other posts a 3 antenna would not help, as it appears the carrier "fixes" modem to a selected tower. With a omnidirectional antenna I may get a slightly better signal strength, but with the option that a carriers could select a different tower ?

Ok, there are a LOT of things that seem to not be understood well and I will try to help. I have had 4G now for over a year. I have Clear. I have gone through at LEAST 50 Reps in that year. All levels of tech support and so on. I have 2 Sierra Wireless 250U and I now use the Sierra Wireless OverDrive. When I was Using the 250U I connected that to a CradlePoint router that supported USB 4G modems so I could make it wireless. Anyways, So connecting that modem to that router gave me MANY options and DETAILED specs on my connection, How it connected, Why it was REFUSED and SOOO much more information. I have Weeks of logs I saved. Now for the important stuff. It showed when we connect to a 4G tower, The tower has the ability to accept the connection, refuse the connection (Even if you payed your bill), Throttle your connection or bounce you to another local tower. When we click connect or let it auto connect what it basically does it Start at lets say 2.5GHZ then it goes up I would say literally every single band possible starting from 2.5GHZ all the way till the last LEGAL range they are registered to. So lets say your local tower is 000002262ac3 which is 1 of my local towers That is the BSID of that tower. So if you have enough RSSI, and a decent CINR then that tower will let you connect as long as that tower does not have you using to much of its bandwidth For that tower I was getting a RSSI of -80dbm and a CINR:17db Which I would rate 3/10 score. If you use to much bandwidth then that tower will attempt to bounce you to a local tower. So then it would bounce me to BSID:000002262ac2 RSSI:-88dbm CINR:9 db Which is more likely not to connect because that is a WEAK signal. Then It would attempt to bounce me to 000002262a49 RSSI:-87dbm and CINR:8 db which again is weak, So since I have HIGH bandwidth usage in tower AC3 and very little in the others but the others are to far away, then I get a refused connection and will not connect until either the congestion goes down and the tower lets me back in or after the timer is over and my service is then restored. I have PROOF for all this if anyone wants to say im wrong. I also have logs of ALL THE FREQUENCY'S that clear/sprint uses if anyone wants a copy, that we we can make our own antennas and/or amps. The frequency starts around 2508500Khz to 2667000Khz and possibly lower and higher. So in other words, using a antenna booster from lets say an old antenna from tv or cb or something I believe would not work as well as it should because it should be tuned in to what ever that tower is broadcasting its signal at. For instance Tower BSID:000002262ac3 is broadcasting at the frequency of 2667000khz, Tower BSID:000002262ac2 is broadcasting at 2657000Khz and Tower BSID:000002262a49 is at 2647000khz ... intersting huh.... Another issue with antenna's is this, MOST people are wanting to amplify the signal to there house or what not, yes thats fine but if the TOWER is not able to efficiently broadcast the signal to your area, how is your phone/modem or whatever you are using supposed to send a signal back? In other words not only do you need to amplify the signal you are reviving you would also need to amplify the signal you are sending. That is probably the biggest issue with the government, Amplifying the signal you are going to send WILL be harmful especially when there are SOOOOO many links to cancer from these devices and harm to yourself and other electronic devices. That being said, if its shielded thats a whole other story. Next, I was able to restrict which tower I wanted to use and its not upto the ISP entirely. For instance, if you find out where the tower is located that you dont want to use you could simply apply some sort of shield in the way of that tower until you connect to the tower of your choice and as long as the other towers RSSI and CINR is not WAY bigger you should be able to stay connected to the ideal tower you want to use. You could simply use some sort of cookie tray or something lol. If the tower are literally in the same direction and about the same area then this will be VERY tricky.Next, IM 100% positive if you get your SPC code and use certian software not only could you CHOSE what tower and how your service works, you could chose which ISP you want to use and not be bound to the default. I have done something like this is its WAY possible to do. I even optimized my signal and removed some features that restricted certain things. (ALL LEGAL FYI), You may void your warranty or your isp may kick you if they find out so be warned. Also this may not be legal in all areas so research before you attempt anything. All this is informational use only!!! Next, Using a type of dish, Satellite, Home made, Misc, WORKS pretty damn well on avg. I even used a lid from a pot that was all aluminum and was about 12 inches long so was pretty big, and it boosted my RSSI from 85-88 to 71-77 and my CINR from 13-17 to 22-26. All I did was tape my device to the middle and it worked wonders. Of course the signal increase will depend on the weather, humidity, and other factors but in general it works well. If you attempt it, dont do it for 2 minutes and give up, try TONS of different angles and windows and areas. Even the SLIGHTEST turn can increase your RSSI and CINR by 10 points (no joke!!!) hmmmm... what else........I been studying this for over 13 months and I own a computer business so I have a lot of resources..........If I remember more stuff off the top of my head I will post more. If anyone is interested in anything I said and wants to know more let me know. Also If anyone is interested in the logs let me know and I will SHED LIGHT and finally expose these things for what they are....unfair. The logs are VERY interested lol Later dudes....

mattred said:

... If I remember more stuff off the top of my head I will post more. If anyone is interested in anything I said and wants to know more let me know. Also If anyone is interested in the logs let me know and I will SHED LIGHT and finally expose these things for what they are....unfair. The logs are VERY interested lol Later dudes....

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Post away. I'm sure there are plenty of folks interested in "SHED LIGHT and finally expose these things for what they are....unfair." , but don't give yourself carpel tunnel syndrome.

Found this forum..hoping someone can help. We buy self-storage units and just ran into a couple of these: JR-30 Mobile WiMAX RF Repeater

Seems like someone here might be able to tell us what it is ... possible what we could do with them? Any help is appreciated. Note, we're not interested in using them (we've read some of your post on legality).

I found this,



I can't find it for sale anywhere or how much it costs. The company looks small. If someone calls or e-mails them we could see how much they are.

Any further word on these JR-30 Mobile WiMAX RF Repeaters?

Funny - I was searching (again) for a suitable repeater for my 4G hotspot and came upon this forum. I scrolled down and found my own entry from months ago...

Oh well, here's the updated version:

Look guys - I see a LOT of misunderstanding in here, with a few facts scattered in. Lets start with facts:
1) Cell phones/3G/LTE use 700MHz & 1900MHz bands. Sprint/Clear uses 2500MHz.
2) Repeaters dont care what you're repeating - but they have to operate on the RF frequency you're using - 2500MHz in the case of Sprint/Clear.
3) Repeaters are not illegal. On the contrary, they help the carriers by extending their range.
4) Manufacturers are not stupid - repeaters are bi-directional. They include circuits to prevent them from repeating their own signal.
5) You can take a weak signal and boost it enough that the demodulators can work with it. The RF interface of WiMax was designed specifically to handle multipath and does a wonderful job of decoding signal from noise at anything 2 bars and up.
6) You are not "assigned" a tower. That is nonsense. ALL cellular systems include the logic to determine which tower will best serve and automatically establish the connetion to that tower and hand you off to another if you move. That's what "cellular" is all about. Of course, if you're miles away from any tower, you KNOW which one will be best, and you can enhance your signal with a directional antenna aimed at that tower.
7) That JR-30 someone mentionned is perfect, but I haven't found a place to buy one. I just emailed the manufacturer. Of course, I dont know what it costs, but at 1W it is clearly in the "homeowner" class. I'm not yet ready to spend $2600 for a commerical grade repeater.

As an aside, and only because someone mentioned WiFi: WiFi has federally regulated power limits intended to keep the operating range small because it uses shared frequencies. Amplifiing/Repeating a WiFi signal is illegal. That has nothing to do with cellular, which operates on entirely different principles.

amplifiergsm said:

If you looking good amplifiers looks:
www.gsminstallations.co.uk
or call:
07511552705
Have a question, willing to help.
greet.

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Sadly, you not only SPAM this forum, but dont even understand enough about the topic to realize that your repeaters and amplifiers operate on the wrong freqency to do any good whatsoever.